Insane to talk about dropping him? As of next game we will be about 25% of the way through the league season. He will have played in every minute of those games and he's currently scored 3 goals from open play in his last ten appearances for the club.
Is Zlatan holding us back at the moment?
- Thread starter djdhrubs
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He's been shunted out to a new position and he's still a teenager. Certainly enough reasons to carry on supporting him.
No.
So far, United have not really had a viable alternative. Martial has been off-form and then injured, it is unrealistic to expect Rashford to carry the burden at his age and Rooney is basically the world's highest paid mascot. If Martial comes back then I agree it may be time to try other options, particularly in games we don't expect to dominate.
Pretty sure he was a winger before he became a striker. So the position is not all that unfamiliar to him. He's young and I get that but when he's not playing well out there, its not good for his confidence either.
how is he holding us back from quick counterattacks? is he the one starting them?
Zlatan has and always will be Berbatov x10. He plays to his own tune (terrible cliche) and that means he'll frustrate a lot and almost look uninterested at times as well
His spell at PSG made many forget what their opinion of him was, one of failing to live up to the hype he got for his spells at Ajax, Juve, Inter, Barca and Milan.
I have no doubt he'll look the part for us at times this season though
His spell at PSG made many forget what their opinion of him was, one of failing to live up to the hype he got for his spells at Ajax, Juve, Inter, Barca and Milan.
I have no doubt he'll look the part for us at times this season though
I just eish we could have a prime world class striker or a world class no 10 who creates and gets the maximum of the forwards around/ and in front of him. We dont have any, imo the main reason we look clueless in attack again.
THE Situation kind of reminds me of how Saf got rid of Van nistelrooy despite him getting the goals still and used saha and then larsson on loan the next season getting us to play a lot better as a team.
Or when he junked Berbatov to use tevez and welbeck. More despite him being our and leagues top scorer iirc.
Or when he junked Berbatov to use tevez and welbeck. More despite him being our and leagues top scorer iirc.
I don't think Ibra is holding Man Utd back. I think the start of the season is more about Mou forcing players to play in his scheme as opposed to finding a scheme that best fits his players.... for Man Utd's sake, i hope Mou adapts himself more to his players and the players are able to adapt to Mou better too.
Remember Ibra is coming from a team that modeled itself over Barca tactics... a ton of possession and short passing. Very methodical build up. Man Utd play very direct.
Milan played somewhat similar to this where the ball was hoofed to Ibra who did something with it. But he was younger then. Not sure he can do it anymore.
Remember Ibra is coming from a team that modeled itself over Barca tactics... a ton of possession and short passing. Very methodical build up. Man Utd play very direct.
Milan played somewhat similar to this where the ball was hoofed to Ibra who did something with it. But he was younger then. Not sure he can do it anymore.
How young and talented you are have no meaning whatsoever in terms of how good your performance is over 90min.
I accept that he makes mistakes, sometimes mistakes are even the best way to learn, but that still doesn't mean that I think he did well every time he lost the ball or that he had a bad game the other night.
It's laughable that he got an average rating of 5.4 and Fellaini got a 6.5 when one of them was really quite poor all the way through and the other one barely set a foot wrong the entire game. Is it really that difficult for people to rate a player for their performance instead of their age and likability?
Being honest about his performance in a game doesn't mean that you're not supporting him.
Also, why does it matter if we write on this forum that someone had a bad game, or a good game for that matter? I've read time and time again that we have to support and be protective of Rashford as if the words written here on the internet are somehow directly linked to his future career..
If a player has a bad game then he has a bad game, regardless of the name on the back of the shirt.
How did Mourinho set up his previous team with Ibra at Inter? Was he faster then so used a counter attacking style? I don't think Mourinho has any intention of playing counter attack with us, he said we need to keep the ball in the final third as much as possible, therefore utilizing creativity and link up rather than pace to break through (as well as distance shots). In some games ws have done this, it's just it doesn't fit us when we are defending deep like in the second half, only when we are pressing high like in the first half. I never saw his Inter side so I'd really like to know how he made the most of Ibra and if he's copying that or adapting it to an older Ibra.
Zlatan hates that he missed a simple header. He has promised to make amends.
I ll wait for it
I ll wait for it
Simple he had better set of players than what he has at United. Another summer window from Jose and watch us fly.
Serie A football is far far more tactical and slower than EPL. You see how Capello, Conte, Ranieri, Carlo A, etc. set up? That's all of Serie A with the exception of Spalletti. It was a better fit for Ibra and Mou. Here, on ball pressure and transition from attack-defense and vice versa is a lot faster.
Other problem is that players who have been in EPL for a long time and/or been developed here are just poor tactically speaking (generalizing). In Serie A, the better teams are so well oiled that everyone knows automatically where the others are going to be and everyone keeps tactical discipline. In EPL, that's just not there. You see Pogba and Ibra having some difficulties because they can't anticipate what their teammates are going to do. So you see a lot of hesitation and missed passes by both... and they NEVER had those issues.
Other problem is that players who have been in EPL for a long time and/or been developed here are just poor tactically speaking (generalizing). In Serie A, the better teams are so well oiled that everyone knows automatically where the others are going to be and everyone keeps tactical discipline. In EPL, that's just not there. You see Pogba and Ibra having some difficulties because they can't anticipate what their teammates are going to do. So you see a lot of hesitation and missed passes by both... and they NEVER had those issues.
Yes, Let's throw another 200m at the problem; what could possible go wrong.
That's exactly what is needed and what will happen. You are kidding yourself if you think otherwise. We need better players and we have money to burn (all English clubs do).
Jose Mourinho buys his team, he doesn't build.
I'm starting to think he is. .
Missed chances against Stoke, Liverpool and Chelsea now have really cost us.
Missed chances against Stoke, Liverpool and Chelsea now have really cost us.
He definitely is and not due to missed chances but because of the style of football he makes us have to play. We are playing similar zombie football to LVG of passing around their box side to side before sending a Moyesesque cross in to him. No counter attacks at all. Its stale, toothless and lifeless. Made all the worse by partnering him with Pogba (not a #10) in a 4-2-3-1. Mourinho needs to go back to the drawing board and make drastic changes or he will miss out on top #4 and get sacked.
Isolated today. But yes.
We need to change our tactics and personal fast. Dropping Zlatan would be the first big step.
This. Like the Berba situation, love his technique and style of play but it's just not the right fit for our team atm.
Mourinho needs to be ruthless and drop him. It's not a case of, we can play him against 'lesser' teams. No we need all the game time to nurture Rashford/Martial in those central positions. They will inevitably come up short but they're the future and their lack of form hurts us even if Zlatan is producing, which he isn't atm.
Berba was the twice the player Zlatan has been for the past few weeks unfortunately, he's been useless. Not scoring but also not contributing anything in general.
There was a situation in the second half which illustrated the problem with playing him up front. We broke through relatively quickly after winning the ball, but nothing sensational in terms of pace on the counter, with Rashford on the left in a good position to cross. Zlatan was nowhere to be seen in the box, and Pogba was the only one who had managed to get into the box.
When you're down 2-0, and your lone striker is too immobile to get into the box when you're attacking with any sort of pace, it's a problem. The example is anecdotal, sure, but how anyone can't see that his immobility and lack of movement is a problem is beyond me.
When you're down 2-0, and your lone striker is too immobile to get into the box when you're attacking with any sort of pace, it's a problem. The example is anecdotal, sure, but how anyone can't see that his immobility and lack of movement is a problem is beyond me.
of course he's holding us back, you can't play a 35 year old every week, as the focal point of your attack and not expect it to limit your style of play.
Zlatan could of been a great signing, used correctly, in the right games, like Giggs and Scholes where at his age, but not as an automatic starter and the focal point of our attack every single Premier league game!
to put it in perspective he is a similar age to Drogba when he went back to Chelsea..... the idea that a player his age is pretty much undroppable or even substitutable in the premier league is mental!!!
Zlatan could of been a great signing, used correctly, in the right games, like Giggs and Scholes where at his age, but not as an automatic starter and the focal point of our attack every single Premier league game!
to put it in perspective he is a similar age to Drogba when he went back to Chelsea..... the idea that a player his age is pretty much undroppable or even substitutable in the premier league is mental!!!
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He's been missing chances. Too many of them to be honest.
Definitely not a Van Persie.
Also, that picture of him smiling with Willian post match pisses me off. This is not me being a football Einstein, just being a fan. And I'm sat here in the early morning bleary eyed from watching the game last night and taking digs from my colleagues for the result.
Definitely not a Van Persie.
Also, that picture of him smiling with Willian post match pisses me off. This is not me being a football Einstein, just being a fan. And I'm sat here in the early morning bleary eyed from watching the game last night and taking digs from my colleagues for the result.
Martial has to start vs City as a striker. Zlatan is one of our only world class players but I think it would be best to rest him next game and bring him back vs Burnley.
He should be dropped and Rashford and Martial should be played as twins CFs in a 442 diamond.
I don't like the way we play with Zlatan up front. He's too clunky and reliant on crosses and not fast enough for the PL.
I don't like the way we play with Zlatan up front. He's too clunky and reliant on crosses and not fast enough for the PL.
I saw someone posted, in one of the thread, that Zlatan is the kind of player who needs games to get into rythm to score, so Jose must play him MORE......
I can't help laughing.
Yes
10 characters.
10 characters.
I've been defending him up to this point, but that pissed me off as well. Honestly, that alone should put him on the bench a couple of games just to teach him a lesson. Missing some chances is forgivable, not giving a damn is not
He has been in terrible form from fhe beginning of the season and now the goals that were masking it have dried up, why should he come back immediately against Burnley? Like the other dropped 30 something he has to work his way back into the starting line up.
nope if you see mourinho's past striker he don't favor ST with pace (drogba, benzema, diego milito) but strong st who have good technique on the ball.
it's not FIFA game ffs, pace is not everything here
it's not FIFA game ffs, pace is not everything here
Agree with this and with Mata pulling the strings in behind we could start playing well again plus playing Pogba and Herrera as RCM/LCM suits them to a tee. I think a 4-4-2 diamond or a 4-3-3 with the pivot backwards are the only ways we can play to get something resembling competence from Pogba, which is a damn shame for the money we spent on him.
it is not fair to say so. the negative formation against liverpool wont help. the early goals conceded led to less space for playing. the most important is we lack players creating the space for a lone striker.
Add City to the list.
He seems to be a hindrance. He drops too deep to pick up the ball, only to then spread it out wide to Valencia. Sounds familiar?
We need a striker who keeps the defenders on their toes with his movements and pace. Play Rashford there. Heck throw in Martial if Marcus can't play. Zlatan is too static at times
We need a striker who keeps the defenders on their toes with his movements and pace. Play Rashford there. Heck throw in Martial if Marcus can't play. Zlatan is too static at times
His technique has been poor though.
All the players you mentioned were great at linking the play and holding the ball up to get other quicker players involved.
Zlatans hold up play has been poor, little flicks that don't come off or just easily dispossessed.
I think he needs to get back to basics and concentrate on doing the simple things first before trying fancy shit.
Even if it means dumbing down his natural instinct for the benefit of the team.
Obviously he's not the player he used to be anymore, he has lost his pace and his quick feet. His pace has been gone for years now, that's not really a surprise, it's his general stiffness that is relatively new and means the end of his career is near. But that doesn't mean he can't be a very useful striker this season. He will miss chances but he will also make chances out of situations that can't be considered a chance with a different striker. We can pretend he's been wasteful in an otherwise well performing squad that created a lot of chances, but I don't think that's the case.
He should be used right, as a static striker. That means that he needs dynamic players around him who make runs with conviction, not reacting to a flick but acting before it comes, or not. To make a static striker work you need more of a plan than with a different type of striker.
He should be used right, as a static striker. That means that he needs dynamic players around him who make runs with conviction, not reacting to a flick but acting before it comes, or not. To make a static striker work you need more of a plan than with a different type of striker.