I don’t think May believes any of that guff. It’s more the case that a second referendum may lead to the break up of the Conservative Party and she doesn’t want that happening on her watch.See Theresa May is urging MPs not to ask for a second referendum as this will "Break faith with the British people":
“Let us not break faith with the British people by trying to stage another referendum,” the prime minister will tell MPs. “Another vote which would do irreparable damage to the integrity of our politics, because it would say to millions who trusted in democracy, that our democracy does not deliver. Another vote which would likely leave us no further forward than the last.”
I think this would be a fair point IF she (or anyone) could deliver the BREXIT that most people were promised before they voted; the one most rational (non-racist) people based their decision on that would make everyone better off, plow £350m a week back into the NHS, restrict immigration but not trade, blah-blah-blah BUT that was a lie!
Following that lie unquestioningly to it's bitter end is where democracy betrayed the people of Britain … not someone saying "now you have seen a fraction of what a real BREXIT might look like how do you all feel now?"
Surely, if people have adjusted their opinions given the established reality, allowing them to voice that before it's too late is the very embodiment of democracy at work?
If there's one thing that the british people don't want it's the conservative party breaking up.I don’t think May believes any of that guff. It’s more the case that a second referendum may lead to the break up of the Conservative Party and she doesn’t want that happening on her watch.
I think the problem is if the vote is 52% remain to 48% leave or close , if another referendum happened at the vote was as close as the last vote but the other way I honestly think we'd see riots and I'd fear for the safety of anyone who isn't a white British national.If there was another referendum and the majority wanted to remain how is that undemocratic? By listening too much to the people?
If a mini-riot like the bradford riots are the price to pay then bring it on. It would only be the EDL types, you arrest them and move on.I think the problem is if the vote is 52% remain to 48% leave or close , if another referendum happened at the vote was as close as the last vote but the other way I honestly think we'd see riots and I'd fear for the safety of anyone who isn't a white British national.
I just think we should leave but still be in the EEC and allow free movement of people, yeah hardline brexiters would be up in arms but so what, they're a minority.
Utter bollocks, the views of a country change it's not undemocratic to check whether that's the case especially given what was voted on hasn't been delivered. That's how our political system works. I wouldn't be against another referendum in 10 years but it would need to be on the same deal.Obviously it's undemocratic to call referendums for things when the result is then not adhered to. You can desperately want to stay in the EU and that's sensible and fine but you can't deny that going back to the public with a referendum whenever you dont like the current result makes a mockery of referendums, and will completely erode the public faith in them.
A second referendum would likely end in another near-stalemate. Except it wouldn't because they'd probably spend months arguing over the number of options (what happens if the new result is 20% leave with no deal, 31% leave with May's deal, 49% remain... for instance??) and all in all would be a massive time sink.
Even if there were just two options and it ended 51% for remain what do people honestly think would happen? Like you can't be naive enough to think there wouldn't be total and utter chaos. Could you deny the Brexiters if they said the result wasn't strong enough? Any government would be forced into a yet another "deciding" Brexit vote within one or two years.
No-one is suggesting that the vote be retaken until it suits a certain outcome. that is ridiculous. You are simply trying to gee up righteous indignation where there is none to be had.Obviously it's undemocratic to call referendums for things when the result is then not adhered to. You can desperately want to stay in the EU and that's sensible and fine but you can't deny that going back to the public with a referendum whenever you dont like the current result makes a mockery of referendums, and will completely erode the public faith in them.
A second referendum would likely end in another near-stalemate. Except it wouldn't because they'd probably spend months arguing over the number of options (what happens if the new result is 20% leave with no deal, 31% leave with May's deal, 49% remain... for instance??) and all in all would be a massive time sink.
Even if there were just two options and it ended 51% for remain what do people honestly think would happen? Like you can't be naive enough to think there wouldn't be total and utter chaos. Could you deny the Brexiters if they said the result wasn't strong enough? Any government would be forced into a yet another "deciding" Brexit vote within one or two years.
Lets be honest the original referendum result wasn't strong enough to justify such a massive decision that would cause so much upheaval. How many idiots voted in protest at the government in 2016 that could have swung the vote to leave?Obviously it's undemocratic to call referendums for things when the result is then not adhered to. You can desperately want to stay in the EU and that's sensible and fine but you can't deny that going back to the public with a referendum whenever you dont like the current result makes a mockery of referendums, and will completely erode the public faith in them.
A second referendum would likely end in another near-stalemate. Except it wouldn't because they'd probably spend months arguing over the number of options (what happens if the new result is 20% leave with no deal, 31% leave with May's deal, 49% remain... for instance??) and all in all would be a massive time sink.
Even if there were just two options and it ended 51% for remain what do people honestly think would happen? Like you can't be naive enough to think there wouldn't be total and utter chaos. Could you deny the Brexiters if they said the result wasn't strong enough? Any government would be forced into a yet another "deciding" Brexit vote within one or two years.
Proving that at least this one time she's not actually wrong.Theresa May literally thinks the British public is stupid.
I think it would be far more than mini riots.If a mini-riot like the bradford riots are the price to pay then bring it on. It would only be the EDL types, you arrest them and move on.
We can't proceed with two situations that no majority wants (deal and no deal) because of the ill thought out principle that a referendum mandate is absolute with no end date. Or because the Tories and May don't want their reputation tarnished.
I'm sure the millions of pensioners rampaging through the post offices of the country would indeed be terrifying..I think it would be far more than mini riots.
What integrity?“Another vote which would do irreparable damage to the integrity of our politics"
So, Remain and use controls on migration allowed under EU laws?I think it would be far more than mini riots.
We've had a referendum, lets go with the least worst option that suits both sides, there has to be compromise now, May kowtowing to the hard brexiteers in the Tory party is doing nobody any good, just tell them to eff off.
I will not accept a compromise to make my family poorer, less secure and hinder the opportunities of my children in the future. That is absolutely not acceptable and its quite right that parliament won't allow it however many morons vote for it.I think it would be far more than mini riots.
We've had a referendum, lets go with the least worst option that suits both sides, there has to be compromise now, May kowtowing to the hard brexiteers in the Tory party is doing nobody any good, just tell them to eff off.
so what's your option? there won't be another referendum and what if there was another referendum leave won again?I will not accept a compromise to make my family poorer, less secure and hinder the opportunities of my children in the future. That is absolutely not acceptable and its quite right that parliament won't allow it however many morons vote for it.
I was in London last week and it seemed to come as embarrassing news to many that the whole world is laughing at them!Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
I wouldn't be so sure about that oneI was in London last week and it seemed to come as embarrassing news to many that the whole world is laughing at them!
No-one, certainly in Europe but also further afield, that I have met on my travels over the last 18 months, can figure how a country doing so well, and so universally admired, can screw itself up so badly and become such a laughing stock.
Universally agreed that although Trump is a bigger short-term embarrassment he is only one man and one that will be almost certainly removed in 2020 and normal service can be resumed.
I totally understand what you are saying (and agree it is not nailed-on by far) but it was not the important take-away from my message.I wouldn't be so sure about that one
what is the renewal mechanism? - is it majority vote - or do we have a veto?No deal vs Remain in a new referendum
One thing probably of concern is the rebate we receive was up for renewal in 2020 and if we revoke article 50 we probably will be paying the £350m instead of the ~£250 million currently. I don't see us getting the rebate again.
The ECJ ruled that the UK could unilaterally withdraw from Article 50 and remain in the EU on the same terms as before. Those terms would include its veto power over withdrawal of the rebate.No deal vs Remain in a new referendum
One thing probably of concern is the rebate we receive was up for renewal in 2020 and if we revoke article 50 we probably will be paying the £350m instead of the ~£250 million currently. I don't see us getting the rebate again.
If ever there was a betreyal of the people, it was the first one where leave spouted all the bullshit possible and promised everything under the sun fulwell knowing they would never have to deliver on it. They were all as shocked as us when they won and ran away from their promises as fast as they could and they were allowed to get away with it.so what's your option? there won't be another referendum and what if there was another referendum leave won again?
Er....what ?I was in London last week and it seemed to come as embarrassing news to many that the whole world is laughing at them!
No-one, certainly in Europe but also further afield, that I have met on my travels over the last 18 months, can figure how a country doing so well, and so universally admired, can screw itself up so badly and become such a laughing stock.
Universally agreed that although Trump is a bigger short-term embarrassment he is only one man and one that will be almost certainly removed in 2020 and normal service can be resumed.
Yes we have a veto but the EU are looking to end rebates and 2020 is the end of the current one.The ECJ ruled that the UK could unilaterally withdraw from Article 50 and remain in the EU on the same terms as before. Those terms would include its veto power over withdrawal of the rebate.
"Britain will be humbled in the eyes of the world". Like the rest of the world hasn't been scoffing at Brexit up to now.It's all over according to this lot.
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/to...s-the-telegraph-that-brexit-is-over-1-5821286
What's the problem?Er....what ?
Going by whats coming out this morning parliament will never vote on her deal. She doesn't want the loss.Who's going for the outcome:
May's deal get's voted down including by the DUP .
May throws the DUP under a bus and put's the Irish border in the Irish sea with NI staying in the CU and SM.
Rest of the Uk fall off the cliff and Scotland declare war on England.