Mikel Arteta | Lego Pep watch

RacingClub

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Well let me put this way, if I were an Arsenal fan I would be saying the guy has been here for 2.5 years now, more or less it's his squad.
Yeah I'd agree with you here, it's his squad now.

Only Klopp and Pep from top 6 has spent more time than him at their respective club so my goal is top 4 or bust or europa win or bust.
Fair enough.


I just don't buy that no one can do what he has done in 2.5 years.
Don't get me wrong I do believe that there are plenty of other managers in world football who could have done a similar job.

The problem is convincing the ones who could do a better job to come to Arsenal.

If it all goes pearshaped for Arteta this season I really do believe that he will leave the club in a better place than he found it (comparing the squads /obviously paid large amounts of money for but that's Football) and the next manager will have a higher base to build from (and if they discover the next Klopp could turn them into a Top 4 club).
 

AshRK

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Yeah I'd agree with you here, it's his squad now.



Fair enough.




Don't get me wrong I do believe that there are plenty of other managers in world football who could have done a similar job.

The problem is convincing the ones who could do a better job to come to Arsenal.

If it all goes pearshaped for Arteta this season I really do believe that he will leave the club in a better place than he found it (comparing the squads /obviously paid large amounts of money for but that's Football) and the next manager will have a higher base to build from (and if they discover the next Klopp could turn them into a Top 4 club).
Again it depends on how he leaves the club. This was the same argument with Ole when people said he will leave the squad in a better shape, but then he continued to stay and left a more , how to put it, complicated task for his successor. He should have left at the end of the season before, after the europa loss to Villareal and he would have been remembered much fondly.

Same could happen with Arteta. The likes of Saka, Martinelli, Tierney may say enough is enough and we want to leave and play CL. This is why they have to be very careful. Things change pretty quick in football.
 

GifLord

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Bottled a top 4 race when he had no European cups to play in - no tricky long away flights. Basically had 1 game per week since end of January and yet still complained about fixture congestion in March.
Seems like there's gonna be a few surprised faces here when he fails miserably.
 

Dancfc

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1. City
2. Liverpool
3. Spurs
4. Man Utd
5. Chelsea
6. Arsenal

I think Chelsea will struggle this year but they're a better team than Arsenal still. Obviously my prediction about United is pulled out of my hole, who knows but we certainly have some top players which I'm not sure you could say Arsenal do.
I'd be wary if you either appointed a manager who would dumb down the system to suit a lot of your limited players (as even Ole got somewhat decent results doing that) or gave ETH all the players he needed to make his football work (probably need about 10-13).

However I feel him trying to get your current squad (even with De Jong) playing the style of football we saw with his peak Ajax side has the potential to get very messy.
 

TwoSheds

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I'd be wary if you either appointed a manager who would dumb down the system to suit a lot of your limited players (as even Ole got somewhat decent results doing that) or gave ETH all the players he needed to make his football work (probably need about 10-13).

However I feel him trying to get your current squad (even with De Jong) playing the style of football we saw with his peak Ajax side has the potential to get very messy.
Although he has a clear style of play I think his track record also shows he can be pragmatic and work out what compromises to make based on the players he has. Clearly it's very much not an easy job and yes it could go badly but I think he's going to do ok personally.
 

awop

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It's not just the incomings that he's been massively backed on but also the outgoings as well.

Aubameyang, Ozil and Kolasinac were all paid off to leave, would have been the same for Willian as well but amazingly he waived the £20m owed to him. He's binned off a 23 year old French international for £9m, had they played that one a bit smarter maybe they wouldn't be coming up short for Raphinha and/or Martinez. He's not doing a bad job overall and they are moving in the right direction but at the same time there's no guarantee they'll actually reach their desired destination.
That we bought for 7m and proved to be an international tw*t. And i fail to see how he's in any way linked to Raphinha or Martinez ? You think these 2 won't be coming because we didn't have enough money ?
 

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Now it doesn't seem too bad to bring in Jesus for 45m with the striker/wide forward market today. Edu still has a lot of work to do to find buyers for players on loan and unwanted players.
 

GoonerInPeace

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Dont understand the hate he gets. He has done better than Emery and Wenger in his final seasons. There is actually come belief among Arsenal fans. He has already picked up a trophy & with a core of around 13 players, only two of which were over 24 years old, almost nicked 4th place ahead of Spurs.

Mind you this year is a big year for Arteta. People are talking about the fact we will have more games to play this year, and we know this, which is why this season the incomings are Jesus, Vieira, Saliba, and outgoing Lacazette. We will sign more players, two at least & aside form Pepe, there doesn't appear to be any major outgoings form the first team asdie from the loanees.

Much of our progress will come form the players already at the club. Saka, Odegaard, ESR, Martinelli need to go to the next level. White and Gabriel need to build on thier partnership, which they will need to as Saliba is a fantastic young defender.

the CL places will be between Arsenal, Man United, Chelsea and Tottenham. I dont know why Arsenal are being written off. Its the kind of commentary you would expect from someone as dense as Gary Neville. W=Tottenham piped us by 2 points and Chelsea by 5. Were not talking 20 point deficits here.
 

roonster09

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Mind you this year is a big year for Arteta. People are talking about the fact we will have more games to play this year, and we know this, which is why this season the incomings are Jesus, Vieira, Saliba, and outgoing Lacazette. We will sign more players, two at least & aside form Pepe, there doesn't appear to be any major outgoings form the first team asdie from the loanees.
When people say more games, they don't mean just players. Biggest issue with more games is lack of preparation time. Arteta had a week to prepare for each game, now he will barely get time to prepare for league game.
 

::sonny::

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Dont understand the hate he gets. He has done better than Emery and Wenger in his final seasons. There is actually come belief among Arsenal fans. He has already picked up a trophy & with a core of around 13 players, only two of which were over 24 years old, almost nicked 4th place ahead of Spurs.

Mind you this year is a big year for Arteta. People are talking about the fact we will have more games to play this year, and we know this, which is why this season the incomings are Jesus, Vieira, Saliba, and outgoing Lacazette. We will sign more players, two at least & aside form Pepe, there doesn't appear to be any major outgoings form the first team asdie from the loanees.

Much of our progress will come form the players already at the club. Saka, Odegaard, ESR, Martinelli need to go to the next level. White and Gabriel need to build on thier partnership, which they will need to as Saliba is a fantastic young defender.

the CL places will be between Arsenal, Man United, Chelsea and Tottenham. I dont know why Arsenal are being written off. Its the kind of commentary you would expect from someone as dense as Gary Neville. W=Tottenham piped us by 2 points and Chelsea by 5. Were not talking 20 point deficits here.
He is a good man, and I like the way they are building the squad, a successful project in the next years
 

Iker Quesadillas

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Dont understand the hate he gets. He has done better than Emery and Wenger in his final seasons.
Emery only had 1 full season at Arsenal, and it was better than either of Arteta's two full seasons (more points, better goal difference, Europa League final).

He has already picked up a trophy & with a core of around 13 players, only two of which were over 24 years old, almost nicked 4th place ahead of Spurs.
Arteta picked up a trophy in his first six months, with a squad that his defenders say was actually terrible and needed to be torn apart and rebuilt. Since he's began to rebuild the squad in his image, Arsenal have won nothing. You can present this as favorable to Arteta, but another person could see it very differently.
 
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Rajiztar

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Dont understand the hate he gets. He has done better than Emery and Wenger in his final seasons. There is actually come belief among Arsenal fans. He has already picked up a trophy & with a core of around 13 players, only two of which were over 24 years old, almost nicked 4th place ahead of Spurs.

Mind you this year is a big year for Arteta. People are talking about the fact we will have more games to play this year, and we know this, which is why this season the incomings are Jesus, Vieira, Saliba, and outgoing Lacazette. We will sign more players, two at least & aside form Pepe, there doesn't appear to be any major outgoings form the first team asdie from the loanees.

Much of our progress will come form the players already at the club. Saka, Odegaard, ESR, Martinelli need to go to the next level. White and Gabriel need to build on thier partnership, which they will need to as Saliba is a fantastic young defender.

the CL places will be between Arsenal, Man United, Chelsea and Tottenham. I dont know why Arsenal are being written off. Its the kind of commentary you would expect from someone as dense as Gary Neville. W=Tottenham piped us by 2 points and Chelsea by 5. Were not talking 20 point deficits here.
Well you are fighting for places among 5,6,7,8 again. Not top 4. Come back when you finish above 5th with arteta as your manager.
 

The holy trinity 68

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The worrying thing with Arteta is that the team of players cost so much money, yet the team is still extremely average. Arteta has done a remarkable job of lowering expectations. He has done worse than Emery yet is allowed to spend far more money. The club would have been far better and benefitted more by backing Emery.

The cost of the players currently at the club, not including home grown players values is £396m. The team still being mediocre after that amount of money spent is crazy and the way Arteta is given so much leeway is baffling.

Fabio Viera £31.5m
Matt Turner £5.7m
Marquinhos £3.15m
White £52.65m
Odegaard £31.5m
Ramsdale £25m
Tomiyasu £16.7m
Lokonga £15.75m
Tavares £7.2m
Trusty £1.6m
Partey £45
Gabriel £23.4m
Mari £5.4m
Pepe £72m
Saliba £27m
Tierney £24.3m
Martinelli £6.4m
Runarsson £1.8m
 
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Varun1

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The worrying thing with Arteta is that the team of players cost so much money, yet the team is still extremely average. Arteta has done a remarkable job of lowering expectations. He has done worse than Emery yet is allowed to spend far more money. The club would have been far better and benefitted more by backing Emery.

The cost of the players currently at the club, not including home grown players values is £396m. The team still being mediocre after that amount of money spent is crazy and the way Arteta is given so much leeway is baffling.

Fabio Viera £31.5m
Matt Turner £5.7m
Marquinhos £3.15m
White £52.65m
Odegaard £31.5m
Ramsdale £25m
Tomiyasu £16.7m
Lokonga £15.75m
Tavares £7.2m
Trusty £1.6m
Partey £45
Gabriel £23.4m
Mari £5.4m
Pepe £72m
Saliba £27m
Tierney £24.3m
Martinelli £6.4m
Runarsson £1.8m
You're missing Cedryc, who cost around 5m.
 

GoonerBear

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The worrying thing with Arteta is that the team of players cost so much money, yet the team is still extremely average. Arteta has done a remarkable job of lowering expectations. He has done worse than Emery yet is allowed to spend far more money. The club would have been far better and benefitted more by backing Emery.

The cost of the players currently at the club, not including home grown players values is £403m. The team still being mediocre after that amount of money spent is crazy and the way Arteta is given so much leeway is baffling.

Fabio Viera £31.5m
Matt Turner £5.7m
Marquinhos £3.15m
White £52.65m
Odegaard £31.5m
Ramsdale £25m
Tomiyasu £16.7m
Lokonga £15.75m
Tavares £7.2m
Trusty £1.6m
Partey £45
Gabriel £23.4m
Mari £5.4m
Pepe £72m
Saliba £27m
Tierney £24.3m
Martinelli £6.4m
Runarsson £1.8m
Soares £7.2m
And how does that compare to the costs of the rest of the top 6 squads if you want to do it that way?
 

The holy trinity 68

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And how does that compare to the costs of the rest of the top 6 squads if you want to do it that way?
I am comparing his spending and league finishes to his predecessor Emery. Arteta falls short of Emery performance wise, yet has a more expensive squad and much more transfer backing.

Like I said, Arteta gets a ridiculous amount of leeway and has managed to lower everyones expectations, yet Wenger and Emery were "not good enough" and most pundits and fans alike wanted them replaced. This being while both outperforming Arteta considering the transfer backing.

Also lets compare the costs to the rest of the big 6. Arteta and Arsenal have outspent Liverpool and Spurs in the last 5 years.

I don't mind though, you can keep defending him all you want, but he is just not good enough, but hopefully expectations stay low because it prevent's the club from progressing.
 

JDDL

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I am comparing his spending and league finishes to his predecessor Emery. Arteta falls short of Emery performance wise, yet has a more expensive squad and much more transfer backing.

Like I said, Arteta gets a ridiculous amount of leeway and has managed to lower everyones expectations, yet Wenger and Emery were "not good enough" and most pundits and fans alike wanted them replaced. This being while both outperforming Arteta considering the transfer backing.

Also lets compare the costs to the rest of the big 6. Arteta and Arsenal have outspent Liverpool and Spurs in the last 5 years.

I don't mind though, you can keep defending him all you want, but he is just not good enough, but hopefully expectations stay low because it prevent's the club from progressing.
But your list includes Pepe, who accounts for a lot of that spend and isn't an Arteta signing?
 

awop

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But your list includes Pepe, who accounts for a lot of that spend and isn't an Arteta signing?
My favorite part was the inclusion of Trusty :lol: He's this close to add up the cost of fresh towels in the dressing room.
 

GoonerBear

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I am comparing his spending and league finishes to his predecessor Emery. Arteta falls short of Emery performance wise, yet has a more expensive squad and much more transfer backing.

Like I said, Arteta gets a ridiculous amount of leeway and has managed to lower everyones expectations, yet Wenger and Emery were "not good enough" and most pundits and fans alike wanted them replaced. This being while both outperforming Arteta considering the transfer backing.

Also lets compare the costs to the rest of the big 6. Arteta and Arsenal have outspent Liverpool and Spurs in the last 5 years.

I don't mind though, you can keep defending him all you want, but he is just not good enough, but hopefully expectations stay low because it prevent's the club from progressing.
OK, a couple of observations then.

You have totalled up the amount spent on the current Arsenal squad, not just the players signed by Arteta. Then you compare them to the spend of Spurs & Liverpool the last 5 years, not the cost of their squad, which is a different set of circumstances again.

Emery didn't get sacked because he was 5th & lost a Europa League final. Emery got sacked because Arsenal tactically were all over the place, they were in free fall, and they were conceding 30 shots a game against the likes of Watford, but more importantly, lost the dressing room and quite wrongly became a figure of fun in the dressing room and in the media. Now, everyone realises that Arteta was very lucky to keep his job when he was in a similar situation at the end of 2020.

Plus, how the team and club is viewed from a few years ago is different to now, hence the shifting in strategies.
 
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AshRK

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OK, a couple of observations then.

You have totalled up the amount spent on the current Arsenal squad, not just the players signed by Arteta. Then you compare them to the spend of Spurs & Liverpool the last 5 years, not the cost of their squad, which is a different set of circumstances again.

Emery didn't get sacked because he was 5th & lost a Europa League final. Emery got sacked because Arsenal tactically were all over the place, they were in free fall, and they were conceding 30 shots a game against the likes of Watford, but more importantly, lost the dressing room and quite wrongly became a figure of fun in the dressing room and in the media. Now, everyone realises that Arteta was very lucky to keep his job when he was in a similar situation at the end of 2020.

Plus, how the team and club is viewed from a few years ago is different to now, hence the shifting in strategies.
Yes emery had some horrible games but so has arteta. You are portraying as if arteta delivers tactical masterclass every game. You have become even more boring to watch than in emery times and play such a drab football more often than not.

You may not want to accept it but Arteta has been protected big time which by the way we rival fans are happy about. Long stay Arteta at Arsenal for all I care.
 

GoonerBear

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Yes emery had some horrible games but so has arteta. You are portraying as if arteta delivers tactical masterclass every game. You have become even more boring to watch than in emery times and play such a drab football more often than not.

You may not want to accept it but Arteta has been protected big time which by the way we rival fans are happy about. Long stay Arteta at Arsenal for all I care.
I don't think I've ever called Artetas tactics as a masterclass for any game, never mind every game. I've also just literally said in my previous post that he was lucky to survive that awful start to the previous season so I know he's been protected by the owners much more than Emery has.

I've also said many times I feel sorry for Emery, because one he didn't deserve the treatment he got, and two, he didn't have control over who was brought in like Arteta & Edu have because that was under Sanllehi.
 

Fridge chutney

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When I said upthread that people at this site were obsessed with Arteta, this is what I'm talking about.
What a strange take. We are discussing Arteta in a thread dedicated to Arteta (many managers have threads dedicated to them, especially our historic rivals) and you call that obsessed?
 

Daydreamer

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I don't think I've ever called Artetas tactics as a masterclass for any game, never mind every game. I've also just literally said in my previous post that he was lucky to survive that awful start to the previous season so I know he's been protected by the owners much more than Emery has.

I've also said many times I feel sorry for Emery, because one he didn't deserve the treatment he got, and two, he didn't have control over who was brought in like Arteta & Edu have because that was under Sanllehi.
Bruv, if someone replies to a post where you say Arteta is lucky to have kept his job with “you portray Arteta as delivering a tactical Masterclass every game”, there’s no possibility of a real discussion taking place.
 
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IrishRedDevil

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Piers Morgan is such a fecking waste of space…

In that photo it’s fitting that neither Ronaldo nor the beautiful woman are even looking at him :lol:

Likewise in his Twitter avatar, he’s looking at the Queen, who again, isn’t even looking at him.
While we look at him on an Internet forum.
 

ThierryHenry14

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Still need to bring in a LB and CM in this window, may be a back up GK and RW if Leno and Pepe leave. Edu will be busy.
 

GoonerBear

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I was including the value of the signings still at the club, because Arteta still benefits from them signings regardless of how good they actually are.
The other thing you have done is include new signings, without them having a chance to actually play and influence the team.
 

ThierryFabregas

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The worrying thing with Arteta is that the team of players cost so much money, yet the team is still extremely average. Arteta has done a remarkable job of lowering expectations. He has done worse than Emery yet is allowed to spend far more money. The club would have been far better and benefitted more by backing Emery.

The cost of the players currently at the club, not including home grown players values is £396m. The team still being mediocre after that amount of money spent is crazy and the way Arteta is given so much leeway is baffling.

Fabio Viera £31.5m
Matt Turner £5.7m
Marquinhos £3.15m
White £52.65m
Odegaard £31.5m
Ramsdale £25m
Tomiyasu £16.7m
Lokonga £15.75m
Tavares £7.2m
Trusty £1.6m
Partey £45
Gabriel £23.4m
Mari £5.4m
Pepe £72m
Saliba £27m
Tierney £24.3m
Martinelli £6.4m
Runarsson £1.8m
1. What's the cost of United, City and Chelsea's squad? I'd imagine all those squads are far more expensive

2. Most of these players were replacing old past it players

3. Most of Arteta's signings have been relatively good players

4. These players weren't his buys and were part of the 12th place Arsenal side he took over:

Pepe £72m
Saliba £27m
Tierney £24.3m
Martinelli £6.4m
Runarsson £1.8m
 

ThierryFabregas

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Yes emery had some horrible games but so has arteta. You are portraying as if arteta delivers tactical masterclass every game. You have become even more boring to watch than in emery times and play such a drab football more often than not.

You may not want to accept it but Arteta has been protected big time which by the way we rival fans are happy about. Long stay Arteta at Arsenal for all I care.
You're happy our manager is backed over the descenting players and allowed to rebuild and enforce a new culture. I'm happy you let the dressing room down tools and sack at least your last 3 managers. I'm also happy your entitled fans seem to think your manager should be sacked if he doesn't get at least 4th place despite the major issues with your squad. Long may that continue. It wouldn't have ever happened under SAF and it currently won't happen under Arteta. I believe there's something to say for that.
 

The holy trinity 68

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The other thing you have done is include new signings, without them having a chance to actually play and influence the team.
Okay I am sorry. The Arteta excuses will be used as usual when he fails though.

"Every team above us spent more money", is an excuse that will wear thin pretty easily. I just don't understand why when Wenger and Emery were not excused like Arteta.
 
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