Wins in big games dont prove that, how we play generally and look does prove. Also not having Eriksen doesnt help either and I dont think you can throw all the big wins in one basket. For instance in City game its not that we were under sustained pressure and solved the game with 2 counters. We had control in the 1st half and City didnt look dangerous. Similar with Arsenal and Liverpool.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
For me, one of the main priorities this season was winning a trophy, any trophy.
Ole's issue was he never get over the line in anything. Erik has been correct in not risking anything in these competitions, even if that has meant a very tired squad.
Ole's issue was he never get over the line in anything. Erik has been correct in not risking anything in these competitions, even if that has meant a very tired squad.
Well you seem more convinced than I am about ETH and I hope you are right. I still see far too many red flags to be totally convinced, but as I said, it's too early too judge him. I would like to see how he does with another transfer window and a pre season with all his signings before judging him.
Very impressed with Ten Hag - would be disappointing if we don't get top 4 though. Still has the Europa as a possiblity to qualify for Champions League next year.
The forced attempt at the start of the season by a minority of fans who were acting as if Ten Hag was already a club legend in order to replicate the genuine rapport that Ole had with the fans (for obvious reasons) was beyond cringeworthy though.
Nobody cant be 100 percent sure the right path or not nor am I. I've seen many positives signs, but there have been mistakes too. For a 1st season and with a bench lacking quality I think he's doing good. Its only natural there were and will be hickups along the way. As you said another transfer window to sort the things he can (we cant solve it all) and next season to see where we're at.
It goes both ways, there are some who think he's no better than Ole.
League Cup win will mean very little if it’s not followed up with CL football next year. While not meaningless, it is the least important competition we are in and we won it on the back of one of the easiest draws anyone has ever had.
I don’t see how anyone could be happy with the season if we end up outside top 4, battered by every single good PL team we have faced in almost every game just because we won the League Cup.
It’s a different story if we win FA Cup or Europa League but given that we have been one of the worst teams in England for the last month or so and our team looks knackered I don’t think that’s very likely at all.
That happened?
We all got carried away by some results, this team needs lots of work and better quality player all over the first 11. ETH also needs to learn from his mistakes, and some are already troubling because are being repeated. Dalot should not start against a winger like ASM when you have AWB. Weghorst is only last resort and Antony needs lots of work by the looks of it.
Been awful after the LC Win.
Mot his fault as injuries and suspensions have come into play. Mentality of players are a concern.
Mot his fault as injuries and suspensions have come into play. Mentality of players are a concern.
AWB was ill.
But now the problem is, is any trophy just that good?
Even Mourinho and Van Gal won a trophy. But our game didn't improve one bit. They were all sacked.
Top level management is not easy, Manchester United is a big club, yes winning Fa Cup or Carabao Cup can smoothen the pain but without being in a title race season after season while being thrashed by your rivals will make you get sacked no matter who you are.
Ole was a club legend, scored one of the most important goals in this club history but when the rubber met the road he was dismissed without sorry.
Also for Ten Hag that will happen if, we don't achieve anything tangible next year. Which is being a title race ( not winning it) and stop this away demolitions.
Because by the end of this summer, Ten Hag will be the most backed manager in United history, if he spends more than 150M. His spending will hit 370M in 2 summer. For sure he will break the 300m barrier.
When you spend such amount of money, tangible results need to be seen.
Not spending over 300M then getting annihilated 7 goals in Anfield or 6 in Etihad, 4 against Brenford, or such a demolition at Newcastle.
He needs to arrest the set-up of the team.
He needs to go 3 flat midfielders, 3 flat attackers. Defence is okay in set-up and structure.
If not he will be sacked, there is no doubt about it, even with winning another carabao cup or fa cup or Europa.
Great managers don't get destroyed away from home in such frequency in one season. Either you're not up to the task or you're not a quick and good learner.
The same high standards he sets to everyone else, he should also maintain that high standard.
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Who else is there?
Serious question.
Kind of. Away from home we were hammered by all of them. Our best game was against Arsenal but they still created a massive amount of chances and 3-2 was flattering. Aside from that game we were destroyed by nearly all other top half teams: City, Newcastle, Brentford, Villa and Liverpool, those games weren’t even contests.
At home if we are to be honest, we were lucky with referee decisions against Arsenal (disallowed Martinelli goal which would have got them 1-0 ahead, they were also all over us for large parts of that game) and City (Rashford’s equalizer). We definitely were not convincing in either of those wins.
We played well against Spurs but were poor v Newcastle, lost to Brighton. Played OK v Liverpool who were badly out of form.
Casemiro being out is no excuse really, a top manager should still be able to make the team function rather than just saying I need more world class players. Nor is tiredness an excuse as he could have rotated much more.
Personally I think we've built something far too reliant on individuals again. Two in midfield won't work whilst our wide man do very little and Bruno creates high turnovers. It's worrying he hasn't adjusted to compensate.
I'm hoping next season with a preseason we begin to see him impose his style onto the team rather than individuals forcing his tactics.
Personally I think we've built something far too reliant on individuals again. Two in midfield won't work whilst our wide man do very little and Bruno creates high turnovers. It's worrying he hasn't adjusted to compensate.
I'm hoping next season with a preseason we begin to see him impose his style onto the team rather than individuals forcing his tactics.
Reminds me of Pep’s galaxy brain stuff in the CL. Just keep it simple. Basic things like persisting with Weghorst upfront, trying McTominay no.10 and no.6 in the same game, playing Fernandes anywhere other than behind the striker etc… What’s he up to? It’s not working.
Casimero isn't in midfield. He's missed 7 or 8 league games.
Honest to god, are some of you even thinking logically?
He's only had two of the players he bought for the last few months, Martinez and Antony. And even Antony has been in and out of the side. This is still Ole's team and they're incapable of holding on to the ball.
I expected he'd be far better at setting up a midfield. It's not enough of an excuse to get outplayed every time Casemiro and/or Eriksen are unavailable.
I said this last week and got told I am an Ole enabler and Ten Hag hater for calling out our poor performances.
A few posters here kept saying its fatigue and tiredness that we played like that. Well after 2 week break, we got absolutely battered by Newcastle all game and this has been happening for the last month.
Yet, if you call out our performances, means I dislike the manager according to some posters.
Opposition teams have access to video technology and know that Fred, Scott and Bruno are not press resistant. They can not hold the ball for more than 2 seconds before losing it.
Too much trust in dogshit players
A touch knee jerk due to too much alcohol admitted. But I do remain unconvinced in him as a manager who actively coaches possession football. Can't do anything without the ball in this league anymore and I've wanted us to be more of a team that does pass and move for nearly 15 years now..
No manager is perfect but for ETH to revive us from our worst season in the PL to hopefully 4th and breaking a 6 year trophy drought is already a fantastic job thus far.
It’s important that he’s backed as this is a group of players that we’ve many many times decide to give up and run through the motions.
Loanees aside his players are all important cogs in our good performances too.
Wout aside, you say that as if he has a choice.
Lost to Brentford in the beginning of the season. Were ok vs Liverpool who were badly out of form, so what? You win whats in front of you. Arsenal didnt exactly have a massive amount of chances, they had possession but werent dangerous, I think you should watch that game again. Against City we actually had a good game overall. Brighton was the 1st game of the season..
Its really strange to discard our wins (luckly with referee decisions imagine that, we were unlucky with that in other games) all the while treating all the defeats the same. Quite the revisionism.
Because an opinion differs from yours
every time, literally. Path of least effort I supposeOur away form is a concern, part of the reason for that is we seem to start every game slowly. I think back to the Forest semi-final, big atmosphere with the crowd up for it and we silence them with the early goal which makes the game far easier. Now obviously you can't expect that in every match but the problem is we do the opposite and give away so many chances. And once a home team starts getting momentum and their fans react then we can't cope with it.
In our last 4 league games we've faced 81 shots which is ridiculous. Arsenal (25), Leeds (16), Liverpool (18), Newcastle (22). In those we've managed 6, 11, 8, 6 ourselves. If you only take those on target it's nowhere near such a gap but we clearly need to stop allowing the opposition to have so many attempts.
In our last 4 league games we've faced 81 shots which is ridiculous. Arsenal (25), Leeds (16), Liverpool (18), Newcastle (22). In those we've managed 6, 11, 8, 6 ourselves. If you only take those on target it's nowhere near such a gap but we clearly need to stop allowing the opposition to have so many attempts.
You expect us to control games with their replacements, Fred and McTominay in midfield?
Why? What evidence is that based on?
Arteta didn’t get 4th last season.. in his 3rd full season. ETH will be here next season regardless and rightly so.
I've been very happy with him and we have to understand fatigue, injuries and suspensions were always going to catch up to us, but his persistence with Weghorst is wearing my patience thin. Why do all our managers have these blinkers for one, horrifically poor player? Weghorst will end up costing him his job if he signs him in the summer.
I have no doubt he's our best manager since SAF. I didn't want Ole even as an interim manager
Trust doesn't mean only picking them but playing them for certain roles as well. Playing Wout or McTom at 10 and moving Bruno onto the wing or deepest midfield position is just too much trust in shit players.
McTominay can't even do the basics right for a midfield position what makes EtH think he would offer creativity behind the striker? This is just having too much trust in incapable players. I can't understand how this player has survived playing for us since Jose picked him up just to prove a point of him giving a chance to young players.
I can't believe that I am reading this and i am not going to even explain why.
The concerns in our performances were well founded but people refused to hear it. Results have caught up.
Can't disagree with anything there but I think we're both fighting just a little above both of our weight and easily exposed to injuries plus Casemiro needs to learn a bit of self discipline, he's not just letting himself down. It's too easy to blame your manager while United are up in the air - nothing is stable at present.
Control, no. But not get completely completely overrun by going up against 3 on 2 every week. Do something different, play Martinez in there if he has to.
I don't even know where McTominay was supposed to be playing yesterday.
This is where control and possession comes into play. One of the more important reasons why Pep plays a possession based system is a defensive function, more safe possession allows less shots on goal generally. Transition breads chaos and leads to chances at both ends.
Incredible what I'm reading in this thread, absolutely incredible.
If we look back how it’s been for the coaches in the past, he will probably get the chance to continue but if the results aren’t there 3-4 months in, he will be sacked.