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And wear Nike, so all good.People are going to criticise this but they drive petrol cars so in the end aren't we all Saudi murderers.
And wear Nike, so all good.People are going to criticise this but they drive petrol cars so in the end aren't we all Saudi murderers.
I'm pretty sure life is pretty decent for thousands of slaves that live in Qatar...It's really disgusting how more than a few are lumping Qatar in with Saudi Arabia.
Life in Qatar is pretty decent for nearly everyone if you shut up about politics. In Saudi Arabia you get killed for literally anything you do that doesnt conform with fundamentalist islam, including existing as a non-muslim.
Stop being so ignorant Caf.
It's polemic for sure. Let see how their matchgoers celebrate when Trippier scored a freekick against Madrid.Yes!
This is totally woosh over my head, mate.I don’t know but I think Geoff Shreeves is probably going to want to hold off on reminding players they are banned from the next round of the competition for these Newcastle games.
To be honest it really all started with Roman buying Chelsea. The fact a Russian gangster with close ties to a despot passed the fit and proper persons test opened the door for all sorts of nefarious regimes, criminals, chancers and charlatans to worm their way into English football.It all started when they allowed City to be bought by a state.
Good job. Money over everything I guess?
So if some people display in an immoral way, that is fine? You're basically saying, 'Who cares if people (including kids) have been tortured and killed' because the fans will still celebrate when they score?It's polemic for sure. Let see how their matchgoers celebrate when Trippier scored a freekick against Madrid.
I thought this thread is on Football Forum? I'm questioning from Newcastle fans POV.So if some people display in an immoral way, that is fine? You're basically saying, 'Who cares if people (including kids) have been tortured and killed' because the fans will still celebrate when they score?
I don't get it. Do you agree with them?
And what impact does this have in real life?I actually think it's the opposite. The tribal nature of sports fandom works well for them. Everyone who follows news and politics pretty much know what are the issues with Saudi Arabia. They usually disapprove of it or don't really care and we'd have threads about in the currenr events forum instead of the football forum. If you support Newcastle and you're owned by them, and the new ownership lifts you back into Champions League, you now how a reason to find excuses for the regime and evem if you can't find any, you can always point out the "hypocrisy" of those who criticize your club to play down the issues with your owners.
Ffs.Life in Qatar is pretty decent for nearly everyone if you shut up about politics.
I think changing the way people speak about their country in general is one of the factors for sure. Not just Newcastle and not just online, of course. It's not just Newcastle anyway. For Saudis there's also F1 and golf. I don't think they want to make money off Newcastle.And what impact does this have in real life?
Do you think a factor in Saudi Arabia buying Newcastle was some online fans now defending the regime in online arguments?
So let's pretend Russia is the same as North Korea? This shit actually matters to people's lives. I'm sure if you'd asked Romanians under Ceaucescu (whatever, I cant spell to save my life) if theyd prefer the circumstances in Hungary in the 80's, theyd all say yes. I don't see the point pretending that not being completely free but having food and a roof over your head and not being killed indiscriminately is the same as not being completely free and having a shit life.Ffs.
1. This thread is about SaudisI'm pretty sure life is pretty decent for thousands of slaves that live in Qatar...
I get that laws in KSA are worse than in other arab states but does that mean we shouldn't discuss them as well?
Zilch I would argue I believe this whole argument of Sports Washing simply boils down to football fans overrating their own importance in the grand scheme of things .And what impact does this have in real life?
Do you think a factor in Saudi Arabia buying Newcastle was some online fans now defending the regime in online arguments?
What's your objection?Do we really need this sort of thing on a football forum?
Yes. It’ll probably be on the United forum soon enough.Do we really need this sort of thing on a football forum?
Yeah they have changed it. For worse. Commentary on Saudi Arabia online is much more negative than positive.I think changing the way people speak about their country in general is one of the factors for sure. Not just Newcastle and not just online, of course. It's not just Newcastle anyway. For Saudis there's also F1 and golf. I don't think they want to make money off Newcastle.
Spot on.Zilch I would argue I believe this whole argument of Sports Washing simply boils down to football fans overrating their own importance in the grand scheme of things .
These countries already have a seat at the top table and don't need defending they are well entrenched in power circles where there are Enough world leaders willing and eager to do their bidding , what they are doing is simply diversifying or simple dick swinging .
Chelsea as well. But City started the trend where its more accepted. Its where it became normality.To be honest it really all started with Roman buying Chelsea. The fact a Russian gangster with close ties to a despot passed the fit and proper persons test opened the door for all sorts of nefarious regimes, criminals, chancers and charlatans to worm their way into English football.
What? It’s horrendous. The actions of the dictatorship. End of. Should not be allowed to hollow out a football club for sports washing purposes. End of. Don’t you agree?Yeah there almost seems to be some kind of rejoicing going on here over a tragic event and using it as some kind of point scoring exercise and it’s really quite ugly. The first page is almost entirely “jokes and parody”
It’s not point scoringI think treat it like it would be treated in the Current Events forum, where the point scoring is at least couched in an attempt at decorum.
I don’t know if they care for the “negative/positive”… There is definitely a lot of talk about them. And the football related talk isn’t all negative.Yeah they have changed it. For worse. Commentary on Saudi Arabia online is much more negative than positive.
Ah yes, the decent life of not being able to practice popular suffrage, truly something to aspire to.It's really disgusting how more than a few are lumping Qatar in with Saudi Arabia.
Life in Qatar is pretty decent for nearly everyone if you shut up about politics. In Saudi Arabia you get killed for literally anything you do that doesnt conform with fundamentalist islam, including existing as a non-muslim.
Stop being so ignorant Caf.
And the regime's strategy is what exactly? I want to correlate it to a video of supporters dancingI don’t know if they care for the “negative/positive”… There is definitely a lot of talk about them. And the football related talk isn’t all negative.
Football magazines with millions of followers posting something like this link bellow about Saudi league is actually a positive for the regime’s strategy.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cti6NA5vpWG/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
My guess is they're trying to entrench themselves in Western popular culture to create an aura of legitimacy. That legitimacy may help them to attract more investors to Saudi Arabia. After all, I think the Saudi royals are well aware of the need for diversification.Zilch I would argue I believe this whole argument of Sports Washing simply boils down to football fans overrating their own importance in the grand scheme of things .
These countries already have a seat at the top table and don't need defending they are well entrenched in power circles where there are Enough world leaders willing and eager to do their bidding , what they are doing is simply diversifying or simple dick swinging .
Death penalty is murder by the state. Legal within their frameworks, yes, but immoral for several reasonsIt’s not murder though is it. It’s the death penalty for a rule they broke. I’m not saying it’s right. But I’ve never heard of other countries committing murder for the death penalty.
Good for you thinking that. I personally think it’s incredibly stupid to say people can have a decent life if they don’t discuss politics and we should be okay with that and accept it but you do you.So let's pretend Russia is the same as North Korea? This shit actually matters to people's lives. I'm sure if you'd asked Romanians under Ceaucescu (whatever, I cant spell to save my life) if theyd prefer the circumstances in Hungary in the 80's, theyd all say yes. I don't see the point pretending that not being completely free but having food and a roof over your head and not being killed indiscriminately is the same as not being completely free and having a shit life.
.
1. This thread is about Saudis
2. Why Arab states? What has Qatar got to do with Saudi Arabia? They're both Arab. Okay, makes perfect sense.
I'm sure that distincton will be of solace to the families.It’s not murder though is it. It’s the death penalty for a rule they broke. I’m not saying it’s right. But I’ve never heard of other countries committing murder for the death penalty.
Again we come back to the same point they are already legit for the people who make all these decisions , they aren't seeking acknowledgement or approval from football fans they are just diversifying and preparing for the future . Or they are buying it because they simply can nothing more to it .My guess is they're trying to entrench themselves in Western popular culture to create an aura of legitimacy. That legitimacy may help them to attract more investors to Saudi Arabia. After all, I think the Saudi royals are well aware of the need for diversification.
Those without enough money to grease the pockets of the necessary people that sanction it.If these people can buy a football club who exactly is not allowed to?
Why?Thankfully it has been posted now. Otherwise how would we be aware of this type of issues. Eye opening. I am sure this will motivate a lot of Redcafe posters to change their vote from Qatar to Ineos.
Good, succinct and poignant post.That is an interesting point I have also thought about for a bit. But in the end public image is only a small part of sports washing. It is also about creating dependencies. And it is about creating connections. Getting into the room with the right people. Create an environment wherein favors and bribes can easily be exchanged. Get important people do your bidding. Public image doesn't even have to improve for sports washing to be effective. It is enough to have people dependent on you so they defend you when criticism is voiced.
So do you class any ‘war hero’ as a murderer?I'm sure that distincton will be of solace to the families.
Not technically murder becasue a handful of blokes have made up an unjust law.
They're not yet legit for everyone though.Again we come back to the same point they are already legit for the people who make all these decisions , they aren't seeking acknowledgement or approval from football fans they are just diversifying and preparing for the future . Or they are buying it because they simply can nothing more to it .
It's nice conjecture nothing more but far from reality , all the things mentioned have already happened for these Nations they don't need to buy Football Clubs for that .Good, succinct and poignant post.
These endless no sense comparisons, like this above, aren't something I get into.So do you class any ‘war hero’ as a murderer?
Ok not being argumentative just general question for whom they are not legit not talking about the masses but the power brokers or influential institutions .They're not yet legit for everyone though.
Depends on where they’re venturing and expanding to; evidenced in other sports, there’s vested interest in dipping toes. So yes, it is necessary, especially in terms of expediency.It's nice conjecture nothing more but far from reality , all the things mentioned have already happened for these Nations they don't need to buy Football Clubs for that .