Peak entertainment. It would be a war.
Ronaldo is the goat
- Thread starter Billy Blaggs
- Start date
Looks like Messi may just be getting carried out of the group stages.
The resemblance is uncanny./cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/60120501/ronaldogoat.1529496805.jpg)
That's just his opinion and he's wrong in mine. Pele won three world cups and Maradona just won one and was shit in 82, 90 and 94. He didn't even score a single goal in 1990 and he was a cocaine addict and alcohol abuser who was caught doping in 91 and caught using a performance enhancer at world cup 94 where he only scored once. He was caught doping again in 97 and admitted his drug problems began in 82 when he signed for Barcelona. His lack of discipline in this respect led to him struggling with weight issues throughout his career and he regularly had to go on liquid diets just to try and keep it down. How are Pele's 757 in 812 games a myth? How are his 70 freekick goals and numerous bicycle kick goals a myth? How are his titles and achievements which dwarf Maradona's, Messi's and Ronaldos a myth?
Nigeria winning yesterday has given Messi a 2nd chance
Lukaku is the goat
3rd really
judging Maradona's contribution on his goals...Yes Im judging his goals contribution in world cup tournaments.
1982- 2 goals
1986- 5 goals
1990- 0 goals
1994- 1 goal
He basically only showed up at Mexico 86. Basic comprehension
So by your estimation his worst tournament was in 1990?Yes Im judging his goals contribution in world cup tournaments.
1982- 2 goals
1986- 5 goals
1990- 0 goals
1994- 1 goal
He basically only showed up at Mexico 86. Basic comprehension
It's pointless to debate across eras.
This. There's so many variables that need to be taken into consideration. You can judge based on eras, more than that and it's just futile.
I wonder if this will hold true 50 years from now when future generations debate Messi, Ronaldo and the stars of their era.
I likely won't care at age 92 as I'll just be happy to piss without a bag.
Yes the answer to the original topic. Ronaldo is the GOAT. You just have to watch him to know this. If only he didn't suffer from seizures in 1998 this wouldn't even be discussed
I would say it was because he didn't meet expectations, not even close. They reached the final again in 1990 despite being unconvincing in the group stages and finishing third. I would say it was a huge disappointment of a tournament for him and his followers. He was the best player in the world and he only managed one assist. How would you rate it? He was still quite young in 82 when Italy knocked them out and he was kicked out of the 94 tournament for using a performance enhancer. Take your pick on his worst tournament
I don't think you remember how he played in any of these tournaments because the idea those three are comparable is totally ridiculous. Using goals and assists as conclusive evidence of anything in this case is like saying Scholes in the late 90s was twice as good as Scholes in the late 00s - in the 5 seasons between 95-00 he scored 53 goals, in the 5 seasons between 05-10 he scored 26 goals. No contest using your logic, yet almost no United fan would hold that opinion for obvious reasons. Likewise no Argentina fan would take your suggestion seriously.
If you want to reduce football to goals then just put Muller and Pele at the top, post some stats and move on. You might as well not even enter the debate, in fact - the numbers speak for themselves.
Until they go to the knockout stage and then in meltdown again.
It doesn't take rocket science to figure out that he didn't produce at those tournaments regardless of how he played. He managed to make it to four world cups and only excelled in one. I vaguely remember the 1990 tournament because i was young but Maradona was mine and every kid I grew up with's hero so I tried to watch every game I could and my uncles told me he was a major disappointment. I watched him in 94 and Argentina were average.
I've no idea what you mean by "produce". He was in the team of the tournament in 1990, and didn't make it into the team of the tournament in either '82 or '94. There's a reason for that. He was also the only Argentinian outfield player to make it into the team of the tournament in '90 - there's a reason for that too. Of course the idea of that one fact being proof of anything is just as silly as your goals tallies being proof of anything, but they are indicative of something. And if you were to re-watch all four of those tournaments you would come to exactly the same conclusion - guaranteed.
Maradona was a disappointment in '90 in the sense that he couldn't replicate his '86 form, or really get anywhere close to it. However by that metric every single player in history was a disappointment, because absolutely no-one performed at that level in two tournaments. Not even close. Very few players even got close to Maradona's '86 form in one tournament, never mind two. Maradona in '86 is in everyone's top 3 performances in an international tournament, and is most people's #1.
So I think saying Maradona only "excelled" in one tournament hides more than it says. He didn't merely excel in '86, he was otherworldly. And while he was clearly a few levels below that in '90, he was absolutely essential to them reaching that final. The clearest evidence of that is Matthaus sacrificing himself entirely to man mark Maradona in that first half - you have to bear in mind Matthaus won the Ballon d'Or in '90 and was a totally dominant force in all aspects of the game in that WC. Beckenbauer wouldn't have tasked his star player with man-marking Maradona if he was anything like as bad as you've portrayed. That effectively neutered German's attack which is a big part of the reason a clearly superior German team only won that game with a penalty.
I don't see how anyone could be better than Pélé, personally. Talent-wise he was perfection, supreme success at every level, and he didn't have any real downside. And my personal take is di Stéfano was a better player than Maradona (and Messi). So I'm not some kind of Maradona fanboy defending my player. But your argument's against him don't stack up against the evidence and have all sorts of logical flaws in them.
Pélé, as good as he was, was never as good in an international tournament as Maradona in '86. It's not his fault that he was kicked out of two World Cups in his prime years, but that is the reality. And it's undoubtedly true that his supporting cast was far superior to anything Maradona had. You can verify that in the sense that Garrincha led Brazil to the '62 WC without him, or in the sense that in the two WCs he fully participated in he was in the team of the tournament alongside 5 other Brazilians in '58 and 4 other Brazilians in '70. He played in the most star-studded teams to ever grace the World Cup. That's in sharp contrast to the Argentina teams in '86 and '90, when Maradona was the only Argentinian outfield player to make the team of the tournament...and that is a fair representation of his singular contribution to the team.
Now, I would agree with you if you were to say Pélé in '58 and '70 was better than Maradona in '86 and '90, overall, but that's a very different point to what you first suggested.
Pretty shite the last two games
Missed a pen. No longer GOAT
That was Messi-levels of bad.
Four goals have disguised three strings of poor general performance by him. Justifiably, it shouldn't be alerted if he comes up with the goods with the goals.
Can't believe we really were so close to getting a group stage exit "because of a missed penalty" from Ronaldo 
Would have been so funny
Think he goes home last 16, Uruguay favourites.
Here comes the hyperbole
On what planet was his general performance poor v Spain? It was one of his better performances in a Portugal strip. Also he was by no means poor v Morocco, Portugal got thoroughly outplayed but he converted the sole chance they created. Also set up Guedes who again messed up.
Don’t be so biased by your agenda that you lose all rationale to judge a performance.
Not vs Spain.
He was magnificent besides the goals.
The following 2 games though, he was poor.
Kane to be a bigger goat this tournament. I'm certain.
Was lucky not to get a red.
Messi performance.
Through the group stages. Now wait for the GOAT to drag them through Uruguay.
He will come back strong against Uruguay.
I stand by it. I'm not biased at all. You'll see a few "Messi fanboys" on here who couldn't fathom that Ronaldo could potentially be better than him. I'm not one of those.Here comes the hyperbole
On what planet was his general performance poor v Spain? It was one of his better performances in a Portugal strip. Also he was by no means poor v Morocco, Portugal got thoroughly outplayed but he converted the sole chance they created. Also set up Guedes who again messed up.
Don’t be so biased by your agenda that you lose all rationale to judge a performance.
It's subjective. Tonight, he was poor and you saw that from the frustration he showed.
He was poor against Morocco - did next to feck all after the goal. You mention the set up, but that doesn't mean a goal and one chance created isn't a good performance. This is Ronaldo we're talking about. An average player will take that performance all day long.
I may be a little harsh on the Spain one, but I genuinely didn't see anything impressive of him when you discount the penalty, freekick and the open play goal. I noted in my original comment that beside the goals he was poor. I may be generalising like feck when it comes to the Spain game as it's hard to ignore a hatrick - hence why you didn't see me in the matchday thread say "Ronaldo has been poor if you take away the goals".
That's his general game, if he scores he's noticed if not you would hardly notice he's on the pitch
Better than Messi? Come on Messi is far more talented and able to play a totally different game to Ronaldo
If he scores that penalty everyone is full of praise for him and saying how good he is, goals don't make you better than Messi
Better than Messi? Come on Messi is far more talented and able to play a totally different game to Ronaldo
If he scores that penalty everyone is full of praise for him and saying how good he is, goals don't make you better than Messi
Ronaldo is probably pissed that VAR was not brought in earlier, could have scored 40 pens a season and really ended the goat discussion.
Missed a penalty, but for now he should count himself lucky he stayed on the pitch and, more importantly, Portugal go through the knockout stages and are still in the World Cup, even though they face Uruguay.
Ronaldo should put his finger out and start performing, because this Portugal team is so deprived from quality it is not funny.
Ronaldo should put his finger out and start performing, because this Portugal team is so deprived from quality it is not funny.