Mason Mount

What’s the issue with him? Can’t see the tweet

The squad is full of physical wrecks so the manager has to play the few than can stay fit constantly, which in turn wrecks them physically for the next season.

Mount has been a disaster. Feel for him but I just don’t get it! why can he not stay fit.

Bloody United.

doomy20 said:

The business should be way harder. Clubs should be allowed to cancel contracts when a player can’t deliver fitness.

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American?

andersj said:

4-5 games a season. Basically not injured at Derby either.

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13 of those 18 were last season, though. Like Bosnian Red says, it could be that he’s now become an injury prone player.

bosnian_red said:

People aren't injury prone right from the off, there's usually a point in time when it starts. Mount seems to have started since 2023. He's missed 40 games since January 2023.

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soapythecat said:

What’s the issue with him? Can’t see the tweet

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Just says he'll miss the FA cup game due to injury

crossy1686 said:

Just says he'll miss the FA cup game due to injury

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Shame. I feel he could have started tomorrow. Would have been ideal for him. Lads had some rotten luck this season.

soapythecat said:

Shame. I feel he could have started tomorrow. Would have been ideal for him. Lads had some rotten luck this season.

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When people start getting long term muscle related injuries it means their bodies just can’t cope with the demands of this level, Martial is another example. It’s glaringly obvious to most of us yet the people at our club seem to not give a feck who they sign as long as the manager is happy.

BenitoSTARR said:

The way we compensate for different muscle groups though can exacerbate other body areas.

I’m not saying this is the case with Mount but it’s a possibility.

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I think that naturally in footbball, and especially in midfielders like Mount all his injuries have been lower body, and repetitive, however this time it's reported as a "calf strain" which implies poor fitness.

Just sack the full medical department at this point. Surely INEOS will be looking at the amount of injuries we pick up.

Ah well, not to worry - we'll replace an injury prone Mount with Olise for 60m.

No longer a footballer now officially a mascot

soapythecat said:

Antony says Hi!

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I think Mount is worse based on this season.

Antony underwhelmed but didn't disrupt the fabric of the team. We needed a RW too and we had already got in key players before him.

Mount was the first, we sold Fred, Hag changed the midfield to make us far more open and then Mount has barely even played. What's more we arguably have our best player in his position.

Mount might come good but based on this season it has been an awful transfer.

Injured again? After playing a full 20mins in a go?
Madness.

soapythecat said:

Antony says Hi!

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Close but at least Antony can play most games and we needed a right winger back then when we got him

My biggest worry about him is when i look at youtube videos - alot of his assists come from corners rather than from open play.

I know he made a great pass in the CL final but i do worry a little bit about his ability to play the deadly final ball.

Maybe he has got it in his locker and Chelsea fans may have seen it before.

EtH thinks MM will be fit for Saturday.

Mason Mount seems to be the symbolic successor to Phil Jones. But Phil did significantly contribute something in his early years with us at least

Don’t write him off he's certainly a much more classy player than he’s shown so far. Let’s hope he can catch a break with his fitness before the end of the season and then in the summer take stock of what he needs to be able to stay fit long term.

QuietOn Fortune said:

My biggest worry about him is when i look at youtube videos - alot of his assists come from corners rather than from open play.

I know he made a great pass in the CL final but i do worry a little bit about his ability to play the deadly final ball.

Maybe he has got it in his locker and Chelsea fans may have seen it before.

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Said the same r.e. the corner assists. Rudiger and Zouma were good at headed goals.

A lot of his goals also came from the space Bruno occupies. So right of the bat you see a lot of his statistical contribution is going to be gone.

And then just the general eye test of watching him 10-20 times for Chelsea and England and he pretty much never impressed. The Tom Cleverly sort of looking busy but not having the ability to actively influence a game.

FootballAI said:

I know he only had about 10 minutes to play today, but his touches and his passing were class. Like to see him start in the next match.

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It’s crazy Eriksen gets so many minutes before him.

Ollie Derbyshire said:

It’s crazy Eriksen gets so many minutes before him.

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I think they were afraid he might get injured again. Honestly I have never watched him before, only a few minutes here and there this year but everytime he has shown that he has the skills.

FootballAI said:

I think they were afraid he might get injured again. Honestly I have never watched him before, only a few minutes here and there this year but everytime he has shown that he has the skills.

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Yeah he’s worth perceiving with amd trying to get a working midfield with Mainoo and Bruno.

Ignoring his injuries for a moment, Mount has 4 starts 9 sub appearances in the PL this season. We paid £55m and wages between £10m and £12m per season (will be lower end of scale since his appearance bonuses will be so low).

United simply cannot afford to pay that level of transfer fee and salary to a back-up player.

The people who made the decision regarding this transfer need to be held accountable, along with those responsible for the Antony and Casemiro deals.

Whenever he plays, he looks good. He’s just never fit.

kundalini said:

Ignoring his injuries for a moment, Mount has 4 starts 9 sub appearances in the PL this season. We paid £55m and wages between £10m and £12m per season (will be lower end of scale since his appearance bonuses will be so low).

United simply cannot afford to pay that level of transfer fee and salary to a back-up player.

The people who made the decision regarding this transfer need to be held accountable, along with those responsible for the Antony and Casemiro deals.

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He was injured for most of season. Seems out of favor or just not ready to play now but it’s hard to assess him based on this year alone.

kundalini said:

Ignoring his injuries for a moment, Mount has 4 starts 9 sub appearances in the PL this season. We paid £55m and wages between £10m and £12m per season (will be lower end of scale since his appearance bonuses will be so low).

United simply cannot afford to pay that level of transfer fee and salary to a back-up player.

The people who made the decision regarding this transfer need to be held accountable, along with those responsible for the Antony and Casemiro deals.

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You haven't ignored his injuries for a second. Why do you think he missed so many games? He doesn't have a second job renovating homes with Dion Dublin that's kept him away.

Like saying "ignoring the goals we've conceded for a moment, we can't afford to conceded as many goals as we have".

kundalini said:

Ignoring his injuries for a moment, Mount has 4 starts 9 sub appearances in the PL this season. We paid £55m and wages between £10m and £12m per season (will be lower end of scale since his appearance bonuses will be so low).

United simply cannot afford to pay that level of transfer fee and salary to a back-up player.

The people who made the decision regarding this transfer need to be held accountable, along with those responsible for the Antony and Casemiro deals.

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But he was bought as a first team player, the second attacking #8 ETH wanted to complete his puzzle.

Seriously though, we can't really say for sure what will happen to him under a new manager. He is good enough to start in this team in Bruno place, but the manager would need to make a decision to phase out Fernandes and ETH has made up his mind about that.

I also believe people focus too much on his transfer fee. He isn't a bad transfer yet, he can still turn out to be a very useful player to us.
We could've predicted Antony not being good enough for this league, or Casemiro decline (at least we should've prepared for it). I am not sure if we could predict Mount injuries this season.

Borys said:

But he was bought as a first team player, the second attacking #8 ETH wanted to complete his puzzle.

Seriously though, we can't really say for sure what will happen to him under a new manager. He is good enough to start in this team in Bruno place, but the manager would need to make a decision to phase out Fernandes and ETH has made up his mind about that.

I also believe people focus too much on his transfer fee. He isn't a bad transfer yet, he can still turn out to be a very useful player to us.
We could've predicted Antony not being good enough for this league, or Casemiro decline (at least we should've prepared for it). I am not sure if we could predict Mount injuries this season.

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We bought a player who was injured a lot the season before he signed so yeah we could have predicted the risk of another injury season.

Borys said:

But he was bought as a first team player, the second attacking #8 ETH wanted to complete his puzzle.

Seriously though, we can't really say for sure what will happen to him under a new manager. He is good enough to start in this team in Bruno place, but the manager would need to make a decision to phase out Fernandes and ETH has made up his mind about that.

I also believe people focus too much on his transfer fee. He isn't a bad transfer yet, he can still turn out to be a very useful player to us.
We could've predicted Antony not being good enough for this league, or Casemiro decline (at least we should've prepared for it). I am not sure if we could predict Mount injuries this season.

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I don't know about that. I don't rate Bruno as highly as most but then I don't rate Mount either and it's very debatable that he can replace him. We agree though that in the real world and not ETHs fantasyfootballand, the only position he can play is the Bruno position. If we accept Mount, Bruno and Mainoo will never work as a midfield three then our options are Mainoo, Bruno, Physical DM or Mainoo, Mount, Physical DM.

UpWithRivers said:

We bought a player who was injured a lot the season before he signed so yeah we could have predicted the risk of another injury season.

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I am not an expert on that, seems like injuries he suffered this season are unrelated to the one from last season (I might be wrong here?).

Desert Eagle said:

I don't know about that. I don't rate Bruno as highly as most but then I don't rate Mount either and it's very debatable that he can replace him. We agree though that in the real world and not ETHs fantasyfootballand, the only position he can play is the Bruno position. If we accept Mount, Bruno and Mainoo will never work as a midfield three then our options are Mainoo, Bruno, Physical DM or Mainoo, Mount, Physical DM.

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That is true, however - Mount and Bruno excel in the same position but play a totally different game. Mount is much more versatile, technical player and imo better instincts defensively (similar to Fred). Bruno is an inconsistent chance creation machine, and a willing runner (I don't rate his off the ball attributes at all). There is no way to play them both, but Imo with Mount we can build modern side. Bruno comes with a lot more limitations that forces us to play 4231 setup.

Borys said:

That is true, however - Mount and Bruno excel in the same position but play a totally different game. Mount is much more versatile, technical player and imo better instincts defensively (similar to Fred). Bruno is an inconsistent chance creation machine, and a willing runner (I don't rate his off the ball attributes at all). There is no way to play them both, but Imo with Mount we can build modern side. Bruno comes with a lot more limitations that forces us to play 4231 setup.

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Agreed.

Borys said:

I am not an expert on that, seems like injuries he suffered this season are unrelated to the one from last season (I might be wrong here?).


That is true, however - Mount and Bruno excel in the same position but play a totally different game. Mount is much more versatile, technical player and imo better instincts defensively (similar to Fred). Bruno is an inconsistent chance creation machine, and a willing runner (I don't rate his off the ball attributes at all). There is no way to play them both, but Imo with Mount we can build modern side. Bruno comes with a lot more limitations that forces us to play 4231 setup.

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Predicting injuries is a very simple matter, even laymen can do it quite precisely. You just read the results from the Hindsight test and backdate the diagnosis into the prognosis box innthe medical journal.

Re Bruno, I agree with your verdict he is a qualitatively weak defender, apart from that I think you underestimate his contribution, even defensively, and even the inportance of the quantitative aspects of his game. His most striking pro’s are not only striking, they are quite extreme in world football. Some of his critics claim that people are fooled by superficial statistical hang ups or unsophisticated ideas about workrate, but are not subtle nor analytical enough to see the real picture. I think it’s worth noting in that regard how many different highly qualified football coaches and experienced players who do not at all share that assessment. Practically every coach he has played under have gone to lengtha to accomodate him in the team, often ahead of very talented players. I’m pretty sure most of them see the issues you and I notice, and have an even better understanding of how it affects the team performance, good and bad. I am willing to bet you (not really, I don’t bet online) that until he physically declines, Bruno will be in the starting eleven of every club or country in the world, under every coach in the world.

Trying to be positive, as i didn’t agree or see a need for the transfer at the time as well as the fee and manner we acquired him being nonsensical. He has been good in the times he has played, however brief.

Does anyone know any examples of players who have moved club, had their first season completely written off by injury and then became a star or key player on their return the following season?

Grande said:

Predicting injuries is a very simple matter, even laymen can do it quite precisely. You just read the results from the Hindsight test and backdate the diagnosis into the prognosis box innthe medical journal.

Re Bruno, I agree with your verdict he is a qualitatively weak defender, apart from that I think you underestimate his contribution, even defensively, and even the inportance of the quantitative aspects of his game. His most striking pro’s are not only striking, they are quite extreme in world football. Some of his critics claim that people are fooled by superficial statistical hang ups or unsophisticated ideas about workrate, but are not subtle nor analytical enough to see the real picture. I think it’s worth noting in that regard how many different highly qualified football coaches and experienced players who do not at all share that assessment. Practically every coach he has played under have gone to lengtha to accomodate him in the team, often ahead of very talented players. I’m pretty sure most of them see the issues you and I notice, and have an even better understanding of how it affects the team performance, good and bad. I am willing to bet you (not really, I don’t bet online) that until he physically declines, Bruno will be in the starting eleven of every club or country in the world, under every coach in the world.

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There are not enough laughing emojis in the universe for that last sentence. Your argument from authority is weak even for a logical fallacy. The highly qualified coaches you speak of are Ole, Ralf and ETH. Two of which have already been fired for failing at their job and the third one is set to follow them.

Oo0AahCantona said:

Trying to be positive, as i didn’t agree or see a need for the transfer at the time as well as the fee and manner we acquired him being nonsensical. He has been good in the times he has played, however brief.

Does anyone know any examples of players who have moved club, had their first season completely written off by injury and then became a star or key player on their return the following season?

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I remember Ruud was supposed to sign for us a year earlier but got injured but that's not your exact scenario.
Can't remember when Ramsey got injured for Arsenal but i think it was quite early in his time with them.
It'll be quite rare to find that exact scenario though which doesn't bode well for Mount

Borys said:

I am not an expert on that, seems like injuries he suffered this season are unrelated to the one from last season (I might be wrong here?).


That is true, however - Mount and Bruno excel in the same position but play a totally different game. Mount is much more versatile, technical player and imo better instincts defensively (similar to Fred). Bruno is an inconsistent chance creation machine, and a willing runner (I don't rate his off the ball attributes at all). There is no way to play them both, but Imo with Mount we can build modern side. Bruno comes with a lot more limitations that forces us to play 4231 setup.

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One point you miss here though, is 4231 suits the strengths of most of our squad, not just Bruno. Especially our most talented footballers.

Bruno - as described

All of our wide players are better suited as inside forwards, rather than being very wide. Better at counter attack rather than intricate build up

None of our CMs are suited to playing a lone six, and all lack athleticism. All better suited to playing in a low block, counter attacking double pivot.

All of our central defenders lack too much pace to play a high line.

Our fbs are well suited to overlap, not so much stepping into midfield

So, whilst I agree with you Mount is probs better suited to ETHs system… who else is???

And if this high press double 8 system was his plan… why in the world did he sell Fred?!?!

Boggles the mind.

Desert Eagle said:

There are not enough laughing emojis in the universe for that last sentence. Your argument from authority is weak even for a logical fallacy. The highly qualified coaches you speak of are Ole, Ralf and ETH. Two of which have already been fired for failing at their job and the third one is set to follow them.

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I’m going to love to see you dismantle the logical fallacy argument from authority next time you doctor gives you advice on how to deal with cancer or anything similar (not really). You could save some emojis for that situation maybe?

We all use authoritated knowledge, or ‘expert opinion’ to understand complex situations. The question is understanding enough about them to understand when they are useful. Like not when your pal tells you you can drink a bottle of port every day without consequences as long as you do pilates. Like yes when your aunties gut feeling tells her that she has a better understanding of how cancer cells operate than four different oncologists she’s been to. Like no when Jamie Carragher tells you that All United really need to become champions league winner material is a good slogging in the dressing room and listening to the oldtimers who has been there done that. Like yes, when ten coaches with something like 10.000 games worth of exoerience in professional elite football says one thing and an anonymous dude on the internet says no because he’s got the deep analysis and them coaches haven’t learned to look beyond the key passes stats on FbRef.

I’m her for good arguments, but your expert opinion seays me as little as your handle on logic and epistemology.

Grande said:

I’m going to love to see you dismantle the logical fallacy argument from authority next time you doctor gives you advice on how to deal with cancer or anything similar (not really). You could save some emojis for that situation maybe?

We all use authoritated knowledge, or ‘expert opinion’ to understand complex situations. The question is understanding enough about them to understand when they are useful. Like not when your pal tells you you can drink a bottle of port every day without consequences as long as you do pilates. Like yes when your aunties gut feeling tells her that she has a better understanding of how cancer cells operate than four different oncologists she’s been to. Like no when Jamie Carragher tells you that All United really need to become champions league winner material is a good slogging in the dressing room and listening to the oldtimers who has been there done that. Like yes, when ten coaches with something like 10.000 games worth of exoerience in professional elite football says one thing and an anonymous dude on the internet says no because he’s got the deep analysis and them coaches haven’t learned to look beyond the key passes stats on FbRef.

I’m her for good arguments, but your expert opinion seays me as little as your handle on logic and epistemology.

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If you're here for good arguments then stop posting because you're bringing the level down. I am a medical doctor myself so your first sentence is meaningless. Like how you mention ten coaches with 10,000 games worth but then (rightly)dismiss the expertise of carragher who has more experience in professional elite football than this whole forum combined. Keep sticking to the expert opinion of Ole, ETH and whoever else is part of the 10 coaches you claim oh wait you didn't just say that, you said

[QUOTE I am willing to bet you (not really, I don’t bet online) that until he physically declines, Bruno will be in the starting eleven of every club or country in the world, under every coach in the world. [/QUOTE]

and that's why you don't do drugs kids.

Grande said:

Predicting injuries is a very simple matter, even laymen can do it quite precisely. You just read the results from the Hindsight test and backdate the diagnosis into the prognosis box innthe medical journal.

Re Bruno, I agree with your verdict he is a qualitatively weak defender, apart from that I think you underestimate his contribution, even defensively, and even the inportance of the quantitative aspects of his game. His most striking pro’s are not only striking, they are quite extreme in world football. Some of his critics claim that people are fooled by superficial statistical hang ups or unsophisticated ideas about workrate, but are not subtle nor analytical enough to see the real picture. I think it’s worth noting in that regard how many different highly qualified football coaches and experienced players who do not at all share that assessment. Practically every coach he has played under have gone to lengtha to accomodate him in the team, often ahead of very talented players. I’m pretty sure most of them see the issues you and I notice, and have an even better understanding of how it affects the team performance, good and bad. I am willing to bet you (not really, I don’t bet online) that until he physically declines, Bruno will be in the starting eleven of every club or country in the world, under every coach in the world.

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I would be willing to take that bet as long as ETH is not the coach next season.

Anyway, my "problem" with Bruno is he forces the team to play in certain way. We did this last season (with reasonable success, although you have to wonder about how much Rashford form impacted this) and almost every previous season (with less success). This season eth has been trying to change the setup, and Bruno's role - and failed miserably. I am not saying it's Bruno's fault, but I am yet to see any evidence that makes an argument that you can play anything else than 4231 (with two players screening Bruno and taking care of the buildup) with Fernandes starting.

And long story short, with Mainoo emergence, I don't think we should be going for this setup. And if we are going for something more sophisticated, Mount is a good alternative to what Bruno offers.

MM injuries are a different story and not something I am interested to discuss because who the feck knows.