The issue really is what that what he was asked to do? We had both him and Matic doing that against a side playing a low block
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we played double pivot, that was tactical to allow our front 4 and fullbacks to create without worrying about the defense.
You need to commit more against sides who setup how Astana did
Fred isn't a deep sitting midfielder. Did you see him play for Shakhtar?
If Ole instructed the team to play with 2 DMs against Astana at home then that is a worrying sign in itself. I don't think that's what he did however. I just don't think Fred has the ability/confidence to play in the way Ole would like him to.
Control the game from midfield and connect it to the attacking front 4 while also rush the opposition when defending. With 90+% pass accuracy i'd say he did his job very well.
I agree but these were instructions and not Fred.
Matic makes everyone shit when played alongside him.
I want to see Fred, McTominay and Pogba as the 3 . I am sure we will play much better.
I want to see Fred, McTominay and Pogba as the 3 . I am sure we will play much better.
Fred should play in a 3 man midfield with Mctominay and Pogba. Pogba being the one to play further forward. Then we might score more and open up defences.
At least we would have 2 midfielders that would threaten to score with shots from distance.
At least we would have 2 midfielders that would threaten to score with shots from distance.
I agree and i think this is what is going to happen once Fred is fully match fit.
Umm yes, that's because he's that kind of a player.. That's his task.
Seems so people mix a defensive midfielder with a deep lying playmaker.
TBF i'd describe him more of a mix between a DM, a DLP and a box to box player. IMO he fits best in a 2 man double pivot along side a more defensive and energetic player. Mctominay Fred and Pogba in a more advanced role looks great on paper.
EDIT: talking about confusion, i think this is a problem with Pogba too. He is a mezzala IMO; this is why so many say he is not good enough as a classic midfielder and not so good as an AM; he's a combination of the two and this is what makes him so special but also require that the supporting cast be adequate. Fred plus Mctominay are perfect IMO; in theory.
Yes if he was asked to do it, then its not his fault
People keep saying Matic was poor, but I thought he was better than Fred, and affected the game more going forward.
Didn't think he was too bad actually. But those type of sides are the ones he'll have created his reputation on so it's not a big sign of things to come.
I'd have him in the starting 11 for the next game.
I'd have him in the starting 11 for the next game.
If he's a deep lying playmaker then he's a pretty bad one. As I mentioned in my original post his positioning off the ball on the defensive side is awful. Easy to play through the lines. I've noticed this in almost all games he's played for United.
I take the cake and then you come out with the last line I bolded? That was pretty obvious from the first time I saw Greenwood play, so surely Ole and the coaches knew that and realized lumping balls down the channel for him to chase was redundant?
They didn't control the midfield, Astana didn't press into the midfield and ceded possession as they came to Old Trafford not to get beat. The job of Matic and Fred was to build some tempo in our play, I never said anything about creating or 50 yard balls, maybe you can't remember Scholes and Carrick but in games like this we'd pen the opposition back as they played probing and quick passes relentlessly into the forwards so we kept pressure on the back 4 and built an attacking rhythm to our play which unsettled the oppositions defensive structure, last night Matic and Fred were so slow on the ball that Astana had time to reset themselves every time we attacked.
Which would be a big mistake with Fred since he's neither.
Well he's certainly more DLP than a DM.
Don't agree.
Thought he was one of our best players yesterday. Sure he made some mistakes but overall I thought he was the best midfielder on the pitch. Was unlucky not to score in the first half too. Encouraging first game back.
No point in arguing with someone like that, stats show that he took an additional 19 touches compared to the passes he attempted, it was pretty clear all game how quickly he was moving the ball. This fella just doesn't like him, or maybe he has him confused with Matic who likes to take 25 touches before releasing the ball.
The thing is he didn't lose the ball often, so you're basing your view of his performance on a preconceived notion. When we had the ball he used it relatively well; he was certainly the better of our two central midfielders.
I think he had a good game. He hasn’t played 90 minutes for decades. Yesterday he was very energetic and was very quick with the ball and always looking for forward passes. I still believe that he will develop to a very good player if we keep playing him next to McTominay and Pogba every week.
If I could be bothered trawling through match clips I'd prove to you what I'm witnessing but I've not the patience nor time for that just to win an online argument.
Thought he was ok. Sprayed the ball around, was energetic.
He did his job well.
It's funny reading this thread, people want Pogba to play exactly the way that Fred did last night - but they now want Fred to play the way that Pogba does.
The caf is a strange beast
It's funny reading this thread, people want Pogba to play exactly the way that Fred did last night - but they now want Fred to play the way that Pogba does.
The caf is a strange beast
Nah, that’s a reasonable observation. I noticed the same thing. He just seemed to struggle to get the ball to stick. Which slowed us down. There’s been other performances where this was much less of an issue (when he had good games in CL last season) so I’m willing to put it down to rustiness. It’s frustrating to watch though. Instant control of the football is really the least you should expect from a top flight CM.
Had a very good game yesterday. He was spraying passes all over the pitch and kept the tempo going. We were doing a good job of moving the ball at quite the pace yesterday.
That's a really useful tweet. Look how often we pass sideways. I think most of our team does the same. I wonder where i can get those stats for the team.
Had a good game, but sometimes Fred's touch is so heavy which just baffles me as he is supposed to be a technical midfielder.
I think he would have been a good DLP or whatever, but his touch is too inconsistent and his passes sometimes are too weak or stop the sharpness of our moves by being behind the players.
I think he would have been a good DLP or whatever, but his touch is too inconsistent and his passes sometimes are too weak or stop the sharpness of our moves by being behind the players.
Agree with you mate. Refreshing to see him Gomes be able to retain possesion.
Your own touches to passes stats argument doesn't even agree with you.
Yes, certainly. There was a certain urgency in moving the ball and it was quite visible. Shame the result does not reflect the performance we put in.
Ok, I win.
Fred was and is useless. He offers little creativity, has no ability to unlock defences and probably a step down from Herrera.
This is what I really want to see for a good run of games, his energy with Mctominay's calmness means Pogba can do his own thing with defensive freedom.
So the deep lying playmaker has to receive the ball in between the lines? Literally there are 4 players who's job is to do that in front of him.
I would say he's more of a jack of all trades, maybe box to box if we had the set-up.
Wrong, wrong and erm, wrong.
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