A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

[GlastonSpur]

This is what Pochettino said today about Spurs:

"I think there's still massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change, if we have time to do that. ... We're doing fantastically but if we don't sign in January people say we're going to struggle. It's all negative, rather than saying, 'If Tottenham don't sign anyone it's because they believe that they're going to, or that they have the tools to, perform well and maybe challenge for the title. The doubt is always negative, never positive. ... The answer is to win games. In the end, the consequence is going to be to win trophies, to be competitive, always to be proud about your team, about your players."

Doesn't sound to me like he intends to jump ship.

 

[Berbaclass]

I dont think Spurs do that though. They bring in lads who have the potential to be very good premier league players like Bale, Modric, Eriksen or Alli and they combine them with very promising young players. I think the flaw with the top 4 is that they wont do this and just want to buy in fully developed top class players at all costs.

It’s an unsustainable model then because those are special players. All relatively cheap compared to now. That’s the point you can’t rely on finding the next Bale or Modric for next to nothing because it’s daft.

 

[Stick]

This is what Pochettino said today about Spurs:

"I think there's still massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change, if we have time to do that. ... We're doing fantastically but if we don't sign in January people say we're going to struggle. It's all negative, rather than saying, 'If Tottenham don't sign anyone it's because they believe that they're going to, or that they have the tools to, perform well and maybe challenge for the title. The doubt is always negative, never positive. ... The answer is to win games. In the end, the consequence is going to be to win trophies, to be competitive, always to be proud about your team, about your players."

Doesn't sound to me like he intends to jump ship.

I think he will go Glaston. No disrespect to Spurs but your board effectively failed to back Poch in the summer. Not signing players he wanted and doing an Arsenal on the stadium. With this in mind and the fact that Mourinho wasnt backed by the united board in the summer then it looks from the outside that united want a manager that plays good ball, can deliver results and will have some cash to bring in a bit more class. My head would be turned if I were Poch and I think the only spanner could be the introduction of a Director of Football at united as they havent operated with one before and it could limit the power of Poch.

 

[Adisa]

ABUs all over twitter shitting on us as a washed up club.

 

[SirAF]

You sound tough mate. Rock hard.

Stop being an ass, newbie.

 

[Stick]

It’s an unsustainable model then because those are special players. All relatively cheap compared to now. That’s the point you can’t rely on finding the next Bale or Modric because it’s daft.

I dont think it's about finding the next Bale or Modric. It's finding very good players that suit their ethos. Eriksen came in after Modric and is arguably one of the best midfielders in the premier league. He's not at the level of Modric yet but then I don't know many saw Modric reaching the level he has at Madrid while he was at Spurs. I dont think it's an unsustainable model because it requires very good management and strength. The unsustainable model is spending hundreds of millions of players who may or may not fit your style and ethos for a club like say Sanchez at United.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Actually when Spurs lose a match you go missing until they next win

A popular myth, but not true. It's much like the many invented things I'm supposed to have said but never did, or the frequent fanciful "translations" of what I've said.

The mistake that some posters on here make is to seek to personalise everything, like they're not really interested in discussing football as much as trying to drag down particular posters.

 

[thegregster]

Do you honestly believe it's as easy as that? This is Levy we're talking about, United hater number 1, he will do anything to frustrate and block the move.

From the info on thetnet it seems he can't do much. All he can get is compo.

It doesn't seem to be the same rules as applies to a player.


When was the last time a club stopped a manager leaving?

https://www.inbrief.co.uk/football-law/managers-moving-clubs/

 

[GlastonSpur]

I'll bet you @GlastonSpur

Do you have a particular sum or other wager in mind? My offered bet is simply that Pochettino will not be the manager of United when the next season kicks off. OK?

 

[Inigo Montoya]

This is what Pochettino said today about Spurs:

"I think there's still massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change, if we have time to do that. ... We're doing fantastically but if we don't sign in January people say we're going to struggle. It's all negative, rather than saying, 'If Tottenham don't sign anyone it's because they believe that they're going to, or that they have the tools to, perform well and maybe challenge for the title. The doubt is always negative, never positive. ... The answer is to win games. In the end, the consequence is going to be to win trophies, to be competitive, always to be proud about your team, about your players."

Doesn't sound to me like he intends to jump ship.

That's what i'd expect a manager to say.

he hasn't been offered the job BTW

 

[Berbaclass]

I dont think it's about finding the next Bale or Modric. It's finding very good players that suit their ethos. Eriksen came in after Modric and is arguably one of the best midfielders in the premier league. He's not at the level of Modric yet but then I don't know many saw Modric reaching the level he has at Madrid while he was at Spurs. I dont think it's an unsustainable model because it requires very good management and strength. The unsustainable model is spending hundreds of millions of players who may or may not fit your style and ethos for a club like say Sanchez at United.

Spurs don’t have money to pay for established good players though. Eriksen was around 10-15 Million and in today’s market that’s more like 40 million now. With this new stadium they’re going to be have to be very frugal in their dealings.

In the next few years Eriksen, Toby, Dembele and others (big players in their last few seasons) will probably be leaving and they can’t go out and buy ready made replacements. They just have to hope that a youth player bridges the gap or they find some bargain to keep them competitive. I think they’ll struggle to stay competitive over the next 5-10 years because of this restriction they have, like Arsenal also had.

If Pochettino goes its an even bigger struggle because he’s holding this thing together.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

That's what i'd expect a manager to say.

he hasn't been offered the job BTW

This isn’t why the argument is pointless, United fans will just say that anything he says is just lip service, it’s a total straw man argument.

 

[Johan07]

Do you honestly believe it's as easy as that? This is Levy we're talking about, United hater number 1, he will do anything to frustrate and block the move.

He can´t though. That players transfer fees are even allowed under EC-law has to do with the registration of the players. Its actually what you are paying for. The change of registration. Its a hornets nest that the Bosman-verdict was the first to open. One could argue that a lot of the the established transfer market within football is not in accordance with EC-law. A "superleague" might change this if it goes AWOL from UEFA and FIFA. Thats another subject though.
A manager is not registered as a player and thus is under the same employment legislation as the canteen lady. Or cheese room lady maybe is more adequate for this thread.

 

[Tarrou]

Do you have a particular sum or other wager in mind? My offered bet is simply that Pochettino will not be the manager of United when the next season kicks off. OK?

yeah alright. I'm giving away a lot of value though, as that's 2/1 in the bookies. I'll bet £100 but if you lose you also have to post a picture of yourself with a piece of paper saying "Lads, its Tottenham"

Deal?

 

[GlastonSpur]

Spurs don’t have money to pay for established good players though. Eriksen was around 10-15 Million and in today’s market that’s more like 40 million now. With this new stadium they’re going to be have to be very frugal in their dealings.

In the next few years Eriksen, Toby, Dembele and others (big players in their last few seasons) will probably be leaving and they can’t go out and buy ready made replacements. They just have to hope that a youth player bridges the gap or they find some bargain to keep them competitive. I think they’ll struggle to stay competitive over the next 5-10 years because of this restriction they have, like Arsenal also had.

If Pochettino goes its an even bigger struggle because he’s holding this thing together.

Here you've posted the basic illusion that so many posters believe. But we've already been very frugal for many years, saving up our pennies to invest towards design, legal and construction costs of the new training ground and stadium ... and the need to keep doing this is now starting to tapering off, because the training ground is finished with the new stadium not far behind.

Yes, we will need to divert some money into stadium-debt servicing for a fair few years to come, but on the opposite side of the coin we will need to divert less money than before into construction costs, because the major part of the construction work has now been done. And on top of this comes the very significant boost to our income from the new stadium.

All in all, Spurs are going to be less cash-strapped than before (and we could hardly be any more cash-strapped then we have been). This is what many folk haven't yet twigged: the future is increasingly going to be the current Spurs, but with a fair bit more money to spend on players than before.

 

[GlastonSpur]

yeah alright. I'm giving away a lot of value though, as that's 2/1 in the bookies. I'll bet £100 but if you lose you also have to post a picture of yourself with a piece of paper saying "Lads, its Tottenham"

Deal?

Let's make it £50, but I'll give you the 2/1 odds, so if you win you get £100. But the piece of paper is out. Deal?

 

[charlenefan]

Here you've posted the basic illusion that so many posters believe. But we've already been very frugal for many years, saving up our pennies to invest towards design, legal and construction costs of the new training ground and stadium ... and the need to keep doing this is now starting to tapering off, because the training ground is finished with the new stadium not far behind.

Yes, we will need to divert some money into stadium-debt servicing for a fair few years to come, but on the opposite side of the coin we will need to divert less money than before into construction costs, because the major part of the construction work has now been done. And on top of this comes the very significant boost to our income from the new stadium.

All in all, Spurs are going to be less cash-strapped than before (and we could hardly be any more cash-strapped then we have been). This is what many folk haven't yet twigged: the future is increasingly going to be the current Spurs, but with a fair bit more money to spend on players than before.

Since you're obviously privy to the ins and outs how much money have Spurs had to put towards construction and how much are they now going to have to put towards the debt?

 

[Berbaclass]

Here you've posted the basic illusion that so many posters believe. But we've already been very frugal for many years, saving up our pennies to invest towards design, legal and construction costs of the new training ground and stadium ... and the need to keep doing this is now starting to tapering off, because the training ground is finished with the new stadium not far behind.

Yes, we will need to divert some money into stadium-debt servicing for a fair few years to come, but on the opposite side of the coin we will need to divert less money than before into construction costs, because the major part of the construction work has now been done. And on top of this comes the very significant boost to our income from the new stadium.

All in all, Spurs are going to be less cash-strapped than before (and we could hardly be any more cash-strapped then we have been). This is what many folk haven't yet twigged: the future is increasingly going to be the current Spurs, but with a fair bit more money to spend on players than before.

Can you back that up with actual fact rather than just your opinion. I’ll happily admit I’m wrong if you do so.

 

[Igor Drefljak]

Tottenham are becoming less frugal

Summer spending just gone: £000,000,000.00


Oh and a failed low ball bid for a championship player

 

[ErranMorad]

The pull of the player lodge..

That has got to be the most amazing thing I have read on this site. This thread is going to fantastic from now till the summer. Funnier when Poch joins us.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Since you're obviously privy to the ins and outs how much money have Spurs had to put towards construction and how much are they now going to have to put towards the debt?

At 30 June, 2018, the Club had net debt of £366m. What it will be by next June I obviously don't know, but it will be higher, and so I can't predict what the annual debt-costs will be. Also, these costs will depend on how quickly or slowly Spurs choose to pay down the principal along with the interest.

As of June 2017 (18 months ago) - the most recent full accounts published - the club had invested £315.1m in the new stadium project (the training ground has been a separate, additional investment project). Again this figure will be much higher by now.

 

[Red Dreams]

all this talk of Poch.
the reality is we just don't know who it will be.
Ole has been appointed to steady a club in turmoil.
In about 3 months things will get clearer.

 

[charlenefan]

At 30 June, 2018, the Club had net debt of £366m. What it will be by next June I obviously don't know, but it will be higher, and so I can't predict what the annual debt-costs will be.

As of June 2017 (18 months ago) - the most recent full accounts published - the club had invested £315.1m in the new stadium project (the training ground has been a separate, additional investment project). Again this figure will be much higher by now.

So you dont actually know whether you debt payments wont far exceed you previous construction costs then, so you cant possibly say whether Spurs will suddenly be more active in the transfer market or not

 

[GlastonSpur]

Tottenham are becoming less frugal

Summer spending just gone: £000,000,000.00


Oh and a failed low ball bid for a championship player

You obviously have difficulty in distinguishing between the past and the future. Moreover, we increased our wage bill in the summer and since then with improved contracts for Kane, Pochettino, Alli, Son and others.

 

[Dumbstar]

ABUs all over twitter shitting on us as a washed up club.

Shame on them.

 

[JohnnyKills]

This is what Pochettino said today about Spurs:

"I think there's still massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change, if we have time to do that. ... We're doing fantastically but if we don't sign in January people say we're going to struggle. It's all negative, rather than saying, 'If Tottenham don't sign anyone it's because they believe that they're going to, or that they have the tools to, perform well and maybe challenge for the title. The doubt is always negative, never positive. ... The answer is to win games. In the end, the consequence is going to be to win trophies, to be competitive, always to be proud about your team, about your players."

Doesn't sound to me like he intends to jump ship.

Where, in your opinion, does he suggest he's going to stay?

 

[GlastonSpur]

So you dont actually know whether you debt payments wont far exceed you previous construction costs then, so you cant possibly say whether Spurs will suddenly be more active in the transfer market or not

That's not the case. Since total construction costs will be close to £1 billion, including the new training ground, I can confidently say that our annual debt servicing costs will be far less than £1 billion, to put it mildly.

Moreover, since we won't be spending as much on further construction, we'll have more spare money to service debt or whatever else the club chooses to spend money on.

And in addition, as I've already said, you need to factor in the very significant increase in our annual income that will stem from the new stadium. Within two years from now I expect our income to roughly match or exceed every club in the Prem bar City and United.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Where, in your opinion, does he suggest he's going to stay?

It's just the general, forward looking, positive tone. For example: "I think there's [still] massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change"

I don't believe Pochettino would talk about "massive work [still] to do" if he had any intention of abandoning the project.

 

[Berbaclass]

That's not the case. Since total construction costs will be close to £1 billion, including the new training ground, I can confidently say that our annual debt servicing costs will be far less than £1 billion, to put it mildly.

Moreover, since we won't be spending as much on further construction, we'll have more spare money to service debt or whatever else the club chooses to spend money on.

And in addition, as I've already said, you need to factor in the very significant increase in our annual income that will stem from the new stadium. Within two years from now I expect our income to roughly match or exceed every club in the Prem bar City and United.

The construction went over budget did it not so I’m gonna assume that will have cost more than initially planned.

 

[T00lsh3d]

This is what Pochettino said today about Spurs:

"I think there's still massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change, if we have time to do that. ... We're doing fantastically but if we don't sign in January people say we're going to struggle. It's all negative, rather than saying, 'If Tottenham don't sign anyone it's because they believe that they're going to, or that they have the tools to, perform well and maybe challenge for the title. The doubt is always negative, never positive. ... The answer is to win games. In the end, the consequence is going to be to win trophies, to be competitive, always to be proud about your team, about your players."

Doesn't sound to me like he intends to jump ship.

He’s professional. He was never going to come out and say “feck this, I’m off to United”.

 

[JohnnyKills]

It's just the general, forward looking, positive tone. For example: "I think there's [still] massive work to do. ... I think we're changing a lot and we're going to change"

I don't believe Pochettino would talk about "massive work [still] to do" if he had any intention of abandoning the project.

Sorry mate but I think you're seeing what you want to see here.

The 'massive work to do' line is the least he could have said, really. And he then focuses on the short term, not the long term by talking about January.

I'd have expected him to be much more adamant about his commitment to Spurs tbh.

 

[EwanI Ted]

Sorry mate but I think you're seeing what you want to see here.

The 'massive work to do' line is the least he could have said, really. And he then focuses on the short term, not the long term by talking about January.

I'd have expected him to be much more adamant about his commitment to Spurs tbh.

I think everyone who follows football knows these non-denials when they hear them. He could easily say “I will absolutely not join Man United under any circumstances”.

Doesn’t mean he’ll join us necessarily, probably just keeping his options open, but still, it’s a well worn tactic.

 

[KM]

His quotes about what he says about Spurs. Jeez, read any interview over the years. He’s so invested in Spurs he lives and breathes us. There’s going to be so many disappointed united fans in the summer. Let’s hope OGS wins a few games hey!

Yeah we'll see who's disappointed in the summer.

For a guy who's so committed to Spurs, he said feck all to quell the rumors but anyhow..

 

[Igor Drefljak]

You obviously have difficulty in distinguishing between the past and the future. Moreover, we increased our wage bill in the summer and since then with improved contracts for Kane, Pochettino, Alli, Son and others.

Luckily for me, I know exactly what past and future mean.

''Here you've posted the basic illusion that so many posters believe. But we've already been very frugal for many years, saving up our pennies to invest towards design, legal and construction costs of the new training ground and stadium ... and the need to keep doing this is now starting to tapering off, because the training ground is finished with the new stadium not far behind.''


Surely, as things taper off, that means the shackles get looser and looser. Your spending hit 0 this summer. That's not really tapering off. That's grinding to a severe halt.
Why haven't you sorted Eriksen's contract out yet btw? or Alderweireld?

Is it cause they want more than your structure? One matched by clubs like Everton?

 

[Rhyme Animal]

I can see so many fans who are going to end up disappointed in the next managerial appointment if we don't get Poch. I'd say lets don't get your hopes up and see how it goes, but I can see some are fully engrossed in the hype and will instantly dislike anyone else the club brings in...

Not for me personally, I'd Love Pochettino as he knows the PL, plays the right way and is a manager who deserves his chance at a truly Elite club.

But I'd genuinely be equally happy with ZZ, maybe more.

I have the feeling that we'll get him for next season, and it makes sense if you think about it.

He's doing it great for Spurs and surely feels comfortable there, but being realistic he can't do much more than he's doing now except winning a cup here or there, which wouldn't mean a radical change in the whole picture. It's difficult to win the league with such limited spending (compared with the big boys) and the same for the Champions league. So unless he does some miracle at some point he's 'condemned' to watch the same film year after year, always moving in the same margins.

He's been there for 4 full seasons plus the current one and the man is touching the roof already. I can't see him being delighted at the prospect of spending 3-4 years more doing the same all over again. To reach a higher level and try something more he needs a bigger club with more financial power and ambition, and I can't see our potential competition like Real or Bayern spending big just to sign a coach. So if we really want him - and it smells like we do, we've got all the tickets to win this prize and win it soon. The moment is now for him and us.

Great post, totally agree.

It's an insult really the way Spurs fans talk of him - like he's some drone who has no ambition to step up to the next level.

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/footbal...-always-bigger-tottenham-mauricio-pochettino/

Very interesting from Carragher - hardly a pundit with United bias, or anti-Spurs.

Hopefully expert know-how like this from people in the business can help Spurs fans accept that what we're saying on here is basically just common sense.

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

Hopefully expert know-how like this from people in the business can help Spurs fans accept that what we're saying on here is basically just common sense.

https://www.skysports.com/football/...pochettino-would160want-to-be-man-utd-manager

https://www.skysports.com/football/...t-tottenham-for-many-years-says-jose-mourinho

http://www.sport.co.uk/news/martin-keown-expects-mauricio-pochettino-to-stay-at-spurs-de/379660/

https://www.tribalfootball.com/arti...uld-pochettino-leave-statues-for-mess-4261569

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/villa-believes-pochettino-will-stay-spurs-091935108.html

Hopefully expert know how from people like this in the business can help United fans accept that what we're saying on here is basically common sense.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Luckily for me, I know exactly what past and future mean.

''Here you've posted the basic illusion that so many posters believe. But we've already been very frugal for many years, saving up our pennies to invest towards design, legal and construction costs of the new training ground and stadium ... and the need to keep doing this is now starting to tapering off, because the training ground is finished with the new stadium not far behind.''


Surely, as things taper off, that means the shackles get looser and looser. Your spending hit 0 this summer. That's not really tapering off. That's grinding to a severe halt.
Why haven't you sorted Eriksen's contract out yet btw? or Alderweireld?

Is it cause they want more than your structure? One matched by clubs like Everton?

"... is now starting to tapering off": this means from the present day onwards. You referred to the summer past, so yes it seems you struggle with the different between past, present and future, And besides I already pointed our increased spending on wages in the summer and since then. Moreover, our zero spend on transfers in the summer is down to not being willing to pay the price asked, not because we had no money at all.

Alderweireld will likely be sold in the summer if he doesn't sign a new contract. Eriksen is an ongoing discussion.

 

[Random Task]

https://www.skysports.com/football/...pochettino-would160want-to-be-man-utd-manager

https://www.skysports.com/football/...t-tottenham-for-many-years-says-jose-mourinho

http://www.sport.co.uk/news/martin-keown-expects-mauricio-pochettino-to-stay-at-spurs-de/379660/

https://www.tribalfootball.com/arti...uld-pochettino-leave-statues-for-mess-4261569

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/villa-believes-pochettino-will-stay-spurs-091935108.html

Hopefully expert know how from people like this in the business can help United fans accept that what we're saying on here is basically common sense.

For all your 'Poch should/will stay links', there is an equal number (if not more) suggesting the polar opposite.

The only way this gets put to bed is when Poch makes a public declaration one way or the other. You know that as well as the rest of us.

 

[Tarrou]

Let's make it £50, but I'll give you the 2/1 odds, so if you win you get £100. But the piece of paper is out. Deal?

Alright deal!

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

For all your 'Poch should/will stay links', there is an equal number (if not more) suggesting the polar opposite.

The only way this gets put to bed is when Poch makes a public declaration one way or the other. You know that as well as the rest of us.

Nail on the head.

I'm not saying I know whether Pochettino will stay, I've been consistent with that in this thread. I do think he will be tempted by the idea of managing a super club like Manchester United, and that he will be weighing up the decision in his mind carefully.

The point of posting those articles was to show exactly what you say, that the guys in the 'business' are split on the issue, because just like us they can only speculate. Carragher, Keown, whoever .. they don't know Pochettino personally, they can only guess at his character and ambitions, just because they have worked in football doesn't mean they know all the answers. Ex players make incorrect predictions all of the time. I don't think many Spurs fans in here have argued that Pochettino won't be tempted by United, have they? Most of us are aware that it's a big opportunity.