Victor Lindelöf

[VP89]

That's exactly what "these people" said, that Rojo is the new Vidic. Rojo has played 12 matches as a CB during the current run. @devilish said that you can’t trust a CB gets sent off twice (he didn’t but should’ve) possibly costing us 6 points. Vidic got sent off a few times. I like the fact that Rojo is aggressive and tough as a CB but yes, he should stop jumping into tackles like that.

Vidic and Rojo are not comparable because Vidic did not make challenges worthy of a red card in 20% of his games.

The idea that the two are comparable just because they are physical is ludacris. Vidic walked a few times, but over a far bigger sample size. Rojo should have walked in 2 of his last 5 appearances at CB. In other words, people are praising Rojo as a CB based on a sample of games where he should have been sent off 40% of the time.

Back to Lindelof though - only 4 yellows last year and none this year so far is impressive. Either that or the Portugese League is terrible poor.

 

[Strats]

Can't embed yet so i'll just link to the tweet: twitter.com/majanilsson/status/774537289544458241

At least Lindelöf has set his priorities right. His girlfriend comes off as very funny and likable.

Translation:

Spoiler

"When your saturday plans goes to feck"

Maja: Shall we go out for lunch today?
Victor: Honey...
Maja: Yes....
Victor: *inserts photo of live score app*
Maja: Omg, okay
Victor: It's the manchester derby
Victor: Game of the century
Maja: Okay okay

Apparently he didn't even want to risk missing the game and watched the game at Benficas training ground instead of coming home. And on an other occation he gave her sleeping pills so he could stay up all night and play Call of duty

 

[top1whoisman]

Vidic and Rojo are not comparable because Vidic did not make challenges worthy of a red card in 20% of his games.

The idea that the two are comparable just because they are physical is ludacris. Vidic walked a few times, but over a far bigger sample size. Rojo should have walked in 2 of his last 5 appearances at CB. In other words, people are praising Rojo as a CB based on a sample of games where he should have been sent off 40% of the time.

Back to Lindelof though - only 4 yellows last year and none this year so far is impressive. Either that or the Portugese League is terrible poor.

Again - not comparing them. Just saying it's dumb to say that a CB who should've been sent off twice can't be trusted. Not even mentioning Rojo, the argument itself is stupid.

 

[devilish]

Bailly could have just has easily seen red for two yellows more than once, the specificity of the tackle is irrelevant and lets face it Jose was a guy content with Ramos who has more red cards than any CB in history. On top of that if we are taking Jose by his word then he sees Blind as a LB, not a CM, in fact he's 3rd choice LB at this stage with even the mediocre Darmian preferred to him. If anything it's far more likely that Blind and Smalling are sold, especially since the latter can only play RCB and is by far our worst CB on the ball.

RB - Valencia/Semedo
RCB - Bailly/Jones
LCB - Lindelof/Rojo
LB - Shaw/New Singing

It is relevant because two foot tackles = red card. No ifs no buts. Regarding Blind I have a feeling he'll end up DM at one point. Its his natural position and we'll need bodies there considering that Carrick is old + Schneiderlin, Bastian and in the near future Fellaini might leave. Lets face it, he's the closest thing we've got to Carrick although the gap in terms of talent is pretty evident.

Also if Mou is happy with Rojo's rash tackles then why are we adding a new CB? Why he wants Rojo as far away from the box as possible?

I admit that things change quickly in defense. Last year's hero may end up this year's villian etc. However Smalling has a number of characteristics that Mou likes in a CB. He's tall and powerful a bit like John Terry was. What I am very confident about is Mourinho's determination to have a reliable back 4 who play together for most of the season. Which is fair enough.

 

[Beachryan]

Anyone else get the feeling that Jose just isn't a big Smalling fan? Not sure he's 'saavy' enough to be our main CB tbh, but then not convinced Lindelhof will walk into the team either, and Jones is guaranteed to be out again soon.

Strange.

 

[Sassy Colin]

Well the positive side is that we get another Swede. Always helps as a Swedish United supporter.

Seems kind of strange now that we have the CB issue sorted with Jones coming into form and Rojo upping his game, Smalling coming back from injury etc.

Lets face it, we can never have too many centre backs at United. What price Carrick & Herrera having to play there come the end of February?

 

[Stookie]

We're gonna end up with the worlds largest squad if we don't get rid of some dross. It'll be like an American football team all stood on the sidelines.

 

[Rado_N]

haven't seen anything of this lad to judge

You're not doing it right, not having seen him play doesn't matter in this subforum.

 

[VP89]

Again - not comparing them. Just saying it's dumb to say that a CB who should've been sent off twice can't be trusted. Not even mentioning Rojo, the argument itself is stupid.

Its so ironic that you used the word "stupid" in that instance. Explain to me why a CB who makes 2 clear red card challenges in his 5 games at CB this season can be trusted?

 

[gza the genius]

Without knowing anything about Lindelof - it does seem obvious that we still need cover at center back. Jones and Smalling are liable to burst in to flames at any moment and be out for the rest of the season, Bailly will be at the AFCON and has injury problems as well lately, Rojo is playing well for now but who knows how long that will last plus he seems to get injured fairly easily as well, and Jose doesn't seem to rate Blind at center back. At the least we could use another reliable defender which should also help with cover for the fullback positions as well.

No clue if Lindelof specifically is the answer, but we do need more cover and if it proves to be too much you get rid of the weak links in the summer.

 

[top1whoisman]

Its so ironic that you used the word "stupid" in that instance. Explain to me why a CB who makes 2 clear red card challenges in his 5 games at CB this season can be trusted?

Sigh. There was never talk about ”in his 5 games (although it’s 12)”.

2 red cards could possibly cost us 6 points. How can anyone trust a CB like that?

In any case, there’s always a possibility that good coaches can iron out the rashness. So yes, I would still show patience and trust in a player that has jumped into two challenges in a way that could’ve ended up in two red cards.

 

[Valar Morghulis]

Spoiler

"When your saturday plans goes to feck"

Maja: Shall we go out for lunch today?
Victor: Honey...
Maja: Yes....
Victor: *inserts photo of live score app*
Maja: Omg, okay
Victor: It's the manchester derby
Victor: Game of the century
Maja: Okay okay

Apparently he didn't even want to risk missing the game and watched the game at Benficas training ground instead of coming home. And on an other occation he gave her sleeping pills so he could stay up all night and play Call of duty

Okay I was undecided but now I definitely want him I remember coming on here in the Summer to find out about Bailly and seeing very similar stuff being said about him to what is now being said about Lindelof. A lot of people thought we'd sign a more experienced centre back in the summer as well, because Bailly needed time.

Absolutely trust Jose with this. I hope there's an unknown Carrick replacement out there somewhere, if we can sign someone of that profile too we are laughing (Most likely have to wait til the Summer for this though!)

 

[VP89]

Sigh. There was never talk about ”in his 5 games (although it’s 12)”.

I'm not talking about what the other guy quoted.

I find it silly that you think its "stupid" to question a CB who has been should be sent off twice this season. Rojo has not had 12 appearances at CB for us in this campaign.

 

[top1whoisman]

I'm not talking about what the other guy quoted.

I find it silly that you think its "stupid" to question a CB who has been should be sent off twice this season. Rojo has not had 12 appearances at CB for us in this campaign.

Well, I am. I questioned the claim that such a CB shouldn’t be trusted. According to transfermarkt he has http://www.transfermarkt.com/marcos-rojo/leistungsdaten/spieler/93176

 

[Adam-Utd]

1 thing for sure, Mourinho has bought him with potential in mind. He might not be a Vidic/Terry yet but who knows what he could do with him.

 

[VP89]

Well, I am. I questioned the claim that such a CB shouldn’t be trusted. According to transfermarkt he has http://www.transfermarkt.com/marcos-rojo/leistungsdaten/spieler/93176

If we were to believe that site - its 10 games at CB. He should have walked on 2 occassions, ie 20% of the time he's played at CB for us.

It is not daft to suggest a player who makes a red card offence 20% of the time cannot, at present, be trusted.

Its certainly daft to suggest otherwise however.. as you are doing right now.

 

[devilish]

Sigh. There was never talk about ”in his 5 games (although it’s 12)”.



In any case, there’s always a possibility that good coaches can iron out the rashness. So yes, I would still show patience and trust in a player that has jumped into two challenges in a way that could’ve ended up in two red cards.

Prior to those 5 games he was dogshite in most of the times.

There's always a possibility that top quality coaches can iron out the rashness however I doubt it. I can't think of many defenders who enjoyed such miracle

 

[top1whoisman]

If we were to believe that site - its 10 games at CB. He should have walked on 2 occassions, ie 20% of the time he's played at CB for us.

It is not daft to suggest a player who makes a red card offence 20% of the time cannot, at present, be trusted.

Its certainly daft to suggest otherwise however.. as you are doing right now.

10 in the league, yes. Don’t know why you’re excluding other comps. Well, I’m sure a lot of CBs have done that, have been trusted anyway, and have become better players. It happens with aggressive players. I’m happy José has trusted him, he’s been good during this run.

 

[podurban2]

It's funny how people rip into Rojo for being careless, when darling boy Bailly is almost equally rash going into tackles (especially in the penalty area).

 

[top1whoisman]

Prior to those 5 games he was dogshite in most of the times.

There's always a possibility that top quality coaches can iron out the rashness however I doubt it. I can't think of many defenders who enjoyed such miracle

I’d say he was dogshite as a LB, been decent-good during the 12 matches as CB though. Some world class CBs still get sent off every now and then. Ramos, one of the best CBs in the world, has been sent off 21 times in his club career. Pepe 8 times, seen quite a lot of claims that he was the best, or most successful at least, CB this year.

 

[Sylar]

Neither has anyone in here except for some of the Portuguese residents and us Swedes, and we are all saying he is not worth the money.

Ive read the part about the money a lot, but forgetting that since its not really an issue for United, the main question should be "is he good enough for United" or "will he ever be good enough for what United need?"

 

[devilish]

I’d say he was dogshite as a LB, been decent-good during the 12 matches as CB though. Some world class CBs still get sent off every now and then. Ramos, one of the best CBs in the world, has been sent off 21 times in his club career. Pepe 8 times, seen quite a lot of claims that he was the best, or most successful at least, CB this year.

Not really. He should have been sent off twice in the past 5 matches.

Also I don't rate Ramos as one of the best CBs in the world. He's one of the most overrated ones, but certainly he's not one of the best.

 

[devilish]

It's funny how people rip into Rojo for being careless, when darling boy Bailly is almost equally rash going into tackles (especially in the penalty area).

Bailly is 22, Rojo is 26. Bailly is rash. Rojo's two footed tackles are stupid. Bailly immediately won his first team place. The only time Rojo came close of becoming first teamer was in the past 5 games were he nearly mauled 2 forwards.

 

[top1whoisman]

Not really. He nearly got sent off twice in 5 matches.

Also I don't rate Ramos as one of the best CBs in the world. He's one of the most overrated ones, but certainly he's not one of the best.

Let's stop derailing this thread, when people are expecting updates on the transfer. I think rash CBs who should've been sent off a couple of times, can still be trusted and with some guidance from the coaching staff and more experienced players, might iron that out of their game. You disagree, which is fine.

 

[Manny]

Jose has gone 4 out of 4 so far in transfers so hopefully he's about to unearth another Bailly like talent.

 

[VP89]

10 in the league, yes. Don’t know why you’re excluding other comps. Well, I’m sure a lot of CBs have done that, have been trusted anyway, and have become better players. It happens with aggressive players. I’m happy José has trusted him, he’s been good during this run.

My count included Europa League (including Feyenoord away where he along with the rest of the team weren't great).

Jose isn't trusting him out of choice, he has had Smalling and Bailly injured. If he found Rojo a trustworthy enough CB, we wouldn't be going in for Lindelof. Its obvious that Jose is as concerned as we are by his rash challenges.

 

[golden_blunder]

You're not doing it right, not having seen him play doesn't matter in this subforum.

sorry yeah, forgot myself.

I've seen him kick every ball, including his dad's since he was born, even when it was "nappies for goalposts" I could see his potential as a world class centre back.

In fact we haven't seen a centre back of his quality since Emile Heskey

 

[top1whoisman]

My count included Europa League (including Feyenoord away where he along with the rest of the team weren't great).

Jose isn't trusting him out of choice, he has had Smalling and Bailly injured. If he found Rojo a trustworthy enough CB, we wouldn't be going in for Lindelof. Its obvious that Jose is as concerned as we are by his rash challenges.

Could be. Still doesn’t make it impossible to trust a rash CB and improve him.

 

[horsechoker]

Could be. I think Valencia split up with his wife recently.

 

[kundalini]

I would suggest that most of the goals we've conceded in the PL this season, had very little to do with our central defenders; Smalling's performance at Chelsea being the exception. Central midfielders not tracking runners has been a problem. De Gea's errors another.

So quite why we need to buy another central defender is beyond me. He might be better than Jones, Smalling or he might not. If the YouTube vids are anything to go by, he doesn't appear particularly comfortable as the left central defender so I wouldn't be buying him for that position.

He's a good age but I'm struggling to see how he develops at United. Either we take a huge risk and put him in as a starter, or he waits for opportunities.

 

[TheSwedeFromSweden]

Ive read the part about the money a lot, but forgetting that since its not really an issue for United, the main question should be "is he good enough for United" or "will he ever be good enough for what United need?"

First question: Probably not right now. He has had mixed performance in this season and is definitely not better than Jones, Bailly and Rojo (at the moment at least). Maybe not even Smalling. Than there could be some sort of a "Bailly-effect" that suddenly makes him look like world class as soon as he arrives in Manchester. But that is more unlikely than likely in my opinion. By the way he has played in Benfica this season, no.

Second question: He definitely has the potential if he gets to play a lot. His development has been incredibly the last year. From in 2015 being a player in Benfica B, not even been selected for U-21 Euro until our RB was injured to then becoming the best RB in the tournament, get a starting position in Benfica and doing great performances in CL by the end of last season. If his development continues in the same pace, he will be the best defender in the world by 25.

 

[VP89]

Could be. Still doesn’t make it impossible to trust a rash CB and improve him.

Very few things are impossible. But the notion that it's stupid to think he can't be trusted off the back of his previous games is beyond ridiculous.

Mourinho is tying down this transfer early for a reason. His first choice CBs are away and he can't continue to trust the step ins.

 

[top1whoisman]

Very few things are impossible. But the notion that it's stupid to think he can't be trusted off the back of his previous games is beyond ridiculous.

Mourinho is tying down this transfer early for a reason. His first choice CBs are away and he can't continue to trust the step ins.

Well I still think it’s stupid to say that a defender can’t be trusted because he has made two stupid challenges. I’m sure a lot of good defenders have done that. Anyway, let’s agree to disagree on this

 

[Gazza]

Not really, Mourinho's teams in the past all had a very clear well defined central pairing. Surely if he wanted competition, it would have been noticeable from his previous team selections? Add to that the fact that there is virtually no top team in the planet who has 4 defenders competing for those 2 positions and it makes no sense.

No two situations are exactly alike so it's a bit lazy to just use his past squads as a guide for this squad. It's not like he has a Terry-Carvalho partnership to rely on as he did in the past

 

[podurban2]

I wonder if Mendes has a sex tape of Mourinho's daughter.

 

[Eckers99]

Without knowing anything about the quality of the player, I can't say I am very enthused by the prospect. We already have a number of CBs of similar age profiles, including Bailley whom we recently bought. What we need most importantly is an experienced good quality CB.

Yeah, you can prove anything with facts.

 

[VP89]

Well I still think it’s stupid to say that a defender can’t be trusted because he has made two stupid challenges. I’m sure a lot of good defenders have done that. Anyway, let’s agree to disagree on this

Yes, but those very good defenders have played over a wider span of games for us to conclude that they can be trusted. A player with 10 appearances at CB with 2 clear red card offences is rash and cannot be trusted.

There are no two ways about it.

 

[top1whoisman]

Yes, but those very good defenders have played over a wider span of games for us to conclude that they can be trusted. A player with 10 appearances at CB with 2 clear red card offences is rash and cannot be trusted.

There are no two ways about it.

Well he’s got another 20 matches as a CB for us from earlier seasons. No sendings off as of yet.

 

[spenzo]

Like @nl_Max and Deepay?

Yeah, it was a joke but I did think it was an interesting observation as you don't often have a thread for a heavily linked player without at least one 'expert'/protector.

 

[spenzo]

Remember the guy who did that with Memphis? That didn't exactly end well...

I know mate I wasn't being serious about it being worrying, just something I noticed to be absent in the thread.