He‘s fine when he puts in the work. That‘s why he ‚isn‘t available for selection‘.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
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Bayern and Burnley.
If it was David Moyes, @pocco would falling over himself to celebrate these players as major losses.
Smells of agenda.
Said myself in recent weeks that I was once as blind/ stubborn in not seeing what is in front of me as posters are being now over ETH. Not just Moyes but Jose.
Like I said, I'm never going to go to lengths to make excuses or even get so attached to a manager until they genuinely have us challenging or I think their football will definitely have us challenging. It's just a fools game making excuses for our managers these days with everything they have at their disposal and the money they spend. There's no excuse for me.
Seems we revert to spamming long balls upfront ??? Tell me one match this season we truly "dominate" and the answer is nada. This is really worrying cause it seems we improve at nothing under him if anything we got worse compared to his first season (even then we were shaky as feck). Zero attacking movements and buildup, midfield that every team walked through easily like a turnstile, shitty pressing, shaky defense / GK and many other problems.
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Moyes and Mourinho were running the club into the ground. Ten Hag isn’t. In hindsight, I do think Moyes was dealt a really poor hand, in fairness.
At this point, Ten Hag in charge of a club that is going through a bad patch of form, but with a seriously hampered, injury-affected squad and some tumultuous issues off the pitch. These aren’t excuses, moreso objective analysis of where we are.
I don’t give a shit about going to lengths to make excuses. I have no attachment to Ten Hag. But as far as I’m concerned I think the club is more or less unmanageable and Ten Hag is just the next poor bastard in charge of making it work for a little while. I said that when he was appointed and I haven’t really changed my mind. All in all, I think he’s doing a reasonable job, and I’d like to think we’ll start playing a bit better when we have more players at our disposal.
If we don’t then I’ll express my concerns. But I’m not going to get upset because a team including the likes of Dalot, Lindelof, Evans, Reguilon, McTominay, Hannibal and Pellistri doesn’t win that many football matches.
He played 10 tonight no?
This is Man Utd, opposition should be irrelevant.
According to the ‘top’ reds, manager of the club has zero responsibility towards anything but should be worshipped like a demigod whenever he manages to win with the players he bought but the same players are irresponsible and lazy and should all be sold.
Ignored this place after the win last night....we did actually win didn't we? Feel like so many have already decided how they're going to react after the game, no matter the score.
As of today, I don't see much difference between Ole and ETH playing wise. It's about getting the result by any means necessary. Takes too long to make subs too
In which dimension does this logic apply ?
In which dimension does this logic apply ?The lack of subs is ridiculous though that much is clear, we did have options to try and regain some control. Happily watching us sit back inviting danger towards ends of games is bonkers, more needs to be done in that regard.
The basics still aren't there. The team is a mess and the recruitment is once again extremely poor.
Some may want to convince themselves we'll magically transform into an amazing team once everyone is fit (when does any team have everyone fit?) but it's not going to happen. All the warning signs are there. The same warning signs that have been there with all previous managers. We'll continue to tread water, barely beating teams like Luton, Burnley and Forest etc. (why wouldn't we, we've spent more on players than their clubs are worth combined) but we'll be no closer to the top teams.
Some will continue to make the same weak and predictable excuses to absolve him of any blame, but the fact of the matter is it's not close to good enough.
If Ten Hag were at a rival and they were performing the same way we are, and had spent £400m on the same players, this place would be United in mocking and laughing and calling him shite.
Some may want to convince themselves we'll magically transform into an amazing team once everyone is fit (when does any team have everyone fit?) but it's not going to happen. All the warning signs are there. The same warning signs that have been there with all previous managers. We'll continue to tread water, barely beating teams like Luton, Burnley and Forest etc. (why wouldn't we, we've spent more on players than their clubs are worth combined) but we'll be no closer to the top teams.
Some will continue to make the same weak and predictable excuses to absolve him of any blame, but the fact of the matter is it's not close to good enough.
If Ten Hag were at a rival and they were performing the same way we are, and had spent £400m on the same players, this place would be United in mocking and laughing and calling him shite.
That we have players happy to throw a manager under the bus if they're not getting their way?
I genuinely want to know who people want if they're happy to toss yet another manager on the scrap heap and keep seeing the same players survive yet again, to do it once again in a season or two.
So this team has the highest amount of turnovers and XG this season in the entire league and that’s what? Condensed into 20 minutes per game?
Must be a hell of a 20 minutes.
That poster just seems to wallow in misery and negativity. Definitely one best placed on the ignore list.
Aye, you can see that pressing shape and winning the ball back higher is starting to click and work more.
Once the chances being created start ending up in the back of the net, there will be a whole lot of confidence to be gained and the players will gamble more or getting forward as they know there's chances to be had.
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You are so energy sapping
So what is your plan then? Sack Ten Hag and bring in who?
We're slightly above league average for xG, I'm not sure where you got that we have the highest in the league, and our xG against is higher than our xG which does indicate that our performances haven't been very good over 90 minutes although having eyes also would have told you that. It's only 6 games though and we've had a tough fixture list to start with a lot of issues to deal with with injuries and off-the-field problems so there has to be some allowance given for the difficulties the team is having but there are also some concerns.
It is unreal to read through some of the last pages, especially the ones right after we won the game. Before the game people had moaned about the manager for his lineup as if it was not the consequence of a massive injury crisis. Then after the win, they moan about the manager for the performance as if they had not moaned about the lineup before. It is genuinely terrifying.
It's unreal that people aren't happy that we won the game due to a wonder goal but produced an otherwise rank performance against probably the most limited team in the league?
Some of our defending was alright but we really shouldn't be having to defend like that as often as we had to against Burnley. Even with the injuries I think it's more than acceptable for fans to expect a team filled with our back ups to have a bit more about them and for the team to look more composed, that we didnt definitely falls on the manager/coaching staff.
We are missing attacking players for whom we PAID £220 million, which does not mean that they are WORTH £220 million. We would be lucky to get half of that if we decide to sell them now. Leaving aside the issue that if you consider one of them attacking, he does not start in any sensible formation and is a backup for Bruno. We have 4 starting attacking players, 3 of whom (Rashford, Bruno, Højlund) started. And that if both Anthony and Sancho were available, only one of them would start.
If you want to be consistent then you should also be complaining about our “£80m defender not playing” but you of course won’t since you understand how ridiculous it would have sounded. But it is the same as comparing about “£220m of attacking players” missing.
To control the game and pass around like Holland of the 20’s you need 3 powerful and commanding cm’s. We have one in Casemiro, we need another 2 to replace mctominay and hannibal needs to develop yet. Is Amrabat the answer? I fear this league maybe to fast for him but lets wait.
I hold back on wanting ten hag out until we are a full squad and still struggling this bad.
I hold back on wanting ten hag out until we are a full squad and still struggling this bad.
Saying its the players is such a silly thing in my opinion. Posters are trying to make out like these players get managers sacked but its pretty much a whole knew set of players.
The only players who have been here since the Jose era are Lindelof, Shaw, McT, Dalot, Martial and Rashford.
The players who have been unhappy, wanted to leave or problematic have largely left. Pogba, Cavani, Ronaldo, Henderson, Bailly, Lingard
So when people say, "these players" get managers sacked, who are the players. Its a lazy throwaway accusation.
Ten hag has made a bunch of new signings and then there are players that have been here before his time like AWB, Dalot, Rashford, Bruno, Lindelof have played a massive part in the team during his time here. You could point to Sancho, Maguire and maybe Mctominay as possible problems but they don't have the influence individually or as a group to extend this to the wider group. In a squad of 30 there will always be unhappy players.
So when people say "the players", his own signings better be included in this rather than scapegoating long standing players.
To me it's simple, EtH didn't prepare the squad properly in preseason, adopted a change in style that hasn't worked and we're having an injury crisis. He's just a manager going through a difficult period, now its up to him to turn things around. A managers role is to improve morale and motivate a squad when results and performances are bad. Sure the players are responsible too but its his job to get them to buy in.
The only players who have been here since the Jose era are Lindelof, Shaw, McT, Dalot, Martial and Rashford.
The players who have been unhappy, wanted to leave or problematic have largely left. Pogba, Cavani, Ronaldo, Henderson, Bailly, Lingard
So when people say, "these players" get managers sacked, who are the players. Its a lazy throwaway accusation.
Ten hag has made a bunch of new signings and then there are players that have been here before his time like AWB, Dalot, Rashford, Bruno, Lindelof have played a massive part in the team during his time here. You could point to Sancho, Maguire and maybe Mctominay as possible problems but they don't have the influence individually or as a group to extend this to the wider group. In a squad of 30 there will always be unhappy players.
So when people say "the players", his own signings better be included in this rather than scapegoating long standing players.
To me it's simple, EtH didn't prepare the squad properly in preseason, adopted a change in style that hasn't worked and we're having an injury crisis. He's just a manager going through a difficult period, now its up to him to turn things around. A managers role is to improve morale and motivate a squad when results and performances are bad. Sure the players are responsible too but its his job to get them to buy in.
This statement alone sums up the team and is largely apart of the responsibility for the manager. There's a massive lack of fundamentals to be good in possession and it's what's going to continually undo United's attempts to have a foot in most games against the top 8.
I'm almost confident that due to this the club will most likely get knocked out of Europe in either the round of 16 or the quarter finals. EtH did identify the intent to be the best transition team and the most successful club to have done this in recent memory was Liverpool. But what people forget about Klopp during this period is that Liverpool were still one of the best teams in possession and in large periods of those seasons played better possession football than City.
That is my only gripe with this team, the lack of possession causes the lack of patterns in the attack, it's why when the ball progresses beyond the midfield the players are disjointed. That is on the manager and his staff because it's basic principles, its not a demand for United to play as expansive as Brighton but to do simple things effectively just like a boxer who is text book (comes behind the jab, pivot, feint) they don't have to be Roy Jones to still have a fantastic career if the fundamentals are done well.
It's disappointing but I hope the next few weeks the team can gather some wins for the sake of momentum but overall the performances need to improve. Playing well for 25 mins means absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things.
I think it was up to this weekend, the stats aren’t updated weekly to be fair. It’s been posted on here a few times
I said he had all his defence out as well.. Mount and Antony would have started if they were available.
Sancho and Maguire weren't his signings, he's made his feelings clear about Maguire but he wouldn't go, and it seems now is the same about Sancho, though without the fallout Sancho would have been a good option off the bench. But both these players are clearly hindering our progress.
I don't know actually what you're trying to say, all I was saying was that he was missing 6 starters yesterday and we won, yet some still saw it as a stick to beat Ten Hag with.
In what way? Reading through this thread, all I see is criticism.
Out of our 6 first choice attackers and midfielders Antony and Mount are the least effective and they were signed by ETH for big money.
If only we could figure out what the constant factor was being all these managers struggling...
The reaction is all because of the performance and deservedly so. It’s unacceptable to be dominated on the ball by Burnley of all teams. They’ve got the youngest team in the league and played us of the park in some parts. We was lucky to come away with 1-0 but a wins a win.
It would be deservedly so, if we weren't so riddled with injuries. But we are. So even weighing in the performance level at this point seems unreasonable. It's a crisis we need to get through however we can, not a signpost from our expected level of performance.
We fielded a team containing 35 year old Jonny Evans, on-loan Spurs flop Reguilon, a kid Mejbri making his second PL start, another kid Hojlund making his second league start and players like Lindelof/Dalot who most people wouldn't have in our best eleven. All thrown together to make a team that has never played together before and almost certainly will never play together again.
No shit we didn't perform well, the feck were ye expecting.
I am watching the game in replay, since I did not have the chance yesterday.
Agreed that with a decimated said you cannot expect a great performance.
However, what buffles me is how we handle the ball once we gain it back. We cannot move the ball at all properly with simple passes and the ball never goes through our midfielders. Only Eriksen seems capable of doing that in our squad. The others are hiding, no one asks for the ball. When teams are pressing us properly, we end up in a long ball to Hojlund, or a long through ball at the back of the defense. We have Onana, who gives that calmness we needed, but even if we break the first press thanks to him (as we successfully did with Bayern and Arsenal), we seem lost in the next phase. So, the ball returns to him and .. long ball.
Yes, ETH wants to be more direct and win the ball and play quick in transition, but you cannot play as a relegation fodder when you gain the ball and being pressed yourself, it’s so frustrating.
Agreed that with a decimated said you cannot expect a great performance.
However, what buffles me is how we handle the ball once we gain it back. We cannot move the ball at all properly with simple passes and the ball never goes through our midfielders. Only Eriksen seems capable of doing that in our squad. The others are hiding, no one asks for the ball. When teams are pressing us properly, we end up in a long ball to Hojlund, or a long through ball at the back of the defense. We have Onana, who gives that calmness we needed, but even if we break the first press thanks to him (as we successfully did with Bayern and Arsenal), we seem lost in the next phase. So, the ball returns to him and .. long ball.
Yes, ETH wants to be more direct and win the ball and play quick in transition, but you cannot play as a relegation fodder when you gain the ball and being pressed yourself, it’s so frustrating.
Mount has played 1.5 games…Antony is also vital to how we play OOP. You’d think that might start to dawn on people at some point now that he’s out and we’ve had to completely change our formation to accommodate it.
You realise that Burnley have been playing this way since they sacked Dyche and have brought in players and managers that also play this style of football?
I'm critical of Ten Hag and his decision to play the same way no matter who's in the team leading us to get carved open constantly because he won't be pragmatic, but for once he was and we got the 3 points we desperately needed. If the style of play doesn't improve once players start to come back then I'll be concerned, but you can't moan about last night because you have no idea what Burnley are about these days.
And was we riddled with injuries against wolves, spurs and forest? Where we also got dominated or played bad… stop trying to make excuses, the performances this season have just been garbage and we’re a year in and still no style of play. That’s all there is to it.
I know exactly what Burnley are about and I actually said in another thread that Burnley will play much better football now than what we’re use to playing against, and I thought it would go in our favour with them being more open but we just chose to sit back. No excuses for a team that’s just got promoted to have 61% possession against us, I don’t care what anyone says. But ye I agree we was desperate for the 3 pts and hopefully our performances improve once everyone’s back but we’ve had a pre season and played the first team against wolves and we was still a shambles…
You say this but is it fair, did you watch the full 90mins? First half, terrible, not at the races and bar a superb goal and a chance right at the start we were woeful.
Second half, complete comfort really - adapted to them, let them have the ball and got a lot of chances/half chances on the break. Hojlund x 2, Rashford x 2 off the top of my head.
This is so far from our first XI you have to assess the games completely differently, it was an awful back 4 and yet it’s a clean sheet, average midfield and lots of shoe horning players.
Stylistically we have leaps and bounds to come on but in hindsight we’re we really expecting that starting XI to play aesthetically well?