[Bobski]

Juventus had a team full of creative players around him. At United, he and Mata are the only real creative outlets in the side. That's when you see him trying to hog the ball and do Cruyff turns for no apparent reason.

Play him deeper and take the creative burden off him. Lingard is the only man that can bring the best out of Pogba in the squad at the moment. Unfortunately, for United, Pogba's mentality had already been set by the time the sub was made.

Play him deeper and he doesn't want to defend. Play him higher and he slows the whole game down taking too many touches. Buy 3 world class midfielders, play a diamond, give him no responsibility in build up, defensively or leadership and he will deliver 10 goals a season and a pretty highlight reel.

 

[westmeath]

We are a better side when he doesn't play.

There is now little doubt about this.
If I am playing 5 a side and a teammate tries to deliberately score with his hands I lose the plot and probably leave, what’s the point of it if people don’t take it seriously? This is a premier league match and he does that?? I can just imagine what his teammates are thinking. It’s like taking the field with ten men when he plays. Get rid, do not want.

 

[edgar allan]

I think it shows how irrelevant people’s opinions are about players from a league they don’t watch.

I think it also shows for the most part that stats in another league are very far from transferrable to the PL.

 

[edgar allan]

I wouldn't have taken him off, you have hope when players like him are on, no matter how bad they've been before, which he was, but so were the rest, Mata should have been subbed instead imo, he looked like he's reaching the end with us today.

It didn't work out for Mata today for sure but he kept trying to the very end, which is one thing more than Pogba.

 

[breakout67]

Pogba did his fair share of Cruyff turns at Juventus.

Pogba is a luxury player, get players to do the fundamentals of the game for him and he'll add flair to the team.

The quality is there, but the maturity in his game is not.

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

That yellow card he picked up. Just why?

I feel like he needs a serious talk with someone to tell him to cut the BS. Because that yellow card was the dumbest thing I've seen all season from any of our players. What in the world was he going to achieve with that?

I didn't think he was awful, but he's got to grow up. If he doesn't next season, I don't even know.

He's still too much of a 'moments' player.

Remind me what he did - I can't remember the yellow.

 

[C'est Moi Cantona]

It didn't work out for Mata today for sure but he kept trying to the very end, which is one thing more than Pogba.

Pogba didn't stop trying, he just played badly, I like Mata, but he looked 'flat out' all the time, and yet still looked like doing nothing.

We must be doing something wrong with Pogba becasue he is world class imo, and so many of our players look out of sorts it's harsh to single him out.

 

[Dante]

Really? What’s your basis for this observation?

I think it's quite an easy trend to see if you look out for it.

 

[westmeath]

Pogba didn't stop trying, he just played badly, I like Mata, but he looked 'flat out' all the time, and yet still looked like doing nothing.

We must be doing something wrong with Pogba becasue he is world class imo, and so many of our players look out of sorts it's harsh to single him out.

I am struggling to see any evidence that Pogba is world class. What do you base this opinion on?

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Remind me what he did - I can't remember the yellow.

Cross comes into him and it's unreachable, so he puts his hand out trying to score.

It was remarkably stupid. I just don't understand what was going through his head.

 

[BusbyMalone]

There come a point where “it’s ok, he just looks casual because that’s his style of play” ends up as “hold on, maybe he looks casual because he is casual?!?”

He passed that point for me a while ago.

That really is the worry isn't it? And he plays in such a pivotal role, too. He's supposed to be the engine of our team and someones who dictates the pace of the game. Unfortunately he is dictating the pace, and it's very much like his style: languid. And again today, he went into his default mode of holding on to the ball for way too long, taking that extra touch, encouraging the tackle. The lad is infuriating and i'd be lying if i said i wasn't worried.

 

[EverReddy]

Remind me what he did - I can't remember the yellow.

couldn't reach a cross with his head and so stuck his hand out

 

[edgar allan]

Pogba didn't stop trying, he just played badly, I like Mata, but he looked 'flat out' all the time, and yet still looked like doing nothing.

We must be doing something wrong with Pogba becasue he is world class imo, and so many of our players look out of sorts it's harsh to single him out.

I do agree that there were lots of very poor performances today.

He has been so out of sorts on a recurrent basis now so I think there is mounting evidence that Pogba is not the world class player we hoped for.

 

[ti vu]

It didn't work out for Mata today for sure but he kept trying to the very end, which is one thing more than Pogba.

While I agree Pogba is bad, but to use Mata of this game as a stick to bet him is a bit stretching. Mata was too scared to play. Composure out the door. Too afraid to turn his head to assess the situation, just auto pilot back pass, side pass, and even the attempt to shoot, forward passing is more of guessing than by observing movement and position around himself. It's one of those games where he doesn't want the ball when he has his back toward opposition goal.

Pogba didn't stop trying, he just played badly, I like Mata, but he looked 'flat out' all the time, and yet still looked like doing nothing.

We must be doing something wrong with Pogba becasue he is world class imo, and so many of our players look out of sorts it's harsh to single him out.

While Pogba didn't stop trying in a sense he just walked about like Alexis toward the end of this game when being switched to right wing, it's not the same Pogba in own shirt long ago. Pogba is less interested to get involved these days in early build up phase of the play. For the ease to illustrate the point, it's similar to Martial wanting the ball to the pitch in certain area than going hunting for the ball and asked to receive the pass short from our defenders and take reaponsibility to the one who ochestrate our attack. Nowadays, it's predictable that Matic is our sole player to pick the ball from defenders with Pogba positioning himself higher as soon as possible.

 

[Valencia's Left Foot]

I wouldn't have taken him off, you have hope when players like him are on, no matter how bad they've been before, which he was, but so were the rest, Mata should have been subbed instead imo, he looked like he's reaching the end with us today.

Agreed on Mata, just too damn slow for what we need from him. As far as Pogba, if we can get back what we paid for him and have a quality replacement on the hook, than I have no problem with letting him go this summer. If he stays, we need to build around other players; he’s simply not the centerpiece to title winning team. I like the guy, but simply doesnt have that IT level of concentration and determination that great players have.

 

[edgar allan]

While I agree Pogba is bad, but to use Mata of this game as a stick to bet him is a bit stretching. Mata was too scared to play. Composure out the door. Too afraid to turn his head to assess the situation, just auto pilot back pass, side pass, and even the attempt to shoot, forward passing is more of guessing than by observing movement and position around himself. It's one of those games where he doesn't want the ball when he has his back toward opposition goal.

Fair point today.
However I have felt that Mata has contributed more regularly this season than Pogba even if that is faint praise by comparison.

 

[Dante]

It didn't work out for Mata today for sure but he kept trying to the very end, which is one thing more than Pogba.

I think Pogba did try. The problem was that he tried to do too much on his own.

Whatever you do, you can't make him the key player in attacking areas of the pitch or he'll revert to playing like the best 12 year-old amongst his group of mates.

 

[edgar allan]

I think Pogba did try. The problem was that he tried too much.

Whatever you do, you can't make him the key player in attacking areas of the pitch or he'll revert to playing like the best 12 year-old amongst his group of mates.

And he can't play a defensive midfield role ,be a box to box midfielder or perform in a midfield two.....what can he do?

 

[C'est Moi Cantona]

I do agree that there were lots of very poor performances today.

He has been so out of sorts on a recurrent basis now so I think there is mounting evidence that Pogba is not the world class player we hoped for.

We could say that about so many of our players though, does this mean what they are showing is really as good as they are?

More I like to think there is a deeper issue that is causing a lot of very good players to show only fleeting moments of their true ability.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Fair point today.
However I have felt that Mata has contributed more regularly this season than Pogba even if that is faint praise by comparison.

That's an interesting opinion.

I think Mata has been one of our worst outfield players all season. Only Herrera has been worse than him imo(this season).

 

[edgar allan]

We could say that about so many of our players though, does this mean what they are showing is really as good as they are?

More I like to think there is a deeper issue that is causing a lot of very good players to show only fleeting moments of their true ability.

You know I really want to believe that,I have expressed it many times but now I am not so sure.

 

[edgar allan]

That's an interesting opinion.

I think Mata has been one of our worst outfield players all season. Only Herrera has been worse than him imo(this season).

He has been very average but compared to Pogba he has been a colossus.

 

[Park's Petrified Pooch]

That's an interesting opinion.

I think Mata has been one of our worst outfield players all season. Only Herrera has been worse than him imo(this season).

Sadly I think I agree with this. He’s been a hindrance at times. The clinical finishing and solid 8-10 assists have been nowhere to be seen. Without those, he has offered nothing.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

He has been very average but compared to Pogba he has been a colossus.

That's very harsh.

Pogba up to the Spurs game was having a much better season than Mata, it's not even a comparison.

And even with his level dropping off since then, he's still been equal to Mata's contributions.

So I don't see how you could think Mata's been a much better performer than Pogba.

It's been his worst season at the club(Mata) and that's saying something considering he's not really impressed in any season since coming here.

 

[C'est Moi Cantona]

You know I really want to believe that,I have expressed it many times but now I am not so sure.

Well I'm sticking to it.. for now, we can't just keep recycling the squad because the current manager can't get the best out them, we have players that the right manager would get far more from, nothing else makes sense.

 

[Dante]

And he can't play a defensive midfield role ,be a box to box midfielder or perform in a midfield two.....what can he do?

I think he can be all of those things. The key to coaxing it out of him is a balanced lineup around him.

This isn't like a Mkhitaryan situation where he simply wasn't good enough and needed everybody else to make him look good.

This a specific psychological issue where Pogba believes his own hype. It's a character flaw that would prove to be terminal, if not for the fact that I've seen Pogba play well in matches he's not asked to be the only attacker to involved in the midfield-attack transitions.

All our forwards are strikers. There's nothing wrong with that, but it does place a lot of creative burden on the midfield and fullbacks. Pogba crumbles when he shoulders too much of it. I'm in no way excusing him for that. I'm just trying to mitigate it.

 

[edgar allan]

That's very harsh.

Pogba up to the Spurs game was having a much better season than Mata, it's not even a comparison.

And even with his level dropping off since then, he's still been equal to Mata's contributions.

So I don't see how you could think Mata's been a much better performer than Pogba.

It's been his worst season at the club(Mata) and that's saying something considering he's not really impressed in any season since coming here.

Obviously the expectations on Pogba are higher but even allowing for that other than the first few months this has been a very poor season for him.

No big fan of Mata but he has impressed ( slightly)more than Pogba on many occasions this year for me. However as Pogba's bar has been so low that is faint praise.

 

[Andycoleno9]

I don't think that he was that bad today. Yes, he had average game but to be changed yfter one hour was jose's mistake.

 

[edgar allan]

I think he can be all of those things. The key to coaxing it out of him is a balanced lineup around him.

This isn't like a Mkhitaryan situation where he simply wasn't good enough and needed everybody else to make him look good.

This a specific psychological issue where Pogba believes his own hype. It's a character flaw that would prove to be terminal, if not for the fact that I've seen Pogba play well in matches he's not asked to be the only attacker to involved in the midfield-attack transitions.

All our forwards are strikers. There's nothing wrong with that, but it does place a lot of creative burden on the midfield and fullbacks. Pogba crumbles when he shoulders too much of it. I'm in no way excusing him for that. I'm just trying to mitigate it.

Do all the other players get psychological passes?

Maybe Young is poor because of the pressure of holding the left side on his own with little movement ahead.?
Linguard due to the uncertainty of starting position.
Maybe Sanchez is poor due to the pressure of his ridiculous wages?

He is not a teenager anymore, his character his fairly well formed at this stage.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Play him deeper and he doesn't want to defend. Play him higher and he slows the whole game down taking too many touches. Buy 3 world class midfielders, play a diamond, give him no responsibility in build up, defensively or leadership and he will deliver 10 goals a season and a pretty highlight reel.

I’m starting to come to the same conclusion. 10 goals is ambitious, mind you. Never once hit double figures in 4 seasons in Serie A.

 

[Dante]

Do all the other players get psychological passes?

Maybe Young is poor because of the pressure of holding the left side on his own with little movement ahead.?
Linguard due to the uncertainty of starting position.
Maybe Sanchez is poor due to the pressure of his ridiculous wages?

He is not a teenager anymore, his character his fairly well formed at this stage.

Of course.

It's a manager's job to manage them. If the issues cost more to fix than he'd get in return, it's not worth it. With Pogba, it is worth it.

Pogba is a puppy who hates being on a leash, but the second you take it off, he runs into the road. The only way to keep him in line is to give him a friend or two who will keep him on the path.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Cross comes into him and it's unreachable, so he puts his hand out trying to score.

It was remarkably stupid. I just don't understand what was going through his head.

Hair dye

 

[edgar allan]

Of course.

It's a manager's job to manage them. If the issues cost more to fix than he'd get in return, it's not worth it. With Pogba, it is worth it.

Pogba is a puppy who hates being on a leash, but the second you take it off, he runs into the road. The only way to keep him in line is to give him a friend or two who will keep him on the path.

Maybe we have been sold a pup?

 

[kouroux]

Which is why it is impossible to build a team around him. In this mode he can only ever be a peripheral figure who gives amazing moments a few times a season or who adds a little style when the team is dominating.

A colossal disappointment given the money spent, his obscene talent level and the need this club has for him to live up to both.

I have said it before, will always say it and therefore I do agree 10000% with your post. This game was the perfect and easy opportunity to keep showing us the little progress he displayed in the past 2 games but no a couple of goals against City and he is back into showboatint "believing his hype" mode.

He vacillates wildly from ambivalence to apathy in a single game. Or at least that's my perception of him having watched him put out insipid performance after insipid performance. You just want to fecking shake the guy silly sometimes and give him a kick up the arse.

He's so fecking infuriating. Many people have already said this, but it is like he's having a kick about with his mates down the park. It's all carefree and blasé. Does my fecking head in.

He probably thinks it's cool to play like that, like football is too easy for him or something

 

[kouroux]

About his sub, he was on a yellow and did make a dumb foul after it. José probably didn't wanna risk him sent off

 

[el3mel]

I'll never understand. Hear his interviews outside the pitch and you'll see talking with too much ambition about becoming the best in the world since his Juve days, then you come on and see him playing as he wants, a good game then a nothing but arrogant performance the next one. If you want to be one of the best, go on and put a fecking consistent performance of 7/10 at least week in week out.

 

[Podgy Poet]

I'll never understand. Hear his interviews outside the pitch and you'll see talking with too much ambition about becoming the best in the world since his Juve days, then you come on and see him playing as he wants, a good game then a nothing but arrogant performance the next one. If you want to be one of the best, go on and put a fecking consistent performance of 7/10 at least week in week out.

I wouldn't worry. He'll fix that by becoming mute, deleting all social media accounts so he can facilitate consistently playing like he did today.

 

[Litch]

Sell him, he's clearly not good enough for our quality squad of footballers. Where would he go anyway that plays the level of football we are playing at the moment with world class players like Young, Smalling, Herrera, Jones, Damian, Rojo, Shaw et al?
If only he wasn't here, look how better we would be and maybe we could convince Fellaini to stay?

Pogba must say a prayer each night thanking god for him choosing utd over staying at Juve or going to PSG to play along side Neymar.

 

[Bwuk]

Pogba has all the talent in the world. If he left us he’d end up at a top European side.

How many of our players can you say the same about.

Mourinho just can’t get the best out of Pogba. Juventus Pogba was miles ahead of the United version.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I think he’s one of the ones who may not survive the summer.

He is infuriating as feck, he can do so much more.