Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Enigma_87 · Oct 4, 2019

Champagne Football said:
His 3 signings have been our 3 most successful signings since Fergie quit. He's faced a mountain of Jose expensive panic buys, Moyes Glasgow Celtic Level buys and Van Gaals endless midtable level injury prone buys - Rojo, Shaw, Martial, Herrera.

Ole was promised a deep lying playmaker over the summer that he never got. We have 2 massive holes in our team due to no DLP or specialist striker. If Ole can land 2 top players we need such as John McGinn and Callum Wilson then he will at least have a mostly balanced squad then and I'm almost certain he can turn it around then.

His three signings have played handful of games so far. Calling them the most successful ones is knee jerk to put it mildly.

I’m not sure where you get those claims that he was promised something that was not delivered. He came out saying there were players available yet we didn’t make a move because they weren’t ‘the ones’.

dove · Oct 4, 2019

kul m said:
We need to stick with Ole and give him 2/3 transfer windows, all this BS about "ole out" is utter rubbish..... A few questions

1. Has he got rid of players that didn't want to play for utd or weren't good enough?...Yes to an extent
2. Has he bought in players, who are different then previous managers signings?........Yes
3. Have the 2 new defensive signings improved us defensively?.................................Yes
4. Has Dan James improved us going forward?........................................................Yes
5. Has he given youth more playing time?...............................................................Yes
6. Has he backed the younger players?...................................................................Yes
7. We've lost a massive player in Herrera, has he been replaced?...............................No
8. Are we playing well at the minute?.....................................................................No
9. Are the senior players stepping up, matic, mata, young, pogba, lingard, fred?..........No
10. Are we scoring enough goals through midfield and our current strikers?.................No
11. Are we lacking a true 20+ goal a season striker?.................................................Yes

To be fair, we need to give Ole more time, there are still players in that squad that need to be moved on, we need to bring some experience players in who have experience in winning trophies, and the right attitude....

It may not be clear what Ole is trying to achieve on the pitch, whether it be formations, playing style, tactics etc.... One thing is for sure he's started to clean this club of deadwood, the cleanse has started. We can see the direction there, so we should support him.

Is Ole clearly out of his depth?........................................................Yes

Hugh Jass · Oct 4, 2019

Needs a good win against Newcastle. He could be in trouble if we drop points against them.

Omahahaha · Oct 4, 2019

Champagne Football said:
His 3 signings have been our 3 most successful signings since Fergie quit. He's faced a mountain of Jose expensive panic buys, Moyes Glasgow Celtic Level buys and Van Gaals endless midtable level injury prone buys - Rojo, Shaw, Martial, Herrera.

Ole was promised a deep lying playmaker over the summer that he never got. We have 2 massive holes in our team due to no DLP or specialist striker. If Ole can land 2 top players we need such as John McGinn and Callum Wilson then he will at least have a mostly balanced squad then and I'm almost certain he can turn it around then.

No way the bolded part is true, and if Ole needs more time before he can be judged, surely it's way too early to judge his signings conclusively?

He also choose to push Lukaku out in favour of Rashford, without a replacement, which left us weaker.
His general management of "Rashy" has been horrible and he should be held responsible for making his ego increase tenfold.
Herrera left, which left us weaker. Even Fellaini or Sanchez could still be of use when we are looking at our dire squad at the moment.
Smalling left (on loan) which leaves our squad weaker.

Meanwhile, new contracts for Young, Mata, Jones. Lingard featuring every game.

As for the midfielder he was promised, wasn't his prime target Longstaff? Would he really make a difference?

Does all his signings have to be British?

I really hope that you are right, that he will turn it around and be a success. But I find it very, very unlikely.

That_Bloke · Oct 4, 2019

Alabaster Codify7 said:
United are 250/1 to get relegated at present, same odds that Leicester had to win the Premier League the season they were favourites to be relegated themselves. Sometimes, something absolutely mental happens in football, when you have conditions that contribute to The Perfect Storm.

Leicester City's Perfect Storm was simple - they had a tidy manager, not great but very good, and a squad of good players that Ranieri had moulded into a very efficient and confident side, who scored a lot of goals (the key to winning football matches for the most part). They also had the crazy luck of United, City and Chelsea all having terrible seasons by their standards, marred by issues. So suddenly they only had Spurs (renowned bottlers) and Arsenal (leaky defence and somewhat bottlers) to compete with.

Our Perfect Storm:

Average manager.

Terrible squad.

Complete lack of goal-scorers.

Injuries.

No morales whatsoever.

Never say this could never happen. Never.

Personally I don't think it will, but I do expect us to be around 17th at some point this season at which point I think they'll pull the plug on Ole.

We were at 5000/1 to win the PL that season.

b82REZ · Oct 4, 2019

fergiesarmy1 said:
The start he had, clearing out some deadwood, the 3 signings so far, not shitting on the club in the press, club legend so deserves some respect, will always give youth a proper chance and has only had 7 league games in a full season.

I know we are getting used to sackings but do we know encourage it?

Absurd reasons.

We should not give him leeway because he raised the morale after Mourinho. There was always going to be an upturn in results when he was sacked

owlo · Oct 4, 2019

Ban said:
I didn't say you mentioned Allardyce and I explicitly said Howe isn't a name just thrown out there.
As for Allegri I meant what the mood here would probably be if we hired him. Hell one even said he wouldn't promote youth just at the thought of Allegri coming.
And Allardyce wasn't a pisstake.

Stop wilfully misrepresentating what I posted please.

I said even Allardyce would be a better choice than OGS at this point, not that we should replace OGS with Allardyce. I believe my initial post was something along the lines of 'Hell I'd even take Allardyce over him.'

You know that, yet have pushed a different narrative.

MisterLupus · Oct 4, 2019

elmo said:
Says the person trying to pretend he's an expert while knowing feck all. Get a life.

JoaquinJoaquin · Oct 4, 2019

Champagne Football said:
His 3 signings have been our 3 most successful signings since Fergie quit. He's faced a mountain of Jose expensive panic buys, Moyes Glasgow Celtic Level buys and Van Gaals endless midtable level injury prone buys - Rojo, Shaw, Martial, Herrera.

Ole was promised a deep lying playmaker over the summer that he never got. We have 2 massive holes in our team due to no DLP or specialist striker. If Ole can land 2 top players we need such as John McGinn and Callum Wilson then he will at least have a mostly balanced squad then and I'm almost certain he can turn it around then.

Yeah, because Callum Wilson and John McGinn are going to turn this team around :rolleyes:

Smores · Oct 4, 2019

Enigma_87 said:
His three signings have played handful of games so far. Calling them the most successful ones is knee jerk to put it mildly.

I’m not sure where you get those claims that he was promised something that was not delivered. He came out saying there were players available yet we didn’t make a move because they weren’t ‘the ones’.

Also two of them were for insane fees and premier league proven they're hardly some unknown quantities. James is a fantastic signing mind you but not sure how many others Giggs can recommend.

I keep seeing people say we can't sack him because we need a long term plan not quick fixes. Why is Ole the only possible person who can implement this long term plan?

If you want a long term plan you put someone in who you have trust in not an amateur who is an unknown prospect. Sticking with failing unproven staff just because we need a long term plan is madness, the plan needs to be good and it needs to be able to be implemented.

Roboc7 · Oct 4, 2019

Champagne Football said:
His 3 signings have been our 3 most successful signings since Fergie quit. He's faced a mountain of Jose expensive panic buys, Moyes Glasgow Celtic Level buys and Van Gaals endless midtable level injury prone buys - Rojo, Shaw, Martial, Herrera.

Ole was promised a deep lying playmaker over the summer that he never got. We have 2 massive holes in our team due to no DLP or specialist striker. If Ole can land 2 top players we need such as John McGinn and Callum Wilson then he will at least have a mostly balanced squad then and I'm almost certain he can turn it around then.

How can they be a success after a handful of games?. It’s total nonsense to praise them yet, Maguire is most expensive defender of all time something he can never live up to in reality. McGinn and Wilson would be expensive but their far from top players and would wipe out our entire budget.

Ole faces an incredibly difficult job but let’s not pretend he’s a great manager and isn’t getting a lot wrong. This is a long term project and if that’s the case is he really the best qualified man for the job, based on what we’re seeing now I’d have to say no.

ash_86 · Oct 4, 2019

JoaquinJoaquin said:
Yeah, because Callum Wilson and John McGinn are going to turn this team around

They would certainly make us better. Midfield and attack is where we struggle. Adding two quality personnel in those areas isn't going make us worse.

Sir Scott McToMinay · Oct 4, 2019

JonDahl said:
What ever helps you sleep at night, young man.

I always sleep well at night, old timer.

Ban · Oct 4, 2019

owlo said:
Stop wilfully misrepresentating what I posted please.

I said even Allardyce would be a better choice than OGS at this point, not that we should replace OGS with Allardyce. I believe my initial post was something along the lines of 'Hell I'd even take Allardyce over him.'

You know that, yet have pushed a different narrative.

Whatever.

fergiesarmy1 · Oct 4, 2019

b82REZ said:
Absurd reasons.

We should not give him leeway because he raised the morale after Mourinho. There was always going to be an upturn in results when he was sacked

Yes 7 league games and not calling for the sack is absurd.

Pretty sure if we could go back in time 90% of posters at some point or other would have called an early sacking of other clubs managers absurd while we sat in our ivory tower.

Enigma_87 · Oct 4, 2019

fergiesarmy1 said:
Yes 7 league games and not calling for the sack is absurd.

Pretty sure if we could go back in time 90% of posters at some point or other would have called an early sacking of other clubs managers absurd while we sat in our ivory tower.

Other clubs rarely appoint nobodies. If Ole was a good manager I’m pretty sure he would have been awarded more time.

However he’s clueless and no top club would touch him even with a Bluetooth, apart from us.

tenpoless · Oct 4, 2019

I'll wait and if in the next 3 months We're not any better, I'll give it to Ole the caretaker manager.

b82REZ · Oct 4, 2019

fergiesarmy1 said:
Yes 7 league games and not calling for the sack is absurd.

Pretty sure if we could go back in time 90% of posters at some point or other would have called an early sacking of other clubs managers absurd while we sat in our ivory tower.

Stop acting like you're the only poster who was around for the start of Fergie's reign. Like it or not if he didn't beat Palace he would have been fired and then we wouldn't have this convenient excuse for future managers.

I'm not judging him on 7 games, I'm judging him on all games he's been in charge. You cannot move the goalposts to suit your agenda. Over his tenure Ole has fallen well short of Watford's standards, let alone Manchester United's.

You're being far too sentimental in your reasoning. Ole is like a fan, but that doesn't make any of us qualified for the job and it shouldn't be enough for him to be immune to criticism.

There's a difference between Ole the player and Ole the manager, and most people aren't seeing that.

JoaquinJoaquin · Oct 4, 2019

ash_86 said:
They would certainly make us better. Midfield and attack is where we struggle. Adding two quality personnel in those areas isn't going make us worse.

You said it yourself, ''two quality personell'. Those 2 are decent Premier League players, but certainly not much better than what we have (and I say this as someone who doesn't think much of our current squad). We are going to need much better than those 2 if we are to turn things around.

fergiesarmy1 · Oct 4, 2019

b82REZ said:
Stop acting like you're the only poster who was around for the start of Fergie's reign. Like it or not if he didn't beat Palace he would have been fired and then we wouldn't have this convenient excuse for future managers.

I'm not judging him on 7 games, I'm judging him on all games he's been in charge. You cannot move the goalposts to suit your agenda. Over his tenure Ole has fallen well short of Watford's standards, let alone Manchester United's.

You're being far too sentimental in your reasoning. Ole is like a fan, but that doesn't make any of us qualified for the job and it shouldn't be enough for him to be immune to criticism.

There's a difference between Ole the player and Ole the manager, and most people aren't seeing that.

My post had nothing to do with how long I’ve supported united, it was stating over the years we used to laugh at other clubs chaos especially when it involved an early sacking and we took the moral high ground more often than not.

Now a lot of people are calling for exactly the same thing.

United Hobbit · Oct 4, 2019

I'm not sure how true this is as it's a Liverpool fan who has taken great delight in sending me this, however apparently we haven't scored from a set piece in over 200 days... apparently it was on Twitter a few days ago however I dont do Twitter so no way of verifying it.

If it is true that is absolutely shocking and pathetic. It wouldn't surprise me if it is given Rashy's wild free kicks and whenever we take a corner I will sit there thinking "we wont score" however why are we not practicing these things? Why isnt Rashy doing multiple free kick practices or being removed from them. I read Ronaldo's autobiography that he published while still at United and he said how he would regularly stay behind after training to practice his free kicks- wonder if any of our players do that....

devilish · Oct 4, 2019

r3idy said:
It's depressing viewing at the moment for sure. Thinking about this overnight but I guess it comes back to a lot of the same conclusions. If fans want Ole gone for the likes of an Allegri or Poechettino then isn't' that saying we will accept a quick fix? That's kind of what got us in this mess, too many quick fixes and not enough long term planning. In my opinion, he seems to be getting us upto pace and having a proper footballing infrastructure like City, Dortmund, Bayern, Juventus. A proper medical set up, footballing analysis, player performance etc. All of that will not reap any benefits today, tomorrow or this season, that's all for the future.

The here and the now we will always judge him on and results and performance polarise opinion. Last night we should have beat the AZ Alkmaar minnows I hear people say. Flip it round to a team that play on that pitch every other game. A formation of 4-1-4-1. As soon as they lose the ball they goto a deep back 5 with the 4 midfielders sitting in front. With the fit forwards we have the only real play we have available is counter-attack with pace. Absolutely no space to run into. So with the players at our disposal last night I am no way surprised either at the result or the performance.

When he came in it was a bloated unbalanced squad with key players not performing (Sanchez), or not wanting to be here (Lukaku). We don't want the toxic atmosphere of Jose but bemoan losing two players not arsed at all about putting a shift in. That problem is down to the board not Ole and he can then only work with what he has got. Old cliche but true nonetheless. It's fine margins at the moment. A decent goal scorer and potentially you have a few more wins under your belt. You can afford to make the mistake that Tuanzebe makes against Arsenal and still end up winning 2-1 or 3-1. However when your only real goal scorer is Rashford and he is carrying a knock, not fully fit, out of form and snatching at shots, again results should not come as a surprise. Change the results will build confidence, which in turn will deliver better performances.

If Ole does get the boot then I dare say whoever comes in next will find the club and squad in much better shape than what Ole inherited.

It depends on what quick fix means for you. Both Allegri and Pochs has worked with weak sides before joining Juve and spurs . They slowly transformed them in better sides and they were able to punch above their weight. We are not talking of the likes of Pep, Jose and Zidane here who had always managed top sides

Now if quick fix means we go for an established manager rather then a rookie one who is learning on the job then that's different

b82REZ · Oct 4, 2019

fergiesarmy1 said:
My post had nothing to do with how long I’ve supported united, it was stating over the years we used to laugh at other clubs chaos especially when it involved an early sacking and we took the moral high ground more often than not.

Now a lot of people are calling for exactly the same thing.

I'm referring to all your other posts.

I couldn't care less what happens at other clubs. Are you so proud you'd rather keep and unqualified manager in place because firing him isn't the "United Way"?

We are further away from the top than we've ever been since Fergie retired and Ole is a huge part of the reason why.

fergiesarmy1 · Oct 4, 2019

b82REZ said:
I'm referring to all your other posts.

I couldn't care less what happens at other clubs. Are you so proud you'd rather keep and unqualified manager in place because firing him isn't the "United Way"?

We are further away from the top than we've ever been since Fergie retired and Ole is a huge part of the reason why.

I’d say Ole maybe is a small part of the reason why we are so far away considering what’s gone on in the last 6 years.

JoaquinJoaquin · Oct 4, 2019

Put it this way,

Would Real Madrid accept this? Nope
Barcelona? Nope
Bayern Munich? Nope
City? No
Juventus? Hell no

Wish we would act like the big club we like to portray.

soralapio · Oct 4, 2019

KristianMackle said:
Hard to say when he didnt get all the players he wanted but then stubbornly refused to buy a striker because Greenwood.

Um. That sure is a piece of revisionist history. Ole kept talking about wanting and "expecting to" bring in an additional attacker even before Lukaku left, so I would be very interested in hearing your source for Ole "stubbornly refusing" to buy a striker. Because frankly it sounds like you're making shit up to fit a narrative.

Judas · Oct 4, 2019

JoaquinJoaquin said:
Put it this way,

Would Real Madrid accept this? Nope
Barcelona? Nope
Bayern Munich? Nope
City? No
Juventus? Hell no

Wish we would act like the big club we like to portray.

We very rarely do, and the supposed "top reds" eat it up and love that about us. Comical.

JPRouve · Oct 4, 2019

JoaquinJoaquin said:
Put it this way,

Would Real Madrid accept this? Nope
Barcelona? Nope
Bayern Munich? Nope
City? No
Juventus? Hell no

Wish we would act like the big club we like to portray.

Now that you mention it, Bayern did sack Ancelotti in September.

Andycoleno9 · Oct 4, 2019

JoaquinJoaquin said:
Put it this way,

Would Real Madrid accept this? Nope
Barcelona? Nope
Bayern Munich? Nope
City? No
Juventus? Hell no

Wish we would act like the big club we like to portray.

You put it all wrong here. You are not paying attention lately. We are now in Leicester, Everton, even some say West Ham or Valencia or Schalke level. So the right question is would they accept this?

Oh wait, they would not.

vangagal · Oct 4, 2019

JPRouve said:
Now that you mention it, Bayern did sack Ancelotti in September.

Even Madrid sacked Lopetegui in October and sacked Solari in March in the same season. Did they look like idiot? Yes. Did they care? Nope.

romufc · Oct 4, 2019

vangagal said:
Even Madrid sacked Lopetegui in October and sacked Solari in March in the same season. Did they look like idiot? Yes. Did they care? Nope.

There is a BIG difference between those clubs and United.
Chelsea, City, Real, Juve, Bayern are all clubs with management that is ruthless, just like how successful organisations are run.

Unfortunately, Manutd are too scared to upset people.

Sjaakmeoff · Oct 4, 2019

I'd sack him. Not because i want to get rid of him. Not because i don't think he can't manage a good team. But because i think he's too green to manage a team that's in this state.

We need a breath of fresh air. Someone to wake up the players.

MoskvaRed · Oct 4, 2019

fergiesarmy1 said:
My post had nothing to do with how long I’ve supported united, it was stating over the years we used to laugh at other clubs chaos especially when it involved an early sacking and we took the moral high ground more often than not.

Now a lot of people are calling for exactly the same thing.

In hindsight, the “moral high ground” was just United fans being smug because we had a one in million manager in Fergie. As others have pointed out, struggling managers rarely turn it around and Ole’s career in management to date doesn’t give us anything to cling to (unlike the post-Aberdeen Fergie in his early years at United).

The most compelling argument I can come up with for not sacking him is that I don’t want us to rush into another reactive appointment. So, unless we are in danger of relegation, I’d keep Ole in place for now while we try to identify the right man. Maybe 5th time lucky for Woodward.

vidic blood & sand · Oct 4, 2019

I wouldn't sack him yet simply because he deserves a full season for everything he did for us as a player.
However, he's unproven, isn't very animated on the touchline, picks wrong players for games, waits too long to change things, and doesn't play Pogba high enough up the field.
My fear is that he won't be a success with us, or any big club. Big Shame. So please Ole prove me wrong!

romufc · Oct 4, 2019

vidic blood & sand said:
I wouldn't sack him yet simply because he deserves a full season for everything he did for us as a player.
However, he's unproven, isn't very animated on the touchline, picks wrong players for games, waits too long to change things, and doesn't play Pogba high enough up the field.
My fear is that he won't be a success with us, or any big club. Big Shame. So please Ole prove me wrong!

This is the biggest reason Manutd fail. Sentiment.

To be successful we cannot have this sentiment of he was a great player so give him time. No if he is not doing well, get rid.

John Blund · Oct 4, 2019

If he doesn't change back to a 4-3-3 formation very soon (like we had in pre-season), he'll be gone before next season. Playing Jesse Lingard in #10-role behind the striker is like an evil joke towards the striker. You know there's not going to be many great balls from your playmaker when you see who's behind you as the ST.

Rocksy · Oct 4, 2019

Sack him, I think he could manage this team towards a relegation battle. He’s so out of his depth and his record from March is around that level.

bleedred · Oct 4, 2019

vidic blood & sand said:
I wouldn't sack him yet simply because he deserves a full season for everything he did for us as a player.
However, he's unproven, isn't very animated on the touchline, picks wrong players for games, waits too long to change things, and doesn't play Pogba high enough up the field.
My fear is that he won't be a success with us, or any big club. Big Shame. So please Ole prove me wrong!

Sure. While we are at it, lets put all our legends in line for their "deserved" year and see if they can get us beating the likes of Rochdale and AZ.

ash_86 · Oct 4, 2019

JoaquinJoaquin said:
You said it yourself, ''two quality personell'. Those 2 are decent Premier League players, but certainly not much better than what we have (and I say this as someone who doesn't think much of our current squad). We are going to need much better than those 2 if we are to turn things around.

Depends on what you mean it by "turning it around". Fight for top 4 , yes these two would be good addition. Going for title - No these two probably wont be quality enough to win the league right now.

Aouer-United · Oct 4, 2019

John Blund said:
If he doesn't change back to a 4-3-3 formation very soon (like we had in pre-season), he'll be gone before next season. Playing Jesse Lingard in #10-role behind the striker is like an evil joke towards the striker. You know there's not going to be many great balls from your playmaker when you see who's behind you as the ST.

What are you watching? We played 4-2-3-1 in pre-season, haha

Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

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