V.O.
Last Man Standing finalist 2019/20
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2019
- Messages
- 8,259
What if Forest win the PL with Elanga scoring 50 league goals?What if West Ham do a Leicester this season and win the PL with Maguire as Captain?
What if Forest win the PL with Elanga scoring 50 league goals?What if West Ham do a Leicester this season and win the PL with Maguire as Captain?
Stats always make players look better than they actually are.If you look at the stats for those seasons it tells the story. I think you're letting the calamities of the past season colour your judgement.
Good point Gandalf, lets add a League Winners clause along with the Ballon d'Or clause.What if West Ham do a Leicester this season and win the PL with Maguire as Captain?
Why? I replied to a post saying he had a great second season by saying i don't think that was the case and i think he was better in his first season. A poster points out that i said he had an outstanding season-which is true, i wrote that- but am i not allowed to think that i went overboard in saying that, especially during a tournament where he was genuinely outstanding? Am I not allowed to consider that we had problems defensively that season and that Maguire might just have been as culpable as the much maligned Lindelof (and as i said he was guilty too).Got 'em
There's no inconsistency. As we pointed before, in 2021 the competitors for our best defenders were Bailly, Lindelof, Jones, Rojo and Blackett vs Maguire and Smalling.They are not. They're pointing out the inconsistency between what posters say they thought about players at a given time and what they actually posted at that time.
I don't know how you don't get the difference.
Mine was funny because it is unlikely.What if Forest win the PL with Elanga scoring 50 league goals?
You haven't heard of Bogarde?I wonder if theres ever been a stubborn owner or manager that has been like “ok fine you can stay but you wont play”. Because im sure no player wants to train with kids and not play matches.
I see.
So these posts doesn't look ridiculous then:
He was good that season, particularly in the second half of it. It was a widely held opinion. No need to revise it now and say he wasn't.Clearly getting swept up in his England performances which were pretty immense . I did defend Maguire a lot in his first two seasons but looking back I feel Lindelof got a lot more stick than was his due (not that that exonerates him as he was sometimes poor) and I remember the consensus on here that if only Baily would partner Maguire we'd be totally set. It was pretty much acknowledged that we were often poor at the back and we conceded 44 goals that season in a counter attacking team. I still maintain his first season was his best here.
Mine was funny because it is unlikely.
"Maybe our worst signing ever" but appearing in your best XI (2013-2021) is pretty inconsistent.There's no inconsistency. As we pointed before, in 2021 the competitors for our best defenders were Bailly, Lindelof, Jones, Rojo and Blackett vs Maguire and Smalling.
Of course Maguire and Smalling are better than these lot.
It doesn't mean they're good by any means. They're just better than these crap players that's all.
There's no contradiction. You and that other poster are just trying to look cool by bringing old posts while giving feck all about the context.
Opinions change over time. I can't seriously believe you're holding on to what somebody said 2 years ago. In the two years since, Maguire's quality has dramatically fallen, even more so when you compare him to both Varane and Martinez, whilst even Lindelof has improved since then. He's even lost his place to Luke Shaw, a left back by trade."Maybe our worst signing ever" but appearing in your best XI (2013-2021) is pretty inconsistent.
Good/decent/alright, was he elite Manchester United level or "outstanding" though? i went overboard in defending and praising a player who was still getting a lot of ridicule even back then by saying he had an outstanding season in 20-21 when he was admittedly fantastic for England (i still maintain that he was) and now with the benefit of hindsight i don't think he was THAT great given our defensive issues that year and I think his first season was better as evidenced by our better defensive record in his first season. Am i not allowed to change my mind? I didn't say I now think he was dreadful in the 20-21 season either, just that i went overboard. Perhaps you'd like to dig up old posts saying that Anderson and Cleverly are the future of Manchester United's midfield or the Martial is the best striker in the league. Also your posts on Rashford and Ole are looking equally ridiculous too by the wayHe was good that season, particularly in the second half of it. It was a widely held opinion. No need to revise it now and say he wasn't.
Nice response i feel. I know he says he'll continue to play for the shirt and all that but it must be getting close to the end for him here.
In hindsight, giving him the captaincy almost right off the bat was insanity. I know we didn't exactly have many leaders at the club at that time anyway but talk about putting pressure on a new 80 million signing
I don't see a way back for him. Most fans have made their minds up about him over the past two seasons and EtH would rather play Shaw at cb than Maguire so.... the writing is really on the wall and i'd be amazed if he doesn't realise that.
Southgate has already said it isn't great that he's not playing regularly so there's that too.
I don't like the booing. He needs to leave for his own sake though, i doubt there's any coming back from this.
1 solid/decent first season, average second season and two catastrophic ones after that. 80 million
Do they think they're going to get Neymar or Mbappe with the money? The players they're after are very good for the level they want to be at it which is a consistent Europa conference league finish.
No doubt it has but "worst signings ever" don't appear in best XIs. Hysterical nonsense.Opinions change over time. I can't seriously believe you're holding on to what somebody said 2 years ago. In the two years since, Maguire's quality has dramatically fallen, even more so when you compare him to both Varane and Martinez, whilst even Lindelof has improved since then. He's even lost his place to Luke Shaw, a left back by trade.
Smalling played for Roma 2021. It was mainly Lindelof who partnered Maguire 2020/21 and they had decents stats, less than 1 goal conceded per game if I remember correctly. Maguire was one of our best players that season, in comparison to all our players not just defenders.There's no inconsistency. As we pointed before, in 2021 the competitors for our best defenders were Bailly, Lindelof, Jones, Rojo and Blackett vs Maguire and Smalling.
Of course Maguire and Smalling are better than these lot.
It doesn't mean they're good by any means. They're just better than these crap players that's all.
There's no contradiction. You and that other poster are just trying to look cool by bringing old posts while giving feck all about the context.
No thanks it was just an easy one to go to the Maguire 20-21 thread. You were right at the time, just because he's fallen off a cliff since then doesn't change it.Good/decent/alright, was he elite Manchester United level or "outstanding" though? i went overboard in defending and praising a player who was still getting a lot of ridicule even back then by saying he had an outstanding season in 20-21 when he was admittedly fantastic for England (i still maintain that he was) and now with the benefit of hindsight i don't think he was THAT great given our defensive issues that year and I think his first season was better as evidenced by our better defensive record in his first season. Am i not allowed to change my mind? I didn't say I know think he was dreadful in the 20-21 season either, just that i went overboard. Perhaps you'd like to dig up old posts saying that Anderson and Cleverly are the future of Manchester United's midfield or the Martial is the best striker in the league. Also your posts on Rashford and Ole are looking equally ridiculous too by the way
By the way here are my most recent posts regarding Maguire- hardly evidence of being super negative and saying he's totally awful:
You're very welcome to trawl through a million Maguire threads and look for evidence of shit posting and being unfair. I genuinely don't remember ever criticizing him to the level of vitriol and abuse he's suffered on here so you're barking up the wrong tree if you think that.
What's the story with him? I've heard this kind of talk before but can never find anything to explain.You haven't heard of Bogarde?
No but you might actually decide that you were being too harsh on him at the time, that he wasn't actually that bad or that your opinion has changed and that it doesn't make you a hypocrite for changing your mind.No thanks it was just an easy one to go to the Maguire 20-21 thread. You were right at the time, just because he's fallen off a cliff since then doesn't change it.
I don't care if any of my old posts look ridiculous, it was my view at the time. Rashford was poor for a long time, I'm not going to now say actually he was brilliant in hindsight under Rangnick etc.
Winston Bogarde: The strange story of Chelsea's misfit | Daily Mail OnlineWhat's the story with him? I've heard this kind of talk before but can never find anything to explain.
Thanks for that. I got confused thinking people were talking about that young Aston Villa lad. Quite funny how the PR machines of club owners will make guys like this out to be villains, while getting people to moan about players trying to get better contracts when the situation is reversed.
Or they win the World Cup or a Nobel prize.What if West Ham do a Leicester this season and win the PL with Maguire as Captain?
Moyes might win a Nobel prize for his dancing.Or they win the World Cup or a Nobel prize.
I don't know why people keep saying this.He was peps original replacement for kompany until we outbid them. he played in every single premier league game, 71 games in a row in total before getting his ankle injury before the europa final. I remember people actually being gutted he missed it and we actually felt his loss with that game. When he got man of the match during his debut, he showed much promise. He had a fairly decent season and it’s unfair to say otherwise. He has always had an error in him.. but his united career has certainly gone downhill. It feels like ever since the Greek incident he just never was the same. The retrial happens next year so even that is still hanging over him. His confidence has looked shot for a long time.
Saying that, it’s time he is sold. That’s certain. He isn’t good enough for what we need.. but he is a decent defender and will do well at WH. Much more importance to the team and less pressure will do him wonders imo.
I don’t think he deserves the shite he gets, he is practically a meme at this point. That’s going to affect anyone. He looks shot to pieces. I hope he turns it around and does well for the hammers.
Firing all fergie assistants just to replace them with his everton cohorts and extending rooney's contract when he was on decline were major damage greater than Ole's ever done, it set the club back for years to come. LvG came second with his foolish clear outs, kicking out many experienced players at good age like evans, chicharito for shingel and replaced them with expensive flops. Mind you i don't hate them, and won't spend any more of my time reminding everyone why they were bad managers for us.What is up with hate towards Moyes? He was completely out of depth of course but he was here 7-8 months failed and got fired. He didn't have enough time to do major damage (as Solskjaer did for example).
Did Moyes bashed club after he was fired or something?
Yeah it's after the Euros where he struggled as well as Ole bringing him back too early during that same season instead of playing Bailly.I don't know why people keep saying this.
The incident in Greece happened after his first season. Yes, he did struggle a bit for a month or so after that, but he then went on to be much better in his second season than he was in his first.
Or worse. Stats are not a good way to assess a player either way.Stats always make players look better than they actually are.
I think it’s a factor. As someone else posted, the ramifications are still going on. He has still got a retrial to go through. The weight of carrying these things tends to grow over time. His account of what happened there is pretty terrible.I don't know why people keep saying this.
The incident in Greece happened after his first season. Yes, he did struggle a bit for a month or so after that, but he then went on to be much better in his second season than he was in his first.
He reached a higher level in 20/21 but he was more consistent in 19/20, at least that's how I remember it.I don't know why people keep saying this.
The incident in Greece happened after his first season. Yes, he did struggle a bit for a month or so after that, but he then went on to be much better in his second season than he was in his first.
Probably the Super bowl as well if we get a decent CB in too.This is shaping up to be the best transfer window I can recall.
Maguire and Fred out, I’m not glad to see DeGea gone but I am excited to see Onana revolutionize our approach, Mount, Onana, Hojland, and possibly Amrabat in. And with Garnacho fully integrated and maybe Pellistri as well, we finally have a red hot attack, mobile and creative mids, and monsters in defense.
We are winning the league, the Kentucky Derby, and possibly the Ryder Cup. Can’t wait!
I wish people could just stop saying Maguire has turned bad just because of the abuses. He's been still pretty good for England because Southgate plays the football that suites him well.Maguire is a case study in how targeted propaganda can cause lasting damage.
The earlier post was about our best players post SAF in general and it was posted in 2021, so in comparison to other competitors during such period, of course back then Smalling and Maguire were our best defenders in comparison to others who played that position from the period 2013-2021. That doesn't make them good players. They were just better than shit.Smalling played for Roma 2021. It was mainly Lindelof who partnered Maguire 2020/21 and they had decents stats, less than 1 goal conceded per game if I remember correctly. Maguire was one of our best players that season, in comparison to all our players not just defenders.
It will need to be done by tomorrow afternoon at the latest. Can't see it myself.We're expecting this to go through in time for the weekend right? Have to imagine Harry starts for West Ham right off the bat
Man, just imagine if we’re there to at least compete for the trophy. Good times ahead.Probably the Super bowl as well if we get a decent CB in too.
If you are not on a wind up then you just lowered the average IQ of posters on the Caf by a ridiculous amount.What if West Ham do a Leicester this season and win the PL with Maguire as Captain?