Nurse Lucy Letby - guilty of murdering 7 babies - whole life sentence

[TheReligion]

I really should know this but why is this trial taking months?

Has there been a lot of expert evidence or short court days? Shipman 's trial lasted from October to January for context.

How long has it been running?

8 murders and 10 attempted murders. She pleaded not guilty to every charge so plenty to get through.

 

[Frosty]

How long has it been running?

8 murders and 10 attempted murders. She pleaded not guilty to every charge so plenty to get through.

It started in mid October and was due to finish at the start of this month. But I don't even think that the prosecution's case has finished yet given the headlines and stories?

 

[TheReligion]

It started in mid October and was due to finish at the start of this month. But I don't even think that the prosecution's case has finished yet given the headlines and stories?

Oh I’m not sure. I guess there’s been a few delays over Christmas, New Year, Death of The Queen etc?

It was down to run for 6 months though you’re right.

 

[Brophs]

I really should know this but why is this trial taking months?

Has there been a lot of expert evidence or short court days? Shipman 's trial lasted from October to January for context.

I’ve not been following it too closely but from what I know:

1. It’s an almost entirely circumstantial case - in many cases I think the causes of death are even in question so they’ll have to spend a lot of time copper fastening what evidence they do have, for each of the offences in turn. For example, it’s not enough that she was on shift on X night, but that there were no other people in a position to have committed the crime etc. There seems to have been quite a bit of fairly arid evidence about shift patterns, numbers of staff and the recitation of logs etc. as to what they were doing throughout their shifts etc.
2. A lot of the evidence relates to pretty long, granular medical testimony, all of which the prosecution has been put on full proof of. Days at a time talking through who administered mediations etc. The states of mind at the time.
3. They’ve found it hard to keep the jury together. I think they’ve gone through all of their reserves at this stage.

 

[Frosty]

Oh I’m not sure. I guess there’s been a few delays over Christmas, New Year, Death of The Queen etc?

It was down to run for 6 months though you’re right.

On reflection it could also be down to the nature of the prosecution case. The police investigation was 2 years or so? And the prosecution case seems to be mainly circumstantial. Nothing wrong with that - plenty of safe convictions have been based on similar.

And there appears to be a mountain of circumstantial evidence. I am speculating but that may explain the sheer number of witnesses attesting to her state of mind surrounding the deaths and potential pathological behavioural patterns.

 

[Frosty]

I’ve not been following it too closely but from what I know:

1. It’s an almost entirely circumstantial case - in many cases I think the causes of death are even in question so they’ll have to spend a lot of time copper fastening what evidence they do have, for each of the offences in turn. For example, it’s not enough that she was on shift on X night, but that there were no other people in a position to have committed the crime etc. There seems to have been quite a bit of fairly arid evidence about shift patterns, numbers of staff and the recitation of logs etc. as to what they were doing throughout their shifts etc.
2. A lot of the evidence relates to pretty long, granular medical testimony, all of which the prosecution has been put on full proof of. Days at a time talking through who administered mediations etc. The states of mind at the time.
3. They’ve found it hard to keep the jury together. I think they’ve gone through all of their reserves at this stage.

Cheers for that. 1 and 2 seem logical. The Shipman trial probably only lasted three months for 15 murders as he was the only doctor who treated the deceased. Much more difficult to establish connections with potentially dozens of staff around. It will be interesting to see the defence case.

 

[SilentWitness]

Giving evidence today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-65431833

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

Didn't want to make another thread but another one;

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[The Corinthian]

Didn't want to make another thread but another one;

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I read this a few days ago and it made me well up. What a horrid woman and such a sad sad story.

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-65960506

Jurors in the trial of nurse Lucy Letby have retired to consider their verdicts.
Ms Letby is accused of murdering seven babies and attempting to kill 10 others at Countess of Chester Hospital between June 2015 and June 2016.
The 33-year-old, originally from Hereford, has denied all charges.
Judge Mr Justice James Goss has told the jury to approach their deliberations in a "fair, calm, objective and analytical way".
The jury has heard nine months of evidence, including claims Ms Letby deliberately injected babies with air, force fed others milk and poisoned some with insulin.

 

[P-Ro]

The jury have been deliberating for 22 days now. Given that the judge has given them a majority verdict ruling I imagine they're stuck at 9-2 for a guilty/not guilty verdict on the murder charges. Normally with a hung jury the judge would have dismissed them by now but this case has taken so long to get through that they presumably don't want it to go to a retrial.

 

[P-Ro]

Guilty of murdering seven babies and attempting to murder another seven babies.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

Evil bitch.

 

[Zen86]

Such a baffling case. Has there ever been a suggestion of why she actually did it?

 

[11101]

Weird that they found her guilty of 7 and not the other 4. Either way, hopefully she doesn't last too long in prison.

 

[phonics_tid]

Can’t remember a recent case that has horrified me more than this one. How someone can have the intention to do something like this is something I’ll never understand.

 

[Pexbo]

Pure evil. They need to psycho analyse her though, it’s important they figure out what motivated her to do these horrific things to determine if it could be recognised earlier next time and hopefully prevented. Beyond the pale.

 

[McGrathsipan]

Can’t remember a recent case that has horrified me more than this one. How someone can have the intention to do something like this is something I’ll never understand.

and repeatedly

She will be in solitarty for her prison career - hard to see anything other than a full life sentence for her - she really deserves a lethal injection

 

[Penna]

Some British posters will be old enough to remember Beverley Allitt, who was convicted in 1993 of killing 4 children and attempting to murder others whilst working as a paediatric nurse. She's been in Rampton for the last 30 years and is evidently now eligible for parole, but I personally can't see that being granted anytime soon. This case has a lot of similarities.

 

[Lay]

Like others have said, baffling case. They haven’t even got a motive have they?

 

[Penna]

Like others have said, baffling case. They haven’t even got a motive have they?

I would assume that she's mentally ill, something like FDIA (Factitious Disorder Imposed on Another, formerly called Munchausen Syndrome by Proxy). It's an attention-seeking behaviour with very serious consequences, of course.

 

[2cents]

Watching the Sky News special report on this, in tears here for the first time in a long while. Just can’t get my head around it.

 

[FortBoyard]

Seems very odd from a profiling perspective. Wonder what is in her backstory.

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

Will surely be only the 4th woman to get a whole life order in the UK when she’s sentenced. Evil doesn't even cover it.

 

[The Cat]

The jury have been deliberating for 22 days now. Given that the judge has given them a majority verdict ruling I imagine they're stuck at 9-2 for a guilty/not guilty verdict on the murder charges. Normally with a hung jury the judge would have dismissed them by now but this case has taken so long to get through that they presumably don't want it to go to a retrial.

Whole thing is horrifying. Imagine also being on the jury - they must be massively traumatized.

 

[Irrational.]

Watching on Panorama now - absolutely horrifying - can't even begin to imagine the scale of evil and the trauma she's caused. These are the cases where I wouldn't be against capital punishment. What a monster.

 

[FootballHQ]

Some British posters will be old enough to remember Beverley Allitt, who was convicted in 1993 of killing 4 children and attempting to murder others whilst working as a paediatric nurse. She's been in Rampton for the last 30 years and is evidently now eligible for parole, but I personally can't see that being granted anytime soon. This case has a lot of similarities.

Too young to remember that case but didn't something similar occur at the Steeping Hill Hospital in Stockport a few years back? Will have to google to remember what happened but a nurse was arrested there on suspicion of unexplained deaths.

 

[Irrational.]

The manager and ex clinical director should also be absolutely disgusted with themselves for defending this monster and caring more about the reputation of the hospital.

 

[Mb194dc]

What an absolute awful and harrowing case. I just hope they get to the bottom of what is wrong with her and why she did it.

 

[FireballXL5]

So, will anyone face criminal charges for ignoring the doctors?

Hospital bosses ignored months of doctors' warnings about Lucy Letby

Hospital bosses failed to investigate allegations against Lucy Letby and tried to silence doctors, the lead consultant at the neonatal unit where she worked has told the BBC.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66120934

 

[Irrational.]

The friends of Lucy who have stood by her, judging by the one friend who agreed to be interviewed are fecking delusional.

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

The friends of Lucy who have stood by her, judging by the one friend who agreed to be interviewed are fecking delusional.

I could see not wanting to believe a loved one is capable of something so horrible. Don’t know the details of their support though.

 

[Oldyella]

The manager and ex clinical director should also be absolutely disgusted with themselves for defending this monster and caring more about the reputation of the hospital.

They should be facing charges of some type themselves

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

They should be facing charges of some type themselves

Criminal negligence causing death(s) at the very least.

 

[dannyrhinos89]

Such a strange situation. Something has obviously triggered her to commit these despicable crimes.

I'm guessing she's going to be studied heavily by many different psychiatrists in the coming months, it'll be interesting what they come up with.

 

[Rams]

Horrific. Her nickname by her friends was Miss Innocent apparently. Clearly a very manipulative nut job. They need to get right to the bottom of her motives & psychological state in order to learn from it. The management of the hospital at the time should also be investigated and if necessary prosecuted.

 

[DatIrishFella]

Some people just get off on killing. I imagine she felt "powerful" in her own twisted mind that she basically had control over these infants lives.

I hope she's tormented in prison. 23hr solitary confinement. Leave her alone in silence with nothing but her thoughts till the day she dies, alone, in a cold jail cell.

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

Horrific.

 

[Sandikan]

Need to root out all the management who watched over this happening and missed countless opportunities to stop it.
Need to have their colossal salaries forced back out of their grubby hands and thrown in the slammer themselves.

As for the woman herself, we pride ourselves on a "civilised" criminal system, but I wonder how many would object to each of the victims' parents being given a 10min slot alone with her with no restrictions.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

Fecking vile scum!! Pure evil that should be exterminated.