Martial is our most important player

[Yagami]

Rashford seems to have raised his game this season, across all areas... Martial needs to do the same.

Martial has done the same. His improvement isn't as significant as Marcus', no, but he has improved nonetheless.

It is no surprise that OGS was interested in Haaland. Perhaps consider those clubs who were not so interested in buying him. Ask yourself why that is.

Well, if you're going by that logic, why did we buy a LW in James when we had Rashford? It's called squad depth.

As for clubs being interested in Martial, how would anyone of us know? Woodward made it clear he was not for sale anyway when Inter tried asking for him.

This season defines Martial at Man United. Another average season, and that's it. He needs a big second half to this season. Not another average one.

Martial's having a good season. If he hadn't missed two or so months of this season not only would his stats be better, we'd be a lot higher up in the table, too. If he stays fit now until the end of the season chances are this will be his best one here.[/QUOTE]

 

[roonster09]

I agree. I have stated, throughout his time at United.. compare him (Martial) to Aguero, Vardy, Kane.. Even Mane, Salah.. ( not even No 9's...). Is he as effective as those players? Does he contribute as much? Work as hard? Lead the line? Inspire the team?

How many seasons does he need? Six.. Eight...?

Rashford seems to have raised his game this season, across all areas... Martial needs to do the same. It is no surprise that OGS was interested in Haaland. Perhaps consider those clubs who were not so interested in buying him. Ask yourself why that is.

This season defines Martial at Man United. Another average season, and that's it. He needs a big second half to this season. Not another average one.

Sorry, I just do not agree. He's 24. Not 17, 18.... How he plays is how he is... He isn't 'learning' anymore.

So were these players as good when they were 24? Did they remain same players or improved even after they were 25/26?

There is clear improvement in his play or at least he has got showcase his talent in the preferred position and he is playing very well this season.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Anthony Martial has had four seasons at United. I base my opinion on his performances.

He is an average forward. Consistently average. His first season was great. Since then he is consistently inconsistent.

How is that a player with 'talent'?

A few good goals and a few good performances every season does not equate to a very good player. It equates to an average player.

Martial, Lingard, Shaw, Fred... these are average players. Not top players. If you are satisfied with that quality at OT then that's up to you. I want us to do better.

Martial has been as good this season as he was in the first. And he was manage poorly by Mourinho for two and a half years. To put him in the same boat as Lingard reflects poor judgment on your part. In reality Martial like Rashford and Pogba is one of our best players. Can we do better? Probably. Can be do better? Of course. But our best performers are the least of our concerns right now.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I agree. I have stated, throughout his time at United.. compare him (Martial) to Aguero, Vardy, Kane.. Even Mane, Salah.. ( not even No 9's...). Is he as effective as those players? Does he contribute as much? Work as hard? Lead the line? Inspire the team?

How many seasons does he need? Six.. Eight...?

Rashford seems to have raised his game this season, across all areas... Martial needs to do the same. It is no surprise that OGS was interested in Haaland. Perhaps consider those clubs who were not so interested in buying him. Ask yourself why that is.

This season defines Martial at Man United. Another average season, and that's it. He needs a big second half to this season. Not another average one.

There's been little between Martial and Rashford this season. Not sure which team you've been watching. His link up play had been ace and he's scoring a decent amount of goals in a team that doesnt create much.

 

[Sp00ks11]

I think one of the biggest benefits that Martial is having this season is the fact he actually receives the ball from Rashford these days. They are actually striking up a decent partnership now, whereas before it looked like Rashford felt HE had to score rather than Martial as he saw him as competition for one spot in the team. Now they both have a position in the team it has brought the best out of both of them, but has benefited Martial more so. Hope Martial can stay fit for the rest of the season, he is a joy to watch.

 

[Jonno]

Anthony Martial has had four seasons at United. I base my opinion on his performances.

He is an average forward. Consistently average. His first season was great. Since then he is consistently inconsistent.

How is that a player with 'talent'?

A few good goals and a few good performances every season does not equate to a very good player. It equates to an average player.

Martial, Lingard, Shaw, Fred... these are average players. Not top players. If you are satisfied with that quality at OT then that's up to you. I want us to do better.

You're getting confused with raw talent and consistency.

He has bucketloads of raw talent, but he isn't consistent.

Just because he is inconsistent, you shouldn't just dismiss the obvious talents he does have.

 

[Jonno]

Sorry, I just do not agree. He's 24. Not 17, 18.... How he plays is how he is... He isn't 'learning' anymore.

Anthony Martial started this season aged 23, just to compare, Salah was playing for Chelsea when he was 23 and shipped out to Fiorentina at 24.

Salah aged 23/24 is not even on the same planet as the Mo Salah currently 27 playing for Liverpool.

To suggest a player can't develop or learn when they're 24 is ridiculous.

 

[Jeffthered]

The responses are interesting, so thanks for them, it makes for a good forum.

The fact that there is still a debate tells me much. Someone mentioned that if someone better comes along, he will be 'upgraded'. Of course he will. Who can state on here that they could rely, or expect Anthony Martial to inspire, lead and fire us to a Premiership title? A CL win? How many would confidently state that? And he is not too young for that. No way.

The name of this forum. provides an extremely interesting assessment of things at Old Trafford. Anthony Martial is our most important player? Really? Based on what, this season? Current form ? And more importantly (and this is my underlying point....) what does that statement say about Manchester United FC when Anthony Martial is our most important player?

That may satisfy some on here, but it tells me much about how our standards and expectations have lowered in recent years. LVG, Mourinho, Deschamps.. all have clearly stated their issues about him, and they are all wrong? It was literally a couple of games ago when Ryan Giggs questioned his effort and comittment as a centre forward, and suggested that Greenwood should not be overlooked if this continues. I would think Ryan Giggs knows a thing or two, probably saw Martial, day-in-day out for a while too...

I love this club, passionately , but this debate happens every single season with Martial. I have watched forwards emerge and develop far, far quicker.. (look at Rashford!) not just here, look around Europe since Anthony Martial has been at the club.

I think we should be doing much better than settling for him as our No 1 centre forward. Just my opinion.

 

[Jeffthered]

Anthony Martial started this season aged 23, just to compare, Salah was playing for Chelsea when he was 23 and shipped out to Fiorentina at 24.

Salah aged 23/24 is not even on the same planet as the Mo Salah currently 27 playing for Liverpool.

To suggest a player can't develop or learn when they're 24 is ridiculous.

So you think we should keep him, as our No 9, until he turns 27, and hope that by that time, he is that super fantastic player that some on here seem to suggest he will be? Sounds a lot like Jesse Lindgard to me, and I could probably name some others. So many 'young talents.... ' and what happens to them?

I do not think he is still 'learning'. I think what he needs is to apply himself more. It's always the same with him. You know some on here feel that he is a potential Ballon' D'or winner? And people say that I am exaggerating.

 

[Eugenius]

A history of Martial’s seasons here:

Debut: comes in up front, scores goals. Moved to LW because Depay flopped and he was our only effective / pacey wing option. Our best player.

Season 2: Mourinho comes in. Zlatan plays every game as CF. Rotated with Rashford on LW. Mainly comes off the bench but has great goals to minute ratio (caf argues he can only play against tired defences). Has off field issues and doesn’t hit any sustained form.

Season 3: Lukaku CF. Eventually wins LW spot from Rashford having started from the bench. Hits form mid season, scoring 3 games in a row in PL. Sanchez signed, moved to RW and benched.

Season 4: Keeps Mourinho in his job for a large part, our best attacker as we struggle. Bounce under Ole but fades with the rest of team after he becomes permanent manager.

Season 5: Misses 6 weeks of the season where we struggle without him. Attack instantly looks better with him. Scoring around 1 in 2 as main CF.

In all his perceives lack of development is more a reflection he actually hasn’t had a run in the team under Mourinho and overall the team struggled. It’s actually a similar story to Rashford or any of our youngsters.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

So you think we should keep him, as our No 9, until he turns 27, and hope that by that time, he is that super fantastic player that some on here seem to suggest he will be? Sounds a lot like Jesse Lindgard to me, and I could probably name some others. So many 'young talents.... ' and what happens to them?

I do not think he is still 'learning'. I think what he needs is to apply himself more. It's always the same with him. You know some on here feel that he is a potential Ballon' D'or winner? And people say that I am exaggerating.

No, first we fix the strength of the collective (cohesion, tactics, fluidity) improve our areas or weakness rather than focusing on one of our best performers. Of course even Rashford and Martial should be held to high standards and eventually we need top class seasons from our forwards however right now we have to focus on other more pertinent things. A better team will also help them get there btw.

 

[Jonno]

So you think we should keep him, as our No 9, until he turns 27, and hope that by that time, he is that super fantastic player that some on here seem to suggest he will be? Sounds a lot like Jesse Lindgard to me, and I could probably name some others. So many 'young talents.... ' and what happens to them?

I do not think he is still 'learning'. I think what he needs is to apply himself more. It's always the same with him. You know some on here feel that he is a potential Ballon' D'or winner? And people say that I am exaggerating.

I agree largely with the points you make. I think that he doesn't naturally possess the mental tools to make it to the very top (ie. resiliance when the game isn't going his way, he tends to hide behind his marker and go missing for large parts, he tends to stop making the correct runs, he doesn't arrive in the 6 yard box, ever, even thought when the likes of Dan James get the ball thats the only place it's going to end up), I see too much inconsistency in his game.

I don't want our true number 9 to be bagging 15 goals in the league on average each season, we need 25-30.

But that doesn't mean flog him, that means buy another top striker and make him earn his spot. Competition for places is healthy and can make him get to the top.

If you don't think he has the potential to explode into a 30+ goals per season striker, then i'm very surprised because he's demonstrated his abilities and his potential. He could reach his peak in 2-3 years and win a PL title. You just don't know. I bet Ole and his staff who work with him day in, day out knows more than you or me though.

 

[JPRouve]

A history of Martial’s seasons here:

Debut: comes in up front, scores goals. Moved to LW because Depay flopped and he was our only effective / pacey wing option. Our best player.

Season 2: Mourinho comes in. Zlatan plays every game as CF. Rotated with Rashford on LW. Mainly comes off the bench but has great goals to minute ratio (caf argues he can only play against tired defences). Has off field issues and doesn’t hit any sustained form.

Season 3: Lukaku CF. Eventually wins LW spot from Rashford having started from the bench. Hits form mid season, scoring 3 games in a row in PL. Sanchez signed, moved to RW and benched.

Season 4: Keeps Mourinho in his job for a large part, our best attacker as we struggle. Bounce under Ole but fades with the rest of team after he becomes permanent manager.

Season 5: Misses 6 weeks of the season where we struggle without him. Attack instantly looks better with him. Scoring around 1 in 2 as main CF.

In all his perceives lack of development is more a reflection he actually hasn’t had a run in the team under Mourinho and overall the team struggled. It’s actually a similar story to Rashford or any of our youngsters.

Your last point is key, Rashford and Martial have had the same type of development during the same period of time but I don't think that it's perceived the same way, Martial commitment is questioned while Rashford's isn't even though they both competed against the other and both won and loss at some points. But we have learn under Ole that they are consistent and play well when they are together and play week in week out while they are inconsistent when they don't play together. So to me both threads are a bit silly, they are a package and they are the most important duo in the team, hopefully we will find a third member.

 

[Kag]

@Jeffthered has seriously attempted to argue that players don’t learn past the point of 24 and then proceeded to use Jamie Vardy as the yardstick at which he compares Martial to. A man who was on tag aged 22 and making medical splints in a factory until he was 26.

Wonderful.

 

[Posh Red]

Comparing Martial to Salah? Think his best season was about twelve league goals before Liverpool signed him, and that was in Italy! Grass is always greener I suppose

 

[sunama]

@Jeffthered has seriously attempted to argue that players don’t learn past the point of 24 and then proceeded to use Jamie Vardy as the yardstick at which he compares Martial to. A man who was on tag aged 22 and making medical splints in a factory until he was 26.

Do remember though, Vardy is the exception.
I think Shearer also did not become World class until he reached age 26.
There are some players who keep learning and improving until their late 20s, but these are rare. If the player is not lighting up the World by his early 20s, I don't expect him to do so at a later age.
Personally, I don't expect Martial to improve, as he does not possess the tough mentality required to make it to the top. He'll be fine playing for a top 6 club, but to win the title, you need a striker of immense quality.

Let's not forget, being a striker is all about scoring goals. Ronaldo and Messi do a lot of other stuff on the pitch, but it's the fact that they score large numbers of goals that sets them apart from their peers.
I know that some of you don't care about scoring goals, but scoring goals is the primary role of a striker and is what wins you games.
To date, Martial's top scoring season is 11 league goals when he was 18! He is nowhere near what is required to be a top striker.

So, who do I define as a top striker? Kane. He is of similar age, where his top 4 seasons (for league goals) are: 30, 29, 25, 21.
His worst season is 17 league goals, which is still 50% better than Martial's best season.
When it comes to goal scoring, Kane at his worst is better than Martial at his best.
I'll put it another way. If Martial had the season of his life and doubled his best season's league goal tally, he still wouldn't be good enough to outscore Kane.

 

[TwoSheds]

He still doesn't score scrappy goals, his movement in the box is crap. And if anyone mentions cutbacks again I'll find you and slap you with a wet fish.

On the other hand the rest of his game has been very good this year. If he ever discovers the near post run he might actually become a top forward.

 

[Jeffthered]

@Jeffthered has seriously attempted to argue that players don’t learn past the point of 24 and then proceeded to use Jamie Vardy as the yardstick at which he compares Martial to. A man who was on tag aged 22 and making medical splints in a factory until he was 26.

Wonderful.

I did not say players do not develop past the age of 24. I said that I do not feel he is still 'learning'. He was at Monaco, and then has four seasons and bit here. And he is still learning? Players at 24 have their games and styles pretty much set out. How many players who are radically inconsistent, become fantastically consistent and World Class by 27? maybe a few, but please do not suggest this is the norm.

Martial needs to use his left foot. Go outside instead of always cutting inside. How about scoring a few goals with his head perhaps? Sorry, you don't need to wait until the age of 27 to do this... that's about application, not learning. As many state on here, he has all the tools required. So what is stopping him?

Daniel James has made a difference, and he is 22. McTominay has taken on more responsibility, and now makes more of an impact for United. He is a year younger than Martial. So why can't Martial take a look at those two as an example. And neither of those have required 'four seasons'.

Martial needs to decide whether he wants to be a world class player or not. Every player can blame managers etc. But Martial has had time.

 

[Woodzy]

If anyone says they thought Salah would one day be among the worlds best players when he was at Chelsea then they are either lying or incredibly gifted!

Martial can still make it to the top, just as many other players after the age of 25 do.

In fact, it’s probably more rare that players look world beaters in their early 20’s.

 

[Raven]

If anyone says they thought Salah would one day be among the worlds best players when he was at Chelsea then they are either lying or incredibly gifted!

Martial can still make it to the top, just as many other players after the age of 25 do.

In fact, it’s probably more rare that players look world beaters in their early 20’s.

Some people in this forum are on meth. Martial is currently on course for a 20 goal season if he stays fit and that's with him having spent 6 weeks on the sidelines already. It is absolutely no coincidence that when Martial returned to the team, we instantly went up a notch in terms of goals and creativity. With Pogba being out so long, Martial has absolutely been our most important player, something that can't be said for Salah or anyone else on the list posted by @Jeffthered with the exception of Aguero and Kane.

 

[Slik]

I did not say players do not develop past the age of 24. I said that I do not feel he is still 'learning'. He was at Monaco, and then has four seasons and bit here. And he is still learning? Players at 24 have their games and styles pretty much set out. How many players who are radically inconsistent, become fantastically consistent and World Class by 27? maybe a few, but please do not suggest this is the norm.

Martial needs to use his left foot. Go outside instead of always cutting inside. How about scoring a few goals with his head perhaps? Sorry, you don't need to wait until the age of 27 to do this... that's about application, not learning. As many state on here, he has all the tools required. So what is stopping him?

Daniel James has made a difference, and he is 22. McTominay has taken on more responsibility, and now makes more of an impact for United. He is a year younger than Martial. So why can't Martial take a look at those two as an example. And neither of those have required 'four seasons'.

Martial needs to decide whether he wants to be a world class player or not. Every player can blame managers etc. But Martial has had time.

Dude which team have you been watching? JAmes has made a difference and martial hasn’t this season? He should learn from James ? What are you on about? James has had some good games especially beginning of the season but has been no where consistent himself and surely isn’t even on the same level as martial.
Take martial out of the squad and the team will be struggling again like it did when he was injured and we had to play Rashford upto (who was useless there to be clear). Martial is the glue that holds United’s attack together at the moment . Even Ole has said as much when he returned from injury.
Your hate is so obvious because your points don’t make any sense whatsoever.
You compare martial to lingard when lingards entire career goals and assists doesn’t even amount to half of martials even though martial is 24. Martial can be better because of his obvious talent and players tend to become more consistent when they go past 26. Some players are consistent even at a young age. But martials talent alone and what he offers the team even currently is way more than anything that so called lingard ever has and ever will for United.

 

[RedIan]

The win ratio stats with Martial in v out support Martial is crucial to the team. When hes on form and looking happy he is superb. Still too many indifferent games but we always remember the last game or 2 most...

 

[Brwned]

If anyone says they thought Salah would one day be among the worlds best players when he was at Chelsea then they are either lying or incredibly gifted!

Martial can still make it to the top, just as many other players after the age of 25 do.

In fact, it’s probably more rare that players look world beaters in their early 20’s.

I had a quick glance through some of the top scorers in the PL over the years...

• Les Ferdinand - had scored 2 league goals in English football by the time he was Martial's age, by the time he'd turned 30 he'd scored over 20 league goals in 3 out of 4 seasons
• Eric Cantona - we know the story
• Andy Cole - was Martial's age now when he moved here, and he struggled in those early years and clearly hadn't established himself as United's #9 by the time he was even 26
• Ian Wright - at 24 he was still playing 2nd division football and hadn't managed to get into double figures in the league, but from the age of 27-34 he managed 15+ league goals every season
• Dwight Yorke - at 24 he had only scored 10+ goals in all competitions once (compared to Martial's 5), and much of that was down to playing on the wing for much of his early career too - he then went on to score 20+ goals in 4 of his next 5
• Didier Droga - at 24 he left Ligue 2 to join Guingamp, and managed 3 goals in half a season, on par with his scoring record until that point - 5 years later he'd established himself as a PL great
• Diego Costa - at 24 he'd just had his real breakthrough season with Real Valladolid, getting into double figures in the top division for the first time, after which he managed 30+ league goals in 3 of his next 5 season

It's not the norm that players suddenly catapult forward at exactly age 24, but most players do go through a fairly significant transformation in that 22-26 year old age range, and precisely when that happens isn't a particularly strong indicator of how good they'll become. If Yorke and Martial played consistently in their best position for most of their early 20s, they might've had that breakthrough season much earlier. Drogba had issues in his early 20s with fitness, and also with his "complicated personal life", much like Martial - and then he said something clicked when his son was born. Things off the pitch do make a difference, and people mature at their own pace.

 

[JPRouve]

If anyone says they thought Salah would one day be among the worlds best players when he was at Chelsea then they are either lying or incredibly gifted!

Martial can still make it to the top, just as many other players after the age of 25 do.

In fact, it’s probably more rare that players look world beaters in their early 20’s.

Even the players that look world beaters in their early 20s are generally better later, with the exception of players with bad injury records. One just has to look at the current top players or last Ballon d'Or winners.

 

[gajender]

I have never understood the notion that Martial lacks resilience and fight ,till this season he never had permanent spot in the first team he had to earn it sometimes with greater scrutiny and higher standards then the others but he did earn it ,maybe he needs a coach who while being demanding and tough genuinely believes in him to unleash his full potential.

 

[RedRonaldo]

In his first season with us he has scored 17 goals in 49 games, quite impressive for a 20 year old young forward who is quite talented and skilful.

During his 2nd to 4th season he average only around 10 goals per season, which is bit disappointing as in contrast to the early form he has shown to us, and he seems to be quite inconsistent throughout, although one could argue that the change of manager and playing for team under transition didn't help..

This is his 5th season with us, so far he has scored 10 goals in 19 games, and lead our attack line quite well. I felt this is going to be his best season yet, and he will start to fulfil his early promise for us and become the player we once thought he would.

 

[JPRouve]

In his first season with us he has scored 17 goals in 49 games, quite impressive for a 20 year old young forward who is quite talented and skilful.

During his 2nd to 4th season he average only around 10 goals per season, which is bit disappointing as in contrast to the early form he has shown to us, and he seems to be quite inconsistent throughout, although one could argue that the change of manager and playing for team under transition didn't help..

This is his 5th season with us, so far he has scored 10 goals in 19 games, and lead our attack line quite well. I felt this is going to be his best season yet, and he will start to fulfil his early promise for us and become the player we once thought he would.

On your second sentence this record was done while playing around half of the available minutes, it's not as disappointing as it seems.

 

[Samid]

Scholes on Martial

“With Anthony Martial, it’s interesting, I don’t know if he’s a wide player, I don’t know if he’s a centre forward.

“Ole [Gunnar Solskjaer] clearly thinks there’s a centre forward in there and he’s telling him to get in the box as often as he can.

“[Against Chelsea] he laboured at times to get in the box, he didn’t really bust a gut. You shouldn’t need to [tell a striker to get into the penalty box], but if you’re Anthony Martial he looks like he needs telling.

“He looks like he doesn’t take that much information in. Some players are like that, sometimes you tell them once and they’ll do it all the time.

“He looks like you need to tell him every two minutes, what you want him to do.”

TLDR: Scholes thinks Martial is a dimwit. I think he's making a good point for once.

 

[Posh Red]

Scholes on Martial


TLDR: Scholes thinks Martial is a dimwit. I think he's making a good point for once.

Well if we play Ighalo in his place and there is a noticeable difference then we can agree with Scholes possibly. In my opinion it’s more a problem of how we set up in an attacking sense. Hopefully I’m wrong as one player is a far easier problem to fix.

 

[Stadjer]

Scholes on Martial


TLDR: Scholes thinks Martial is a dimwit. I think he's making a good point for once.

''bust a gut''.. is that in the category as ''earn the shirt'' and ''play for the badge''?

The only support Martial had during the Chelsea game was Daniel James running somewhere and running into a Chelsea player and losing the ball when he got on the ball. Martial dropped deep the hold up the ball because realisticly he doesnt have much of a chance by himself without any support against those Chelsea centre backs. The reason he did score was because that header was really special but not something you could expect of any player to do all the time.

I think it makes perfect sense that he didnt stay in the box against and tried to bring other players into play by holding up the ball. He just wasnt very good at holding up the ball against Chelsea which was disappointing because he usually isnt bad at that.

 

[Vault Dweller]

There was numerous times in the first half where he was passed the ball to hold it up and every time he was tackled or lost it.

His run into the box for his goal was excellent and that's what we need to be doing far more, moving it quicker in transition and down the flanks. Constantly feeding the ball to Martial on the halfway line where he isn't good enough to hold it up is not the way to go when he is our foremost player.

 

[AttackAttackAttack]

I’d like to see martial played up top with Ighalo. I think the two of them feeding off each other could be fruitful. Don’t need to hold to ball up for long if another striker is close to you. A lot of one touch passes in behind the defenders.

 

[Falcow]

Scholes always had great football intelligence on the field so I think he knows what he is talking about here.

I think Martial just doesnt put in the level of work required to be effective in the centre of the front three, he may be better suited to a front 2.

That said he does not have the quality around him at the moment, it would be interesting to see him with rashford on the left of him and someone like a peak Arjuen Robben on the other side, I like Daniel James but he just doesnt have enough to be a starter for us. I think that right attacking position is our biggest need, we have nobody anywhere near good enough for it, bar the odd AVB cross there is nothing happening for us on that right side.

 

[Sky1981]

I had a quick glance through some of the top scorers in the PL over the years...

• Les Ferdinand - had scored 2 league goals in English football by the time he was Martial's age, by the time he'd turned 30 he'd scored over 20 league goals in 3 out of 4 seasons
• Eric Cantona - we know the story
• Andy Cole - was Martial's age now when he moved here, and he struggled in those early years and clearly hadn't established himself as United's #9 by the time he was even 26
• Ian Wright - at 24 he was still playing 2nd division football and hadn't managed to get into double figures in the league, but from the age of 27-34 he managed 15+ league goals every season
• Dwight Yorke - at 24 he had only scored 10+ goals in all competitions once (compared to Martial's 5), and much of that was down to playing on the wing for much of his early career too - he then went on to score 20+ goals in 4 of his next 5
• Didier Droga - at 24 he left Ligue 2 to join Guingamp, and managed 3 goals in half a season, on par with his scoring record until that point - 5 years later he'd established himself as a PL great
• Diego Costa - at 24 he'd just had his real breakthrough season with Real Valladolid, getting into double figures in the top division for the first time, after which he managed 30+ league goals in 3 of his next 5 season

It's not the norm that players suddenly catapult forward at exactly age 24, but most players do go through a fairly significant transformation in that 22-26 year old age range, and precisely when that happens isn't a particularly strong indicator of how good they'll become. If Yorke and Martial played consistently in their best position for most of their early 20s, they might've had that breakthrough season much earlier. Drogba had issues in his early 20s with fitness, and also with his "complicated personal life", much like Martial - and then he said something clicked when his son was born. Things off the pitch do make a difference, and people mature at their own pace.

None of them plays with manchester united from the age of 19.

 

[Pexbo]

''bust a gut''.. is that in the category as ''earn the shirt'' and ''play for the badge''?

No, it's just an old English idiom that means "Make every effort"

 

[Mr PG]

Martial clearly lacks proper conditioning. Rashford is determined, persistent and blistering fast he never gives up and puts up a hectic fight with his wiry frame. Martial on the other hand is slower than when he first arrived, always easily shoved off the ball and walks a lot on the field or lazily jogs around.

He tends to do better on the wing when Pogba can feed him balls to the feet as he does possess some decent foot skills but in a top team you have to be more dynamic and fight for those wayward passes intended for you. The Mourinho coaching staff worked on developing his outside game as he would always cut in when playing on the wing. He did develop that the problem now is when he plays on the wing he always goes on the outside...100% of the times so he is easy to mark which is why people accuse him of lacking football intelligence.

Martial will be found out when Ighalo plays as fans will see what a number 9 should really be like. in 5 minutes, Ighalo's movement against chelsea was better than anything I have seen from Martial all season.

 

[elmo]

I had a quick glance through some of the top scorers in the PL over the years...

• Les Ferdinand - had scored 2 league goals in English football by the time he was Martial's age, by the time he'd turned 30 he'd scored over 20 league goals in 3 out of 4 seasons
• Eric Cantona - we know the story
• Andy Cole - was Martial's age now when he moved here, and he struggled in those early years and clearly hadn't established himself as United's #9 by the time he was even 26
• Ian Wright - at 24 he was still playing 2nd division football and hadn't managed to get into double figures in the league, but from the age of 27-34 he managed 15+ league goals every season
• Dwight Yorke - at 24 he had only scored 10+ goals in all competitions once (compared to Martial's 5), and much of that was down to playing on the wing for much of his early career too - he then went on to score 20+ goals in 4 of his next 5
• Didier Droga - at 24 he left Ligue 2 to join Guingamp, and managed 3 goals in half a season, on par with his scoring record until that point - 5 years later he'd established himself as a PL great
• Diego Costa - at 24 he'd just had his real breakthrough season with Real Valladolid, getting into double figures in the top division for the first time, after which he managed 30+ league goals in 3 of his next 5 season

It's not the norm that players suddenly catapult forward at exactly age 24, but most players do go through a fairly significant transformation in that 22-26 year old age range, and precisely when that happens isn't a particularly strong indicator of how good they'll become. If Yorke and Martial played consistently in their best position for most of their early 20s, they might've had that breakthrough season much earlier. Drogba had issues in his early 20s with fitness, and also with his "complicated personal life", much like Martial - and then he said something clicked when his son was born. Things off the pitch do make a difference, and people mature at their own pace.

Problem is he's being paid like a star player.

 

[Infra-red]

Scholes on Martial


TLDR: Scholes thinks Martial is a dimwit. I think he's making a good point for once.

I thought that Ighalo's movement in the few minutes he was on the pitch, put Martial to shame. He's not a #9 in my view. At best, I think he's a reasonable backup for Rashford in a left sided forward role. We need a new striker in the summer.

 

[Hammondo]

Honestly thinking he should be focusing on buying a new 9 in the summer over other positions. I usually do not care as much about 9's, but now I think its a big problem and should be focused on.

 

[JPRouve]

Honestly thinking he should be focusing on buying a new 9 in the summer over other positions. I usually do not care as much about 9's, but now I think its a big problem and should be focused on.

So you think that the 9 position is a bigger priority than our right wing where we have virtually no one?