[hmchan]

I wouldn't no, but then again Owen, Fowler, Kaka etc etc...

But this isn't about fitness, so much as a loss of a reflex. Keepers can lose them and were not talking about huge drops here. Remember, shots are fired at keepers at average speeds of about 70mph I believe? So the very slightest loss of a reflex does indeed make a massive difference.

I posted this a few moments ago in another De Gea thread.

Can argue all you like there is a whopping nose dive in form since the WC in 2018.

People from both sides keep talking about de Gea's mistakes as if it's his only problem. It's not. His huge decline in shot stopping is more worrying but few address that.

Season	xGA	GA	Difference
14/15​	39.84​	37​	+2.84​
15/16​	39.66​	35​	+4.66​
16/17​	31.62​	29​	+2.62​
17/18​	43.54​	28​	+15.54​
18/19​	52.30​	54​	-1.70​
19/20 (after 33 matches)​	33.04​	33​	+0.04​

 

[Foxbatt]

As much as goal keepers shouldn‘t get beaten on their front post I do feel it was just a perfectly placed time and shot. Like the only space for that ball to go in is found.

More concerned later with the one that hit the post and some poor passing choices. He did have a few good passes mind but after that goal went in he seemed to be in panic stations if that makes sense.

I do hope he gets back to where he was at. Maybe it’s unfair by us because he was at such a high level, easily best keeper in the world that now hes going through a period where he’s just a really good keeper by normal standards we are nit picking at everything.

It is a school boy error. His positioning was wrong. You simply cannot let have any daylight between your post and your body. If he got beaten by the pace outside, I would have had no issues with it. But you simply cannot leave an inch between you and the post. He did not get beaten for pace. He got beaten by his positioning.
Then he put his defence under pressure by passing to them when he should not have done so. I really do not understand why he has to pass every ball to his defence. He should mix things up. It is not as if we do not have tall players in midfield now.

 

[Amar__]

Our very own Iker, unfortunately.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

It is a school boy error. His positioning was wrong. You simply cannot let have any daylight between your post and your body. If he got beaten by the pace outside, I would have had no issues with it. But you simply cannot leave an inch between you and the post. He did not get beaten for pace. He got beaten by his positioning.
Then he put his defence under pressure by passing to them when he should not have done so. I really do not understand why he has to pass every ball to his defence. He should mix things up. It is not as if we do not have tall players in midfield now.

Look at the goal his positioning isn’t wrong. It’s just the timing of the strike is just as Milli seconds before DeGea sets. And it’s fired in between his glove and knee that is there to block and shot.

The player found the space.

 

[Le Red]

I don't think the goal was his fault. It was a brilliant finish from Stanilas.
I think you people have no idea how hard it is to save that one, if it was that easy nobody would score from that position.
Sloppy distribution though.

 

[Keefy18]

Whopping nose dive in form?
Looking at clean sheets and goals conceded, yes. Of course, for the first few seasons he had Rio and Vidic in front of him, whereas recently he's had Jones, Rojo, Smalling, etc., but let's ignore mitigating circumstances and collective responsibilities.

Rio and Vidic were in their early to mid 30s and past their best. Vidic was a bit part player in that last season title, with 18 apps and finishing a full 16 games. Evans and Jones were Rio's main CB partner.

Looking at errors leading to goals, yes. This season it's been 4 (according to the PL website). Of course, Ederson and Allison have both also had 3 this season, but there's no reason to compare De Gea to them.
Every other individual statistic is very much on a par with other seasons up to this point - saves, save percentage, passes, pass accuracy.
This reads much more like occasional lapses in form rather than a consistent capitulation in ability.

Two full season's is not "occasional lapses in form", that is consistent? He's made more errors over those 2 years than any other keeper I believe.

What you might of missed also is the fact he is facing far less shots this season than previously and yet as error prone.

 

[Keefy18]

People from both sides keep talking about de Gea's mistakes as if it's his only problem. It's not. His huge decline in shot stopping is more worrying but few address that.

Season	xGA	GA	Difference
14/15​	39.84​	37​	+2.84​
15/16​	39.66​	35​	+4.66​
16/17​	31.62​	29​	+2.62​
17/18​	43.54​	28​	+15.54​
18/19​	52.30​	54​	-1.70​
19/20 (after 33 matches)​	33.04​	33​	+0.04​

I absolutely agree.

He's facing considerably fewer shots this season but his errors are as bad as they've ever been.

I had a mate point out the xg stat to me a week or so back and its a big concern.

 

[Shimo]

I don't think the goal was his fault. It was a brilliant finish from Stanilas.
I think you people have no idea how hard it is to save that one, if it was that easy nobody would score from that position.
Sloppy distribution though.

Agreed - keepers do get beaten at their near post, he got down quick enough but, it was a strong finish. Bet you he would have got slaughtered if it was him giving up the first goal against Mason, a thunderous finish.

And wholeheartedly agree on his distribution, it needs to be a lot more buttoned up.

 

[MadDogg]

I absolutely agree.

He's facing considerably fewer shots this season but his errors are as bad as they've ever been.

I had a mate point out the xg stat to me a week or so back and its a big concern.

He was worse last season. Particularly for the last 1-2 months of the season.

 

[Keefy18]

He was worse last season. Particularly for the last 1-2 months of the season.

The last 2 months roughly yes, but I think he was still making some superb saves and I still had that sense of feeling sorry for him cause the team in front of him wasn't performing.

This season I don't trust him at all though.

 

[MadDogg]

The last 2 months roughly yes, but I think he was still making some superb saves and I still had that sense of feeling sorry for him cause the team in front of him wasn't performing.

This season I don't trust him at all though.

Spurs was the only match I remember him being amazing last season. Otherwise it was quite obvious throughout the entire season that he was a long way off his best and was letting in goals he probably should save, much like he has been this season. Then of course he was virtually throwing the ball into the net himself for the last couple of months.

 

[Keefy18]

Spurs was the only match I remember him being amazing last season. Otherwise it was quite obvious throughout the entire season that he was a long way off his best and was letting in goals he probably should save, much like he has been this season. Then of course he was virtually throwing the ball into the net himself for the last couple of months.

When we were smashed by Liverpool at Anfield, Jose's last game. Faced a record number of shots in a league game and he pulled of a serious amount of saves. There were others too but yes he was poor in comparison to previous years.

This year though is just mind boggling.

 

[Le Red]

Agreed - keepers do get beaten at their near post, he got down quick enough but, it was a strong finish. Bet you he would have got slaughtered if it was him giving up the first goal against Mason, a thunderous finish.

And wholeheartedly agree on his distribution, it needs to be a lot more buttoned up.

He definitely would, it reminded me so much of the Bergwijn goal. Yet the comments on the matchday were that Ramsdale was Bournemouth's MOTM.
DDG had a disproportionate amount of howlers in the last couple of years, but now he gets crucified whenever a shot that's remotely saveable gets into the net.

 

[Le Red]

People from both sides keep talking about de Gea's mistakes as if it's his only problem. It's not. His huge decline in shot stopping is more worrying but few address that.

Season	xGA	GA	Difference
14/15​	39.84​	37​	+2.84​
15/16​	39.66​	35​	+4.66​
16/17​	31.62​	29​	+2.62​
17/18​	43.54​	28​	+15.54​
18/19​	52.30​	54​	-1.70​
19/20 (after 33 matches)​	33.04​	33​	+0.04​

There are lies, damn lies and statistics.
I don't think this thing was made by a board of keepers, and even if it did, I'd be wary ("I'd have saved that one for sure").
I don't need a spreadsheet to tell me he had a freak 17/18 and a piss poor 18/19.
What really matters is: what's the problem and how to address it?
From the outside point of view confidence and hypothetical loss of reflex are the issues, but do we know that for sure? Does he have any underlying problems or medical conditions that are holding him back?
I don't want to be ungrateful but as it stands, he's not a keeper for a top club anymore. Still, my main interest is in seeing him recover, many in here are happy to throw him under the bus.
This is an issue that demands full attention of the club, maybe they haven't addressed it entirely.

 

[White Fury]

Got beaten at the near post twice today, first time was a goal that wouldnt happen 2-3 years ago. I thought GKs get better with age and at 30 to mid 30 are their best years. Guess its not like that for De Gea.

Someone already said it : When his reflexes start to go he will be exposed as hes not very good at anything else besides shot-stopping with his insane reflexes. I think the decline started and when hes not shot-stopping like before he looks very bad. Hes not a commanding GK, doesnt get out of his box that often to clear high balls, not a sweeper keeper like Neuer and his ball-playing is also average at best.

I really hope this is some kind of dip in form and he gets back to his best, but I think we definitely need to have a plan B next season for his position.

We cant be dragging passengers, underperforming and past it players at this club anymore if we want to challenge for the league and CL.

 

[Ayush_reddevil]

People need to stop saying that he is having a small dip or we are comparing from a crazy peak . DDG over the last two years has not been good enough to be a United number 1 . He is now an average short stopper which when added to the fact that he was always average at every other aspect of keeping means that he is a league average keeper now . I don't see him as irreplaceable at all and specially when we have a young kid at the club who could have the potential to be better than him . It's brutal for Dave but his performances haven't been good enough unfortunately

 

[Mainoldo]

People need to stop saying that he is having a small dip or we are comparing from a crazy peak . DDG over the last two years has not been good enough to be a United number 1 . He is now an average short stopper which when added to the fact that he was always average at every other aspect of keeping means that he is a league average keeper now . I don't see him as irreplaceable at all and specially when we have a young kid at the club who could have the potential to be better than him . It's brutal for Dave but his performances haven't been good enough unfortunately

He’s a lot better than average. But he needs to go. His poor footwork and lapses are costing us. Time to move on... said at the time we shouldn’t have gave him that stupid contract.

 

[Ayush_reddevil]

He’s a lot better than average. But he needs to go. His poor footwork and lapses are costing us. Time to move on... said at the time we shouldn’t have gave him that stupid contract.

It depends on what we mean by average. I think at this moment he is the league average goal keeper for me. Nothing special but not really disastrous

 

[Mainoldo]

It depends on what we mean by average. I think at this moment he is the league average goal keeper for me. Nothing special but not really disastrous

He’s still top 3 based on his shot stopping. His frailties are his laps in concentration right now. Which highlights his faults such as no footwork and a phobia to leave his six yard line.

 

[Adamsk7]

I think we at least need to have Henderson back next year. I can’t see the harm in it - it’ll either fire a rocket up De Gea’s arse and he’ll focus his game OR we’ll get the answer to the question of whether Henderson is ready. We should sell it to Dean like “come back next season and compete - if you’re performing better than David, you’ll play” it’ll be a good barometer for him on how he’s developing. I think the thought of this perfect transition where David says “Bye Guys” and Henderson is instantly ready is just wishful thinking.

 

[Levenstein]

Should be benched sadly. Just gets away too easy.

 

[Mr Smith]

He's had a poor season but I strongly feel he should not be criticised for the goal today. Did his best to narrow the angle; from that close in there's only so much you can do. Was let down by his defence.

Calls to replace him with Henderson are still extremely premature in my opinion. De Gea deserves to be backed after how many season's he's bailed us out, and I still believe he can recover his best form.

 

[Sean_RedDevil]

He is currently lucky that his form between 2011-2018 was amazing because otherwise everyone would want to sell him in the transfer window

 

[meamth]

Whatever XG and errors he made, I still believe he is the right person to be in our goal if we want to win titles.

Ability is one thing, but personality is as important, De Gea fits right in that category. Respected by everyone at the club, players and staff.

We should calm the feck down and have faith in him.

 

[hmchan]

There are lies, damn lies and statistics.
I don't think this thing was made by a board of keepers, and even if it did, I'd be wary ("I'd have saved that one for sure").
I don't need a spreadsheet to tell me he had a freak 17/18 and a piss poor 18/19.
What really matters is: what's the problem and how to address it?
From the outside point of view confidence and hypothetical loss of reflex are the issues, but do we know that for sure? Does he have any underlying problems or medical conditions that are holding him back?
I don't want to be ungrateful but as it stands, he's not a keeper for a top club anymore. Still, my main interest is in seeing him recover, many in here are happy to throw him under the bus.
This is an issue that demands full attention of the club, maybe they haven't addressed it entirely.

I have no intention in speculating the reason behind de Gea's decline. No matter what the reason is, the most sensible thing to do is to drop him for at least a few matches. It's important for him to get a break to adjust his mentality, feel the competition, forget the howlers etc. However, Ole seems to stick with him no matter what and this does no good to all parties.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

This is more than a loss of form guys. He's not been the same guy since the world Cup where he had a mare.
If Henderson isn't happy to be loaned out yet again we've got a serious decision to make.

The mistakes are now coming thick and fast. The Everton one wasn't long before lockdown, then the Spurs one and now yesterday he shouldn't be getting beat there at that post even if the defence was also to blame.

 

[SambaBoy]

His lack of form started before he signed the new contract. Due to his age and his previous performances, most felt it was due to not being able to fully concentrate until his contract was sorted out. Once it was, we all expected the real DDG to return but apart from a few decent performances and amazing saves here and there, it hasn't happened. The goal yesterday wasn't a major error but you never want to see your keeper getting beat at the near post from the angle. He should be doing better and the old DDG was excellent at covering most of the goal.

 

[calodo2003]

In the second half he got beat near post again with a low ball. Bono hit the post

That’s a bit harsh, he was getting up from making a very good save to his right when the shot was taken off the rebound (I may be missing another near post strike, but I don’t think so). He was far more culpable for the goal than allowing this shot to hit the post.

 

[calodo2003]

It is a school boy error. His positioning was wrong. You simply cannot let have any daylight between your post and your body. If he got beaten by the pace outside, I would have had no issues with it. But you simply cannot leave an inch between you and the post. He did not get beaten for pace. He got beaten by his positioning.
Then he put his defence under pressure by passing to them when he should not have done so. I really do not understand why he has to pass every ball to his defence. He should mix things up. It is not as if we do not have tall players in midfield now.

That shot was struck with pace from an indoor soccer distance, no GK in the world is going to reflex save that. He certainly should have made himself bigger, but the shot was inch perfect, but it wasn’t like he let that in from outside the box. Hardly a schoolboy error, he was probably shocked that Maguire was so soft on the play & he simply didn’t get his angles right on a shot that materialized rather quickly in front of him in a very tight, close space.

 

[Based Adnan]

That shot was struck with pace from an indoor soccer distance, no GK in the world is going to reflex save that. He certainly should have made himself bigger, but the shot was inch perfect, but it wasn’t like he let that in from outside the box. Hardly a schoolboy error, he was probably shocked that Maguire was so soft on the play & he simply didn’t get his angles right on a shot that materialized rather quickly in front of him in a very tight, close space.

You don't need reflexes to save a near shot post from that distance. Relying on reflexes in that situation is impossible. His issue was his poor positioning.

 

[calodo2003]

You don't need reflexes to save a near shot post from that distance. Relying on reflexes in that situation is impossible. His issue was his poor positioning.

I agree, but the development of the shot was not one that lent itself to much time for DDG to be able to adjust quickly. He did go a little small above his waist & was leaving the near post slightly open, but it was somewhat of a bang / bang play & not one that should be criticized too heavily. More apropo would be criticism on his abhorrent distribution from his foot during open play.

 

[Nickelodeon]

The unfortunate part now is that every goal will be analysed from ‘Would peak De Gea save that?’ lens. And since this seems like a confidence issue, it can only make it worse. Other GKs like Ederson and Allison (less so), have their howlers but remain out of the spotlight. Kepa, despite being dropped for being out of form, has attracted less criticism.

Both De Gea’s mistakes since the restart have also been horrible piece of defending from Maguire who somehow doesn’t attract that level of criticism.

Having said that, maybe its time for us to bring Henderson back and create the Cech and Courtois situation and see who emerges as the winner. The negative I can think of is that the answer could be that De Gea is past it and Henderson is still not ready. Also that would mean the end for Romero. It is a perplexing situation for us but since there are no clear answers, I would still persist with him. His good performances, such as the Brighton one, should be highlighted as much as his howlers. But I feel that the only thing that can bring in a positive change is one of his God-mode type performances.

 

[Greck]

He is currently lucky that his form between 2011-2018 was amazing because otherwise everyone would want to sell him in the transfer window

Anyone wanting that will be operating under skewed expectations. De Gea is only bad by his normal standards. He regressed to looking mortal but is still damn good. Mistakes are more common than people realise but no one really notices when keepers on other teams make them. Off the top of my head LLoris and Ederson conceded the exact same clangers when we played City and Tottenham in December. In world football there are rarely ever more than one or two keepers at a given time who have those long stretches of looking invincible.

 

[Revan]

Anyone wanting that will be operating under skewed expectations. De Gea is only bad by his normal standards. He regressed to looking mortal but is still damn good. Mistakes are more common than people realise but no one really notices when keepers on other teams make them. Off the top of my head LLoris and Ederson conceded the exact same clangers when we played City and Tottenham in December. In world football there are rarely ever more than one or two keepers at a given time who have those long stretches of looking invincible.

Bournemouth keeper was mentioned here for having a great performance, where the first goal from Greenwood was quite similar to Spurs goal for which De Gea was criticized.

Henderson has been getting praise and people want him to replace De Gea, when in fact he is making mistakes too.

De Gea is being judged by his old standards. Which probably he should considering the wages. However, he is still a damn good keeper.

 

[charlenefan]

Anyone wanting that will be operating under skewed expectations. De Gea is only bad by his normal standards. He regressed to looking mortal but is still damn good. Mistakes are more common than people realise but no one really notices when keepers on other teams make them. Off the top of my head LLoris and Ederson conceded the exact same clangers when we played City and Tottenham in December. In world football there are rarely ever more than one or two keepers at a given time who have those long stretches of looking invincible.

Officially DDG is level with Pickford and Ederson on 3 errors leadings to goals which is 2 fewer than Dubravka who's on 5

That being said any GK who makes continual errors leading to goals must have their position questioned, for DDG it's not just showing he's mortal because that would just be him not making worldy saves every game it's definitely something else

 

[Annihilate Now!]

He punched the ball out ridiculously hard from that corner of theirs.

10/10

 

[Kazi]

He has the most appearances for us by an overseas player apparently - 399 games

 

[ValenciasDrilledCrosses]

Didn't have any saves to make, though he cut the angle off decently on that Trezeguet chance though he went down slowly. He was quite good on the ball, had a few lovely balls out when Villa forced us to go long from the goal kicks. One great punch from a corner which is rare for him. One nervy moment that was mostly down to an awful Shaw backpass.

 

[el3mel]

He punched the ball out ridiculously hard from that corner of theirs.

10/10

Hilarious that I was going to post about this. Didn't believe my eyes when this happened. Couldn't believe he actually came out and punched a ball from a corner.

 

[12OunceEpilogue]

He was fine, he looked livid a couple of times in the first half with some of our sloppy play. I barely noticed Maguire either tonight, good from this pair to just keep their heads down and do their jobs.