Mourinho fanboys will suddenly move goalposts saying that those clubs have won nothing and we finished above them last season.
The Mourinho Thread: Should he stay or go? | Sacked
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Man. City are a different class.
Think the issue here is why Liverpool, Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal are all 7-10 points clear of Man. United with nearly half a season gone now.
Not saying Man. United should be finishing above all of those but 10 points behind Spurs already? Is there really that gulf between the two? We could be talking 20 point gap by end of season if Spurs are going to get 80 + points as they're on course to do. They've obviously spent way less since 2016.
Arsenal having their transition season after having the same manager for 20 years yet 7 points clear of Man. United (of course the gap could easily be reduced in weeks time) and just 1 point off top 4.
I agree wholly and there is a massive onus on Jose Mourinho to get most the blame for that.
The club have look/scout properly - the right manager isn't going to just fall in our lap. We have to look at whose out there even if the option is on our doorstep.
How did Southampton find Poch? Monaco and Jardim? BVB Klopp and Tuchel? Hoffinheim and Nagglesman? Even Pep at Barca. None these managers were obvious picks but the club's scouted properly because they knew what they were looking for.
We need to offload Sanchez, hasnt worked out and with the tactics of Mourinho it never will, plus reduces 10% from the wage bill
Good luck finding someone willing to pay Sanchez and United.
I have been reading the last few pages of this thread and looks like the Mourinho fanboys have gone full Mourinho ass licking mode. I cannot believe we are still talking about average players like Perisic and Willian.
Willian has played under three different managers in the PL, he was a squad rotation option under Conte and now again gets rotated under Sarri, his numbers are very very poor for an attacker, especially seeing as he plays with the likes of Hazard. He is extremely inconsistent and while he does look good with space ahead of him, he'd be pretty much useless against packed defence(the kind we face every week) and is crossing isn't all that. While he will look like an upgrade on our current options for the RW position, on the long term he offers nothing and is more of an extremely short fix. Plus Barcelona tried to buy and Chelsea firmly held them off, we probably would have had to pay over 50m for his services. We really should look for different RW options.
And I see that @haram is still crying about Perisic after 2 years. Apparently Perisic had a very good world cup so he'd pulling up trees here at United. Sound logic when Mourinho himself has said that World Cup is a completely difference proposition to the league and we have a world cup winning midfielder looking bang average already.
Oh and another amazing logic that you cannot hear from anywhere other than here among the Manchester United supporters, since Woodward buys players, he is responsible for the higher transfer fees. It's like Mourinho fanboys are going mad and thinking up newer way to prop their idol up and protect him from criticism. While I agree that Woodward is the reason for the higher wages, he cannot be criticized for the transfer fees. Imagine if we hadn't bought neither Lukaku or Morata, think of how big a fit Mourinho would have thrown to the press. Plus it's not the old times, we cannot twist the arms of the smaller clubs anymore, we need to pay top dollar to get players or have really smart managers who know what kind of player they want and are actually capable of coaching bought players and make them look better instead of the crap manager we have who went on and on about wanting a experienced CB to a ball playing CB and to actually being okay to sign Yerry fecking Mina, imagine that disaster, signing a player not good enough for Everton.
Willian has played under three different managers in the PL, he was a squad rotation option under Conte and now again gets rotated under Sarri, his numbers are very very poor for an attacker, especially seeing as he plays with the likes of Hazard. He is extremely inconsistent and while he does look good with space ahead of him, he'd be pretty much useless against packed defence(the kind we face every week) and is crossing isn't all that. While he will look like an upgrade on our current options for the RW position, on the long term he offers nothing and is more of an extremely short fix. Plus Barcelona tried to buy and Chelsea firmly held them off, we probably would have had to pay over 50m for his services. We really should look for different RW options.
And I see that @haram is still crying about Perisic after 2 years. Apparently Perisic had a very good world cup so he'd pulling up trees here at United. Sound logic when Mourinho himself has said that World Cup is a completely difference proposition to the league and we have a world cup winning midfielder looking bang average already.
Oh and another amazing logic that you cannot hear from anywhere other than here among the Manchester United supporters, since Woodward buys players, he is responsible for the higher transfer fees. It's like Mourinho fanboys are going mad and thinking up newer way to prop their idol up and protect him from criticism. While I agree that Woodward is the reason for the higher wages, he cannot be criticized for the transfer fees. Imagine if we hadn't bought neither Lukaku or Morata, think of how big a fit Mourinho would have thrown to the press. Plus it's not the old times, we cannot twist the arms of the smaller clubs anymore, we need to pay top dollar to get players or have really smart managers who know what kind of player they want and are actually capable of coaching bought players and make them look better instead of the crap manager we have who went on and on about wanting a experienced CB to a ball playing CB and to actually being okay to sign Yerry fecking Mina, imagine that disaster, signing a player not good enough for Everton.
I think that's a really good point. I don't know whether those clubs you listed were just lucky, or whether they had a vision which extended beyond short term results.
When Mourinho was appointed, it was clear to almost everyone that it wasn't an ideal fit. The gamble was that he would halt the decline and bring in the big trophies in the short term, and there would be time later to repair whatever damage had been done to the club. It looks like we've now reached the point where winning more big trophies look unlikely, and the damage being inflicted on the club is painfully obvious.
Our next appointment should be one that seeks to re-establish the image and brand of Manchester United. The brief included in the job description should emphasise the things that originally made our club great - a commitment to exciting football, and to nurturing and promoting talented young players. The new manager, whoever he is and whenever he is appointed, needs to be told that he will be given time to achieve results as long as he works within those parameters.
As fans, we will need to be patient. We are some way away from being in a position to challenge for the league, and we're not going to close the gap in the short term through a series of fantasy football signings (there are clubs that can match or surpass our spending, and we're no longer a great destination for ambitious players).
During the game against Young Boys, when Jose got out his 3 fingers out I was expecting him to brandish them to the United crowd.I was like 'Oh no.He cant be'.
But he was just complaining about the lack of a longer stoppage time.
But there will be a time,I'm sure of it.
He's going to rise his polished 3 fingers to the sky at Old Trafford in the same vein that Lion-O raises his lofty Sword Of Omens ,in the intro to Thundercats. And a bolting light will strike his 3 fingers while Jose screams out "3 PL Titles ! Hoooooooooooooooooooooo!"
Now was the wrong time to watch 90's cartoon intros.
But he was just complaining about the lack of a longer stoppage time.
But there will be a time,I'm sure of it.
He's going to rise his polished 3 fingers to the sky at Old Trafford in the same vein that Lion-O raises his lofty Sword Of Omens ,in the intro to Thundercats. And a bolting light will strike his 3 fingers while Jose screams out "3 PL Titles ! Hoooooooooooooooooooooo!"
Now was the wrong time to watch 90's cartoon intros.
As soon as this cnut opens his filthy mouth, he talks bollocks. The club is already an embarrassment, keeping this past it clown any longer only highlights this more, on and off the pitch.
Here Here. Some people must have shit in their eyes as they will defend the indefensible if it involves Mourinho. Giggs was a great footballer and won more honours than anyone in the English game, but you wouldnt have him on the wing now because of past glories, its what he could produce now, and obviously he couldnt.
True that.
And he can atone for his earlier massive mistake (undeserved contract renewal) by sacking him ASAP.
A loss vs Mark Hughes's well drilled men would surely seal Mourinho's fate "sacked in the morning" I hope to hear ringing round St.Marys tonight.
Hope Sparky "does him" as Sparky must have added motivation.. playing for United in the 80s/90s with free-flowing football it must break his heart the dross we are seeing from United abandoning our principles and ethos for this charlatan named Mourinho.. never put a manager above a clubs traditions.. first mistake we made.. you add the manager to compliment them ala Poch.
Come on Sparky!
Watch though.. Mourinho will somehow fluke a win and then get an extra month or two.. it's groundhog day.. this needs to be the final nail in the coffin Mourinho can't keep dodging bullets. Dragging this out is helping nobody...
Hope Sparky "does him" as Sparky must have added motivation.. playing for United in the 80s/90s with free-flowing football it must break his heart the dross we are seeing from United abandoning our principles and ethos for this charlatan named Mourinho.. never put a manager above a clubs traditions.. first mistake we made.. you add the manager to compliment them ala Poch.
Come on Sparky!
Watch though.. Mourinho will somehow fluke a win and then get an extra month or two.. it's groundhog day.. this needs to be the final nail in the coffin Mourinho can't keep dodging bullets. Dragging this out is helping nobody...
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Apparently according to some on here, because managers are not "athletes" they can't get "past it" like a footballer can. A load of bollocks, football has passed him by.
Nah, he was letting the ref know he's won it 3 times.
I agree - I find the club's approach to scouting managers and players very lazy!
LVG and Jose were hired based on their name and past achievements. The club don't seem to know what type of manager they're looking for, there was no real thought process when we hired Jose. We can't afford to make that same mistake again.
I mean most managers are hired on name and previous achievements, I do get what you mean in that it seems rudderless, however I’ve always thought LVG was a direction and have always assumed the plan was he come in create a youthful team for Giggs to then takeover. That seemed like the plan to me but we obviously got cold feet and having Jose lurking as a free agent made it worse.
Arguably he was the worst manager to come in after LVG as they have completely different philosophy’s on how the game should be played and what you need for that so it was basically a hard reset on everything we’d been working on.
Anyway at some point I think there was a plan and a direction and we bottled it.
LvG and Jose are different managers for different purposes. If we wanted to promote youth and develop them, in the long run LvG is that kind of manager, he likes to work with players, coach them through mistakes and help them become better.
If the idea is to win trophies in the here and now, then that's Jose. He won't spend too much time investing development time in the younger players who cannot give him their best right now. That's why he almost sees them with suspicion in the sense that "how long is it going to take before he makes a mistake and disappoints me?".
Considering Woodward is seemingly more concerned about the financial and marketing side of the club business I'd say that the club know exactly what type of manager they are looking for and got exactly who they wanted. A high profile manager who would make headlines. The club doing well on the pitch would have been a positive side effect of hiring the high profile manager but I'm not sure if the "money men" are all too concerned about results on the pitch as long as the deals keep coming in.
Really wish this fella would make an appearance...
The simple answer is stop giving so much power to one person. If the next manager does a poor job you sack him too. You can afford not to settle for anything less than excellence, so why should you?
I mean ik we're in a pretty bad shape right now but homie that's David MoyesReally wish this fella would make an appearance...
Ik you're referring to grim reaper
Yep. Really don't get "what if the next guy does nothing"? Look at Real. Hired Lopetegui, sacked him 6 months, made Solari manager since no-one was available and are likely to sack him too and replace him with a top class manager if he becomes available.
We have the money to pay off 5 managers per year. So hire someone risky, cut him loose if he isn't up to the job and hire someone else. Not rocket science.
I mean ik we're in a pretty bad shape right now but homie that's David Moyes
Ik you're referring to grim reaper
As much as Real Madrid’s revolving door policy on managers annoys me it is interesting to compare how their fans don’t settle for anything less than excellence as you call it. If things aren’t going well the white handkerchiefs are out and the manager is gone pretty quickly to make way for the next one to do a better job and it keeps going until you’re back on top.
Has it always been like that? Even before the days of the Galacticos when Real went many years without winning the European Cup / not winning regular La Ligas (my knowledge of Reals domestic success pre-2000s is weak).
I don’t want to see that kind of thing at United but I do wonder if as a fanbase many of us are too willing to sit tight and hope for the best even when it’s clear as day we’re going in the wrong direction. I can’t think of a top club in any other league in recent times having such a sudden fall from grace like we have. Not since Liverpool in the early 90s perhaps. Happy to be corrected on that.
For me it's about waiting and still considering if manager a b or c is going to be good for us.
We all know that Jose has failed here & not all of it is his fault but neither is he faultless enough to stay. Ultimately we are now waiting here contemplating whether Howe, Carrick ,butt, pochettino Giggs etc are good fits.
If LVG got fired earlier if there was no future for him - we could have given 5 months to Giggs - having us have one less potential manager to contemplate for the future. If we get rid of Jose - we can put butt or Carrick in charge - another 2 managers we can see if they have a future or not until someone gets in for the summer like Howe or the spurs manager.
The loyalty aspect of this club has been built over years & it is one we must continue with if it is worth it - not given freely to anybody and everybody.
If we are going to stay like this until end of the summer & say we get Howe in - we have Giggs, Butt Carrick & mauricio to contemplate with still if Howe ends up struggling.
@Niall Yes. Since Miguel Munoz in the '60s(lasted 15 years until the mid 70s, won the league 9 times and the CL twice during that span, and was responsible for pushing Di Stefano out of the club) our longest tenured manager was Del Bosque, who lasted 3 seasons and a half straight and won 2 CL and 2 league titles in that span
Yeah, just a tiny little mishap that from Woodward, that.
Needs to go. Argument should be about when.
So from the mid-1970s Real have never had a manager for longer than 3 seasons? Mad!
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That's actually the case at most big clubs outside england
Funny you want to say all this but want us to buy yet again another CB who could fail. Is it not the same logic?
Anything less than a comfortable win vs Southampton is pretty poor, they are championship standard.
He clearly doesn't give a flying fcuk anymore judging by his line-up today.
Giggs is not going to come for just end of the season. He is the Welsh Manager. Carrick maybe or Butt yes but the Board is not going to sack Jose now to give it to Butt or Carrick now.
After almost 3 years and €400m spent, Mourinho doesn't know his best formation or best team.
Get rid.
Get rid.
Fire him based just on this lineup
@Niall you got me curious about that so i went and checked: since 1945, when you hired Matt Busby, your club has had 13 differrent managers(including caretakers and multiple tenures by the same man). Liverpool, 16...
...and every one of Juventus, Inter, Milan, Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern Munich and Ajax have had more than 40
...and every one of Juventus, Inter, Milan, Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern Munich and Ajax have had more than 40
In all seriousness he probably just wants sacked, to have his big pay-out and enjoy Xmas with his family. It makes complete sense - he knows he's been a complete failure with us - why extend it?
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