The MMA thread

[Kaush949]

But what I am saying is promotional skills only matter when you are top dog which he no longer is. And ultimately it comes down to the UFC. In Ferguson and Khabib they have two potential characters and skilled fighters that certainly could be marketed just as compelling as Conor to the casual fan. They both have material for just as compelling stories. Of course Khabib has to reign in his more aggro tendencies for that to work

Disagree here.

Today I was at thanksgiving dinner with some people who do not watch any sort of combat sports or even sports.

It was funny, one of my mates significant mentioned 'hey did you hear about ufc brawl with the conor guy?'

Ladies and gentleman, the ufc PR machine did it again. When even a non-casuals interest has been piqued by the curiosity imagine how many buys conor-khabib 2 will do!

Look at our cafe! We have been discussing this for 20 pages now!

Dana's face may seem all concerned but he is probably grinning deep inside as the promotion job is again done!

Last nights event was a win for UFC, win for NSAC, win for Khabib (gaurentee he wont get more than 6 months and over $500k fine) and a win for Conor purely monetary wise.

Just hopefully this wont set a dangerous precedent.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Just hopefully this wont set a dangerous precedent.

A few people have said this but it's already too late. The precedent has been set by Dana and the UFC constantly indulging McGregor and his antics. How many other fighters would've gotten away with that bus incident bearing in mind Paul Daley was thrown out the UFC for aiming a punch at Josh Koscheck after the buzzer? Money comes first for them and the reputation of the sport and anything else is a secondary consideration at best.

 

[Kaush949]

Can't disagree. But it is prize fighting after all I guess.

I am one of those kinds who appreciates both the art as well as the intensity of buildup. I love GSP but also love the Diaz brothers. I did feel Conor was lame, unfunny and took it a but far this time. The back and forth with Nate and Eddie was fun. This was terrible.

Can't even imagine what to expect from Jon Jones who is already fired up and talking smack. Theres going to be some incident involving him gaurenteed.

 

[Kaush949]

I did feel Conor was not at all same one who fought nate and Eddie. Conor was phenonenal against Nate 2.

The lifestyle, whisky and ring rust has slowed him down a big notch. Add on poor conditioning and gas tank

I still dont think Khabib can take peak Conor's left.

I really hope Conor pulls a Bruce Wayne in Batman Begins and dissappears with league of shadows for a few months.

 

[antihenry]

Dillon Danis called Khabib Nurmagomedov a "f**king Muslim rat" during the main event at UFC 229 -- and that's what set him off.

Now, that's from TMZ, so who knows how true that is, but still.

http://www.tmz.com/2018/10/08/khabib-conor-mcgregor-dillon-danis-muslim-rat/

 

[Zebs]

Dillon Danis called Khabib Nurmagomedov a "f**king Muslim rat" during the main event at UFC 229 -- and that's what set him off.

Now, that's from TMZ, so who knows how true that is, but still.

http://www.tmz.com/2018/10/08/khabib-conor-mcgregor-dillon-danis-muslim-rat/

Yeah from TMZ who spoke to "a fan" and posted a video that starts as Khabib leaps from the ring, proving nothing. Top notch journalism.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Hmmm not sure what to believe. Kavangh said that he heard nothing but clearly Khabib was looking over there during the fight and he was definitely pissed at something/someone at the end.

 

[Zebs]

Hmmm not sure what to believe. Kavangh said that he heard nothing but clearly Khabib was looking over there during the fight and he was definitely pissed at something/someone at the end.

I'm not denying that Danis probably said something, but we can't just take the "Muslim rat" comment as fact because "a fan" told TMZ.

 

[RussellWilson]

Yeah just listened to the rest of it (he takes over from broscience about an hour in for anyone interested). Some really interesting stuff about the Khabib and Mayweather fights, training and what the plans are for the future. Looking forward to that Malignagi footage on the Netflix doc. Was pissing myself about Floyd in a hybrid leg kick fight scenario.

Kavanagh always comes across really well. Top bloke.

FFS listened to the whole thing, thinking he'll go back to Kavanagh any second. But it continued forever.

 

[Oggmonster]

Like I said let's wait and see. From what I'm hearing there is a lot of growing hype for Ferguson and Khabib and no one's talking about Conor. Maybe I'm just seeing more Ferguson and Khabib fans in interactions but for example even the liquor store owner near me was just all talk about Ferguson and Khabib.
I mean does anyone in this thread care more about Conor-Diaz 3 than Khabib-Ferguson? If Poirier beats Diaz, that Conor-Diaz 3 will really feel like a third tier fight.

This thread bares no relevance to what fight is next. The people in here would watch whatever fight the UFC puts in front of us. The people who make the difference are the ones who buy 1 off fights. Conor will still outsell any fight in the UFC regardless of who he fights next. He might not do the numbers rumoured to of done this fight but he still easily clears a million. The Diaz 3 fight is massive for example.

I'm not denying that Danis probably said something, but we can't just take the "Muslim rat" comment as fact because "a fan" told TMZ.

Yeah I don't like Danis at all and it's possible he said that (especially the rat part cos he copies everything Conor does) but it seems a bit unfair to cast him as guilty on the basis of 1 fan who was there.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

I'm not denying that Danis probably said something, but we can't just take the "Muslim rat" comment as fact because "a fan" told TMZ.

I'm not taking anything as fact which is why I explicitly said "I don't know what to believe". Would seem doubtful that he'd aim anything racist at him though as I expect he'd be jumped by a whole bunch of people before Khabib got his hands on him.

FFS listened to the whole thing, thinking he'll go back to Kavanagh any second. But it continued forever.

Joe really was on a WUM there. Absolute bellend. If I was Kavanagh I'd have walked out.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

I'm not denying that Danis probably said something, but we can't just take the "Muslim rat" comment as fact because "a fan" told TMZ.

I'm sure that knob did say something, Rogan I think also said he heard Danis say some shit to Khabib. Not calling Kavanagh a liar, maybe in that moment Dilon didn't say anything, but it could have been between rounds.

What he said though is not known. Dont trust anything TMZ say.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Khabib's father has posted on Instagram today that he forgives Conor and it's all in the past fwiw.

 

[Zebs]

Reyes and Pettis both medically suspended until April. Shit one for Reyes who probably would have liked to build on that good win.

 

[Oggmonster]

Reyes and Pettis both medically suspended until April. Shit one for Reyes who probably would have liked to build on that good win.

He could come back early, they just need to see a doctor who will clear them.

 

[stevoc]

Yes. It counts for me even if Conor wasn't expected to win.

But it was his first fight in boxing against one of the best ever, so it shouldn't really have any bearing in judging whether or not he is past his prime in MMA.

And I fully realize that some athletes are in their prime at 30 and can get back into peak condition. But what I question is Conor's dedication to actually do that. For a football analogy, I see Conor as more Ronaldinho than Cristiano if that makes sense.

I see what you're saying mate, he may have lost his hunger. Having children changes you and the Mayweather money has no doubt gave him financial security he didn't have before. But we'll see, McGregor has always been motivated by money, people who crave money are rarely ever satisfied with how much they have. The more you have the more you want is the case for many people.

So he could still be hungry for more, he just looked very rusty against Khabib. Jon Jones said he found it hard to come back after being out for a year and was rusty against OSP. So McGregor being out for 2 years wasn't ideal build up to fighting a monster like Khabib. Conor could do with a fight or two against the likes of Pettis, Lee or Poirier to get his rhythm back before attempting to fight Khabib again.

The McGregor that fought Alvarez would have landed way more shots on Khabib on Saturday, no idea if it would have changed the result but it would have been a closer fight in my opinion.

 

[T00lsh3d]

But it was his first fight in boxing against one of the best ever, so it shouldn't really have any bearing in judging whether or not he is past his prime in MMA.





The McGregor that fought Alvarez would have landed way more shots on Khabib on Saturday, no idea if it would have changed the result but it would have been a closer fight in my opinion.

He should never have got in the cage with Khabib if he was gonna be any less than 100%. Prime Conor would have still struggled with Khabib, it made no sense taking on Khabib and goading feck out of him, only to get in there and look flat-footed

 

[padr81]

Conor is far from the fighter he was 2 years ago and he got mauled for it. He's spent two years fannying about doing nothing but being an ass and then thought he could walk back in against one of the best in the business and paid a hefty price for it. I don't think at his peak he could beat Khabib and he certainly can't now.

Hasn't earned a rematch, similar to Aldo not earning on vs Conor, UFC need to keep rematches for close fights and contentious decisions not when someone is just after getting murdered.

The question is where does he go from here?
He has fought lightweight fighters 4 times (two of those fight at 170) and been submitted twice, won one by ko and the Diaz win was a narrow decision. He's in an awkward spot now, it looks like both Ferguson and Khabib are far beyond his level now, so 155 is out for him. He can go back to 145 but that's a huge weight cut's and a certain Max Holloway who I think might better him now too. Even if UFC start a 165 division, can he really compete at the size?

He has 5 fights left with UFC but really what does he do? Who does he fight? Aldo II? Diaz III? Both nothing fights at this point in time.

 

[Oggmonster]

Conor is far from the fighter he was 2 years ago and he got mauled for it. He's spent two years fannying about doing nothing but being an ass and then thought he could walk back in against one of the best in the business and paid a hefty price for it. I don't think at his peak he could beat Khabib and he certainly can't now.

Hasn't earned a rematch, similar to Aldo not earning on vs Conor, UFC need to keep rematches for close fights and contentious decisions not when someone is just after getting murdered.

The question is where does he go from here?
He has fought lightweight fighters 4 times (two of those fight at 170) and been submitted twice, won one by ko and the Diaz win was a narrow decision. He's in an awkward spot now, it looks like both Ferguson and Khabib are far beyond his level now, so 155 is out for him. He can go back to 145 but that's a huge weight cut's and a certain Max Holloway who I think might better him now too. Even if UFC start a 165 division, can he really compete at the size?

He has 5 fights left with UFC but really what does he do? Who does he fight? Aldo II? Diaz III? Both nothing fights at this point in time.

Earning a rematch doesn't really matter to the UFC (although Aldo did deserve one in fairness) it's what will bring in the most money and that's Conor vs. Khabib 2 so I reckon that's the way they want to do it. Dana will say something how Tony and Khabib has never happened so many times so they don't want to risk it or something.

I doubt he does all 5 fights, I reckon he does 2 maybe 3 maximum. I wouldn't be surprised to see him boxing again either in all honesty.

I think people are quick to write ihm off, I see him struggling any time he fights Khabib but I think he could beat anyone else in the LW division on his day, it's a stacked division though.

 

[Fortitude]

But it was his first fight in boxing against one of the best ever, so it shouldn't really have any bearing in judging whether or not he is past his prime in MMA.



I see what you're saying mate, he may have lost his hunger. Having children changes you and the Mayweather money has no doubt gave him financial security he didn't have before. But we'll see, McGregor has always been motivated by money, people who crave money are rarely ever satisfied with how much they have. The more you have the more you want is the case for many people.

So he could still be hungry for more, he just looked very rusty against Khabib. Jon Jones said he found it hard to come back after being out for a year and was rusty against OSP. So McGregor being out for 2 years wasn't ideal build up to fighting a monster like Khabib. Conor could do with a fight or two against the likes of Pettis, Lee or Poirier to get his rhythm back before attempting to fight Khabib again.

The McGregor that fought Alvarez would have landed way more shots on Khabib on Saturday, no idea if it would have changed the result but it would have been a closer fight in my opinion.

Making money and training like a maniac, like hungry on-the-up MMA fighters do, is not mutually exclusive, unfortunately.

Conor generates $$$$$$ with far less effort than in the past, in fact, his past is carrying him now because he's not training or disciplining himself like he used to and coming in lacklustre as a result.

I think pride and legacy are the only things that can get Conor back to his best. Sure, he can take the fights take a boatload of money whilst going through the motions, but for the sport, that's a really bad look that their star draw is half-arsing it.

 

[RedFish]

Ferguson v Khabib is the fight I want to see.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Earning a rematch doesn't really matter to the UFC (although Aldo did deserve one in fairness) it's what will bring in the most money and that's Conor vs. Khabib 2 so I reckon that's the way they want to do it. Dana will say something how Tony and Khabib has never happened so many times so they don't want to risk it or something.

I doubt he does all 5 fights, I reckon he does 2 maybe 3 maximum. I wouldn't be surprised to see him boxing again either in all honesty.

I think people are quick to write ihm off, I see him struggling any time he fights Khabib but I think he could beat anyone else in the LW division on his day, it's a stacked division though.

Was intresting listening to Kavanagh yesterday talking about all the things that have been floated around, another boxing fight, maybe against Floyd, maybe against Mallinagi. Also mentioned there is a Netflix doc coming out that should have the 12 rounds from their 2nd spar, so want to see that. He seemed dead very that he (Connor) wanted Kahbib straight away.

Made the point that boxing after a long lay off guys will often get tune up fights. Doesn’t really happen in the UFC, you get thrown to the wolves. Personally I’d quite like to see Connor not just in prizefights but fighting guys that would be intresting, like Petis a stand up fight where we get to see people showcase their stand up. A fight I’d be really interested to see probably more so than another Nate fight or Kahbib rematch would be Holloway at 155lbs. Think that would be an incredible match up and probably the best fight the UFC could make. Although I’d like to see a boxing match vs Mallinagi, sounds like it would be a good dust up.

People saying Connor is half arsing it, where is this coming from? Seemingly in the gym all the time. Half arsing? You been to that gym and watched?

 

[RobinLFC]

I don't think he's too fussed about being rememberd as one of the all-time MMA greats. If he was he wouldn't have side-stepped to boxing for the money instead of focusing on the UFC. Can't blame him though when there's that much money involved.

 

[rotherham_red]

Nice to see all the pearl clutching over the brawl from the likes of Helwani and Rogan has subsided after a day or two, just as I predicted...

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Ferguson v Khabib is the fight I want to see.

Weirdly I have no intrest in that fight, I need to put Tony in the irrational hate thread although it’s mostly because he seems like a right tool. First time I saw him was in TUF and he was a complete tool even then, instant dislike. Kahbib I appreciate how his wrestling is next level and if I was going to watch a guy wrestle he’d be the only one I’d want to watch but I must admit I do find that aspect of MMA really boring. Would be great if he added some better jits to his game tho but I just see a Ferguson fight going the same way in that Kahbib gets him down and beats him up.

 

[stevoc]

Making money and training like a maniac, like hungry on-the-up MMA fighters do, is not mutually exclusive, unfortunately.

Conor generates $$$$$$ with far less effort than in the past, in fact, his past is carrying him now because he's not training or disciplining himself like he used to and coming in lacklustre as a result.

I think pride and legacy are the only things that can get Conor back to his best. Sure, he can take the fights take a boatload of money whilst going through the motions, but for the sport, that's a really bad look that their star draw is half-arsing it.

True but i think McGregor is intelligent enough to know that if making money is his main goal in continuing his MMA career then his potential earnings can be maximized by putting in top performances and beating top fighters. If he does phone it in and loses more fights then his drawing and earning potential diminishes.

It was interesting listening to Kavanagh on the Rogan show last night. He said he basically told McGregor he should retire after the Alvarez fight.

 

[Zebs]

The rematch talk is interesting. Yes Khabib dominated but at the same time McGregor became the only person to win a round against him in the UFC. I'd say Dana will use that as enough reasoning if people challenge him re Aldo when the rematch is made.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Was just wondering did anyone spot Artem when all the fights were going down? I don’t recall seeing him and since he is a major reason behind all of this you would have thought he’d be front and centre.

 

[Zebs]

Was just wondering did anyone spot Artem when all the fights were going down? I don’t recall seeing him and since he is a major reason behind all of this you would have thought he’d be front and centre.

I don't think he was there. From what I could see, Conor just had Danis, Roddy and Kavanagh in his corner.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

I'd love for them to do Conor vs. Aldo next at LW. That's a fight that can sell and actually be meaningful wiithout the title belt.

 

[Buchan]

https://m.independent.ie/sport/othe...to-national-fuss-in-vegas-farce-37394380.html

 

[Raoul]

Weirdly I have no intrest in that fight, I need to put Tony in the irrational hate thread although it’s mostly because he seems like a right tool. First time I saw him was in TUF and he was a complete tool even then, instant dislike. Kahbib I appreciate how his wrestling is next level and if I was going to watch a guy wrestle he’d be the only one I’d want to watch but I must admit I do find that aspect of MMA really boring. Would be great if he added some better jits to his game tho but I just see a Ferguson fight going the same way in that Kahbib gets him down and beats him up.

It would be a fight many want to see but given the previous attempt at making it happen and Khabib having to pull out, there is a degree of fear that something similar may happen again. From a money perspective it would obviously take a backseat to Conor/Khabib2 or Conor/Nate 3

 

[Oggmonster]

https://m.independent.ie/sport/othe...to-national-fuss-in-vegas-farce-37394380.html

Weird article that written by someone who thinks they're "above" or "better" than MMA as a sport.

Can't get what his point is really...it just seems to be "I don't like MMA and anyone who does is an idiot."

Edit: - The journalist changed his tune from just over 2 years ago as well...

http://cached.newslookup.com/cached.php?ref_id=474&siteid=2392&id=7384491&t=1406415600

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Missed it at the time but just saw the post fight presser with Khabib. Saying his dad will "smash him" made me laugh. Hard man Khabib, rolls with bears, doesn't sit or drink water between rounds, jumps solo into team McGregor to attack them etc etc but still terrified of a beating from pops

The key thing I took from that is the apology afterwards. He said his reasons for doing it (still doesn't excuse what he did) then he apologises. Which is a better way of handling this incident than the "it had to be done" approach Conor took after the bus attack.

People (mainly McGregor fans) are clamouring for a rematch but no way is that justified or even safe. The whole event would be poison between fans. Do Khabib vs. Tony, it's the right fight to make. Conor has plenty more options. Poirier, Diaz, Lee, Aldo or Iaquinta would all be fights I'd get up for.

 

[Buchan]

There had to be a ‘match’ in the first place for there to be a rematch.

Khabib strangled him. McGregor committed, what, twelve fouls to try stay in the fight? It was a ludicrous mismatch. McGregor never defended a belt nor did he afford a rematch to a beaten opponent. Khabib should follow suit.

 

[Ole90+3]

Weirdly I have no intrest in that fight, I need to put Tony in the irrational hate thread although it’s mostly because he seems like a right tool. First time I saw him was in TUF and he was a complete tool even then, instant dislike. Kahbib I appreciate how his wrestling is next level and if I was going to watch a guy wrestle he’d be the only one I’d want to watch but I must admit I do find that aspect of MMA really boring. Would be great if he added some better jits to his game tho but I just see a Ferguson fight going the same way in that Kahbib gets him down and beats him up.

You might find Ferg irritating but damn he is such an interesting fighter to follow. I mean the guy doesn't spar or really do much combat training at all; just a natural athlete who loves to compete. He runs his mouth a lot but also constantly backs it up with dominating and entertaining performances. He's been my favourite fighter to watch and follow since getting into MMA about 6 years ago - he has such a unique fighting style which is almost impossible to prepare for. Much like Khabib, he's constantly on the offence, rushing you against the fence so he can pepper you to death with a crazy range of nasty punches and elbows. There's so many things to look forward to when considering a potential Tony v Khabib title fight - so many elements to both fighters. I don't think there's any fighter in the LW division more well equipped to deal with Khabib's style. Tony has crazy athleticism, balance, and cardio for days; guy could go 5 rounds against pretty much any fighter in the world without issues.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

It would be a fight many want to see but given the previous attempt at making it happen and Khabib having to pull out, there is a degree of fear that something similar may happen again. From a money perspective it would obviously take a backseat to Conor/Khabib2 or Conor/Nate 3

In the buisness model of the UFC it does seem that they are tending to go with which fight makes the most money and if I recall last time Kahbib and Tony was scheduled it wasn’t doing well in PPV buys at all. Maybe now with Kahbibs actions it’s like “red panty night” and more people will want to see him fight but really neither Tony of Kahbib are that much of a draw I wouldn’t think.

See these PPV figures are they just America? Because being in the UK I pay my monthly fee for BT which comes with UFC currently. I’d imagine quite a few people in the UK do the same thing. I noticed on the App you can buy a PPV so maybe there are quite a few in the UK or throughout Europe who just do that but really 1.6-2mil doesn’t really seem that much for a global audience.

Still Fight I most want to see is Holloway vs Connor, I think that will be incredible. Max massively improved and has that confidence of being a champ, Connor hopefully won’t be fighting with a torn ACL. I think bar JJ vs The Bullet that is my most want to see fight.

 

[RedFish]

You might find Ferg irritating but damn he is such an interesting fighter to follow. I mean the guy doesn't spar or really do much combat training at all; just a natural athlete who loves to compete. He runs his mouth a lot but also constantly backs it up with dominating and entertaining performances. He's been my favourite fighter to watch and follow since getting into MMA about 6 years ago - he has such a unique fighting style which is almost impossible to prepare for. Much like Khabib, he's constantly on the offence, rushing you against the fence so he can pepper you to death with a crazy range of nasty punches and elbows. There's so many things to look forward to when considering a potential Tony v Khabib title fight - so many elements to both fighters. I don't think there's any fighter in the LW division more well equipped to deal with Khabib's style. Tony has crazy athleticism, balance, and cardio for days; guy could go 5 rounds against pretty much any fighter in the world without issues.

Ferguson is amazing. Such an interesting figher as you say. His unorthodoxy combined with his superhuman cardio and dexterity could prove to be the antidote to Khabib's style. I do think that this is the fight that needs to happen. Feck superfights, changing divisions, these 2 are the top 2 in the division and they (UFC) need to make it happen.

 

[Raoul]

In the buisness model of the UFC it does seem that they are tending to go with which fight makes the most money and if I recall last time Kahbib and Tony was scheduled it wasn’t doing well in PPV buys at all. Maybe now with Kahbibs actions it’s like “red panty night” and more people will want to see him fight but really neither Tony of Kahbib are that much of a draw I wouldn’t think.

See these PPV figures are they just America? Because being in the UK I pay my monthly fee for BT which comes with UFC currently. I’d imagine quite a few people in the UK do the same thing. I noticed on the App you can buy a PPV so maybe there are quite a few in the UK or throughout Europe who just do that but really 1.6-2mil doesn’t really seem that much for a global audience.

Still Fight I most want to see is Holloway vs Connor, I think that will be incredible. Max massively improved and has that confidence of being a champ, Connor hopefully won’t be fighting with a torn ACL. I think bar JJ vs The Bullet that is my most want to see fight.

Yes, I believe the PPV figures are only US. The UFC are having an increasingly difficult time making money of late since PPV numbers have been generally going down and Conor is the only cash cow they have remaining since the likes of Lesnar, Anderson Silva, GSP, Rousey et al are generally out of the picture at this point. So from a profit perspective, they are forced to rely on these megafights to make up for the lost revenue resulting from their ordinary PPV cards.

Conor has been responsible for the 5 biggest PPV events in UFC history and with the emergence/mass availability of free online streaming, they are having to do a bit of scrambling to make their money from these big Conor events while he's actually still around. The flip side of that bargin of course, is that they have to pay Conor what he wants to make him stick around and continue fighting for as long as possible until the next big star emerges. They can augment things with one off events featuring the likes of Lesnar (v Hunt) or GSP (v Bisping) to make some cash from non Conor sources.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Now with the world's eyes on UFC, lets see if WME-IMG see the UFC as a sport (Khabib vs. Tony) or money grabbing entertainment (Khabib vs. McGregor 2).

I stopped watching boxing because of the power fighters have means some of the best fights don't happen, or take too long to materialize.
I stopped watching WWE because of the love in for Roman Reigns.
I'll stop watching UFC if it keeps favouring money fights ahead of being an actual sport.

Then all I'll be left with is Football... Mourinho brand of football