Manchester United vs Tottenham (Thu 25th July, 12:30 UK time)

[Havak]

Expecting Gomes and Greenwood to be given a good amount of time, possibly start and play 60 minutes? I hope so anyway. I assume we will see more of Fred and maybe some of Darmian as they're further behind than pretty much everyone else. Chong and Lindelof will probably sit this one out or only play a small part in the latter stages after their knocks. I could be totally wrong though and TuOle is trying to use the players he expects to start the season for us from now.

Romero
Darmian Smalling Rojo Young
Pereira Fred
Mata Gomes Martial
Greenwood​

Sub on J.Pereira, Dalot, Tuanzebe, Bailly, Jones, Pogba, Lingard, Garner, McTominay, James, and Rashford after an hour.

If Darmian isn't involved then I'll assume a deal is almost done to let him move on.

We still have another two games where I'd like to see certain players maybe get 90 minutes, I see this as the last time to be changing entire XI's at 45-60 minutes and making sure everyone is involved. Once we get to the last two games, I'd rather de Gea, Wan-Bissaka, Lindelof, Shaw, McTominay, Pogba, Rashford, and Martial play the whole lot as I think they should be starting against Chelsea from what I've seen so far. The other spots are much more up for grabs which is why I think getting a look at as many as possible against a Premier League team is a good shout. This game is very much a fitness test still, the next two games are more where I think Ole should be considering his first XI.

 

[LingiBW]

De Gea
AWB Smalling (Bailly if not fit) Lindelof Shaw
McTominay Fred
Greenwood Rashford Martial

I know we are further ahead of Spurs this pre-season, but not enough to have Pogba sit out

 

[TwoSheds]

I know we are further ahead of Spurs this pre-season, but not enough to have Pogba sit out

Who cares, it's just match fitness, let's see what Fred's got. Also, imagine the wagging tongues of all the transfer tits!

 

[LingiBW]

Who cares, it's just match fitness, let's see what Fred's got. Also, imagine the wagging tongues of all the transfer tits!

i get you mate, i was more on the fact that you had us play with 10 men, but i guess the joke didn't register as well as i thought it would

 

[ManchesterYoda]

I want to see Garner be given a chance. I want another proper look at Gomes as no.10 again too.

Front 6 for 60 mins I would like to see

Greenwood
James - Gomes - Chong
Fred - Garner​

 

[mitchmouse]

the papers are a bit slow.. surely this will be when we bid for Toby A....

 

[Red_toad]

Rashford
Martial Gomes
Pogba
Fred McTommy
Shaw Jones Bailly Wan-Bissaka
De Gea
​

To start the game, then a lot of changes in the 2nd half I'd imagine.

 

[TwoSheds]

i get you mate, i was more on the fact that you had us play with 10 men, but i guess the joke didn't register as well as i thought it would

Fair point! Alcohol is a helluva drug.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Goalkeepers: David De Gea, Lee Grant, Joel Pereira, Sergio Romero, Dean Henderson

Confirm Dean's joining this tour?

Or this is a case of OP want him to.

 

[Samid]

Confirm Dean's joining this tour?

Or this is a case of OP want him to.

Official word was that he was joining the Asian leg of the tour. Not my problem if he hasn't joined up.

 

[Oldyella]

Hope Gomes gets a decent run out after only coming on at the death against Inter.

 

[Tomuś]

Aren't you guys pretty early into pre-season though?

Nah I believe we have had three games so far . We are definitely more match fit than Spurs players who I believe are pretty early into pre-season. I am not sure though. I recalled pochettino getting Spurs to the champions league final without spending anything last season. A final they dominated and should have won, so perhaps due to that, they had a late pre-season.

Kostur thinks Amadeus is a Spurs fan while Amadeus reckons Kostur is a neutral.

 

[mattunited1978]

Hate playing English teams in pre season

 

[ivaldo]

Nah I believe we have had three games so far . We are definitely more match fit than Spurs players who I believe are pretty early into pre-season. I am not sure though. I recalled pochettino getting Spurs to the champions league final without spending anything last season. A final they dominated and should have won, so perhaps due to that, they had a late pre-season.

You should recall Poch getting incredibly fortunate along the way too.

 

[IrishRedDevil]

Confirm Dean's joining this tour?

Or this is a case of OP want him to.

He's not joining up. It was confirmed mid last week.

 

[lukepowell1988]

Was really impressed with Chong over the last few games so hoping to see him and Gomes start

 

[romufc]

Why is everyone so keen to play smalling? Surely by now we know exactly what he does? Why not see what Tuanzebe can do against spurs?

This is a good test to see how far we are ?

 

[Amadaeus]

You should recall Poch getting incredibly fortunate along the way too.

You don’t get fortunate when you beat the favorites and have the right calls go your way. Scoring three at the Eithad and keeping a clean sheet at home is not luck. Moreover, dominating Ajax overall when all things concluded and putting on an impressive display against the bundesliga first place team at the time. Pochettino organized Spurs perfectly and if he had more quality, he would have done the unthinkable and won the champions league.

 

[ivaldo]

You don’t get fortunate when you beat the favorites and have the right calls go your way. Scoring three at the Eithad and keeping a clean sheet at home is not luck. Moreover, dominating Ajax overall when all things concluded and putting on an impressive display against the bundesliga first place team at the time. Pochettino organized Spurs perfectly and if he had more quality, he would have done the unthinkable and won the champions league.

But you call it unfortunate when Spurs lose in the final to the eventual winners? Spurs only qualified for knockouts because key results elsewhere went their way, and only then they advanced with the smallest points tally of any team, and relied on head to head results. In the knockouts they made it only because of missed penalties and extremely dubious VAR decisions after being battered by City, and an over reliance on their star striker at key moments. It was far from tactical perfection. This isn't an unpopular opinion.

 

[SATA]

Spurs were pretty good against Juventus for their first pre-season game. But we are quite ahead of them in terms of sharpness and fitness so i expect us to start and finish the match strongly

 

[Seven Seas Sardines]

De Gea
AWB - Axel - Lindelof - Shaw
Pogba - McTominay
Greenwood - Mata - Rashford
Martial​

Why did you have to go and ruin a perfectly good lineup? Having Mata on the pitch when we're pressing is suicide.

 

[Amadaeus]

But you call it unfortunate when Spurs lose in the final to the eventual winners? Spurs only qualified for knockouts because key results elsewhere went their way, and only then they advanced with the smallest points tally of any team, and relied on head to head results. In the knockouts they made it only because of missed penalties and extremely dubious VAR decisions after being battered by City, and an over reliance on their star striker at key moments. It was far from tactical perfection. This isn't an unpopular opinion.

Yea because Spurs was the better team most of the time, which was the same narrative towards most teams they beat to get to their final. If City battered Spurs, they would have gone true. Spurs matched City and scored three and had a goal rightfully called of. They qualified for knockout because they did what they had to do and others things didn’t. Getting a point against Barcelona at home is a great feat and they did that to get through. There was no dubious Var decision, they were all correct and an over reliance on a star striker? Kane missed some important matches for them and where would Barcelona be without Messi and Ronaldo without Juventus and so on. It was tactical perfection a lot of times as they dominakey stats numerous games and in the champions league final as well.

 

[ivaldo]

Yea because Spurs was the better team most of the time, which was the same narrative towards most teams they beat to get to their final. If City battered Spurs, they would have gone true. Spurs matched City and scored three and had a goal rightfully called of. They qualified for knockout because they did what they had to do and others things didn’t. Getting a point against Barcelona at home is a great feat and they did that to get through. There was no dubious Var decision, they were all correct and an over reliance on a star striker? Kane missed some important matches for them and where would Barcelona be without Messi and Ronaldo without Juventus and so on. It was tactical perfection a lot of times as they dominakey stats numerous games and in the champions league final as well.

Then you use the same logic for the final. You can’t have it both ways. Either Spurs were unfortunate in the final, in which case they were incredibly fortunate just to reach it, or they weren’t unfortunate and therefore got soundly beaten. Incredible how you can’t see your own hypocrisy.

They were outplayed several times on the way to the final. Llorentes goal should not have stood. Kane’s double against PSV, which included a double deflection, was a game they should’ve won comfortably, as was the loss against Inter. Poch’s ‘tactical perfection’ relied on other teams doing them a favour, random rebounds, opposition imploding, a handball goal. Spurs own players admit they were lucky, they admit Liverpool are the ‘yardstick.’ They had been within 10 minutes of being knocked out of the champions league on FIVE separate occasions, and it wasn’t Poch’s ‘tactical perfection’ which lead to their survival.

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

I’m doing a 5 day trek to Machu Picchu on Thursday morning so I’ll miss both this and the next game. Will have no idea of performances or anything.

Hope to come back to Wifi to see Greenwood continue his form and Gomes getting some good game time.

 

[Scroto Baggins]

Spurs were pretty good against Juventus for their first pre-season game. But we are quite ahead of them in terms of sharpness and fitness so i expect us to start and finish the match strongly

Yeah I think we should be able to get a result. Not sure how much of a part fitness will play. Given both teams probably change most players at half time.

But we should definitely be sharper than Spurs. Had more time to dust off the cobwebs.

They put out a very young team vs Juve. Didnt recognise a lot of the names.

 

[klayton88]

 

[Amadaeus]

Then you use the same logic for the final. You can’t have it both ways. Either Spurs were unfortunate in the final, in which case they were incredibly fortunate just to reach it, or they weren’t unfortunate and therefore got soundly beaten. Incredible how you can’t see your own hypocrisy.

They were outplayed several times on the way to the final. Llorentes goal should not have stood. Kane’s double against PSV, which included a double deflection, was a game they should’ve won comfortably, as was the loss against Inter. Poch’s ‘tactical perfection’ relied on other teams doing them a favour, random rebounds, opposition imploding, a handball goal. Spurs own players admit they were lucky, they admit Liverpool are the ‘yardstick.’ They had been within 10 minutes of being knocked out of the champions league on FIVE separate occasions, and it wasn’t Poch’s ‘tactical perfection’ which lead to their survival.

I don’t know what inconsistency you are talking about. Leading up to the finals and in the finals, Spurs was dominant in several vital statistics against most teams. The llorente goal should have stood, var checked it and they concluded it wasn’t handball. The Sissoko handball on the other hand would not have stood with the new handball rule, so pochettino was unfortunate in the finals not only because his team was better but also because of a handball that ruined the game.

When you referred to Spurs performance in the group stage, you see it as opposition imploding, but Spurs still had to get results. Those result were not by luck as they outplayed most of the teams they came up against. When they needed a point against Barcelona, they managed to do that even against all odds stacked against them. It was a tactical masterclass by Pochettino to get them out of the group stage and then they showed their dominance against some of the best teams in Europe without some of their key players. No manager in the world would have done what pochettino did last season with that Spurs team.

 

[ivaldo]

I don’t know what inconsistency you are talking about. Leading up to the finals and in the finals, Spurs was dominant in several vital statistics against most teams. The llorente goal should have stood, var checked it and they concluded it wasn’t handball. The Sissoko handball on the other hand would not have stood with the new handball rule, so pochettino was unfortunate in the finals not only because his team was better but also because of a handball that ruined the game.

When you referred to Spurs performance in the group stage, you see it as opposition imploding, but Spurs still had to get results. Those result were not by luck as they outplayed most of the teams they came up against. When they needed a point against Barcelona, they managed to do that even against all odds stacked against them. It was a tactical masterclass by Pochettino to get them out of the group stage and then they showed their dominance against some of the best teams in Europe without some of their key players. No manager in the world would have done what pochettino did last season with that Spurs team.

What inconsistency? They had 1 point in their first 3 games. They lost, what, 5 games? They were within 10 minutes of going out of the competition on 5 separate occasions.

They had to get results because it had been a train wreck up until the last day of the groups stages. They went through with a 33% win rate in a group that, along with Barca, should’ve advanced through comfortably. But yeah, a tactical masterclass what are you smoking? Spurs were outplayed several times throughout the tournament and Poch got his tactics wrong on numerous occasions, too. You don’t lose that often, you don’t rely on incorrect decisions, double deflections and teams imploding to advance pal. Or are you telling me Poch planned all this? You’ve got to be WUMing at this point.

They checked it with VAR and still got it wrong, hence why they are looking to simplify the rules in avoid confusion.

 

[Alemar]

De Gea
AWB Smalling (Bailly if not fit) Lindelof Shaw
McTominay Fred
Greenwood Rashford Martial

Why do you think we will only field 10 players instead of 11?

 

[ayushreddevil9]

Why do you think we will only field 10 players instead of 11?

The 11th will be lingard, who offers close to feck all so i don't see any problem with that lineup.

 

[Amadaeus]

What inconsistency? They had 1 point in their first 3 games. They lost, what, 5 games? They were within 10 minutes of going out of the competition on 5 separate occasions.

You stated that I was being inconsistent with regards to their fortune before and after the finals and I explained how that wasn’t the case. They had 1 point in their first due to having a slow start. It has nothing to do with being fortunate. Spurs got the results needed due to getting the better of the teams in the second half of the group stage. Being fortunate is when they get completely outplayed and still get the victory. That was not the case for pochettino as they deserved most of the results they got.

They had to get results because it had been a train wreck up until the last day of the groups stages. They went through with a 33% win rate in a group that, along with Barca, should’ve advanced through comfortably. But yeah, a tactical masterclass what are you smoking? Spurs were outplayed several times throughout the tournament and Poch got his tactics wrong on numerous occasions, too. You don’t lose that often, you don’t rely on incorrect decisions, double deflections and teams imploding to advance pal. Or are you telling me Poch planned all this? You’ve got to be WUMing at this point.

Spurs should have advanced comfortably. You must be high. Pochettino has the toughest group stage in the tournament with Inter Milian, Barcelona and psv amongst them. These are not teams that Spurs could easily advance against. . You keep referring to the group stage, but they were slow starters then and got results when they had to. If Spurs lost as much as they did, they would not be in the finals or qualify for the knockout. The fact is that the team in that group was tough and Pochettino could not guarantee a victory every game because he was not coming up against the likes of young boys, AEK, pilzen and other easy team. If pochettino didn’t have such a difficult group stage he would have comfortably went through. Yet, your focus is on the group stage where Spurs had the toughest group in the competition. It is a weak argument.

They checked it with VAR and still got it wrong, hence why they are looking to simplify the rules in avoid confusion.

Nah, they checked it with var and he still got it right. You need to read the rules. Let me post it here for you:

“
Law 12 deals with fouls and misconduct, and the relevant passage for handball reads that a direct free kick will be awarded if a player handles the ball deliberately (other than the goalkeeper in the penalty area)”

Given Llorente’s body position, in which he is clearly competing for the header and misses, it’s hard to argue that the positioning of his hand is a deliberate attempt to handle the ball, even if the incident resulted in a goal.

So.......mate, I know you don’t want to admit how good Pochettino is but now you are gaslighting.

 

[Sweech]

I hope both teams play several youngsters as I think there's opportunities in both teams for some youth to come through this season and play some meaningful minutes. Then it's just a hope that those players grab the opportunity in games like this.

For Spurs I'd highlight DM Oliver Skipp (imo MOTM against Juventus), ST Troy Parrott, and CB Japhet Tanganga.

I know about Mason Greenwood, are there any others who I should look out for that could possibly get minutes for you this season?

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

I hope both teams play several youngsters as I think there's opportunities in both teams for some youth to come through this season and play some meaningful minutes. Then it's just a hope that those players grab the opportunity in games like this.

For Spurs I'd highlight DM Oliver Skipp (imo MOTM against Juventus), ST Troy Parrott, and CB Japhet Tanganga.

I know about Mason Greenwood, are there any others who I should look out for that could possibly get minutes for you this season?

Hopefully Gomes, Chong and Garner. Obviously Tuanzebe if we dont send him on loan.

 

[Sweech]

Hopefully Gomes, Chong and Garner. Obviously Tuanzebe if we dont send him on loan.

Anyone willing to give me a bit of a run down on them? I've known about Tahith Chong and Angel Gomes as they were very highly rated at 15/16 but I haven't really paid attention to their development since then. I know almost nothing about Garner. Anyone think he's got a shot at playing in your midfield this season as it looks a little light at this current moment?

 

[eltigreFalcao]

to be fair that statement is somewhat factual. However, Ole can make a name for himself this season if he continues to trust in youth, learn how to motivate his players to consistently perform at a high level and stick to a gameplan that gets result.

Ole is being supported by the board and if we get Maguire and Bruno/Longstaff then I have no doubt that he will do well this season.

In regards to this game, it will be a good match. I believe our squad depth will be proven to be superior as we alternate teams in both half.

To be honest, I could give one of the two the legendary status many times more than the other one, even though he's havent had that many chances of coaching top flight clubs...

 

[the hea]

Would love to see this team given 60 minutes.
I think it is our strongest eleven right now.

DDG

AWB Lindelöf Tuanzebe Shaw

McTominay Pogba

Greewood Gomes Martial

Rashford​

 

[ivaldo]

You stated that I was being inconsistent with regards to their fortune before and after the finals and I explained how that wasn’t the case. They had 1 point in their first due to having a slow start. It has nothing to do with being fortunate. Spurs got the results needed due to getting the better of the teams in the second half of the group stage. Being fortunate is when they get completely outplayed and still get the victory. That was not the case for pochettino as they deserved most of the results they got.


Spurs should have advanced comfortably. You must be high. Pochettino has the toughest group stage in the tournament with Inter Milian, Barcelona and psv amongst them. These are not teams that Spurs could easily advance against. . You keep referring to the group stage, but they were slow starters then and got results when they had to. If Spurs lost as much as they did, they would not be in the finals or qualify for the knockout. The fact is that the team in that group was tough and Pochettino could not guarantee a victory every game because he was not coming up against the likes of young boys, AEK, pilzen and other easy team. If pochettino didn’t have such a difficult group stage he would have comfortably went through. Yet, your focus is on the group stage where Spurs had the toughest group in the competition. It is a weak argument.



Nah, they checked it with var and he still got it right. You need to read the rules. Let me post it here for you:

“
Law 12 deals with fouls and misconduct, and the relevant passage for handball reads that a direct free kick will be awarded if a player handles the ball deliberately (other than the goalkeeper in the penalty area)”

Given Llorente’s body position, in which he is clearly competing for the header and misses, it’s hard to argue that the positioning of his hand is a deliberate attempt to handle the ball, even if the incident resulted in a goal.

So.......mate, I know you don’t want to admit how good Pochettino is but now you are gaslighting.

No you didnt explain, I outlined your hyprocisy, and you've just plowed ahead with it anyway. I wasn't discussing their fortunate after the finals. Why would I discuss that? Nice strawman.

Wait. You admit they had a 'poor start' and yet you say Poch was tactically 'perfect,' that if was a 'masterclass.' You argue they weren't inconsistent. Yup. Flawless logic.

Going through purely on the back of a double deflection isn't fortunate? Having to rely on other teams to do you favours isn't fortunate? Sure chief.

Inter finished 4th in the league behind bleedin' Atlanta, and over 20 points behind Juve. This isn't the 90s you know. It was no more difficult than group C, E and H. They should have advanced, comfortably. Failure to do so would have been considered very poor, and to have to rely on other teams to do him favours demonstrates how periously close that came to reality.

My focus is on the whole tournament, due to your claim it was a tactical masterclass. If you don't want to discuss the whole tournament then don't make claims relating to the whole tournament? Again, you've claim Spurs were unfortunate in the final but flatly refuse to apply that same logic throughout the rest of the tournament. You've ignored my point yet again that they were within 10 minutes of going out on FIVE separate occasions because, yet again, it doesn't fit your warped perception of what actually happened.

So mate... Perfection hey? Masterclass hey? Poch's mum hey?

 

[TwoSheds]

No you didnt explain, I outlined your hyprocisy, and you've just plowed ahead with it anyway. I wasn't discussing their fortunate after the finals. Why would I discuss that? Nice strawman.

Wait. You admit they had a 'poor start' and yet you say Poch was tactically 'perfect,' that if was a 'masterclass.' You argue they weren't inconsistent. Yup. Flawless logic.

Going through purely on the back of a double deflection isn't fortunate? Having to rely on other teams to do you favours isn't fortunate? Sure chief.

Inter finished 4th in the league behind bleedin' Atlanta, and over 20 points behind Juve. This isn't the 90s you know. It was no more difficult than group C, E and H. They should have advanced, comfortably. Failure to do so would have been considered very poor, and to have to rely on other teams to do him favours demonstrates how periously close that came to reality.

My focus is on the whole tournament, due to your claim it was a tactical masterclass. If you don't want to discuss the whole tournament then don't make claims relating to the whole tournament? Again, you've claim Spurs were unfortunate in the final but flatly refuse to apply that same logic throughout the rest of the tournament. You've ignored my point yet again that they were within 10 minutes of going out on FIVE separate occasions because, yet again, it doesn't fit your warped perception of what actually happened.

So mate... Perfection hey? Masterclass hey? Poch's mum hey?

Relax, it's fine.

 

[ivaldo]

Relax, it's fine.

It was a bit tense.

 

[WireMUFC]

1st half:

Romero

AWB - Bailly - Lindelof - Shaw

Pogba - Mctominay

Greenwood - Lingard - James

Rashford

Subs on 60-70:

De Gea

Tuanzebe - Jones - Rojo - Dalot

Pereira - Fred

Chong - Mata - Gomes

Martial