NZ did well to restrict England and battled fantastically to the total. They are a great all round team. Hopefully we can have a classic final.
ICC T20 World Cup 2021
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
Did you even see the game? England were well on top crushing them. It was terrible 20 balls that put Kiwis back in
That over from Jordan with numerous wides and sixes really changed the momentum of the game. Shades of the drama from the 2019 final with Bairstows catch on the boundary but touching the rope. Then Bairstow and Livingstone both leaving the catch to the other.
In hindsight, with Billings in at 7 and ultimately not needed with the bat, I wonder if England will regret not picking another seam option. Willey or even Tom Curran would have offered something different, and they can swing a bat at the end of an innings too.
In hindsight, with Billings in at 7 and ultimately not needed with the bat, I wonder if England will regret not picking another seam option. Willey or even Tom Curran would have offered something different, and they can swing a bat at the end of an innings too.
Irrelevant as I agree with that. England should have won.
If England chased they would have been HUGE favs. But we will never know.
What we do know is NZ won fair and square. They deserve a trophy for their all round performances over the last few years.
There was hardly any dew factor today is my point. No massive advantage second innings
I do agree that England capitulated in Jordan's over, but I would also stress that missing J Roy was a huge factor.
It's so hard to lose a player of Jason Roy's calibre at that stage in a competition. His presence alone breeds confidence.
Bairstow deputized and he struggled first up in the slightly tougher bowling conditions for openers. I could still envision Roy scoring briskly and putting pressure back onto the bowler; Bairstow was understandably a little unsure of what to do.
But I totally accept that England bowled poorly toward the end and contributed to their own demise. The Jordan over was similar to a Stokes/Braithwaite moment.
It's so hard to lose a player of Jason Roy's calibre at that stage in a competition. His presence alone breeds confidence.
Bairstow deputized and he struggled first up in the slightly tougher bowling conditions for openers. I could still envision Roy scoring briskly and putting pressure back onto the bowler; Bairstow was understandably a little unsure of what to do.
But I totally accept that England bowled poorly toward the end and contributed to their own demise. The Jordan over was similar to a Stokes/Braithwaite moment.
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I’m not really seeing the chasing argument. By and large throughout this tournament the better teams have ended up chasing. I don’t think they’ve won because they chased. We batted first and second in different matches and still lost all of them except Bangladesh. Similarly Bangladesh chased against us and lost.
I really think it’s just happened that the better teams have been chasing for most of the tournament.
I really think it’s just happened that the better teams have been chasing for most of the tournament.
I think even without the dew there is always an advantage chasing in t20 cricket. The pitches are unlikely to become worse and just the idea of knowing how much you need makes it more comfortable.
Again England should still have won and lost because of some really poor death bowling
Again England should still have won and lost because of some really poor death bowling
Chasing 57 in the last four overs is the highest ever chase in t20i history for the last four overs. The fact that they did it in 3 overs shows how much better the NZ batting was in the end and how poor England's bowling was.
There was no dew late on, the position England were in, they should not have lost. No excuses from them at all, unlike on other matches were dew was having an impact.
There was no dew late on, the position England were in, they should not have lost. No excuses from them at all, unlike on other matches were dew was having an impact.
Small margins. Hardly worth a postmortem. It's pretty obvious there's not much in it between the top sides in terms of quality. Just how the wind of fortune blows on the day.
England denied a clear run out according to the epic animation.
Yup . I don’t think you can analyse much in close t20 games,loads of things you could do better in hindsight
Bowling at the death is pretty much one of the primary things every t20 team focusses on and getting it wrong to such an extent where you throw away a wc semi final which at that stage you should be winning 10/10 times would obviously be a big concern. As a poster mentioned above this was the biggest tally chased in the last 4 overs in any T20I game, ever.
They needed to defend 57 runs in 4 overs, at which point Jordan gave away a 23 run over, by trying to aim for a yorker and missing it for every single ball in the over, at that point you could have simply bowled a defensive line and even a 10-12 run over would have been fine and kept them out of the game. Didn't see the point of going for broke at that moment. That one over changed the whole game and knocked England out of the world cup.
It's a shame Joe Root broke Joffra Archer because he could've made a difference there
Stats clearly show that winning the toss does impact game outcome. It is not a 100% loss for team that losses it in night games but it tips the balance hurting the overall fairness aspect for sure.
I think from a holistic perspective this is certainly true. But I think the death bowling was sufficiently bad that one has to look at that and address it. England were in a commanding position at 15 overs.
But blaming the toss is this particular case is just sour grapes. England could've chosen to bat against South Africa and that way tested both their ability to set a target and their ability to defend a score at the death. They already knew they could chase down scores so why not try to bat first when you know there is a 50 % possibility you won't win the toss in the semi? In 5 games they only defended a score once, and that was before they lost one of their death bowlers. So this particular bowling lineup hadn't defended a score before, which resulted in them conceding 57 runs in 3 overs. They've only got themselves to blame for leaving their bowling so undercooked.
It’s not really sour grapes though. England lost because of their poor death bowling and chasing in t20’s is an advantage are two mutually exclusive statements that can both be true. I would say that pre game England were favourites for this and the toss basically made it 50-50.
England’s big issue apart from the death bowling was that Rashid had an off day. The bowling attack lacks wicket takers and Rashid is the one who generally gets some wickets in the middle overs. While 4 overs for 57 seems a lot it was also only 61 from 5 overs which in modern t20’s isn’t a lot of runs. England were always only one bad over away from losing and unfortunately Jordan served up a lot of trash in that over
I am not arguing who won what and what could have been done better. It is an undeniable fact that in day night games this tournament, toss plays a role in giving advantage to the team batting second. It can not be a co-incidence that for overwhelming majority of games between evenly matched teams were won by the chasing side.
Is batting second in t20s a definitive advantage then?
Glad to see we all agreed it was pointless to overanalyse it
Then analysed the feck out of it.
Then analysed the feck out of it.
Sorry I wanted to stay away but I felt absolutely shit so needed to vent a bit
Does T20 evoke that in you?
I was over it before it even finished.
I enjoy the format at times but it doesn't touch a test series or even that 50 over world cup in 2019.
It's taken over 50 overs stuff. Personally I'd kill the one dayers and just have T20 for entertainment.
There's another one next year right ? Wasn't this one supposed to be the 2020 edition but got postponed because of covid ?
If we can get Archer, Roy and Stokes back in time for that.
If we can get Archer, Roy and Stokes back in time for that.
Yep, next year in Australia.
Sooner or later this will happen. Having three formats is not sustainable and out of the WC/ICC tournaments ODIs have already lost any kind of value.
I think you two are probably right.
Shame as T20 Cricket has actually really improved the 50 over game.
It depends on countries. I did a simple check about all t20 results (between the big 8) and the team that won the the toss and batted first won around 55% if I remember correctly. If you look at just UAE then that figure jumps up to 71%, that's understandable when you take into account the slower pitches and batsman batting first having a problem adjusting, and then the dew factor later on.
Always felt that the death bowling would be where we fell short. Jordan hasn't been great in the last 18 months or so and Woakes & Wood are poor in that role.
Could do with batting first more often and testing themselves under that pressure of defending a target as much as possible. Morgan has chosen to field first every time he's won the toss since September 2016.
Could do with batting first more often and testing themselves under that pressure of defending a target as much as possible. Morgan has chosen to field first every time he's won the toss since September 2016.
Great stat, that's mad.
We'd be having a different conversation had Bairstow not touched the rope whilst taking the catch. A few centimetres changed the course of the game.
Aussies are bowling after winning the toss.
Aussies are bowling after winning the toss.
Pakistan batting first under pressure for the first time. Hopefully openers get us off to a good start.
This Australian team winning the World Cup will make me genuinely sick
There is a bit of swing. Rizwan not looking as confident as Babar so far.
Welcome to the game Rizwan!
Solid start.
Babar is class.
wonder if they might be tempted to get asif ali up the order