Chelsea 2017/18 thread - FA Cup Champs, League chumps

[kouroux]

Allegri training method caused plenty of muscle injuries. Both Morata and Pogba were there with Allegri at Juventus. Just wanna take a dig at Juve since I am bored with international break.

In that case, feck them alright. They're a bit boring to watch tbh.

 

[Don _ Conte]

Really confused by the amount of time Morata is supposed to be out for :/

Hopefully its only 2-3 weeks.

 

[Theonas]

I don't understand how Conte hasn't gotten way more stick in the media for having such incredibly negative tactics in a home game.

He played most of it without a striker for feck sake.

Martin Samuel wrote a good piece that criticized Chelsea's approach. Although it was more within the lines of "City can do this to even the champions" than a straight out dig at Conte. I suppose the reason for that is Conte doesn't have a reputation for doing that like Mourinho which means he gets the benefit of the doubt for now at least.

 

[Don _ Conte]

Martin Samuel wrote a good piece that criticized Chelsea's approach. Although it was more within the lines of "City can do this to even the champions" than a straight out dig at Conte. I suppose the reason for that is Conte doesn't have a reputation for doing that like Mourinho which means he gets the benefit of the doubt for now at least.

There was a lot of criticism from the Chelsea fan base for it.

However due to the job he's done so far and the fact he doesn't often tend to get it wrong approach wise and tactically I think we are willing to cut him some slack.

 

[Bepi]

Why blame Conte? He spoke clearly all the Summer: his squad is thin, oppos are deeper and coming hungrier. Weren't you all predicting the CL would take its toll on Chelsea this year? Here you go. Where is Conte's fault?

 

[Theonas]

There was a lot of criticism from the Chelsea fan base for it.

However due to the job he's done so far and the fact he doesn't often tend to get it wrong approach wise and tactically I think we are willing to cut him some slack.

It's a strange one with Conte as it's difficult to define just what his vision is the way Pep or Mourinho are. I think the only manager in the league who builds a team in a way that can confidently go toe to toe with Pep is Pochettino. By that I mean, come match day, it is actually a legitimate strategy for them to go out and play. The rest either want to be able to do that but have little to show for it (Klopp and Wenger) or don't even try to build a team that can do that which leaves them with only one viable strategy come match day (Mourinho). Conte is a bit in between for me. I guess we just haven't seen enough of him to judge yet.

 

[The Outsider]

We had a problem against City they were a stronger team than us. Walker has certainly added a new dimension at RWB.

We had Luiz suspended, Drinkwater still injured, Hazard just getting back to fitness and then Morata gets injured.

The match that annoyed me was against Arsenal and playing Fabregas in a two man midfield which I think was over-confidence.

Still after 7 matches we have played already 3 of the top 6.

Also a strange start to the season as Bakayoko was injured, Drinkwater still is injured and Hazard was injured yet we have done ok, I see us getting stronger as the new players bed in.

 

[RooneyLegend]

The changes that Pep made for that game worked a charm against Chelsea and Conte didn't know how to react once his plan A fell apart. He's more a manager of consistency rather than a good reactive one. The diamond in midfield had Chelsea chasing shadows with them not really aware of how they are going to match up to them especially as the front three pinned the defenders back and made them afraid of pushing up. The ball to Silva was always available and the rotations between him and KDB were quality. Add Fabregas who doesn't count as a number in midfield it became a disaster for Chelsea. With the many changes that Pep made it was almost impossible for them to plan for it from the outset.

I was really impressed by Chelsea's defence though, they really kept putting fires out before they could develop. The young kid in the middle of the three did really well as did the others. Despite being heavily outplayed City weren't exactly creating chances at will.

 

[AshfordLad]

The changes that Pep made for that game worked a charm against Chelsea and Conte didn't know how to react once his plan A fell apart. He's more a manager of consistency rather than a good reactive one. The diamond in midfield had Chelsea chasing shadows with them not really aware of how they are going to match up to them especially as the front three pinned the defenders back and made them afraid of pushing up. The ball to Silva was always available and the rotations between him and KDB were quality. Add Fabregas who doesn't count as a number in midfield it became a disaster for Chelsea. With the many changes that Pep made it was almost impossible for them to plan for it from the outset.

I was really impressed by Chelsea's defence though, they really kept putting fires out before they could develop. The young kid in the middle of the three did really well as did the others. Despite being heavily outplayed City weren't exactly creating chances at will.

I think Conte is able to adapt his game plan well enough given the players are available. The problem this time was that he did not have the players to change the tactic mid game.

That said, I think he got his tactics wrong at the start by a mile this game. A 3-4-3 would have been a lot better at exploiting City's defensive weakness.

 

[breakout67]

People are really criticizing the manager in a game where he lost his main Striker to an injury early on in the game; and his back-up was fecking Batshuayi. Conte did exactly what any classical manager would do, shut up shop and hope to nick a goal.

The game was even until Morata came off, and city dominated the second half because Chelsea had no out ball. A poacher like Batshuayi is useless against a Guardiola side; you need a strong and dynamic striker like Costa or Morata to exploit the high line of this City team and resist the press of the midfielders.

 

[acnumber9]

I think Conte is able to adapt his game plan well enough given the players are available. The problem this time was that he did not have the players to change the tactic mid game.

That said, I think he got his tactics wrong at the start by a mile this game. A 3-4-3 would have been a lot better at exploiting City's defensive weakness.

Conte regularly struggles to change things mid game. At Old Trafford he stood on the sideline scratching his head with not a clue what to do and the cup final was the same. If Chelsea don't score first his tactics become somewhat limited.

 

[el3mel]

Conte regularly struggles to change things mid game. At Old Trafford he stood on the sideline scratching his head with not a clue what to do and the cup final was the same. If Chelsea don't score first his tactics become somewhat limited.

There's nothing he could have done in this Old Trafford game. The only solution he had was to put Fabregas and he did it.

Problem with current Chelsea squad is it doesn't offer any tactical solutions for the manager in tricky situation. If his attack is failing he'll have Fabre, Willian and Batshuayi as attacking options, pretty poor tbh.

I can't evaluate Conte's ability to change things mid games until he gets better bench with different attacking options.

 

[RooneyLegend]

I think Conte is able to adapt his game plan well enough given the players are available. The problem this time was that he did not have the players to change the tactic mid game.

That said, I think he got his tactics wrong at the start by a mile this game. A 3-4-3 would have been a lot better at exploiting City's defensive weakness.

Looking at how they got tortured in midfield i don't think reducing the players in that department would've helped much.

 

[RooneyLegend]

People are really criticizing the manager in a game where he lost his main Striker to an injury early on in the game; and his back-up was fecking Batshuayi. Conte did exactly what any classical manager would do, shut up shop and hope to nick a goal.

The game was even until Morata came off, and city dominated the second half because Chelsea had no out ball. A poacher like Batshuayi is useless against a Guardiola side; you need a strong and dynamic striker like Costa or Morata to exploit the high line of this City team and resist the press of the midfielders.

The match was never equal really, even when Morata was on. It became clear from the onset that no pressure was to be applied by Chelsea which is suicidal vs a Pep team which hopefully now Mou knows or we're going to run into the same issues.

 

[RonW]

We had a problem against City they were a stronger team than us. Walker has certainly added a new dimension at RWB.

We had Luiz suspended, Drinkwater still injured, Hazard just getting back to fitness and then Morata gets injured.

The match that annoyed me was against Arsenal and playing Fabregas in a two man midfield which I think was over-confidence.

Still after 7 matches we have played already 3 of the top 6.

Also a strange start to the season as Bakayoko was injured, Drinkwater still is injured and Hazard was injured yet we have done ok, I see us getting stronger as the new players bed in.

I think Chelsea couldn't keep up with a high tempo or close City down because they played Atletico on the wednesday and City had a additional day rest. Also, I think the fact that Chelsea has to play 2 games every week now is finally catching up because last season they had it easy with only being able to prepare for 1 game every week.

 

[ValenciasDrilledCrosses]

The Morata injury is a worry, but I still expect Chelsea to find the goals from elsewhere while he's out. They're still comfortably a top 3 team in the league for me. City played them to perfection on Saturday though, completely exposed Kante's lack of ability in tight spaces with their press

 

[AshfordLad]

Conte regularly struggles to change things mid game. At Old Trafford he stood on the sideline scratching his head with not a clue what to do and the cup final was the same. If Chelsea don't score first his tactics become somewhat limited.

You need to correct your definition of "regularly" then.

 

[AshfordLad]

Looking at how they got tortured in midfield i don't think reducing the players in that department would've helped much.

Fabregas was pretty much non existent anyway. Those two extra wide men upfront could / would have helped peg City's fullbacks in their own half.

Would still have probably gotten beat but wouldn't have been as spineless as this. This was the sort of performance (and loss) that saps the confidence right out of a team.

 

[Prometheus]

Does anyone else think if Luiz wasn't suspended, we could have played him in midfield instead of Fabregas and the game would have been better against City?

 

[Don _ Conte]

Does anyone else think if Luiz wasn't suspended, we could have played him in midfield instead of Fabregas and the game would have been better against City?

Good shout, Fab is non existent in fast paced games, if he plays in the 3 with Kante & Baka he needs to be the most advanced.

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

The changes that Pep made for that game worked a charm against Chelsea and Conte didn't know how to react once his plan A fell apart. He's more a manager of consistency rather than a good reactive one. The diamond in midfield had Chelsea chasing shadows with them not really aware of how they are going to match up to them especially as the front three pinned the defenders back and made them afraid of pushing up. The ball to Silva was always available and the rotations between him and KDB were quality. Add Fabregas who doesn't count as a number in midfield it became a disaster for Chelsea. With the many changes that Pep made it was almost impossible for them to plan for it from the outset.

I was really impressed by Chelsea's defence though, they really kept putting fires out before they could develop. The young kid in the middle of the three did really well as did the others. Despite being heavily outplayed City weren't exactly creating chances at will.

Jepp it was a smart move from Guardiola. Chelsea had 3 man in central midfield and he did counter by having 4 against them and Citys winger did push up high forcing the wingbacks in Chelsea to drop really deep. Peps 3-6-1 formation proved really effective for that game. Wonder if he would have played like that with Aguero though.

 

[The Outsider]

I think Chelsea couldn't keep up with a high tempo or close City down because they played Atletico on the wednesday and City had a additional day rest. Also, I think the fact that Chelsea has to play 2 games every week now is finally catching up because last season they had it easy with only being able to prepare for 1 game every week.

Ron that is undoubtedly a factor and it will be interesting to see how Conte handles this with the smaller squad than Utd or City.

 

[acnumber9]

You need to correct your definition of "regularly" then.

Yeah that sentence probably wasn't worded correctly. I just think Conte has suffered quite a bit with not knowing what do when defending deep and countering is no longer an option. And he looked completely clueless in those games.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Fabregas was pretty much non existent anyway. Those two extra wide men upfront could / would have helped peg City's fullbacks in their own half.

Would still have probably gotten beat but wouldn't have been as spineless as this. This was the sort of performance (and loss) that saps the confidence right out of a team.

City didn't really play with fullbacks though, Delph was in a midfield 4 while Walker was in a back three.

 

[The Outsider]

Does anyone else think if Luiz wasn't suspended, we could have played him in midfield instead of Fabregas and the game would have been better against City?

With Luiz, Kante and Bakayoko I think Chelsea would have won. Small margins for me yet that is the way it is.

 

[AshfordLad]

City didn't really play with fullbacks though, Delph was in a midfield 4 while Walker was in a back three.

I am referring to the city team sheet. They were marked as fullbacks on it and would have been kept there if Chelsea had two wide forwards threatening those areas.

 

[AshfordLad]

Yeah that sentence probably wasn't worded correctly. I just think Conte has suffered quite a bit with not knowing what do when defending deep and countering is no longer an option. And he looked completely clueless in those games.

Both those games had serious injury issues. Also they were just two games. I have seen Conte change formations mid-game about 5-10 time to get a better result on most attempts so this plan B argument does not stack up.

 

[acnumber9]

Both those games had serious injury issues. Also they were just two games. I have seen Conte change formations mid-game about 5-10 time to get a better result on most attempts so this plan B argument does not stack up.

That's your opinion. Those are two games I watched and he hadn't a clue what to do. Against top opposition last season how many times did Chelsea recover after going behind?

 

[Prometheus]

Against top opposition last season how many times did Chelsea recover after going behind?

Won from behind against both City away and Spurs away?

 

[AshfordLad]

That's your opinion. Those are two games I watched and he hadn't a clue what to do. Against top opposition last season how many times did Chelsea recover after going behind?

Went behind 6 times while playing against top 6 and improved that position in 4 of the games by the end (while winning 2 of those games). Even last week against Atletico a change of tactic from 3-5-2 to 3-1-4-2 resulted in a turn around. It seems like you have formed an opinion on limited number of games you watched/remembered.

 

[acnumber9]

Went behind 6 times while playing against top 6 and improved that position in 4 of the games by the end (while winning 2 of those games). Even last week against Atletico a change of tactic from 3-5-2 to 3-1-4-2 resulted in a turn around. It seems like you have formed an opinion on limited number of games you watched/remembered.

Perhaps. We can add a third on Saturday too.

 

[roonster09]

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[el3mel]

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Ouch.

That's a massive blow for Chelsea. I hope he becomes okay.

 

[VorZakone]

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Ouch, that's gonna hurt Chelsea.

 

[CechMate1]

This is the problem with International football, sometimes your best players come back injured. Kante will be a huge loss for us. David Luiz to come into midfield with Christensen taking his place in the centre of the back three

 

[Don _ Conte]

Kante injury is unknown at the moment but they believe a few weeks. Please ignore that post above it is from a fake twitter account.

In regards to Morata its not as bad as first thought he will be rested against palace and there is a chance he plays against Roma.

Drinkwater is also fit and back in squad this weekend.

 

[roonster09]

Kante injury is unknown at the moment but they believe a few weeks. Please ignore that post above it is from a fake twitter account.

In regards to Morata its not as bad as first thought he will be rested against palace and there is a chance he plays against Roma.

Drinkwater is also fit and back in squad this weekend.

Yeah looking back that was from fake account. The real account posted that he might be back for Roma game.

 

[The Outsider]

Kante injury is unknown at the moment but they believe a few weeks. Please ignore that post above it is from a fake twitter account.

In regards to Morata its not as bad as first thought he will be rested against palace and there is a chance he plays against Roma.

Drinkwater is also fit and back in squad this weekend.

it's about time Drinkwater made an appearance if only from the bench.

 

[Don _ Conte]

Palace lineup with rotation should really be;

Tibo
Azpi - Luiz - Cahill
Zappa - Baka - Drinkwater - Fab - Alonso
Hazard - Batshuayi

 

[Gasolin]

Injury + champions league is going to test Chelsea's depth of the squad.