UK Policing

[The Purley King]

Don't really know enough about this case to comment but something about your post irked me. Reads like 'fecked about and found out' or the usual 'should have followed the police instructions'

Ramming the car would only be relevant to the shooting if the shot was taken while doing so and an officer was inside. That would make all the gun and gangster stuff mentioned irrelevant.

If the shot was fired because the officer thought he had a gun and shot to prevent an officer being shot, the personal stuff would be relevant only if he knew it at the time like you said, but also he'd have to have a reason to believe he'd drawn the gun, not just guessed so based on speculation or 'at some point he has to make a decision' if he's refusing to comply.

It’s a fair opinion, there was an element of “just do as instructed “ about it.
That on its own wouldn’t justify shooting him, but in combination with other things that perhaps the police knew in advance might mean an officer doesn’t take a chance when observing erratic behaviour that could potentially end up with that officer getting shot.
Hopefully everything is made public during the trial and we can learn about what actually happened.
I’m siding with the police based on what has been made public thus far but I’m sure more will come out during the trial.

 

[SalfordRed18]

I've never understood how police can run up at you shouting all sorts, then have the audacity to tell you to calm down. Cut dude with their cuffs and with a straight face say it's because of his actions? Make up bullshit about smelling weed?

Met police are terrible.

 

[Sara125]

I've never understood how police can run up at you shouting all sorts, then have the audacity to tell you to calm down. Cut dude with their cuffs and with a straight face say it's because of his actions? Make up bullshit about smelling weed?

Met police are terrible.

fecking scumbags. Honestly they get so under my skin. Also…’we smelled weed’ in 2020? Someone should tell them that the 2000s called and they want their bs excuses for stopping black men back.

 

[Ludens the Red]

I've never understood how police can run up at you shouting all sorts, then have the audacity to tell you to calm down. Cut dude with their cuffs and with a straight face say it's because of his actions? Make up bullshit about smelling weed?

Met police are terrible.

Watched this video a few times and I’m confused as to the weed comment. At what point of the video is weed mentioned? Can’t actually hear anything that main officer says.


This video shows the grounds and what they’re searching for and what supposedly happened.

Male Officer in the first video is a bit of a disaster, unnecessarily going in at 100mph, not clearly giving grounds (even having to be prompted) I think he’s very nervous and he’s made the situation worse by losing rationality in complete contrast to the female officer in the other video.

 

[Sara125]

In some unedited versions of the video the officer on the right says something like ‘we smelled cannabis in your car’

ETA: for example in the daily mail article’s one

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12570013/ricardo-dos-santos-police-video.html

(Sorry don’t know how to post just the vid but it’s around the 1:50 mark)

 

[SalfordRed18]

Watched this video a few times and I’m confused as to the weed comment. At what point of the video is weed mentioned? Can’t actually hear anything that main officer says.


This video shows the grounds and what they’re searching for and what supposedly happened.

Male Officer in the first video is a bit of a disaster, unnecessarily going in at 100mph, not clearly giving grounds (even having to be prompted) I think he’s very nervous and he’s made the situation worse by losing rationality in complete contrast to the female officer in the other video.

What @Sara125 said.

I saw the video on on tiktok which I can't embed so posted this one instead.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Totally normal to take information provided to you by a potential victim and give it to the accused.

 

[Jippy]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Totally normal to take information provided to you by a potential victim and give it to the accused.

I'm curious about the details of the disgusting acts that required the women to get medical help.

 

[Buster15]

A friend of mine was telling me that he was woken in the middle of the night by a loud banging noise. He looked out of his window to see someone across the road trying to break down the side gate of the house.
So he phoned for the police. They asked him for a description.
Obviously it was dark and so he told them that. They then asked him if he could give them their getaway car registration number.
My friend asked them how he was supposed to know which if any was their car.
The police said that because it was dark and my friend could not be sure that an actual crime was being committed there was nothing they could do and hung up.....

 

[Drainy]

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-67148208

Boy with water pistol confronted by armed police

Being discussed on LBC at the moment. Apparently the water pistol was bright blue

 

[horsechoker]

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-67148208

Boy with water pistol confronted by armed police

Being discussed on LBC at the moment. Apparently the water pistol was bright blue

Was there any mention of the boy's skin colour?

 

[Drainy]

Was there any mention of the boy's skin colour?

The boy is black

 

[horsechoker]

The boy is black

 

[11101]

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-67148208

Boy with water pistol confronted by armed police

Being discussed on LBC at the moment. Apparently the water pistol was bright blue

My next door neighbour growing up had a similar thing happen to him. I'd guess we were about 14 at the time, he had just got a Nerf gun and was playing with it outside a local bank. The staff called the police and he was ordered to the ground with a gun in his face. Is that really newsworthy?

 

[Drainy]

My next door neighbour growing up had a similar thing happen to him. I'd guess we were about 14 at the time, he had just got a Nerf gun and was playing with it outside a local bank. The staff called the police and he was ordered to the ground with a gun in his face. Is that really newsworthy?

I think having a policy of neutralising a reported threat, and then identifying whether there is a threat is newsworthy.

As is clear from my posting history I believe there is scope for mistaken but reasonable belief based on the facts known at the time, but it's grossly negligent in use force with no attempt to check if the person is even a threat by observing what is in their hand when it would be obvious to any reasonable person that the use of force wouldn't be based on minimal verification.

 

[decorativeed]

My next door neighbour growing up had a similar thing happen to him. I'd guess we were about 14 at the time, he had just got a Nerf gun and was playing with it outside a local bank. The staff called the police and he was ordered to the ground with a gun in his face. Is that really newsworthy?

That police officers aren't able to identify a popular toy as not being a threat to the public and having a hugely disproportionate response? Yes, to be honest, I think it is.

 

[mitChley]

I'm very pro-ACAB but if I played devils advocate there are some guns that look like toys (intentionally) and who the hell plays with a water gun in mid-October in Britain!

 

[decorativeed]

I'm very pro-ACAB but if I played devils advocate there are some guns that look like toys (intentionally) and who the hell plays with a water gun in mid-October in Britain!

Devils advocate would do well to read the article.

The boy was having a water fight with his sibling on 19 July...

One of the water pistols being played with was blue and white and one was pink and white, and unmistakably toys, it added.

 

[mitChley]

Devils advocate would do well to read the article.

Ah feck, that's what I get for browsing the caf while working. July, fair enough, stupid.

 

[decorativeed]

Ah feck, that's what I get for browsing the caf while working. July, fair enough, stupid.

It's all fine. Nothing in it to change that ACAB sentiment!

 

[11101]

That police officers aren't able to identify a popular toy as not being a threat to the public and having a hugely disproportionate response? Yes, to be honest, I think it is.

Real or toy?

If they've a report of a gun they're not going to feck around until absolutely certain it's a false alarm.

 

[horsechoker]

Real or toy?

If they've a report of a gun they're not going to feck around until absolutely certain it's a false alarm.

If someone stepped on that they could be seriously injured

 

[decorativeed]

Real or toy?

If they've a report of a gun they're not going to feck around until absolutely certain it's a false alarm.

I think the foam projectiles or water spraying from it, the children's laughter and the lack of bang bang sounds are also worth taking into consideration in these cases.

 

[Buster15]

Devils advocate would do well to read the article.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-67148208

To be honest I thought this was some kind of joke. Arrested for playing with a PINK WATER PISTOL of all things. I didn't realise that gangsters carried pink guns.
So you are burgled in the middle of the night and the police don't turn up.
Well now we know why. Too busy arresting children for playing with pink and blue and white water pistols.
I used to play with a Spud Gun when I was a kid. Better go and had myself in.....

Question on your job application:
Have you ever been arrested....
Yes I have....
And what were you arrested for...
Playing with my Water Pistol....
Application denied. Now F.OFF you criminal.

 

[yumtum]

Let not all laugh about pink/blue guns just being toys - you're all showing your age these days, 3d printers have made guns an actual threat, no matter the colour (of the gun).

They're not going to know until they investigate further.

https://news.sky.com/story/3d-print...irearm-in-the-uk-and-who-is-doing-it-12630777

 

[SalfordRed18]

Let not all laugh about pink/blue guns just being toys - you're all showing your age these days, 3d printers have made guns an actual threat, no matter the colour (of the gun).

They're not going to know until they investigate further.

https://news.sky.com/story/3d-print...irearm-in-the-uk-and-who-is-doing-it-12630777

You've truly gone out your way to defend police knocking a child off his bike and holding him at gunpoint for water pistols. Water pistols that have been around for how many years?

If you truly believe that the police thought some 13 year old black kid in hackney has access to a 3D printer or was even given a 3D printed gun I don't know what to tell you.

 

[The Corinthian]

My next door neighbour growing up had a similar thing happen to him. I'd guess we were about 14 at the time, he had just got a Nerf gun and was playing with it outside a local bank. The staff called the police and he was ordered to the ground with a gun in his face. Is that really newsworthy?

How are you able to have the worst possible take on such a wide variety of topics? It's actually quite impressive.

 

[The Corinthian]

If someone stepped on that they could be seriously injured

I think the foam projectiles or water spraying from it, the children's laughter and the lack of bang bang sounds are also worth taking into consideration in these cases.

 

[horsechoker]

How are you able to have the worst possible take on such a wide variety of topics? It's actually quite impressive.

I like that his take away from the story was that this is just an everyday situation and not a massive overreaction by the police

 

[yumtum]

You've truly gone out your way to defend police knocking a child off his bike and holding him at gunpoint for water pistols. Water pistols that have been around for how many years?

If you truly believe that the police thought some 13 year old black kid in hackney has access to a 3D printer or was even given a 3D printed gun I don't know what to tell you.

I actually truly dislike the police, and think the situation that's been reported is ridiculous.

I just wanted to point out people saying pink or blue guns can't possibly be a threat.

 

[Red in STL]

My next door neighbour growing up had a similar thing happen to him. I'd guess we were about 14 at the time, he had just got a Nerf gun and was playing with it outside a local bank. The staff called the police and he was ordered to the ground with a gun in his face. Is that really newsworthy?

Yes it is because it shouldn't happen and if it doesn't make the news it'll keep happening

 

[11101]

How are you able to have the worst possible take on such a wide variety of topics? It's actually quite impressive.

You're right. It's an OUTRAGE what happened. Its probably Israel's fault too.

 

[11101]

Yes it is because it shouldn't happen and if it doesn't make the news it'll keep happening

Police get reports of a gun. Police respond with their own guns. Police let the kid go once they've established its not a real gun (as we've already seen real guns can look like toy guns). Take issue with the initial report but the response from there is totally normal.

 

[Bert_]

Real or toy?

If they've a report of a gun they're not going to feck around until absolutely certain it's a false alarm.

When I was a kid we had BB guns that looked like actual firearms albeit made of platic. They could also cause for more damage than water pistols as well. No idea how we got away without being swarmed by armed police.

 

[Drainy]

I find it bizarre that an unverified report can be used as justification for a serious use of force - they knocked him off his bike with a car and then pointed guns at him, then put him in handcuffs while they looked at his plastic water pistol.

That kind of thinking isn't adequate for 21st century policing where people get swatted or pranked all the time.

 

[SilentWitness]

Police get reports of a gun. Police respond with their own guns. Police let the kid go once they've established its not a real gun (as we've already seen real guns can look like toy guns). Take issue with the initial report but the response from there is totally normal.

It's not totally normal to have reacted in the way that they did.

 

[SalfordRed18]

Police get reports of a gun. Police respond with their own guns. Police let the kid go once they've established its not a real gun (as we've already seen real guns can look like toy guns). Take issue with the initial report but the response from there is totally normal.

It was a police officer on patrol that initially reported the "firearm," so...

 

[Drainy]

It was a police officer on patrol that initially reported the "firearm," so...

I hadn't heard that.

If so, it does make the use of force itself more understandable (at least rational, if seemingly still premature and excessive) from the officers who hadn't seen the water pistol and relied on the report, but calls massively into question the character of the reporting officer. It sounds like straight up racism.

 

[11101]

It was a police officer on patrol that initially reported the "firearm," so...

Yeah I saw, so like I say question that report. It's dream land if you think firearms police aren't going to take that seriously and it's normal to treat something like that as a threat until the person is detained and they've checked the gun. But that's no fun for those who think everything the police do is wrong.

 

[SalfordRed18]

Yeah I saw, so like I say question that report. It's dream land if you think firearms police aren't going to take that seriously and it's normal to treat something like that as a threat until the person is detained and they've checked the gun. But that's no fun for those who think everything the police do is wrong.

But this has only happened because of a police officer on patrol? You do get that right?