Club Sale | It’s done!

Status
Not open for further replies.
You said there are precedents, but there hasn't been one like this where the same entity owned two big clubs. I looked at the clubs under the City Group and none of them are big, with New York FC probably the biggest.

Even if there aren't any legal standpoints to block the takeover, whose to say whether it could come back to bite us in the arse in the future.

from a legal standpoint the size of the club is not relevant.
 
In a footballing perspective Paris has hardly been a powerhouse city. Yes PSG have had some stars prior to the Qatari takeover, but compared to the other major cities in Europe its hardly a massive footballing legacy compared to the clubs you'd think in Milan, Madrid, London, Manchester, etc. Only other major city I can think of that's also been lacking in footballing prowess is Berlin.

The french authorities do not give a damn about PSG, the city of Paris barely care about PSG to the point where it's been a constant battle between QSI and the city of Paris to get anything regarding the Parc des Princes. The city of Paris don't need, has never needed and will never need PSG when it comes to its image, in fact historically the opposite is true with the city of Paris not liking the fact that PSG used its name and symbols while not actually being a club from the 75(Paris) but from Saint-Germain-en-Laye and has used the fame of Paris to its advantage.

Also Ligue 1 isn't dead or at least no more than it was in before 2012.
 
No shit, the French league is about as exciting as my cat's litter tray.

The hilarious thing in all this is I bet the French authorities were delighted with the Qatari takeover of PSG and all the stardom its brought to their capital, not realising its led to the essential death of their league.

I'm sure the league was alive and kicking when Lyon won 7 in a row back in the day
 
I'm not a fan of Qatari ownership and personally believe that state backing is the complete death of football (see: City), but I'm at least getting a bit of entertainment out of the panic that us being potentially acquired is causing. The sheer fecking hypocrisy of some of these people.

A part of me wants to see it happen just to prove the point of how utterly unbalanced this kind of thing is for the game. It doesn't level the playing field, it doesn't make things more competitive, and it certainly doesn't help the football pyramid.
 
That could be the same with any team. We’re only 7 points above 5th!
Girona are 11th. They could easily get EL football next year. There you go. Same competition as City since 3rd in your group gets you EL football. You can’t own two teams that play in either competition thanks to that.
UEFA can’t step in because we aren’t in the same competition when the the takeover happens. They never ruled on Ref Bull until they both qualified for the same competition. That wasn’t judged by what ifs or odds of something happening, they waited until it happened. Both clubs had been well taken over by that stage
Right but they should learn from previous errors and take steps to mitigate them going forward at least.

It's a bit like the Glazer situation when they bought us - a proper body should look at that and make legislation against aggressively leveraged deals. Ultimately the integrity of the sport is in the drain if they continually allow unethical and unfair things to happen. Having the same rich state own two big clubs just magnifies the lack of integrity that was shown at the Red Bull level (PSG being big in the modern standpoint from the attrition of all the Qatar investment).
 
Right but they should learn from previous errors and take steps to mitigate them going forward at least.

It's a bit like the Glazer situation when they bought us - a proper body should look at that and make legislation against aggressively leveraged deals. Ultimately the integrity of the sport is in the drain if they continually allow unethical and unfair things to happen. Having the same rich state own two big clubs just magnifies the lack of integrity that was shown at the Red Bull level (PSG being big in the modern standpoint from the attrition of all the Qatar investment).

In this particular case what is the error to learn from? Do we have a single case of malpractice when it comes to clubs being owned by the same entity?
 
In this particular case what is the error to learn from? Do we have a single case of malpractice when it comes to clubs being owned by the same entity?
It's a conflict of interest and that damages the integrity of the sport.
 
Until they get drawn in the same CL group.
OTW_RBLFCS.jpg
 
I’m pleased to hear this. Whilst it won’t necessarily stop the Qatari takeover, it will add an important layer of scrutiny so they are jot simply waltzing in and riding roughshod over the rules. Hopefully we will find out more about who these ‘private individuals’ are and just how private they are too!

It is good.

A positive thing about middle eastern influences in english football would be if they would take notes from our part of the world when it comes to freedom of speech and human rights and change it to the better. Would be the best form of "sportwashing".
 
Right but they should learn from previous errors and take steps to mitigate them going forward at least.

It's a bit like the Glazer situation when they bought us - a proper body should look at that and make legislation against aggressively leveraged deals. Ultimately the integrity of the sport is in the drain if they continually allow unethical and unfair things to happen. Having the same rich state own two big clubs just magnifies the lack of integrity that was shown at the Red Bull level (PSG being big in the modern standpoint from the attrition of all the Qatar investment).
But they can’t adjust rules just to get the result they want for this one case.
You can’t make it up as you go along.
Simple example is cups exist. You may think you have all angles covered as a EL team owner only to have your second club who isn’t a threat at all for Europe in the Championship go on a cup run and receive an EL spot.
They have warned Atalanta in the past to sell shares in another club (I forget who) if they wanted to compete in a competition both qualified for. UEFA simply doesn’t outright ban teams and clubs even if they fall fowl
 
How? What happened that supports that point?
I don't think I should be explaining how two clubs with one owner can open up conflict of interest and potential for anti-competive behaviour. Nothing needs to happen for them to act retrospectively. That would be too reactive.
My point is, having one state own two big European clubs is dicey, that is something that shouldn't really need explaining. Unless there is a deal or commitment we are unaware of whereby Qatar have promised to reduce their interest in PSG to a minority stake.

But they can’t adjust rules just to get the result they want for this one case.
You can’t make it up as you go along.
Simple example is cups exist. You may think you have all angles covered as a EL team owner only to have your second club who isn’t a threat at all for Europe in the Championship go on a cup run and receive an EL spot.
They have warned Atalanta in the past to sell shares in another club (I forget who) if they wanted to compete in a competition both qualified for. UEFA simply doesn’t outright ban teams and clubs even if they fall fowl
Generally it is normal to introduce legislation to adapt to the changing dynamics of the environment. That's how regulation tends to work everywhere.
I think the problem is UEFA is 1) Corrupt and 2) incompetent.

My views are just about integrity of the sport and why I personally don't enjoy the idea of one state owning two big clubs. It opens up all sorts of possibilities of anticompetitive behaviour and I don't think we should apply the premise of "it hasn't happened or been proven yet so lets crack on". This is aside from Manchester United, it's just my view on the football landscape.
 
Sounds like this 'letter' probably had a Paris postage stamp on it, doesn't it?

They're the ones to suffer the most if Qatar buys us. New shiny toy and all that.
 
There's a bunch of people who like to not be the silent majority. They have to voice their opinion so it's on record, then they can say 'we told you so' down the line if it goes to shit.

Yes.These pesky human rights companies who just want to run other people’s faces in if.
 
I’m pleased to hear this. Whilst it won’t necessarily stop the Qatari takeover, it will add an important layer of scrutiny so they are jot simply waltzing in and riding roughshod over the rules. Hopefully we will find out more about who these ‘private individuals’ are and just how private they are too!

Yeah much as I want the Qatari's to take over it's only right there is scrutiny. Whether we will actually get more information who these private individuals are though remains to be seen.
 
Not a single mention of this when Ratcliffe was buying us while owning Nice, we could easily meet in the Europa league. The size of clubs should have nothing to do with it.
 
Sounds like this 'letter' probably had a Paris postage stamp on it, doesn't it?

They're the ones to suffer the most if Qatar buys us. New shiny toy and all that.

No. It has a stamp from a human rights charity on. The most likely to suffer are the vulnerable people in Qatar.
 
Sounds like this 'letter' probably had a Paris postage stamp on it, doesn't it?

They're the ones to suffer the most if Qatar buys us. New shiny toy and all that.

Oh they are definitely worried about being pushed to the side there is no doubt about that
 
The UEFA has no legimate reasons to stop it, there are too many precedents. There are clubs that owns other clubs, Monaco and Cercle Bruge being an example. Also Ineos already owns 2 clubs and people aren't as vocal about preventing them or Ratcliffe to purchase United. Also City owners own I don't know many clubs across Europe.
what other club does Ratcliffe own besides Nice
 
I don't think I should be explaining how two clubs with one owner can open up conflict of interest and potential for anti-competive behaviour. Nothing needs to happen for them to act retrospectively. That would be too reactive.
My point is, having one state own two big European clubs is dicey, that is something that shouldn't really need explaining. Unless there is a deal or commitment we are unaware of whereby Qatar have promised to reduce their interest in PSG to a minority stake.

No but you have to explain how that fits with the part that I quoted in your initial post which is that they need to learn from their errors, what error are we talking about, has something actually happened? And I should add that two clubs with two owners that know each others can open up conflict of interest and potentional for anti-competitive behaviours. Two clubs with the same sponsors can open conflict of interest and potential for anti-competitive behaviours. Two clubs with the same lender can open up conflict of interest and potential for anti-competitive behaviours.

If we follow the logic of not only suspecting but preemptively punishing anti-competitive behaviours then what do we do about lenders and sponsors?
 
No. It has a stamp from a human rights charity on. The most likely to suffer are the vulnerable people in Qatar.
Ah yes, because a football club located in Manchester is responsible for the people of Qatar.
 
No. It has a stamp from a human rights charity on. The most likely to suffer are the vulnerable people in Qatar.
They want to "ensure integrity across competitions", how does that effect vulnerable people in Qatar :lol:

It's nothing to do with saving people. Purely trying to make sure PSG are the only golden child.
 
They want to "ensure integrity across competitions", how does that effect vulnerable people in Qatar :lol:

It's nothing to do with saving people. Purely trying to make sure PSG are the only golden child.

So you think a non profit organisation dedicated to helping protect vulnerable people are secretly trying to help PSG?

Fair enough, not much I’m going to say that will change your mind.
 
So you think a non profit organisation dedicated to helping protect vulnerable people are secretly trying to help PSG?

Fair enough, not much I’m going to say that will change your mind.
I'm literally reading the tweet and their reasonings.

If they said "We don't want Qatar being owners of United because of poor human rights" then fair enough.

They're complaining about it making football unfair :wenger: since when has being fair ever been an issue? and why now because it's us? read between the lines.
 
No but you have to explain how that fits with the part that I quoted in your initial post which is that they need to learn from their errors, what error are we talking about, has something actually happened? And I should add that two clubs with two owners that know each others can open up conflict of interest and potentional for anti-competitive behaviours. Two clubs with the same sponsors can open conflict of interest and potential for anti-competitive behaviours. Two clubs with the same lender can open up conflict of interest and potential for anti-competitive behaviours.

If we follow the logic of not only suspecting but preemptively punishing anti-competitive behaviours then what do we do about lenders and sponsors?
The error of allowing multiple clubs which risk playing in the same major competition to have the same owner. That is an error because it puts the integrity of the sport into question, and it's going to be under the microscope much more if it's done at scale (i.e. if Qatar sustains ownership of PSG and also Manchester United).

All of your examples are plausible but having the same owner for two clubs is taking that questionable integrity to an entirely new level, and an entirely new scale when its the clubs we are referring to. You're reverting to whataboutism which I do understand, the game is far from perfect, but it doesn't really vindicate any logic toward this monumental move being ethical.
 
The error of allowing multiple clubs which risk playing in the same major competition to have the same owner. That is an error because it puts the integrity of the sport into question, and it's going to be under the microscope much more if it's done at scale (i.e. if Qatar sustains ownership of PSG and also Manchester United).

All of your examples are plausible but having the same owner for two clubs is taking that questionable integrity to an entirely new level, and an entirely new scale when its the clubs we are referring to. You're reverting to whataboutism which I do understand, the game is far from perfect, but it doesn't really vindicate any logic toward this monumental move being ethical.

How was that an error? What has happened since that lead you to that conclusion?

And I'm not reverting to whataboutism, you talked about hypothetical integrity issues and I went with the same issue.
 
I'm literally reading the tweet and their reasonings.

If they said "We don't want Qatar being owners of United because of poor human rights" then fair enough.

They're complaining about it making football unfair :wenger: since when has being fair ever been an issue? and why now because it's us? read between the lines.
Do you see how mental your line of reasoning is? Because of your football club, you’re calling into question a London based human rights charity that has been campaigning on this very issue for years and suggesting they support PSG.

Does that not make you pause and question your own beliefs? If your line of reasoning is “maybe the human rights charities are secretly in cahoots with a Paris based football club” then reevaluate your thinking.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.