Is it totally on him though? The whole team has regressed. How can a group of 25 people all be individually responsible for a collective regression?
10
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 40
- Goals
- 8
- Assists
- 5
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Red cards
- 1
I also dont understand how his team mates are letting him get away with it, why is no one screaming at him to tell him to track back and work harder. The whole situation is baffling.
Sorry but that is rubbish.
A player can be out of form but still put the effort and application into his time on the pitch.
People would be off his back if they could see he was trying.
So you're blaming TenHag for Rashfords refusal fight for the team. Ffs
How many managers has he gone through now? Him and his lazy arse mate Martial.
Keep on blaming managers if that makes you happy
His own form is totally on him, yes.
No it’s definitely on him. There’s a baseline of performance level below which you can’t pass the buck to your team mates or manager. Rashford has sunk so low he can’t even see that baseline - the baseline is a dot to him.
He doesn't. Has always been bang average. His real level is bench player for crystal palace. He was never better than someone like Wilfred Zaha.
He absolutely can run. Just can’t an be bothered.
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I would agree with that. He's had maybe 2 good seasons for us. Everyone was raving about him last season but forgot he was pulling the same sh*t the previous years with body language, application etc. At that time, the excuse was that he needed a shoulder operation.
Rashford has a habit of downing tools when the team is struggling.
This is a joke right?
Bench level player for Palace but then compared to arguably Palace's best ever player
It's not totally on him, for sure. But the serious regression in his output, effort and impact has a hell of a lot to do with him. You can't really take a big feck off contract as a senior player and then act like a petulant child when things aren't going your way.
Basically it says if any new manager challenges Rashford in the future, or they disagree in how they set up, he'll just stop playing for him. Good standard to set for one of your most senior and highest paid players.
Hasn’t he just posted about a cousin dying? If he was close to that person, football might well be the last thing on his mind.
If he’s head is not in it, where should the blame be apportioned?
Still, whether that’s the reason or not, if he’s evidently as bad as this constantly, why is he being selected without fail?
Last question: is the manager bound by the club to field him as the face of our club, in other words, is Rashford’s PT guaranteed irrespective of performance?
If he’s head is not in it, where should the blame be apportioned?
Still, whether that’s the reason or not, if he’s evidently as bad as this constantly, why is he being selected without fail?
Last question: is the manager bound by the club to field him as the face of our club, in other words, is Rashford’s PT guaranteed irrespective of performance?
Nobody places a gun against his head forcing him to play..........or maybe that is what is stupid goal celebration is all about!
The point is that he can withdraw himself from the squad if he doesn't feel he's mentally upto it.
Besides, how many excuses does he need?? He's broken up with his girlfriend. He needs a shoulder operation. His cousin died. His brother's in trouble with the police.
Give me a break.
He's 26 now, should be in his prime. Not once in his career has he scored 20 league goals in a season. This is his level, a decent attacker who sometimes goes on a scoring spree. He is not a top level player and most definitely not someone we should be relying on if we want to be an attacking force. Yet we reward mediocrity with a 350k a week contract.
Right. If a loved one of yours died, you are certain you’d be in the best frame of mind to do something a lot less meaningful? You’ve rolled that bunch out like they’re one and the same, are they?
Part of being a good manager is overruling as and when necessary, in any field. Just because someone turns up to work, it doesn’t mean they are good to go. That’s a matter of fact.
Given your handle, there’s clear and apparent evidence of how bereavement can cause fallout.
His form has been diabolical since long before the cousin died. So it's a red herring.
Why is he being selected? Because he was our top scorer by a huge margin last season and literally nobody else looks like taking over those duties this season. So the manager has no choice other than hoping he can play himself into some goalscoring form.
This is what the fans and club deserve to be honest.
For years this club has overprotected him, any criticism he received about his game was severely shot down. He was given everything just because the club is desperate for a figure and a saviour. Sure there is a certain prestige which comes from players developed through the ranks but I and others always thought Rashford was given the status he never deserved as far back as the Jose days.
With each passing manager, his ego and standing at the club has been inflated without the expectations rising to the same level. The Rashford under LVG and early Jose days was a workhorse that played honest and simple team football, no matter if he played on the left, up front or on the right. Somewhere in the Mourinho phase is where the greed was introduced and him taking potshots from anywhere and it only got worse from there.
Even on here before everyone’s eyes opened, you couldn’t say a bad word about him. The Ole period was by far the worst, he was spoiled rotten. That’s when he was allowed to play like shit for 90mins and was excused for either providing a goal and assist, if you ever pointed out the performance was unacceptable, you would be stat bashed to death. If he performed poorly and didn’t contribute to the score then the good old excuses of him playing with an injury or dealing with personal life issues (such as breaking up with his girlfriend, fecking he’ll) were given as valid reasons.
He’s been given everything Manchester United greats got despite doing half the work. He got £200k a week at 22, the number 10 shirt, lack of tracking back privileges as well as being the face of the club. All this for a player whose biggest trophy is the Europa League and has never scored more than 17 league goals in a season.
It’s all well and good complaining now but this club created what Rashford has become.
For years this club has overprotected him, any criticism he received about his game was severely shot down. He was given everything just because the club is desperate for a figure and a saviour. Sure there is a certain prestige which comes from players developed through the ranks but I and others always thought Rashford was given the status he never deserved as far back as the Jose days.
With each passing manager, his ego and standing at the club has been inflated without the expectations rising to the same level. The Rashford under LVG and early Jose days was a workhorse that played honest and simple team football, no matter if he played on the left, up front or on the right. Somewhere in the Mourinho phase is where the greed was introduced and him taking potshots from anywhere and it only got worse from there.
Even on here before everyone’s eyes opened, you couldn’t say a bad word about him. The Ole period was by far the worst, he was spoiled rotten. That’s when he was allowed to play like shit for 90mins and was excused for either providing a goal and assist, if you ever pointed out the performance was unacceptable, you would be stat bashed to death. If he performed poorly and didn’t contribute to the score then the good old excuses of him playing with an injury or dealing with personal life issues (such as breaking up with his girlfriend, fecking he’ll) were given as valid reasons.
He’s been given everything Manchester United greats got despite doing half the work. He got £200k a week at 22, the number 10 shirt, lack of tracking back privileges as well as being the face of the club. All this for a player whose biggest trophy is the Europa League and has never scored more than 17 league goals in a season.
It’s all well and good complaining now but this club created what Rashford has become.
And you have conveniently ignored the other excuses used by Rashford fan boys for his poor performances on the pitch.
But if you really want to focus on the death of his relative then why was he playing with the same lack of intensity BEFORE his cousin died?
He's exactly like he was two seasons ago. Useless and playing with a sulky face all game, every game.
Except he had the excuse of the back injury back then. He is clearly over that given his form last season so what's the excuse this time?
I think it's the same thing that has happened a few stars; secured the biggest contract they'll ever get so they know they can coast by. Ozil did it, Aubameyang, Sanchez. They are probably others not coming to mind right now.
We are like Arsenal back then, so desperate for any player to bring us back that we lose our minds after a season of good output so we offer them an outrageous contract. Goal achieved for them, the motivation is gone.
Except he had the excuse of the back injury back then. He is clearly over that given his form last season so what's the excuse this time?
I think it's the same thing that has happened a few stars; secured the biggest contract they'll ever get so they know they can coast by. Ozil did it, Aubameyang, Sanchez. They are probably others not coming to mind right now.
We are like Arsenal back then, so desperate for any player to bring us back that we lose our minds after a season of good output so we offer them an outrageous contract. Goal achieved for them, the motivation is gone.
The manager always has a choice, unless the higher ups say otherwise. Finding form is long since passed as he’s been a liability to the team for a long time now.
I’m not sure death can ever be a red herring. Perhaps a compound, making a bad thing worse, but never not a legitimate reason for a person to plummet mentally for a period of time.
Bolded. I don’t care about any of that, only what I asked.
Your second sentence, I don’t know what’s going on with him in relation to the season as a whole, but if his performance is so egregious, the man in charge can hook him at any time. But players are not robots, and if he is in the shit, it’s not going to be any better with the worst news imaginable on top, is it?
I don’t wish to absolve him. He was abysmal, but there are plenty of questions to ask at the moment and not all are front-facing.
A very delusional post, defending the indefensible.
It was very obvious to anyone watching that a lad who didn't travel to Turkey during the week wasn't giving his all which is unforgiveable.
He's one of the highest paid players in the world and there's been various instances of him not working hard enough all season but the Newcastle game took it too new levels; He was a disgrace, should be fined for it.
I’m not arguing that grief can’t affect form. I’m arguing that Rashford’s form has been terrible since long before the bereavement. So the bereavement obviously isn’t a trigger for his bad form. Hence it’s a red herring.
Saw Keano's post-match remarks on Rashford earlier today and I'm in agreement. Most United fans just want to see a player put in the hard yards and go down fighting especially if he's having a poor game. Rashford doesn't track back and McT continues to ghost. And these are academy graduates who are supposed to exemplify the United ethos.
I am not comparing them. He would be holding bench for Zaha. If you take work rate into account, even Dan James was better than him.This is a joke right?
Bench level player for Palace but then compared to arguably Palace's best ever player
As the proverb goes: as you sow, so shall you reap. United were looking desperately for a brand new and marketable face to spearhead the post-Ferguson campaign(s). Well, they got him. In so many ways, the club and Rashford mirror each other nowadays. A self-indulgent and overpaid player being the main man at an ever navel-gazing club that throws money away left, right and centre to satisfy its own self-importance.
I've said it a million times, there's a good player there. One that could prove very useful to most managers and at most clubs. But i'm afraid we chose a different trajectory for him, and now there's probably no turning back. I tend to agree with those who suggest that a change of environment would do him a world of good and help him gain a better perspective.
Other than that, his two best seasons at the club coincided with his contract talks. Since he's not the only one, the club should really look into this and understand that they're not handling these renewals in a way that benefits the collective. But, as a friend mentioned to me the other day, why the anger and the hate? The man's the perfect capitalist. In the US, these are role models. He found himself in the right place at the right time, and he's milked every last penny out of this old cash cow by playing his hand incredibly well on and off the pitch.
I've said it a million times, there's a good player there. One that could prove very useful to most managers and at most clubs. But i'm afraid we chose a different trajectory for him, and now there's probably no turning back. I tend to agree with those who suggest that a change of environment would do him a world of good and help him gain a better perspective.
Other than that, his two best seasons at the club coincided with his contract talks. Since he's not the only one, the club should really look into this and understand that they're not handling these renewals in a way that benefits the collective. But, as a friend mentioned to me the other day, why the anger and the hate? The man's the perfect capitalist. In the US, these are role models. He found himself in the right place at the right time, and he's milked every last penny out of this old cash cow by playing his hand incredibly well on and off the pitch.
Unless you genuinely think 2018/19 was one of his two best seasons (rather than 2019/20), suggest you reconsider this.
I'm sorry that doesn't really wash with me.
When you had Luiz Diaz, who's dad was kidnapped, played and scored then I think excuses start to wear thin.
Apologies, it was the summer before. Although, if i remember correctly, it was his first season with double figures in the league and everything looked rosy once Mourinho got the sack.
Rashford needs to sort himself out. And Man Utd need to sort out this culture of players 'not feeling right' etc. This is life, I'm sorry to say and to be playing football, as a living, with full health, and living such a life, is a gift.
He needs to simplify his game and keep working and keep listening (if, if he is getting coached by anyone at Man Utd....). Rashford could be ok, but the club is lacking management, from boardroom, to First XI.
He needs to simplify his game and keep working and keep listening (if, if he is getting coached by anyone at Man Utd....). Rashford could be ok, but the club is lacking management, from boardroom, to First XI.
We talk about Rashford being out of form and having a bad season. I'm sorry, but this is Rashford's level. Last season was a fluke with the help of a new manager bounce. The two seasons before that, he was just as abysmal as he is playing now.
With Mbappe surely leaving PSG in the summer, I would hope it may spark their interest in Rashford again, but I think it's unlikely. Even if they did, we're a very badly run club who would consider him unsellable as a homegrown player, so we'd probably even turn down a decent offer.
At the very least, ten Hag needs to bench him for the next few games. It's a disgrace that he continues to start games.
With Mbappe surely leaving PSG in the summer, I would hope it may spark their interest in Rashford again, but I think it's unlikely. Even if they did, we're a very badly run club who would consider him unsellable as a homegrown player, so we'd probably even turn down a decent offer.
At the very least, ten Hag needs to bench him for the next few games. It's a disgrace that he continues to start games.
I would say he's regressed past the mean though. His level is higher than this for sure, he's not 20+ goals a season, but he sure as hell isn't no-goals-from-open-play-since-September bad.
I was of the opinion prior to last season, we should sell him to PSG if Mbappe left and I'm probably back at that opinion now. For his good own good as well.
Yes, the point is that after signing his previous bumper new contract, he went on to have definitely his best season up to that point the next season and had 3 out of 4 seasons under that contract where he was one of the most productive LWs in the world.
I don’t think his new contract has anything to do with his current form. I think what is clear though is that he doesn’t react well to adversity. The team is underperforming, he sees the problems and gets frustrated. Rather than leading by example, he then lets his head go down and plays worse (especially when played on the RW where everyone, including him, knows he struggles). Whether there are other off-field issues affecting him is obviously unknown.
Whilst this is obviously a very frustrating flaw, it’s one that the right coach should be able to eradicate (a player being solely motivated by money would be more difficult). Players who can contribute 30+goals at top level do not grow on trees. Son, for example, who is being lauded as a great player Rashford should aspire to has never scored more than 24, and arguably the Spurs team he has played for has generally been a lot stronger than the disjointed mess we’ve had since Rashford emerged.
Personally, I would bench Rashford for the next game as his head hasn’t looked right at all the last few matches. When he is introduced that has to be on the LW (or at a push at CF). We need him to somehow get his mojo back as no other player in our frontline has demonstrated even close to being able to match his top level in their careers.
How can anyone come out onto a pitch and play like that? - I'm still stunned. Disgraceful.
What makes it worse is that he didn't even travel to Turkey like his teammates.
I'm angry the manager/players didn't call him out for it on the pitch - should never be allowed to happen again.
What makes it worse is that he didn't even travel to Turkey like his teammates.
I'm angry the manager/players didn't call him out for it on the pitch - should never be allowed to happen again.
He's a grown man - if he's not mentally right then he should remove himself from playing if he can't give 100%. Other players have gone to various manager's and asked for time off - nothing wrong with it.
You're right, and i should have checked first. I was just explaining that it wasn't intentional, i mixed up his first excellent season at the club with the general state of euphoria in the early days of the Solskjaer era.
I also agree with your point that he doesn't respond very well to adversity. Again, it's not just him. It's more of a general issue that seems to permeate the club. I've also argued earlier in this thread that you can't simply throw him away and expect to be just fine, at least in the short-term, without his goals. The same goes for Bruno etc. On the other hand, the way he wants to play the game and the type of player he's become (indulged by the club, too), creates a conundrum for anyone who occupies the hot seat at the edge of the bench. Let's not forget that we let goalscorers greater than Rashford go, and the team became significantly better. But it wasn't an abrupt cutting of the chord, it happened more organically. A passing of the baton, if you like, with the club not being in the sorry state it is now, either. Which, admittedly, is something that raises the risks and creates questions about what is the best way to move forward.
Furthermore, i don't think that everything starts and ends with his starting position on the pitch. For me, it has to do with his role. He wants to start on the left, but he also wants to be the primary finisher. His best seasons came when he had either Martial or... basically nobody to lead the line. He thrives when the movement around him drags defenders out of position so that he can either attack the pocket of space in-behind or go 1v1 against an opposition defender (preferably a centre-half, not FB, which can occur with overlaps/underlaps or one of the midfielders moving there). That's his element, when he can rely mostly on his instincts. His most unspectacular seasons are when there's another focal point in the box (Lukaku, Ronaldo, Hojlund), which forces him into a more traditional role as a wide player. It's required of him to do "midfield" things and assess the game better, which isn't his strong suit, and he doesn't fancy it much. "You wouldn't ask Ronaldo to start flinging crosses in the box" might be his line of thinking when he throws his hands in the air and stops running.
Won't win an important trophy with Marcus being a starter. He doesn't have the mentality or technical ability when there is no space to ever be a world class player.
He really has been nothing short of a disgrace this season. He should be one of the senior players at the club now, and has his big contract, but shows no leadership whatsoever. Can't even produce the bare minimum in his own performance. Only a matter of time before we start to hear the usual PR around him kick into gear again too. Just hope it doesn't wash.
What's sad is that with the likes of Martial it's expected, he's never had the right attitude.
But Rashford was spot on when he first broke through and the first couple of years. You couldn't ask for a better attitude from a young player.
But Rashford was spot on when he first broke through and the first couple of years. You couldn't ask for a better attitude from a young player.