Spurs 2018/19

[breakout67]

Spurs were cruising at half time against Wolves and proceeded to have one of the worst 45 minutes of their season. This was after they had battered Everton and Bournemouth and were getting closer to Liverpool.

In typical Spurs fashion, they didn't bottle a title challenge, rather they bottled getting into a position to challenge. They've been to 1 cup final in almost a decade and have lost 7 FA cup semi-finals in a row, falling at the penultimate hurdle is what they do.

 

[hellohello]

Spurs were cruising at half time against Wolves and proceeded to have one of the worst 45 minutes of their season. This was after they had battered Everton and Bournemouth and were getting closer to Liverpool.

In typical Spurs fashion, they didn't bottle a title challenge, rather they bottled getting into a position to challenge. They've been to 1 cup final in almost a decade and have lost 7 FA cup semi-finals in a row, falling at the penultimate hurdle is what they do.

We weren't getting closer to Liverpool though, and let's get some perspective.

We played a good team who have had good results against the top 6, and have actually only lost against Liverpool and Spurs so far this season.
Wolves 2-1 Chelsea
Arsenal 1-1 - Wolves
Man United 1-1- Wolves
Wolves 1-1 Man City

On top of this they had 2 extra rest days, and the team looked flat in the second half and void of energy. We played badly, but as always, apparently it was bottle that was the reason the team lost.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

We weren't getting closer to Liverpool though, and let's get some perspective.

We played a good team who have had good results against the top 6, and have actually only lost against Liverpool and Spurs so far this season.
Wolves 2-1 Chelsea
Arsenal 1-1 - Wolves
Man United 1-1- Wolves
Wolves 1-1 Man City

On top of this they had 2 extra rest days, and the team looked flat in the second half and void of energy. We played badly, but as always, apparently it was bottle that was the reason the team lost.

While I agree with most of what you say, these are the kind of matches we lose or throw away when the pressure is on. The fact we fecked about most of the first half not putting the game to bed just pisses me off even more.

 

[finneh]

Yeah to me bottling indicates throwing something away. Like they bottled the Juventus game.

Were they ever legitamately in the title hunt? They would need a lot of luck going their way. Maybe get knocked out of a few competitions. And have a good run with injuries. And even if all those pieces fell into place still debatable.

That midfield for me can be got at, Winks - Sissoko. Sissoko has a great engine but despite his form still isnt in the same league as a fully fit Dembele. And Winks is more one for the future.

Truthfully the only reason they're close to in a title race at the moment is down to the kind of luck you'd expect over 38 games concentrated into the first 20.

Out of their first 5 away games they should have dropped 6-8 points. Add in Cardiff at home and Crystal Palace away and they could easily be 10 points down and above United on goal difference alone.

They've been seriously unimpressive if you take away 4-5 results.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

Truthfully the only reason they're close to in a title race at the moment is down to the kind of luck you'd expect over 38 games concentrated into the first 20.

Out of their first 5 away games they should have dropped 6-8 points. Add in Cardiff at home and Crystal Palace away and they could easily be 10 points down and above United on goal difference alone.

They've been seriously unimpressive if you take away 4-5 results.

Unimpressive? We are second, over half a season.

 

[breakout67]

Unimpressive? We are second, over half a season.

You're 3rd mate.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

You're 3rd mate.

Good point, we are shite then.

 

[hellohello]

While I agree with most of what you say, these are the kind of matches we lose or throw away when the pressure is on. The fact we fecked about most of the first half not putting the game to bed just pisses me off even more.

I'm disappointed, but I don't think this had anything to do with pressure. It was as much pressure as most other weeks imo, and Poch and other players have talked about challenging for the title for a while. If we beat Wolves, but lost to Cardiff it would be a bottlejob, if we beat Cardiff as well, but lost the next game it would be a bottlejob.

 

[GlastonSpur]

... They've been seriously unimpressive if you take away 4-5 results.

Fine. Let's deduct 15 points from United also. That would put you in 14th place, 5 points above the drop zone.

 

[finneh]

Unimpressive? We are second, over half a season.

In terms of performances I'd put Spurs behind Arsenal, Chelsea, City, and Liverpool this season.

Between August and early October your ability to win games whilst being barely as good as or worse than the opposition was unbelievable.

If you're honest it would've been just as easy to draw every one of the Newcastle, Brighton, Watford, West Ham, Cardiff and Crystal Palace games as it would have been to win. That's a 12 point swing of which with a lot of luck you'd hopefully expect half to go your way. With Spurs every single result has pulled their way.

I sincerely hope that Spurs win every game remaining and win the league (given the alternatives) but truthfully it's incredibly fortunate that they're above Chelsea, let alone City or Liverpool.

Fine. Let's deduct 15 points from United also. That would put you in 14th place, 5 points above the drop zone.

No-one is saying we should deduct your 5 great perfomances... I'm saying the results where you've not been better than the opposition but have held on for a very fortunate 3 points have been far far regular than anyone would expect.

You don't generally see title winning teams not only 9 points behind at the half way point... But also near 25% of the points they do have being gained whilst not being the better team. You simply can't keep being barely as good as the opposition and winning by a goal.

Spurs performances in any normal environment put them on 37-40 points... So any talk or a title challenge was strange.

 

[breakout67]

Good point, we are shite then.

Weren't you saying a few weeks back that the football has not been all that impressive this season and you've grinded out a few results? That might have been Squishy.

Spurs have won 7 games by 1 goal in the league this season. I have not been impressed by Spurs either to be honest. It might be hard to believe but United are better at creating good chances than Spurs this season, but Spurs are much more clinical.

I was starting to get impressed by Spurs after beating Bournemouth and Everton, but then this happened.

 

[hellohello]

In terms of performances I'd put Spurs behind Arsenal, Chelsea, City, and Liverpool this season.

Between August and early October your ability to win games whilst being barely as good as or worse than the opposition was unbelievable.

If you're honest it would've been just as easy to draw every one of the Newcastle, Brighton, Watford, West Ham, Cardiff and Crystal Palace games as it would have been to win. That's a 12 point swing of which with a lot of luck you'd hopefully expect half to go your way. With Spurs every single result has pulled their way.

I sincerely hope that Spurs win every game remaining and win the league (given the alternatives) but truthfully it's incredibly fortunate that they're above Chelsea, let alone City or Liverpool.

This also apply to Liverpool, Arsenal and to a lesser extent Chelsea.

 

[finneh]

This also apply to Liverpool, Arsenal and to a lesser extent Chelsea.

All those teams have done what you'd expect in maybe turning 3-4 draws out of 20 in which they're often the better team (but not by much) into wins. I'd say in a "normal" environment all 3 would be maybe 4 points worse off.

Spurs have turned nearly a third of their games whereby they've not done enough to deserve all 3 points into wins, that's extraordinary.

 

[Halds]

Tottenham has had an impressive season so far. Why do some people need to downgrade the quality of their team because of a single bad result? Being clinical and grinding out results is also a quality.

 

[cyberman]

Tottenham has had an impressive season so far. Why do some people need to downgrade the quality of their team because of a single bad result? Being clinical and grinding out results is also a quality.

It also catches up on you though. Its impossible to sustain.

 

[Halds]

It also catches up on you though. Its impossible to sustain.

Where is the evidence for that? For all I know, Spurs could have as good a second half of the season or even better.

 

[cyberman]

Where is the evidence for that? For all I know, Spurs could have as good a second half of the season or even better.

You'll soon see.
Relying on being clinical means you need the opposition to be less clinical than you. That just doesn't happen over 38 games.
Especially when so many didn't have a break after the WC. Their energy levels won't allow these dogged, hard fought wins to be as frequent over the second half of an English season.

 

[GlastonSpur]

All those teams have done what you'd expect in maybe turning 3-4 draws out of 20 in which they're often the better team (but not by much) into wins. I'd say in a "normal" environment all 3 would be maybe 4 points worse off.

Spurs have turned nearly a third of their games whereby they've not done enough to deserve all 3 points into wins, that's extraordinary.

You've watched every single Spurs game in full have you?

 

[finneh]

You've watched every single Spurs game in full have you?

I've certainly watched the highlights, listened to pundits discussing the games, and also reading the threads on here where the reasonable Spurs fans (not yourself of course) were stating game after game that winning is great but the manner was absolutely not (including comments of being dominated in midfield)

Do you believe that Spurs deserved to win the vast majority of those 6~ games?

 

[balaks]

Weren't you saying a few weeks back that the football has not been all that impressive this season and you've grinded out a few results? That might have been Squishy.

Spurs have won 7 games by 1 goal in the league this season. I have not been impressed by Spurs either to be honest. It might be hard to believe but United are better at creating good chances than Spurs this season, but Spurs are much more clinical.

I was starting to get impressed by Spurs after beating Bournemouth and Everton, but then this happened.

It happens - our busy schedule and lack of options to rotate in midfield finally got the better of us. I still think we are much more 'in the groove' than we have been most of the season which made the recent defeat all the more disappointing - that said, Wolves played extremely well and fully deserved the win and we have to remember it's not all about how Spurs play as much as how the other team plays also. The next game is huge for us now.

 

[GlastonSpur]

I've certainly watched the highlights, listened to pundits discussing the games, and also reading the threads on here where the reasonable Spurs fans (not yourself of course) were stating game after game that winning is great but the manner was absolutely not (including comments of being dominated in midfield)

Do you believe that Spurs deserved to win the vast majority of those 6~ games?

4 or 5 minute highlights ... and from that you've drawn your sweeping conclusions about which games we didn't deserve to win . Moreover, a team can perform not that well but still be the better team on the day and deserve to win.

 

[finneh]

4 or 5 minute highlights ... and from that you've drawn your sweeping conclusions about which games we didn't deserve to win . Moreover, a team can perform not that well but still be the better team on the day and deserve to win.

I've watched some full games, spoken to Spurs fans, read comments on here and listened to pundits discussing the games... Moreover you have conspicuously but typically failed to answer my question.

 

[HisDudeness]

wolves have turned out to be a good team. they would go far in the europa league. they defended first half. just tactical instructions though. in the second half they attacked and totally outplayed spurs.

if not for that wonder strike.... 0-3

spurs players probably thought "this is a relatively comfortable game. we'll keep it 1 nil" up until wolves were instructed to come out.

 

[croadyman]

I think Spurs have got 5 huge league games that they need to take minimum 11 points from. That is along with picking up results in the other games too

I hope you do push the other two all the way but worry about your away records against Chelsea,City and Liverpool.

 

[Adisa]

Dembele is off to China. Imagine they don't replace him?

 

[charlenefan]

Sissoko has been his replacement this season

 

[Scroto Baggins]

Sissoko has been his replacement this season

Not in the same league as a fit and firing Dembele who himself isnt in the same league as Spurs' last good midfielder before him, Modric.

Sissoko is doing well, all action, great engine, superb athlete. Just a poor footballer compared to the likes of Dembele or Modric.

They really need some midfield investment and to move on Wanyama and Dembele. They tried to get Grealish for 30mil. 30mil buys you nothing in todays market, in the age of megabucks tv deals.

 

[padr81]

£9m only for Dembele, whats the story there? Levy wouldn't sell a bag of crisps for only £9m...

 

[Adisa]

£9m only for Dembele, whats the story there? Levy wouldn't sell a bag of crisps for only £9m...

Six month left on his contract.

 

[Adisa]

Sissoko has been his replacement this season

In the XI not the squad. If Sissoko gets injured, they are fecked.

 

[hellohello]

£9m only for Dembele, whats the story there? Levy wouldn't sell a bag of crisps for only £9m...

I think his body is finished at the intensity at top level due to injuries. A prime Dembele who can play most games would never be sold for anywhere near that.

 

[TheLord]

If they can do the back-to-back double against Chelsea tonight in the Cup after their heroics in the league a few weeks back, I'd be mighty impressed.

 

[Scroto Baggins]

Yeah 9-11mil to China apparently, im sure he will boss the Chinese league.

They should sell Wanyama while they are at it. Seems his knees are gone.

Then throw every spare cent Levy can scrounge up on a decent midfielder. Winks, Skip, Dier, Sissoko, none of these are top 4 material. Maybe Dier due to his flexibility to play both DM destroyer and CB roles. But he would only be a bench player.

 

[balaks]

In the XI not the squad. If Sissoko gets injured, they are fecked.

We sure are - remarkable that I would now be absolutely gutted if Sissoko wasn't available to play when this time last year I would happily have drove him to another club myself.

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

You'll soon see.
Relying on being clinical means you need the opposition to be less clinical than you. That just doesn't happen over 38 games.
Especially when so many didn't have a break after the WC. Their energy levels won't allow these dogged, hard fought wins to be as frequent over the second half of an English season.

This would be somewhat relevant if we were still playing poorly, but our performances have actually had a massive upturn recently. I think we were suffering from a world cup hangover and struggled to get together decent performances, but for a while now we've been smashing goals past teams with the exception of Wolves. The dogged, hard fought wins and becoming less and less common.

Also, we're not all that clinical a lot of the time but we happen to possess the best striker in the world, who guarantees us goals.

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

£9m only for Dembele, whats the story there? Levy wouldn't sell a bag of crisps for only £9m...

As others have said, contract running low, he's clearly injury prone/declining, so it's fair.

We really should have signed a CM in the summer. It was pretty criminal of us not to. Yes we've done very well despite that but we're very thin on the ground in midfield and Sissoko's massive upturn in form has been very fortunate, along with Winks doing a solid job. Genuine investment in this area is absolutely crucial as soon as possible with Dembele moving on and Wanyama's injury issues as well.

 

[padr81]

Didn't realise his contract was running so low, despite his injury proneness I reckon with a 2 year contract they'd have got £15m or so.

 

[Adisa]

Could be without Sissoko, Kane and Son for a few weeks.

 

[charlenefan]

Anyone know specifically how long Son is gone for? He tends to be the go to guy for Spurs when Kane is missing

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Anyone know specifically how long Son is gone for? He tends to be the go to guy for Spurs when Kane is missing

If those are out for a good period of time, it’s not unreasonable to see them as more gettable than Chelsea.