[Remember the geese]

I've been saying repeatedly ever since Garnacho broke into the squad that at some point a big decision needs to be made between him and Rashford. They won't be able to exist together. Perhaps that big decision will be upon us a little sooner than I thought.

 

[Escobar]

You've been dropped for being lazy, you've got 10 minutes

Run as far and as hard as you can for those 10 minutes, would be my plan.

Rashford just lolled around. Awful level of no effort . He just doesn't seem to want to play .

Fair enough and I would not be surprised if ETH is not bringing him on in the next few games if he does not change drastically. You have the feeling he sees himself above everyone else and does not see the need for him to work his ass off.

 

[Escobar]

I've been saying repeatedly ever since Garnacho broke into the squad that at some point a big decision needs to be made between him and Rashford. They won't be able to exist together. Perhaps that big decision will be upon us a little sooner than I thought.

Like when Ronaldo came in, or Rashford broke through... these young, talented and especially hungry players will kick out the senior players if they're not pushing any longer. I dont have a problem with it and if Rashford cannot be bothered, I dont mind selling him for a nice fee

 

[Pickle85]

That's what it looked like to me, a player short of confidence and unsure where to go a number of times, it's much easier for us to say 'I would have known' when we're watching from on high.

You'll find no complaints from me about how bad h's been defensively when LW or RW and why Antony is so good in that aspect - something as simple coming in when the ball is with the LB to pressure the closest CB, then having to sprint back out to the wing if the ball then comes back and is lifted out to the RB, that's the off the ball running which should be an absolute minimum for our team.

So if he's been so bad defensively on the flanks, what makes you think the only thing stopping him pressing as a CF is it's an unfamiliar position?

Sorry but nah, his attitude was horrendous yet again. He could play anywhere and he'd do no running ATM.

 

[Lentwood]

I genuinely don't think he understands and thinks he has been treated unfairly.

I think the problem with some of these Academy kids is that they are told they are special from the age of 5.

Imagine going to junior school and then secondary school as a Manchester United academy player. Imagine scoring goals for the u18s or u23s and then going into school the next day. They'll be fawned over by people at the club, their schoolmates, even teachers, parents etc...

When I look at Rashford, his performances almost scream of some kind of silent protest. I actually think he reads what is written about him. Remember when this forum was full of talk of how greedy he was by not passing to Hojlund? The very next game he inexplicably tried to roll Bruno in when he was through on goal and the pass was harder than the shot...and he then got pelters for that.

At this point, I think the relationship between him and the club is broken because he believes he's bigger and better than he is. I have been very forthright in my opinion since he was 21 that he's not a first XI standard player at United but we've promoted him well beyond his abilities.

He should be a Nicky Butt / Phil Neville-type squad player. Happy to sit on the bench most of the time and make an impact when needed. Instead he believes he's this superstar who's entitled not only to play every game but also to pick his position!

 

[Remember the geese]

Like when Ronaldo came in, or Rashford broke through... these young, talented and especially hungry players will kick out the senior players if they're not pushing any longer. I dont have a problem with it and if Rashford cannot be bothered, I dont mind selling him for a nice fee

Think it's the most likely route. You could have seen a scenario where Garnacho becomes impatient if Rashford had kept up his 20-30 goals a season tally. I don't think Garnacho has the temperament or ego to be a bench player long term. Rashford has been put on a pedestal and that allied with the wages he is on means he won't be happy as a substitute here either.

 

[Kill 'em all]

Rashford in this kind of form was part of the recipe when previous managers got sacked after they kept playing him in this kind of form, essentially starting the game with 10 men.

6 months of looking world class and a full season or more of providing nothing. This has been the story of his Manchester United career. He doesn't have the mentality to sustain the highs for very long periods. I'm saying this because when he bothers, he can be an excellent player. Before his contract renewal, many of us were comparing him with Mbappe.

 

[GreatDane]

People still forgetting that his goal spree last season, was mostly confined to 3 month period around and after the World Cup.
After the League Cup final at the end of February, he turned to dogshit for the last 3 months of the season.
Even in that scoring few months, he was shockingly bad at times, but the goals redeemed him.

I'm convinced that if he manages to get his shit together and rediscovers some good form, it'll only last for so long, before he slumps back again.
He's done that for about 4 seasons now.
It's just wishful thinking that he could become a consistent asset to the team.
We can't build a successful squad with players like that.

.

We will never win anything with a patch player like that, agree.
I can forgive a player for bad form, but his lack of trying, running and caring is a deal breaker. Sell him asap.

 

[Escobar]

I know we shouldn't be making excuses for him but he has been coached horribly for most of his senior career. I think he was a better footballer as an 18 year old than he is today. Obviously the poor work rate is on him.I often wonder how he and Martial turn out if lvg had stayed longer.

What a cheap excuse. And you dont coach attitude, work rate or determination - you either apply it or you are lazy.

 

[matherto]

it's almost insulting how easy the depression gets thrown in these performance threads.

Except that he's admitted in the past that he's struggled with it and he's just lost a cousin so who knows what's been going on off the pitch this season?

You can spot the signs quite easily when watching him., coming from someone who's had it and someone who helped people with it.

 

[Leftback99]

People still forgetting that his goal spree last season, was mostly confined to 3 month period around and after the World Cup.
After the League Cup final at the end of February, he turned to dogshit for the last 3 months of the season.
Even in that scoring few months, he was shockingly bad at times, but the goals redeemed him.

I'm convinced that if he manages to get his shit together and rediscovers some good form, it'll only last for so long, before he slumps back again.
He's done that for about 4 seasons now.
It's just wishful thinking that he could become a consistent asset to the team.
We can't build a successful squad with players like that.

.

Yep, 19 goals in his last 49 PL appearances since the start of last season.
- 9 in 39 outside the 10 in 10 hot streak

- 34 in 111 PL appearances since 20/21 including a 6 in 6 streak
- so 18 in 95 appearances outside of his streaky periods

 

[Alex99]

When I look at Rashford, his performances almost scream of some kind of silent protest. I actually think he reads what is written about him. Remember when this forum was full of talk of how greedy he was by not passing to Hojlund? The very next game he inexplicably tried to roll Bruno in when he was through on goal and the pass was harder than the shot...and he then got pelters for that.

His lack of effort against Chelsea had to be deliberate.

Re: the pass to Bruno, that's just a sign of his general lack of football intelligence and poor decision making.

 

[fergiewherearethou]

What on Earth is happening to him is hard to say, but he needs to stay on the bench for a period, as it pains me to say this, Antony is a better option on the right and Garnacho should start every game on the left.

 

[Lentwood]

His lack of effort against Chelsea had to be deliberate.

Re: the pass to Bruno, that's just a sign of his general lack of football intelligence and poor decision making.

Yeah I'm not saying he made that bad pass/decision on purpose - I'm saying it's interesting timing, coming soon after he'd been heavily criticised by fans for choosing not to pass to Hojlund several times in the previous game. It suggests he does read, and is influenced by, things that are said about him by fans/the media.

Perhaps he feels he's being badly treated by the fans? Hung out to dry by the manager? Too much pressure on his shoulders?

Again, as much as I dislike him and think he's an average player, I think the club have failed him these last few years. They gave him a crown he was never fit to wear and piled unnecessary pressure onto his shoulders.

 

[Alex99]

Yeah I'm not saying he made that bad pass/decision on purpose - I'm saying it's interesting timing, coming soon after he'd been heavily criticised by fans for choosing not to pass to Hojlund several times in the previous game.

Perhaps he feels he's being badly treated by the fans? Hung out to dry by the manager? Too much pressure on his shoulders?

Again, as much as I dislike him and think he's an average player, I think the club have failed him these last few years. They gave him a crown he was never fit to wear and piled unnecessary pressure onto his shoulders.

You see it all the time when players are criticised for wasting good opportunities by being greedy. They almost always spend the next game barely shooting, and will invariably end up trying to make a pass when shooting is the better option.

I don't know what his issues are, but as someone who's always been a big fan of us and thought last season was a sign of better things to come, the complete lack of effort has been incredibly disappointing.

 

[Nevilles.Wear.Prada]

Yeah I'm not saying he made that bad pass/decision on purpose - I'm saying it's interesting timing, coming soon after he'd been heavily criticised by fans for choosing not to pass to Hojlund several times in the previous game. It suggests he does read, and is influenced by, things that are said about him by fans/the media.

Perhaps he feels he's being badly treated by the fans? Hung out to dry by the manager? Too much pressure on his shoulders?

Again, as much as I dislike him and think he's an average player, I think the club have failed him these last few years. They gave him a crown he was never fit to wear and piled unnecessary pressure onto his shoulders.

There were few times he looked genuinely shell shocked watching us win it without him from the bench. He believed he earned that crown and rightfully his. He needs to go.

 

[lex talionis]

What on Earth is happening to him is hard to say, but he needs to stay on the bench for a period, as it pains me to say this, Antony is a better option on the right and Garnacho should start every game on the left.

Nail on head…actually, the saying should be head on nail. Whatever.

Garnacho on the left is beyond all possible dispute. So I’m sure Rashford is now frustrated that he’s been shunted to the right, depriving him of that cut to his right foot for the shot and now he’s sulking. Boo fukking hoo. It’s his fault for relying solely on his athleticism and developing his game as a complete footballer. And now that he’s 26, I think, it’s a bit late for him to get where he needed to get 4-5 years ago as that footballer.

 

[tomaldinho1]

I don't mean to single you out, but I really don't get the constant excuse making for Rashford.

I have heavily criticized him all season I just don't get why a quick cameo invokes such ire.

 

[Lentwood]

I have heavily criticized him all season I just don't get why a quick cameo invokes such ire.

I normally agree with your views/posts but I think the reason people are annoyed with that cameo is because clearly he'd learnt absolutely nothing from the experience of being dropped.

I have always been critical of Rashford but remember the game he was dropped last season for being late vs Wolves? He came on and really had the bit between his teeth and scored an excellent goal. The type of goal I rarely see him score, showing sheer will and determination to bludgeon past two challenges. I thought to myself, "maybe this is it, finally a manager has gotten through to him".

The disappointing thing about his 10mins vs Chelsea was he clearly either didn't understand why he'd been dropped or outright chose to ignore the idea that he hasn't been working hard enough. Bear in-mind, he has the freshest legs on the pitch and the team are fighting to hold onto a very important win - and he's ambling around like it's some Football Aid charity game.

I just can't comprehend. I can't play football anymore, had to stop completely at 29 due to three serious knee injuries. It was gutting at the time, can't even play 5-a-side with mates and I absolutely loved the game.

I cannot even begin to comprehend how or why a local lad can be that arrogant, lazy, entitled or whatever the problem is, to represent Manchester United, his boyhood club, and turn in that level of effort. Its an insult to us, the staff and his teammates. Its a privilege, something most of us would kill to have the opportunity to do one time. Me and my one good knee would be racing around that pitch like my life depended on it if I'd had that 10mins at the end!

 

[vanrooney]

I really like rashy alone for his contribution away from football, but it seems as though he is not giving his all and that is frustrating. Maybe he is pissed of with sanchos punishment but he shouldn’t as a professional. Eth is just doing what other successful managers would do. You have to get rid of the rotten apples and instill discipline into the squad. If rashford doesn’t get that he has to go unfortunately

 

[tomaldinho1]

I normally agree with your views/posts but I think the reason people are annoyed with that cameo is because clearly he'd learnt absolutely nothing from the experience of being dropped.

I have always been critical of Rashford but remember the game he was dropped last season for being late vs Wolves? He came on and really had the bit between his teeth and scored an excellent goal. The type of goal I rarely see him score, showing sheer will and determination to bludgeon past two challenges. I thought to myself, "maybe this is it, finally a manager has gotten through to him".

The disappointing thing about his 10mins vs Chelsea was he clearly either didn't understand why he'd been dropped or outright chose to ignore the idea that he hasn't been working hard enough. Bear in-mind, he has the freshest legs on the pitch and the team are fighting to hold onto a very important win - and he's ambling around like it's some Football Aid charity game.

I just can't comprehend. I can't play football anymore, had to stop completely at 29 due to three serious knee injuries. It was gutting at the time, can't even play 5-a-side with mates and I absolutely loved the game.

I cannot even begin to comprehend how or why a local lad can be that arrogant, lazy, entitled or whatever the problem is, to represent Manchester United, his boyhood club, and turn in that level of effort. Its an insult to us, the staff and his teammates. Its a privilege, something most of us would kill to have the opportunity to do one time. Me and my one good knee would be racing around that pitch like my life depended on it if I'd had that 10mins at the end!

I do agree - and said in my response earlier - he could have made more of a 'show' of effort which is probably what people want to see i.e. let's say he closes down a defender at full sprint and wins a throw in, this conversation probably isn't happening, but whilst watching him I just thought it was much more uncertainty than laziness, multiple times from memory he'd look back at one of our players who would then direct him. I could be completely wrong, his attitude might genuinely stink but I find it hard to believe he isn't aware of how terrible he's been and wanted to try and help the team when he came on.

On reflection, I think one issue Rashford has is the team culture is hopefully heading towards a much more confrontational style and he might be too passive a personality for the system - these nippy, hard working and super fit players are much better suited to pressing teams, Antony and Garnacho dish it out as well as take it and feel they have that inner desire to compete for any ball, to somewhat enjoy a scrap with a full back - Antony is arguably too emotional with how he's lashed out a couple of times and Garnacho obviously got booked for dissent but there's so much more to them, it's so much harder for teams to generally bypass our flanks and then you have the super fit pair of Bruno and McT who despite all their flaws never stop running, hound players for 90mins and are starting to reap the rewards offensively now. Neither Garnacho or Antony will likely ever hit the peak numbers in a season Rashford has but then if they make us a better team overall, no one will care.

For the criticism of ETH's signings, this combative streak runs through all of them: Licha, Amrabat, Antony, Hojlund, Case, even Mount has that to his game, we need more of it. I feel it's quite a stark contrast when you think of the likes of Lindelof, AWB, DDG, Sancho, Martial, Rashford and how they appear on the pitch, much quieter, much quicker to drop their heads, never really get into any kind of confrontations.

 

[Nevilles.Wear.Prada]

I do agree - and said in my response earlier - he could have made more of a 'show' of effort which is probably what people want to see i.e. let's say he closes down a defender at full sprint and wins a throw in, this conversation probably isn't happening, but whilst watching him I just thought it was much more uncertainty than laziness, multiple times from memory he'd look back at one of our players who would then direct him. I could be completely wrong, his attitude might genuinely stink but I find it hard to believe he isn't aware of how terrible he's been and wanted to try and help the team when he came on.

On reflection, I think one issue Rashford has is the team culture is hopefully heading towards a much more confrontational style and he might be too passive a personality for the system - these nippy, hard working and super fit players are much better suited to pressing teams, Antony and Garnacho dish it out as well as take it and feel they have that inner desire to compete for any ball, to somewhat enjoy a scrap with a full back - Antony is arguably too emotional with how he's lashed out a couple of times and Garnacho obviously got booked for dissent but there's so much more to them, it's so much harder for teams to generally bypass our flanks and then you have the super fit pair of Bruno and McT who despite all their flaws never stop running, hound players for 90mins and are starting to reap the rewards offensively now. Neither Garnacho or Antony will likely ever hit the peak numbers in a season Rashford has but then if they make us a better team overall, no one will care.

For the criticism of ETH's signings, this combative streak runs through all of them: Licha, Amrabat, Antony, Hojlund, Case, even Mount has that to his game, we need more of it. I feel it's quite a stark contrast when you think of the likes of Lindelof, AWB, DDG, Sancho, Martial, Rashford and how they appear on the pitch, much quieter, much quicker to drop their heads, never really get into any kind of confrontations.

Never liked ETH as a ManUtd manager, hated most of his signings but you are right, he did tried to instill some steel into us. Fair play

 

[Borninthe80ts]

The hate for a player who does love the club and is clearly suffering from mental health issues is staggering. Is he in poor form? No doubt but I just hope that those he bury him on here don’t move onto social media with their abuse. Hopefully out of the line of pressure he can regain confidence and form. Maybe at his age the fluidity should be more apparent but injuries( and playing through them) at crucial times in his career surely hasn’t helped him progress.

 

[AndySmith1990]

The hate for a player who does love the club and is clearly suffering from mental health issues is staggering. Is he in poor form? No doubt but I just hope that those he bury him on here don’t move onto social media with their abuse. Hopefully out of the line of pressure he can regain confidence and form. Maybe at his age the fluidity should be more apparent but injuries( and playing through them) at crucial times in his career surely hasn’t helped him progress.

You should try thinking up a few more excuses for him, see if you can reach double digits

 

[luke511]

The hate for a player who does love the club and is clearly suffering from mental health issues is staggering. Is he in poor form? No doubt but I just hope that those he bury him on here don’t move onto social media with their abuse. Hopefully out of the line of pressure he can regain confidence and form. Maybe at his age the fluidity should be more apparent but injuries( and playing through them) at crucial times in his career surely hasn’t helped him progress.

He's made a rod for his own back. As soon as he chooses to not defend, to deliberately walk past opposition players instead of covering them whilst showing signs of entitlement and arrogance, it's all on him.

 

[Lentwood]

For the criticism of ETH's signings, this combative streak runs through all of them: Licha, Amrabat, Antony, Hojlund, Case, even Mount has that to his game, we need more of it. I feel it's quite a stark contrast when you think of the likes of Lindelof, AWB, DDG, Sancho, Martial, Rashford and how they appear on the pitch, much quieter, much quicker to drop their heads, never really get into any kind of confrontations.

This is why I have never criticised his signings, because I can see what he's shooting for and I 100% agree with the approach.

United fans need to get used to more Mount's and Antony's and fewer Pogba's and Sancho's. Flair and flash-in-the-pan skills are secondary to work-rate and tenacity.

That's a good thing, in my book

 

[tenpoless]

The hate for a player who does love the club and is clearly suffering from mental health issues is staggering. Is he in poor form? No doubt but I just hope that those he bury him on here don’t move onto social media with their abuse. Hopefully out of the line of pressure he can regain confidence and form. Maybe at his age the fluidity should be more apparent but injuries( and playing through them) at crucial times in his career surely hasn’t helped him progress.

Did I miss anything? mental health issue? He looked very lively and happy last season. What changed then?

 

[tomaldinho1]

This is why I have never criticised his signings, because I can see what he's shooting for and I 100% agree with the approach.

United fans need to get used to more Mount's and Antony's and fewer Pogba's and Sancho's. Flair and flash-in-the-pan skills are secondary to work-rate and tenacity.

That's a good thing, in my book

Agree - we've been constantly buying players before getting the system in place, this time if ETH stays I think we will do it the right way round. if he's good enough to then elevate the team to the level we win things, remains to be seen, but we absolutely have to get a core group of aggressive feckers who will graft and buy into the system before we get anywhere.

 

[jem]

The hate for a player who does love the club and is clearly suffering from mental health issues is staggering. Is he in poor form? No doubt but I just hope that those he bury him on here don’t move onto social media with their abuse. Hopefully out of the line of pressure he can regain confidence and form. Maybe at his age the fluidity should be more apparent but injuries( and playing through them) at crucial times in his career surely hasn’t helped him progress.

I've always found this statement so empty. Just by watching their respective performances on the pitch, you'd swear Wayne Rooney had been the wool United fan, not Rashford. And yes Rooney flirted with the idea of leaving, but then so has Rashford, so I really struggle to see a player who gives his all for the club. As much as I hated him, Gerrard came across as that kind of player; Rashford not so much.

 

[owlo]

Think Garnacho is in an interesting period development wise; he has the technique etc as well as some intelligence, the question is whether he'll pick up the decision making. Some do (Ronaldo, Kane were bad at it his age) and some just never get it. Rashford seeming to be a prime example. He'll go through up and downs, but it's not like we can't play both if they are both in form anyway.

 

[Alex99]

I've always found this statement so empty. Just by watching their respective performances on the pitch, you'd swear Wayne Rooney had been the wool United fan, not Rashford. And yes Rooney flirted with the idea of leaving, but then so has Rashford, so I really struggle to see a player who gives his all for the club. As much as I hated him, Gerrard came across as that kind of player; Rashford not so much.

Gerrard getting about and wanting to be involved with everything actively hindered Liverpool in his final season there.

He wasn't really playing too often until it was announced he'd be leaving at the end of the season, then Rodgers bowed to pressure to include him more and results tanked precisely because his legs had gone but he was still trying to play like he always had, and it made him a passenger.

Rashford can't even break into a jog when he's come on as a sub with 10 minutes to go, at what's supposed to be the prime of his career.

 

[hobbers]

The hate for a player who does love the club and is clearly suffering from mental health issues is staggering.

“clearly” …

 

[jem]

Gerrard getting about and wanting to be involved with everything actively hindered Liverpool in his final season there.

He wasn't really playing too often until it was announced he'd be leaving at the end of the season, then Rodgers bowed to pressure to include him more and results tanked precisely because his legs had gone but he was still trying to play like he always had, and it made him a passenger.

Rashford can't even break into a jog when he's come on as a sub with 10 minutes to go, at what's supposed to be the prime of his career.

Yeah I hated Gerrard, and my brother (who for some fecking reason is a Liverpool fan) wanted him gone during those final years. But with regard to the post that I was responding to, you could see that Gerrard really gave his all for the team (despite obviously having a huge ego and even flirting with Chelsea at one point.) I've never seen that from Rashford.

 

[flappyjay]

What a cheap excuse. And you dont coach attitude, work rate or determination - you either apply it or you are lazy.

I love how you skipped the part where I said his lack of work rate is on him not the coaching.

 

[Alex99]

Yeah I hated Gerrard, and my brother (who for some fecking reason is a Liverpool fan) wanted him gone during those final years. But with regard to the post that I was responding to, you could see that Gerrard really gave his all for the team (despite obviously having a huge ego and even flirting with Chelsea at one point.) I've never seen that from Rashford.

Yeah, that was my point really. He always gave his all, even when him charging out of position and not having the legs to get back was a hindrance and not a help.

Still hate him, mind.

 

[Borninthe80ts]

You should try thinking up a few more excuses for him, see if you can reach double digits

Okay. That’s the response.

 

[Borninthe80ts]

He's made a rod for his own back. As soon as he chooses to not defend, to deliberately walk past opposition players instead of covering them whilst showing signs of entitlement and arrogance, it's all on him.

Nobody’s excusing poor form or an apparent lack of application. I’m talking about comments going past him as a player. Also the way you phrased it highlights my point. He doesn’t choose to play poorly. Clearly something other than him not caring. Also someone who does outside activities like he does wouldn’t suggest a entitled or arrogant individual.

 

[Borninthe80ts]

Did I miss anything? mental health issue? He looked very lively and happy last season. What changed then?

He has mentioned in the past he has struggles in this area, coupled with abuse on social media and issues with squad players who are close to him I believe these have an impact. Also while he was in good form last season he also went through phases were he was targeted by fans and media alike.

 

[luke511]

Nobody’s excusing poor form or an apparent lack of application. I’m talking about comments going past him as a player. Also the way you phrased it highlights my point. He doesn’t choose to play poorly. Clearly something other than him not caring. Also someone who does outside activities like he does wouldn’t suggest a entitled or arrogant individual.

Jimmy Saville raised £40 million for charity, it’s not always an honest reflection on a person’s personality. I think he’s become a very entitled and arrogant person, there’s no other way he’d behave the way he has on the pitch at times in his career. He got subbed vs Newcastle after a horrible display in every aspect and his response to it was “what the feck am I doing here?”, to me that shows his head is well inserted up his own arse.

 

[hobbers]

Also someone who does outside activities like he does wouldn’t suggest a entitled or arrogant individual.

Only if they took part in those activities without plastering it all over their socials and making sure there's always plenty of press coverage of them.

Otherwise it's a PR exercise.

He has mentioned in the past he has struggles in this area, coupled with abuse on social media and issues with squad players who are close to him I believe these have an impact. Also while he was in good form last season he also went through phases were he was targeted by fans and media alike.

So the diagnosis of "clear mental health problems" are because of basically non-existent social media abuse, and empathy for Sancho?