For what it's worth (and I'll bow to your superior medical knowledge) didn't Shaw and Valencia get the best results in fitness tests:
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/fittest-player-manchester-united-revealed-11599740
23
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 19
- Clean sheets
- 13
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Status
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/fittest-player-manchester-united-revealed-11599740
Unsurprisingly no details of anything ‘amazing’ within the article.
Similar stories after we lost at Watford last season and this is probably why Shaw will be sold. Mourinho despises leaks to the press and if he suspects someone of leaking they are dead to him. Shaw's camp probably sealed his fate a year ago unwittingly...
...He wasn't that great against Brighton either.
Mourinho is still holding a grudge because Shaw's brother called him a cnut at the start of his tenure here. Mourinho publically humiliated Shaw about a year ago when the pressure started building because we were about to drop out of the top 4. Now, the pressure is on again because of our pathetic CL-display, he does it again, this time after a game that we won, and where the other two fullbacks on the day were equally as bad.
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Multiple managers have criticised him for his attitude at this stage but RedCafe is still painting him as a victim...
Tired of everyone making excuses for him. Earning 100k per week and has access to World-Class facilities, nutritionists, and coaches but still cannot keep himself in prime physical condition. He has shown his worth maybe 12 games in his almost 4 years here but everyone still thinks he should be our starting LB. If he wasn't an Ingurlish lad then no one would give 2 shits about him but now everyone is crying that he's being ruined by Big Bad Mourinho
...
He got some tough injury luck but the leg break was almost 2 full seasons ago now, it isn't an excuse anymore. These days Full Backs are increasingly important and Luke Shaw isn't enough if we have aspirations of being a top side again. Good riddance.
Tired of everyone making excuses for him. Earning 100k per week and has access to World-Class facilities, nutritionists, and coaches but still cannot keep himself in prime physical condition. He has shown his worth maybe 12 games in his almost 4 years here but everyone still thinks he should be our starting LB. If he wasn't an Ingurlish lad then no one would give 2 shits about him but now everyone is crying that he's being ruined by Big Bad Mourinho
...He got some tough injury luck but the leg break was almost 2 full seasons ago now, it isn't an excuse anymore. These days Full Backs are increasingly important and Luke Shaw isn't enough if we have aspirations of being a top side again. Good riddance.
Who said he's not in prime physical condition? He's fully fit. Say what you want about his form or performances but the truth is Mourinho is singling him out without warrant.Multiple managers have criticised him for his attitude at this stage but RedCafe is still painting him as a victim...
Tired of everyone making excuses for him. Earning 100k per week and has access to World-Class facilities, nutritionists, and coaches but still cannot keep himself in prime physical condition. He has shown his worth maybe 12 games in his almost 4 years here but everyone still thinks he should be our starting LB. If he wasn't an Ingurlish lad then no one would give 2 shits about him but now everyone is crying that he's being ruined by Big Bad Mourinho
He got some tough injury luck but the leg break was almost 2 full seasons ago now, it isn't an excuse anymore. These days Full Backs are increasingly important and Luke Shaw isn't enough if we have aspirations of being a top side again. Good riddance.
Yeah but we've determined his BMI and VO2 from watching him on the TV.
Scholes' opinion on Shaw 5:17 onwards, I fully agree with him. Had a decent game, we saw a lot better football from the left side of the pitch when he was on the field and we looked more open at the back in the second half after he was taken off, as pointed out by Savage and Scholes. Everyone's reaction at the end of the game on here saying he needs selling was way over the top in my opinion.
Mourinho is a vengeful person. Once Luke rejected Mourinho’s Chelsea to join United, Mourinho branded him as a young lad who looks for money at that time. You can see Mourinho agenda against Luke since day 1.
Very vengeful indeed and very proud. He'll never get over Shaw snubbing him for United.
I thought he played well.
Our players have always been "stunned" or "shocked" or "flabbergasted" a lot over 3 years. Poor darlings.
In any case, I think this is leaked by Shaw's people, just as the Beeb article was. Probably someone like Smalling or Young or Carrick put an arm around Shaw and consoled him, which was then spun into a story of "they are all stunned".
Mourinho wants a better LB and thinks the board won't sanction one until they feel Shaw has no potential. Explains the treatment. Shaw is also within his rights to defend himself by such leaks, ofc.
I look forward to two actual FBs next season after all this trouble.
In situations like this it's the parties closest to both persons who are in a better position to know if the situation is warranted or over the top, not random Internet posters taking sides or blindly projecting some silly idea of mental weaknesses. Shaw has a track record of unfitness and Jose has a track record of getting enraged and victimisimg individuals
Then why didn’t shaw get motivated last month after Mourinho called him best left in the league? Why didn’t he keep training and perform well when given the chance? Ashley Young got a chance in a CL game and played well in that game and forced mourinho to give him a chance in the PL and that’s how he made the LB position his.
Yeah. Or send him on loan.
I think Valencia has more lungs than most players in the league. In fact thats probably been his standout quality over the years, so you can remove him from any comparison right now
Ashley Young? Well no I can't agree seeing as the goals he's had some involvement in us conceeding this season are usually due to him failing to track back, walking while someone else is covering his position or simply not keeping up with and marking his man properly. So I'd say theres more evidence of Young either not being in the right physical condition or refusing to use his physical condition to live up to his responsibilities as a defender.
Shaw was playing reasonably well which is why Mou commented on it. He wasn't amazing, but he was actually better than Young (after Young came back). Young was pretty good early in the season, but there is no point in rewriting history. He was awful once he came back which is why many of us wanted Shaw to play. Shaw started to play after news came out of him defending Mourinho against City I think. This is why Shaw was not sold I think as going into the new year we all thought Shaw was on his way out based on his lack of game time.
It's not like we're all saying Shaw is amazing or anything like that. We only think of him as a victim because he's getting treated badly in comparison to his teammates who are also not performing well.
It's clear Mou has his favorites. For example, I love how much effort Lukaku is putting in and performing lately despite lack of goals. But he also had a period where he was just awful which included being at fault for like 3 goals on set pieces. He was not dropped once. Mou allowed him to shrug off that poor form. Similarly, Matic started off great, then was really awful for a long time until that Crystal Palace match. Yet Pogba who was great, and has had poor form since that Spurs match has been dropped.
Again, this inconsistency is what makes posters like myself side with players who really should not be seen as victims if they were treated fairly. I don't think Shaw deserves to start every match over Young. I think if Young performs like Shaw, there really should be no preference shown towards Young.
As for Shaw's actual attacking performances, I quite like how he plays in attack. No he doesn't give you cross after cross, but I like his combining with attackers. He provides another passing option and encourages the attack to find openings because he's more conservatives with his crossing. When Young is a LB I feel like Young is so ball dominant on the left wing that the attack defers to him so we get cross after cross or dribbling from Young.
That’s not surprising though. You have more goodwill if you are more trustworthy. Sometimes managers cut more slack to players he trusts more. SAF used to do that to cantona for instance. Lukaku even in his dry spell was helping our team so it wasn’t a tough decision to keep playing him.
Shaw has never been reliable in terms of fitness and injuries. And in the long term has never been consistent. Young gets a little more leeway because he has had top games like the Watford game where he scored two or other games where he kept guys like Alli or Salah in his pocket. As of now, there is little evidence to expect shaw to put in that kind of a performance. Shaw has done very little since Jose came so it's not surprising that he doesn’t get the same leeway that young or lukaku gets.
Top notch logic.
There's a lot of thing for which Mourinho should be criticised, however this one is not his fault. He's not fit and that's what most of us can see, if you're a professional footballer than that's the first and the bare minimum expected out of you.
Whatever is going on behind the scenes with the player and coach this should be kept in-house. The public criticism is costing the club millions in diminishing player assets. The simple solution is not to play a player when not fit or performing and sell when possible.
Expect Shaw to be sold to top side & become one of the top left backs in the league. Then people on these boards will start saying, he never played like that for us.
He should have been sold last summer.
Will go on to have s great career.
Will go on to have s great career.
The Shaw experience isn’t going to work and it’s time to move on. Whether it’s Shaw’s fault or Mourinho’s fault.
Shaw should be sold and replaced this summer.
Such a shame because he has massive potential.
Shaw should be sold and replaced this summer.
Such a shame because he has massive potential.
Not sure about great, though I think he’ll do ok for a manager who’s prepared to both shout at him and praise him when necessary.
I see some people go on about Shaw having a great career after this? Its all in the man's head, Mourinho tried but failed. Fully deserved critisism!
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We will sell him - and he will perform brilliantly for his next club.
Shameful treatment towards Shaw by Jose. Always has been, I'm surprised he is still here based on Jose's clear dislike of him. Shaw was playing alright, no worse than Valencia. Young offers little and was arguably worse than Shaw was.
Jose has enough problems in the squad as it is without singling players out. Shaw will move on and fulfil his potential elsewhere, which will be a major loss to us because we aren't using him properly.
Jose has enough problems in the squad as it is without singling players out. Shaw will move on and fulfil his potential elsewhere, which will be a major loss to us because we aren't using him properly.
I'm sure we will replace him with a better player either way.
Like everyone else we’ve sold over the last few years.
We will sell him in the summer and he's going to shite for someone else. Good riddance.
I don't know what happens inside, but I have the feeling that Mourinho never gave him a fair treatment. After the broken leg I guess the kid was insecure when he was playing, and sensitive at the minimal signal of pain. Given the situation Mourinho should have been a bit more gentle and show the lad a bit of warm. Instead of it he was thrown under the bus systematically.
It's true that when we hired LVG Shaw was sent to train aside the group because he wasn't fit. Surely the kid has some problems and needs to put in extra efforts, but after that period I remember him playing well and becoming a fix starter, performing like the best left back in the league. The talent is there but he needs an arm around the shoulder, and I'm sure that under Ferguson (or anyone with man mangement skills) he'd be flying again down the left side. Mourinho seems to be incapable of it, or maybe he doesn't even want. He only seems to be friendly with the workhorses, while the rest are ignored or treated miserably.
Now it's pointless to keep Shaw if Jose is going to remain next season, but I'd like to see the kid under a more decent manager, along with players like Pogba or Martial who don't seem to be enjoying at all. The task of the manager is to get the best out of the talents and It's obvious that Mourinho is not getting enough out of them. All he does is to ask for money and transfers, but he's got the tools at home. It's his fault that he's not interested or just incapable of squeezing the talent at his disposal.
To me this case looks like De Bruyne, Salah, Lukaku film at Chelsea, we're at risk of losing exciting talents and then regret when they shine anywhere else. I'd pay that price if Mourinho had us playing like buffalos and competing for the big trophies. But I don't think it's worth to accept Mourinho antics and negatives to win a pair of mickey mouse cups, and play the current garbage football. While he admits we had no chance at CL and cries every week about City having advantages, heritages or whatever.
I'm sure that any half decent manager with the current squad could easily replicate and improve what he's offering us, and without his antics, the dull displays and the permanent drama. If our club wasn't being ruled by ignorants Mourinho would be shown the door at the end of the season.
It's true that when we hired LVG Shaw was sent to train aside the group because he wasn't fit. Surely the kid has some problems and needs to put in extra efforts, but after that period I remember him playing well and becoming a fix starter, performing like the best left back in the league. The talent is there but he needs an arm around the shoulder, and I'm sure that under Ferguson (or anyone with man mangement skills) he'd be flying again down the left side. Mourinho seems to be incapable of it, or maybe he doesn't even want. He only seems to be friendly with the workhorses, while the rest are ignored or treated miserably.
Now it's pointless to keep Shaw if Jose is going to remain next season, but I'd like to see the kid under a more decent manager, along with players like Pogba or Martial who don't seem to be enjoying at all. The task of the manager is to get the best out of the talents and It's obvious that Mourinho is not getting enough out of them. All he does is to ask for money and transfers, but he's got the tools at home. It's his fault that he's not interested or just incapable of squeezing the talent at his disposal.
To me this case looks like De Bruyne, Salah, Lukaku film at Chelsea, we're at risk of losing exciting talents and then regret when they shine anywhere else. I'd pay that price if Mourinho had us playing like buffalos and competing for the big trophies. But I don't think it's worth to accept Mourinho antics and negatives to win a pair of mickey mouse cups, and play the current garbage football. While he admits we had no chance at CL and cries every week about City having advantages, heritages or whatever.
I'm sure that any half decent manager with the current squad could easily replicate and improve what he's offering us, and without his antics, the dull displays and the permanent drama. If our club wasn't being ruled by ignorants Mourinho would be shown the door at the end of the season.
Was about to post something similar, this is what I believe.
Jose's behaviour is not acceptable imo. He's here to lift the players up and get the best out of them. What he does behind closed door is another thing but in a away, it feels like he wants to shift responsibility onto his players whenever things dont work out
I believe Mourinho has given him a lot of time to get his attitude sorted. He's criticised Shaw in public previously, he also publicly praised Shaw to the hilt. Yes, people, Mourinho also has praised Shaw publicly too.
But none of it has worked on his long term mentality.
My feeling is that Shaw just cannot be bothered to turn himself into a top left back. He applies himself for a few weeks, plays alright, and then lets himself go.
He's like a smoker trying to give up fags. He just cannot do it.
But none of it has worked on his long term mentality.
My feeling is that Shaw just cannot be bothered to turn himself into a top left back. He applies himself for a few weeks, plays alright, and then lets himself go.
He's like a smoker trying to give up fags. He just cannot do it.
Mourinho may be wrong or he may be right.
Concerning Shaw, what he done to be labelled one of the greatest fullback prospects out there? He's not very productive in attack; his crossing is no better than average. He has speed, but he's not Alba fast, and he is a little slow on the turn, thus getting rinsed by Jesus Navas, rather easily. He's not particularly good defensively either. He is a good, albeit safe passer of the ball, and he is very strong. That being said, does anyone see him becoming the best fullback in the league, let alone the world? I am also genuinly concerned about his engine, and although I somewhat doubt that he is overweight, he is bulky, so how long can he keep it up? His frame is even bigger than Rooney's, for instance.
Concerning Shaw, what he done to be labelled one of the greatest fullback prospects out there? He's not very productive in attack; his crossing is no better than average. He has speed, but he's not Alba fast, and he is a little slow on the turn, thus getting rinsed by Jesus Navas, rather easily. He's not particularly good defensively either. He is a good, albeit safe passer of the ball, and he is very strong. That being said, does anyone see him becoming the best fullback in the league, let alone the world? I am also genuinly concerned about his engine, and although I somewhat doubt that he is overweight, he is bulky, so how long can he keep it up? His frame is even bigger than Rooney's, for instance.
I saw some interesting quotes from Pochettino about him the other day criticising Shaw for his lack of work ethic and professionalism whilst at Southampton. I think they were in a book by Pochettino and weren't new, but I'd forgotten about them all the same.
So that's the last four managers that Shaw has had that have criticised him for more or less identical things, including Hodgson at England, and all the while he's still looking visibly unfit. Shaw's had four managers – FOUR (!) –complain about his attitude and work rate, and we're still here watching a visibly unfit player not be able to perform the basic requirements of his position in the modern game.
And yet he'll still find defenders on here as posters jump to inexplicably defend Shaw from the big bag mean Mourinho and ignore the fact that Mourinho is simply criticising Shaw for the exact same fecking things Luke Shaw's last three managers did. If the professional athlete who is being paid hundreds of thousands of pounds a month to do a job he's shown very little intention of ever actually doing shouldn't be criticised then who the feck should?
And why the absolute feck are fans of Manchester United siding with a player whose lack of work ethic has equated to him taking the club for a very expensive ride? Shaw's inability to stay fit show a basic lack of respect for the shirt. It's absolutely baffling that that receives anything other than condemnation. He's a fully grown man not a baby.
So that's the last four managers that Shaw has had that have criticised him for more or less identical things, including Hodgson at England, and all the while he's still looking visibly unfit. Shaw's had four managers – FOUR (!) –complain about his attitude and work rate, and we're still here watching a visibly unfit player not be able to perform the basic requirements of his position in the modern game.
And yet he'll still find defenders on here as posters jump to inexplicably defend Shaw from the big bag mean Mourinho and ignore the fact that Mourinho is simply criticising Shaw for the exact same fecking things Luke Shaw's last three managers did. If the professional athlete who is being paid hundreds of thousands of pounds a month to do a job he's shown very little intention of ever actually doing shouldn't be criticised then who the feck should?
And why the absolute feck are fans of Manchester United siding with a player whose lack of work ethic has equated to him taking the club for a very expensive ride? Shaw's inability to stay fit show a basic lack of respect for the shirt. It's absolutely baffling that that receives anything other than condemnation. He's a fully grown man not a baby.
The fact that a 30+ Young with a catalogue of injuries behind him, can overtake Shaw says it all
Only if it's the Norwegian league
Shaw’s an odd case. I didn’t really see what the fuss was about prior to us signing him. When he came I was surprised at his body shape, but there have been plenty of players with that heavy set look that are perfectly athletic enough to play. The reality of his career with us though, is a handful of games that were ok-decent, and that’s it. He’s looked pretty poor under 2 different regimes and Mourinho has given him a year and a half to show some fight, dedication and willingness to improve. He’s shown nothing. It baffles me that so many fans are this invested in a player who has given nothing except disappointment to Manchester United.
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