Film Star Wars

[bucky]

Star Wars Episode IV: Definitely not the same film as Return of the Jedi, pinky promise.

A lot of people are saying this, so I hope they take notice and do something different.

 

[NinjaFletch]

A lot of people are saying this, so I hope they take notice and do something different.

I don't see why they will tbh. Episode 7 was a huge commercial and critical success despite being utterly derivative, and there's plenty of people who will defend it to the hilt.

The prequels (which were shite) tried something new and failed. I don't see why Disney would take the commercial risk of taking the story somewhere else when they know that simply rehashing the original trilogy and massaging fans nostalgia buttons is a virtual licence to print money.

I really hope I'm wrong, I desperately want to be; we will have to wait and see.

 

[bucky]

I don't see why they will tbh. Episode 7 was a huge commercial and critical success despite being utterly derivative, and there's plenty of people who will defend it to the hilt.

The prequels (which were shite) tried something new and failed. I don't see why Disney would take the commercial risk of taking the story somewhere else when they know that simply rehashing the original trilogy and massaging fans nostalgia buttons is a virtual licence to print money.

I really hope I'm wrong, I desperately want to be; we will have to wait and see.

Well, yeah. Not really getting my hopes up either until I've seen The Last Jedi.

 

[Revan]

So, Kylo kills Snoke while he is electroshocking Rey in the ninth movie? And dies while doing so.

But of course, it won't be the same movie as Episode VI. Kylo and Rey are cousins while Vader and Luke were father and son. Huge, huge difference there.

 

[kps88]

Abrams directing is good news. Abrams writing...not so much.

 

[MoBeats]

So, Kylo kills Snoke while he is electroshocking Rey in the ninth movie? And dies while doing so.

But of course, it won't be the same movie as Episode VI. Kylo and Rey are cousins while Vader and Luke were father and son. Huge, huge difference there.

Whatchootorkinbaht?

 

[Redlambs]

Whatchootorkinbaht?

Spoiler alert!

I think Revan should guess at a timeline now...

 

[Welsh Wonder]

Spoiler alert!

I think Revan should guess at a timeline now...

I'm so glad that has become a 'thing'

 

[Hoof the ball]

I just want Rey to be Palpatine's granddaughter. That's all.

"DO IT"

 

[Revan]

Spoiler alert!

I think Revan should guess at a timeline now...

 

[MoBeats]

Is that legit? Cousins?

 

[Revan]

Is that legit? Cousins?

Probably. It was heavily speculated that Rey is Luke's daughter, which would make her Ren's cousin.

 

[2 man midfield]

Why does everyone have to be related? Whenever there's a black guy there's talk that it's Mace Windu's grandson

Just make new stories, please. Not everything has to revolve around stories we heard 30 years ago.

 

[Randall Flagg]

Probably. It was heavily speculated that Rey is Luke's daughter, which would make her Ren's cousin.

Do you believe the Snoke actually being Darth Plagius (The guy Palps discussed in ep 3) will happen?

I think they would be great

 

[kps88]

Probably. It was heavily speculated that Rey is Luke's daughter, which would make her Ren's cousin.

Are you reading leaks or anything like that?

 

[Revan]

Are you reading leaks or anything like that?

No, why? The main theory since the movie was released was that Rey is Luke's daughter. Pretty sure that this was discussed to death also in the Force Awakens thread here.

 

[Revan]

Do you believe the Snoke actually being Darth Plagius (The guy Palps discussed in ep 3) will happen?

I think they would be great

I would like Snoke to be Darth Plagueis (my Star Wars nerd persona loves to see as many things from EU universe as possible), but not sure. He looks quite similar to the cover of Darth Plagueis book (now uncanonized), but apparently the first model had Snoke as female.

Ren is actually fairly similar to Jacen Solo in EU (Han/Leia's son who turned out dark), and they put Thrawn in the cartoon TV show, so there is hope that they are bringing other good parts of EU.

 

[Eckers99]

Why does everyone have to be related? Whenever there's a black guy there's talk that it's Mace Windu's grandson

Just make new stories, please. Not everything has to revolve around stories we heard 30 years ago.

That's the problem isn't it, the original trilogy dragged so much emotional oomph from the family angle that this trilogy, being so seemingly averse to any kind of drift from the formula, is bound to follow that path. It's just the nature of modern blockbusters isn't it?

 

[2 man midfield]

That's the problem isn't it, the original trilogy dragged so much emotional oomph from the family angle that this trilogy, being so seemingly averse to any kind of drift from the formula, is bound to follow that path. It's just the nature of modern blockbusters isn't it?

Yeah, unfortunately. If it isn't a sequel or a reboot the studios won't back it. Which makes sense considering the amount of people who just pirate stuff online.

 

[MoBeats]

Yeah I'd be disappointed if they shoehorned another family tie in.

 

[squiggle]

I don't see why they will tbh. Episode 7 was a huge commercial and critical success despite being utterly derivative, and there's plenty of people who will defend it to the hilt.

The prequels (which were shite) tried something new and failed. I don't see why Disney would take the commercial risk of taking the story somewhere else when they know that simply rehashing the original trilogy and massaging fans nostalgia buttons is a virtual licence to print money.

I really hope I'm wrong, I desperately want to be; we will have to wait and see.

The Phantom Menace probably had more similarities to the plot of the original than The Force Awakens did, and it was a lot less fun. They just threw some trade war gumpf around it.

Star Wars: A young man with a mysterious past on a desert planet has his world upended. His new mentor is killed but everything's pretty okay in the end.

The Force Awakens: a young woman with a mysterious past on a desert planet has her world upended. Her new mentor is killed but everything's pretty okay in the end.

The Phantom Menace: a boy with a mysterious past on a desert planet has his world upended. His new mentor is killed but everything's pretty okay in the end.



And the original and The Phantom Menace even both had promises of romance which TFA wisely avoided.

Okay, TFA had the mistake of another Death Star but I really don't see why people say it's a rip-off of the original. It was similar (they're not complex films) but it wasn't the same. The characters were likeable or interestingly unlikeable and it rattled along at a good pace. I thought it was very enjoyable.

 

[sullydnl]

TFA was a very conservative movie that basically aimed no higher than making a successful film that was deliberately and unmistakeably tied to the original trilogy as closely as they could manage. That didn't particularly bother me as I thought it worked well on that basis, so I don't really see any reason to gloss it up more than that.

If TPM menance had more in common with ANH than TFA did then TPM would have been a less awful film. It was actually quite different and roughly a thousand times worse.

 

[fishfingers15]

Ban @Revan

 

[squiggle]

Do you believe the Snoke actually being Darth Plagius (The guy Palps discussed in ep 3) will happen?

I think they would be great

Snoke's just zis guy, you know?

 

[Mrs Smoker]

Star Wars -- should we even care anymore?

Star Wars is a guaranteed money-making film franchise for Disney. Like an enormous Star Destroyer looming over every other film or franchise it’s up against on any opening day, it’s as close to a sure thing you can get in entertainment investments. The question here, however – with Disney, and more specifically with Kathleen Kennedy’s steering and the evolving face of film, audiences and technology – is, should we still care?

Since George Lucas handed off his cultural behemoth in 2012, Disney has sought to expand its merchandising capabilities to the far reaches of the universe, as well as expanding the commercial brand to include entire theme parks based on the films and even hotel guest experiences not unlike that of "Westworld," where guests participate in their own “Star Wars Story.”

But the tree is only as strong as its roots, the roots being the films both Disney has acquired and the films Disney produces.

One would think the legacy of the original trilogy is intact and untouchable. But a series of creative controversies of late have plagued the franchise as it attempts to not only branch off with a new trilogy, but conjure up a commercialized nostalgia by milking whatever they can with spin-off films of older beloved characters, as we saw with “Rogue One” last year. In addition to Episode VIII (“The Last Jedi,” due out this December) and IX (due out some time in 2019), Disney has a planned launch of films featuring Han Solo’s origin, a Boba Fett film, and the possibility of an Obi-Wan Kenobi film (could have sworn we already had three of those). Is anybody out there really demanding to see a Han Solo origin film? Or another Ben Kenobi story? Does it matter?

But a series of creative differences have since plagued the franchise with filmmakers clashing with Kennedy. “Rogue One’s” Gareth Edwards fell out of favor and Tony Gillroy was called in to do reshoots and story tweaking. Phil Lord and Christopher Miller, who helmed “The Lego Movie,” were brought on board to write and direct the Han Solo origin film (not starring Harrison Ford, by the way, but younger lookalike actor Alden Ehrenreich) and were released about a third of the way into shooting due to their improvisational and humorous style – which was cause for concern with Kennedy and the higher-ups at Imperial command. Kennedy friend and reliable old scribe Ron Howard was brought on to oversee the rest of production. Director Josh Trank was hired and promptly fired from a project thought to be ‘Boba Fett’ and just recently, “Jurassic World” director Colin Trevorrow was released from directing and scriptwriting duties for the anticipated Episode IX, the final film of the main trilogy, due to creative differences.

Smart, introspective Sci-Fi (which Star Wars is and can be) is a thriving genre at the moment. There are several working directors who seem primed for a Star Wars film. “Wonder Woman’s” Patty Jenkins seems ideal. There’s also “Arrival” and “Blade Runner 2049”’s Denis Villeneuve.

Ava DuVernay or Ryan Coolger (already under Disney contract with Marvel for “Black Panther”) would have been intriguing choices. “District 9”’s Neill Blomkamp or “Dark City’s” Alex Proyas have proven they understand conceptual science fiction, as has Kathryn Bigelow and Robert Zemeckis.

But all the fan dreaming of a perfect, smart and new take on Star Wars went out the window when it was announced early Monday morning that J.J. Abrams, who helmed “The Force Awakens,” a soft reboot of the original film, would be returning to direct Episode IX. It’s a safe bet, if not a particularly bold decision. And that’s what Disney is going for. Disney’s message so far has been simple: Don’t rock the multibillion dollar boat.

But Disney’s direction here is a complete antithesis of what Star Wars represents to begin with. “Star Wars, A New Hope” (the very first Star Wars film, released in 1977) as an original film would never have been made if not for daring risks and bold directions taken by George Lucas or the studio that agreed to distribute it.“The Empire Strikes Back,” perhaps the greatest film sequel in history, took the groundwork of the original and flipped it on the ear of conventional wisdom. Lucas turned over an extraordinary amount of creative control to Irvin Kershner and screenwriters Lawrence Kasdan and Leigh Brackett. “Return of the Jedi,” while not as revered as its predecessors, was a satisfying conclusion to the trilogy with its own iconography in film culture.

But it wasn’t just the original trilogy standing on its own that allowed Star Wars to thrive for over 30 years. Constant successful merchandising was part of it, of course, but it was also George Lucas opening his universe to expansion by independent novella authors, allowing them to create new stories for Luke, Han and Leia, as well as other characters.

This decision allowed the mythology itself to thrive. Series like “Heir to the Empire,” “Bloodline,” and “Shadows of the Empire” went on to somewhat commercial success without tarnishing the nostalgia of the original films and are largely responsible for the expanded mythology of Star Wars beyond the films, today.

Disney appears to be doing the exact opposite and seems content with cashing in on the back of Darth Vader’s lightsaber for the foreseeable future. Instead of opening the universe up to new storytellers with fearless visions and ideas they are clamping down.

When Disney assumed control of Star Wars, the creative decision was made by Abrams that the only official cannon that would be followed from there on out would be the films – even if, by all appearances, his own story-map for the new trilogy seems to be following groundwork laid by authors of the expanded universe.

Another factor in all of this is the audience. To resist needless nostalgia means capturing the spirit of the time the original films were released. This is not that time. The era of the blockbuster has gone the way of the Jedi. Most franchise films today come built-in with a sequel (or three) and Star Wars as it exists is not a particularly novel concept anymore (“Harry Potter,” “Hunger Games,” “The Matrix,” “Twilight,” “Lord of The Rings” are all examples of this).

Star Wars isn’t new anymore. Keeping it interesting will require risks. Abrams deserves all the credit in the world for fixing what many fans thought the Lucas prequels broke. But the question is just how much farther would he be allowed to take the final episode. It already seems we have our answer

Disney and Kennedy seem content to keep everything they believe to be right with Star Wars (fan service and nostalgia) while moving away from everything that could take it into the future. This should cause a disturbance in the force for any fans anxious for something new.

[ LINK ]

 

[Raoul]

Nolan needs to direct a Star Wars

 

[squiggle]

I'd like Duncan Jones to film a Star War, even though his best film had more in common with pre-SW sci-fi films.

Or someone out of left field. Like Julie Delpy. If critics want people to take risks then let them be happy for people to take risks.

 

[Mrs Smoker]

Mel Gibson would be great.

 

[GBBQ]

[ LINK ]

Hmmm, a few issues with this. It seems to suggest that pre-Disney that Star Wars was some hallowed ground that did not lower itself to fan service or cash ins. The prequels, the Christmas special, the 2 ewoks movies are all examples of how Lucas was well capable of shitting on his own legacy.

It also seems to suggest that directors have been let go purely because they are mavericks taking risks, rather than maybe not delivering a great movie... Josh Trank seems like a mess and feedback on how Fantastic 4's production went (as well as the final product) means it was probably a savvy move to side step him. Colin Trevorrow is hardly the epitome of risk taking either, Jurassic World was a soft reboot of Jurassic Park so I don't see that he is a great loss if there were concerns about the film. Lord and Miller could have delivered a great movie but Ron Howard is no slouch so all good on that score (at least until we see the final product).

Kennedy played a huge part in the original trilogy so might be just looking to keep the story on track which the directors weren't.

Anyway, just a quick counterpoint to the doom and gloom.

 

[Welsh Wonder]

an M Night Shyamalan Star Wars film would be something to behold

 

[ArmandTamzarian]

an M Night Shyamalan Star Wars film would be something to behold

If theyre gonna go down that road just go full on and get Tommy Wiseau to write, direct and produce it where he will also play a character of his creation.

 

[Mockney]

Smart, introspective Sci-Fi (which Star Wars is and can be)

Stop it.

 

[ADJUDICATOR]

And the original and The Phantom Menace even both had promises of romance which TFA wisely avoided.

"Stop taking my hand!"
"You looked at me like no one ever had.."
"Don't go.."
"We'll see each other again.." *kiss*

I mean I'd love for that to be the case but I'm not particularly hopeful.

 

[Eckers99]

I'd like Duncan Jones to film a Star War, even though his best film had more in common with pre-SW sci-fi films.

Or someone out of left field. Like Julie Delpy. If critics want people to take risks then let them be happy for people to take risks.

Julie Delpy is pretty fecking left - field. Hadn't considered a Before Midnight inspired entry. Just Ren and Rey walking the halls of a death star discussing life, love and the universe for an hour and a half. Feck it. I'm in.

 

[El-Manos]

I don't care what anyone says, that lightsaber fight between Darth Maul and Obi Wan/Qui Gon is absolutely fantastic! The Duel of fates theme is equally stunning. Really missed a proper lightsaber fight in TLJ.

In regards to the prequels, despite its many flaws, the plot is actually quite intriguing if you think about it. In fact, the story line in the prequels is more interesting than the original trilogy, just not executed the way it should have been. I will probably be shot over this opinion

 

[Ubik]

Could someone read through this thread (warning: it's long) and tell me if it's an accurate description (exaggerated a little for comedy) of the much vaunted Thrawn trilogy?

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

I didn't realise it was the one with the evil clone of Luke called Luuke It sounds bad.

 

[Revan]

I don't care what anyone says, that lightsaber fight between Darth Maul and Obi Wan/Qui Gon is absolutely fantastic! The Duel of fates theme is equally stunning. Really missed a proper lightsaber fight in TLJ.

In regards to the prequels, despite its many flaws, the plot is actually quite intriguing if you think about it. In fact, the story line in the prequels is more interesting than the original trilogy, just not executed the way it should have been. I will probably be shot over this opinion

I think that all duels in the prequels bar probably Kenobi & Ani vs Dooku Part 1 are really great. My favorite is obviously Kenobi vs Skywalker, intensely emotional duel (and I thought that Lucas actually did a great job in mixing it with the other duel, you really see the difference between them and Yoda vs Palps).

Agree on the second part. Original trilogy had a very simple story which was told flawlessly, prequels had a great story which was told terribly.

 

[Revan]

Could someone read through this thread (warning: it's long) and tell me if it's an accurate description (exaggerated a little for comedy) of the much vaunted Thrawn trilogy?

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

I didn't realise it was the one with the evil clone of Luke called Luuke It sounds bad.

It is caricature of the books, but yes, quite accurate.

Thrawn is fecking amazing though, to the point that I was rooting for him against Luke and co. As Twitter said, he is essentially a Sherlock.

 

[Ubik]

It is caricature of the books, but yes, quite accurate.

Thrawn is fecking amazing though, to the point that I was rooting for him against Luke and co. As Twitter said, he is essentially a Sherlock.

Did they also really make Luke go evil for the sake of it with a cloned Palpatine in a later series? These writers had obviously gone mad with power.

 

[Cheesy]

Could someone read through this thread (warning: it's long) and tell me if it's an accurate description (exaggerated a little for comedy) of the much vaunted Thrawn trilogy?

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

I didn't realise it was the one with the evil clone of Luke called Luuke It sounds bad.

fecking hell, a Palpatine clone as well. Remember reading that somewhere before.