Television Breaking Bad

[Buchan]

Yet to come.

Cool.

On the topic of The Wire v The Sopranos v Breaking Bad, it's The Wire all day long for me. I've watched it in its entirety three times now and it never gets dull. Breaking Bad is a great effort and an engaging watch, but for me, the array of unlikable characters makes it infuriating at times. Skylar is really beginning to grate me and I find her incredibly insufferable.

I know the premise of the show is all about displaying the complex character transformations, but every single main character (bar Walt in my view, but others have told me they dislike him at times too) has been wholly unlikable at various stages of the show and to me that takes away from the enjoyment of the show slightly.

 

[VeevaVee]

That fly episode has to be the most frustrating thing to watch ever. So glad its over.

 

[JohnLocke]

That fly episode has to be the most frustrating thing to watch ever. So glad its over.

Yeah I didn't like it at all. I think it's supposed to serve as a metaphor or some shit.

 

[Buchan]

Yeah I didn't like it at all. I think it's supposed to serve as a metaphor or some shit.

No.

Just shit.

 

[MikeUpNorth]

That fly episode has to be the most frustrating thing to watch ever. So glad its over.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottle_episode

 

[VeevaVee]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottle_episode

Yeah, certainly seems to be one of those (edit: just read the bottom where the creator admits it is). I can see how it would accentuate the more dramatic episodes like it says, although it didn't have to be quite as annoying as chasing a fly round for 45 minutes.

Just seen the second to last episode of the series (3) though

 

[MikeUpNorth]

Yeah, certainly seems to be one of those. I can see how it would accentuate the more dramatic episodes like it says, although it didn't have to be quite as annoying as chasing a fly round for 45 minutes.

It is a bottle episode - the wiki quotes Vince Gilligan. They're done because of budget constraints.

 

[VeevaVee]

It is a bottle episode - the wiki quotes Vince Gilligan. They're done because of budget constraints.

Yeah just edited my post after I read that.
They could've thought of something more interesting couldn't they? Even just getting locked in there together and having a heart to heart would have been better than the fly thing.

 

[crappycraperson]

I thought the fly episode was great. Showed the strength of the show, that they could make something like that work

 

[MikeUpNorth]

Yeah, I liked the fly episode.

 

[Eboue]

The fly episode was alright but as bottle episodes go, it wasn't even as close to as good as Pine Barrens.

 

[crappycraperson]

Pine Barrens was not a bottle episode at all

Comparison to Pine Barrens would be 4 days out. Hard to choose between those two.

 

[MikeUpNorth]

The fly episode was alright but as bottle episodes go, it wasn't even as close to as good as Pine Barrens.

Pine Barrens is the opposite of bottle episode surely?

 

[jem]

Pine Barrens is the opposite of bottle episode surely?

Pine Barrens is one of the greatest episodes of any TV show ever. Directed by my favourite actor, Steve Buscemi.

 

[Eboue]

My understanding of a bottle episode was that it was mostly set in a single location without much impact on the main plot. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Pine Barrens fits that.

 

[Drainy]

Yeah just edited my post after I read that.
They could've thought of something more interesting couldn't they? Even just getting locked in there together and having a heart to heart would have been better than the fly thing.

the point of the fly was to show that Walt has gone completely nuts and at the same time forces them to do something together that isn't autopiloting through cooking meth. If I remember the point at which the episode happened was just after Hank kicked the shit out of Jesse and the relationship between them was extremely fractured.

It did set up that compelling and sad part where Walt is holding the ladder after being drugged and they talk about what happened with Jane and her dad. It was important to show that while he does these horrific things, he isn't without any remorse for it (at least at that point).

Obviously they needed the heart to heart, you'll see why later in the season if you haven't already.

 

[VeevaVee]

the point of the fly was to show that Walt has gone completely nuts and at the same time forces them to do something together that isn't autopiloting through cooking meth. If I remember the point at which the episode happened was just after Hank kicked the shit out of Jesse and the relationship between them was extremely fractured.

It did set up that compelling and sad part where Walt is holding the ladder after being drugged and they talk about what happened with Jane and her dad. It was important to show that while he does these horrific things, he isn't without any remorse for it (at least at that point).

Obviously they needed the heart to heart, you'll see why later in the season if you haven't already.

Don't get me wrong, I see the point in the episode and see how a quiet one can accentuate the bigger ones, even if its done mainly for budget reasons. But it was frustrating to watch him chase a fly around, whether it was to demonstrate something or not.

Also, someone mentioned how pretty much all the characters are unlikeable at some point. Definitely agree with that. It certainly adds interesting character development and keeps it fresh in its own way.

Spoiler

So far where I'm up to in season 4, we've had Jesse go off the rails twice. This side of the story I can only assume is to show the drug user side of things rather than the manufacture/dealing side. He's a right bellend at the moment. Skyler is obviously a massive bitch but is alright in this part. Hanks being a cnut which is a huge change, his wifes a weird cnut but you kind of feel sorry for her. And everyone else is shady anyway. Although I quite like Saul for some reason. And enjoy Gus' and what's his face, the PI/hitman/cleaner upper fella's characters.

 

[Buchan]

Also, someone mentioned how pretty much all the characters are unlikeable at some point. Definitely agree with that. It certainly adds interesting character development and keeps it fresh in its own way.

Spoiler

So far where I'm up to in season 4, we've had Jesse go off the rails twice. This side of the story I can only assume is to show the drug user side of things rather than the manufacture/dealing side. He's a right bellend at the moment. Skyler is obviously a massive bitch but is alright in this part. Hanks being a cnut which is a huge change, his wifes a weird cnut but you kind of feel sorry for her. And everyone else is shady anyway. Although I quite like Saul for some reason. And enjoy Gus' and what's his face, the PI/hitman/cleaner upper fella's characters.

That would have been me, Vee. From reading your spoilered post, it seems I am just a couple of episodes ahead of you in the series so everything you've said is still fresh in my mind. I agree with you regarding all of your character evaluations:

Spoiler

• Skyler is actually coming across as being decent enough in the middle-to-latter end of the fourth series, but I still don't particularly like her.

• Jesse was becoming increasingly annoying with his drug use but he seems to have got back on track again.

• Walt is still my favourite character in the show but his ego started to get the better of him when Hank was crediting Gale as being a "genius". Obviously, Walt couldn't let that slide by without explicitly saying that Gale was just a copycat chemist. Giving your DEA megamind of a brother-in-law that lead when you're the man he's supposed to be hunting? Ridiculous.

I quite like Saul and Hank actually, and have found myself rooting for them throughout the series. Funnily enough, I detested Hank in the opening four or five episodes and wished he'd just piss off, but I really enjoy his character now and find it enthralling how good he is at his job.

 

[crappycraperson]

My understanding of a bottle episode was that it was mostly set in a single location without much impact on the main plot. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Pine Barrens fits that.

Bottle episodes are done to save cost so that more money can be used for other episodes.

 

[Snow]

God damn that opening of episode 7. Cranston just owned TV right there.

 

[Buchan]

God damn that opening of episode 7. Cranston just owned TV right there.

Season 1?

 

[kietotheworld]

Say My Name.

 

[VeevaVee]

That would have been me, Vee. From reading your spoilered post, it seems I am just a couple of episodes ahead of you in the series so everything you've said is still fresh in my mind. I agree with you regarding all of your character evaluations:

Spoiler

• Skyler is actually coming across as being decent enough in the middle-to-latter end of the fourth series, but I still don't particularly like her.

• Jesse was becoming increasingly annoying with his drug use but he seems to have got back on track again.

• Walt is still my favourite character in the show but his ego started to get the better of him when Hank was crediting Gale as being a "genius". Obviously, Walt couldn't let that slide by without explicitly saying that Gale was just a copycat chemist. Giving your DEA megamind of a brother-in-law that lead when you're the man he's supposed to be hunting? Ridiculous.

I quite like Saul and Hank actually, and have found myself rooting for them throughout the series. Funnily enough, I detested Hank in the opening four or five episodes and wished he'd just piss off, but I really enjoy his character now and find it enthralling how good he is at his job.

Spoiler

Yeah it was definitely a mistake when Walt said that to Hank, but he was obviously a bit pissed plus wants to take credit for the only successful thing he's done.

I'm flying through the episodes. Up to episode 8 of season 4 now. Heard good things about the ending to this season.

When does season 5 conclude?

 

[VeevaVee]

So I'm onto season 5. Is episode 7 up to date?
This the last series I take it?

 

[Drainy]

8 is the last episode that was aired and yes

 

[Buchan]

So I'm onto season 5. Is episode 7 up to date?
This the last series I take it?

What did you think of the ending of season 4, mate?

I just finished it myself last night.

 

[VeevaVee]

What did you think of the ending of season 4, mate?

I just finished it myself last night.

Wasn't bad. Felt a tiny bit flat but I think it was bound to.

 

[Wibble]

Flat? It was fecking brilliant. It would have been a great end to the whole thing.

 

[Mockney]

Yeah the 4 finale is probably one of the greatest season finale's in TV history and the best of the show by far IMO.

 

[VeevaVee]

Flat? It was fecking brilliant. It would have been a great end to the whole thing.

I dunno, I loved the build up but when it actually happened I felt like it wasn't dramatic enough. Maybe I was just tired.

 

[Wibble]

Try it again because I think it summed his journey from mild mannered school teach to drug lord up perfectly. I was blown away.

 

[Revan]

Yeah the 4 finale is probably one of the greatest season finale's in TV history and the best of the show by far IMO.

It was brilliant, no doubt about it. Anyway I liked how season 3 ended too, equally brilliant for me.

 

[The Red Baron!!!]

Spoiler

 

[Zebs]

 

[VeevaVee]

Try it again because I think it summed his journey from mild mannered school teach to drug lord up perfectly. I was blown away.

Yeah I definitely see that. Specially with the way he was talking to Skyler after it too. Thinking about it the end of season 3 hit me harder and seemed to really show the journey he's made more to me.

Spoiler

 

[Wibble]

Season 3 ended well but 4 was far better IMO but of course such things are a matter of opinion and not fact. I just hope the the end of series 5 is as good as the series deserves.

 

[jem]

Yeah the 4 finale is probably one of the greatest season finale's in TV history and the best of the show by far IMO.

Got me thinking about other great season finale:

Season 1 of Sopranos "I Dream of Jeannie Cusamano": For me, this is the finale against which all others must be measured. It's absolutely immense (I won't go into details in case any on here haven't seen it.)

Season 2 of Sopranos "Funhouse": Another incredible finale (and again, I'll stay mum on the details."

Season 4 of Sopranos "Whitecaps": Edie Falco and James Gandolfini unleashing...

*

Season 4 of The Wire: The final episode of what is, in my opinion, the greatest season of television ever. You feel exhausted by the end.

Season 4 of Dexter: So good and so shocking that you could make a case that the show hasn't been able to recover from it.


* I think it's worth mentioning with regard to The Sopranos (at least in the first several seasons,) that the penultimate episodes were also pretty incredible. Season 1 ("Isabella") with the hallucinations, Season 2 (Knight in White Satin Armor") with the resolution of Richie and Janice's relation, Season 3 (Amour Fou) with Tony's fecked up affair and Jackie's misguided attempt to make a statement, Season 5 (Long Term Parking) featuring arguably the most gutting moment in the whole series - all examples of television at its very best.

 

[KingEric7]

Got me thinking about other great season finale:

Season 1 of Sopranos "I Dream of Jeannie Cusamano": For me, this is the finale against which all others must be measured. It's absolutely immense (I won't go into details in case any on here haven't seen it.)

Season 2 of Sopranos "Funhouse": Another incredible finale (and again, I'll stay mum on the details."

Season 4 of Sopranos "Whitecaps": Edie Falco and James Gandolfini unleashing...

*

Season 4 of The Wire: The final episode of what is, in my opinion, the greatest season of television ever. You feel exhausted by the end.

Season 4 of Dexter: So good and so shocking that you could make a case that the show hasn't been able to recover from it.


* I think it's worth mentioning with regard to The Sopranos (at least in the first several seasons,) that the penultimate episodes were also pretty incredible. Season 1 ("Isabella") with the hallucinations, Season 2 (Knight in White Satin Armor") with the resolution of Richie and Janice's relation, Season 3 (Amour Fou) with Tony's fecked up affair and Jackie's misguided attempt to make a statement, Season 5 (Long Term Parking) featuring arguably the most gutting moment in the whole series - all examples of television at its very best.

Spoiler

You mean Adriana's death, yeah? That was fecked up!

 

[jem]

Spoiler

You mean Adriana's death, yeah? That was fecked up!

Yeah, that's the one.

 

[Mockney]

Season 2 of The West Wing - Two Cathedrals - is one of the best.