[Acole9]

Back to his casual self I see. Obsessed with not losing to City but not assed when it's a team bottom of the league.

He hasn't got the three man midfield excuse to dig him out of this one. I keep hearing people say there's an agenda against him, Souness has one clearly but no one else does. He's not doing himself any favours. I watched him in the warm-up, didn't look focused.

 

[Thisistheone]

One of the biggest disappointments in a long time. Possibly a bigger flop than Veron?

I enjoyed Seba, who in fairness was in a much better team, but he never lived up to the very high expectations. I thought he was the best CM in the world at Lazio. And I assumed Pogba had the potential to be while at Juventus.

 

[Smores]

Incredible to see people put all the blame unquestionably on the manager. Jose might be responsible for not getting the very best out of him but Pogba is responsible for bringing his worst in 30% of games.

I'm starting to come to terms that we'll have to carry Pogba and the rest of the team will need to make up for it. He's Robinho level of inconsistent right now

 

[sullydnl]

At 25 he should be stepping into his prime years now but he still plays like an inconsistent kid. At this point I will be very surprised if he lives up to his potential as that would require a massive improvement in attitude, consistency and intelligence. A tall order at the best of times, let alone when playing for a manager he doesn't seem to gel with.

 

[Miscemayl]

He needs to learn to self motivate and have some personal pride with his performance.

We can blame Mourinho all we want but I am pretty certain walk casually around the pitch wasn't the tactic. And who the heck plays volleyball with a cross to earn a completely stupid yellow card? At 25 in the elite level? Even school kids get hauled off for that!

 

[Lentwood]

Sick of people whingeing about Jose’s management of Pogba. Pogba has been given every opportunity. We’ve tried him in multiple positions and literally signed players just to try and help him. Jose defended Pogba time after time last year and all Pogba has done has been to let him down.

I still believe there is a player in Pogba somewhere but these people who keep blaming the manager are way off. If someone can name me a CM who ISNT expected to work hard and track back I might accept Pogba might play better under that manager but I can’t think of any.

 

[manunited1919]

Is he already gone?

 

[Achilles McCool]

How can he go from winning a game on his own against the champions of England, to then get hauled off after 58 minutes against the team at the bottom of the table? that's the problem fans are having with him, he's far too hot and cold for a supposed elite talent. Nobody expected him to score another double vs West Brom either, he could have just done the basics right and most wouldn't have minded. He was atrocious and uninterested.

The uninterested part is the most troubling.

 

[Andycoleno9]

He has everything to be worlds best midfielder. But he must change one thing. Commitment. He is super rich, famous, has football skills and he thinks that he can go on the pitch, show some special moves and that is that. Back to enjoy in life. I swear, i sometimes have a feeling that he doesn't want to be on the pitch.

 

[van Nistelrooy]

How short are some peoples memories? We literally just saw him produce his best performance for United, playing in his best position, against City last week. He didn't have a great game against WBA and now fans revert to saying they don't know what to do with him. He should play as the most advanced midfielder of a 3. Consistency is the only issue at present, hopefully that will come if he is played in his favoured role for a prolonged period.

Do you not remember the first half vs City?
Do you not remember the majority of the past two seasons?

Short memory indeed.

 

[reddaz71]

Offer him to Madrid in exchange for Kroos then buy Savic and I think that would not be bad piece of business if it happened!

 

[markhughes]

Obviously he has all the physical and technical tools needed to make a great player, for me the big question is whether or not he has the mental discipline required to perform consistently from week to week, I just don't see that in him though I hope I am wrong. He showed some mental strength against city of course however can he get up for the smaller teams every week and add consistency to his game? I am not so sure, all great players are consistent and have drive but the majority of the time Pogba seems uninterested to me. Big season coming up for Paul (assuming he is still here), more of the same then we should cut our losses.

 

[edgar allan]

Sick of people whingeing about Jose’s management of Pogba. Pogba has been given every opportunity. We’ve tried him in multiple positions and literally signed players just to try and help him. Jose defended Pogba time after time last year and all Pogba has done has been to let him down.

I still believe there is a player in Pogba somewhere but these people who keep blaming the manager are way off. If someone can name me a CM who ISNT expected to work hard and track back I might accept Pogba might play better under that manager but I can’t think of any.

And if a manager spends 90 million on a player who underperforms is the manager not ultimately to blame.

 

[Lentwood]

And if a manager spends 90 million on a player who underperforms is the manager not ultimately to blame.

Jose saw what we all saw in Pogba. A physical monster with world-class technical ability. I’m sure Jose thought he could turn the lad into the best midfielder of his generation but it’s looking increasingly like Pogba would rather be a star on Instagram

 

[sunama]

We can't possibly sell him a 2nd time, in such quick succession.
Whatever happens, he will not be leaving anytime soon. Jose has put huge faith in Pogba and will continue to do so until he succeeds or Jose leaves.

 

[POF]

Pogba is now becoming a massive problem for the club. They invested heavily in him, he was destined to be the captain and is already the face of the club. He would ensure that the "one academy product in every match day squad" record would be maintained long term.

He also comes across as a very popular figure in the dressing room and highly influential on the other players like Lukaku, Lingard, Rashford, Martial, Bailly, etc. That core of players was effectively set to be the long term leadership group of the club, driving the culture in the playing group.

The worry now is that Pogba and Jose are clearly not on the same page and the only culture being driven by Pogba is one of inconsistency, indifference and lack of effort.

If it gets to a position where the club has to choose between Pogba and Jose it will be a massive call. You cannot have players undermining the manager but getting rid of Pogba would have huge implications on a number of levels.

The whole situation reflects really badly on both of them. Jose has done a lot of really good things at the club but the amount of conflict between the squad and management seems to be at unhealthy levels.

 

[Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell]

It would be very sad to see Pogba leave again and most likely do well elsewhere.

However, if he thinks he can get Jose sacked or not follow instructions then the club have little option. We don't want a dressing room like Chelsea that's out of control and dictates to the manager/club. A stand needs to be taken at some point.

 

[sunama]

One of the biggest disappointments in a long time. Possibly a bigger flop than Veron?

I enjoyed Seba, who in fairness was in a much better team, but he never lived up to the very high expectations. I thought he was the best CM in the world at Lazio. And I assumed Pogba had the potential to be while at Juventus.

I do remember Juan Sebastian Veron. He was the guy who was going to take our team to new levels, especially in CL games.
It just didn't work out for him in England.

 

[Stubble]

Is anyone really being serious in saying we should sell 2 of our best potential future young talents in Pogba and Martial as they're not playing to their potential for a manager who can't seem to get the best out of any of the attacking players. Sell them and short-termist Mo will just bring in more 28-30 year old workhorses who will need replacing along with half the squad when he realises he can't overtake City and sacks it off in a year or two. Another big rebuild would be just what we need! Meanwhile they'll both go off to be worldbeaters for years elsewhere in teams that play to their strengths. Fact is both these players were playing fine until Mo inexplicably brought in Sanchez to play him mostly on the LEFT where he has disrupted Pobga's play as he continually drifts into the same areas and has displaced both Martial and Rashford. How many would have wanted Sanchez if we would have known he would be used to totally disrupt the balance of the team ? Play him on the RIGHT and all problems are solved - Mo is such a stubborn pigheaded sod he's the only one who chooses not to see it and has persisted with it for 3 months of on the field rubbish and disorganisation. No wonder half the team look disinterested or hacked off - they must know like us what simple changes are needed to solve the problem but the manager is such a narcissist he must always be prooved right. All the usual issues of squad unity and criticism of players are now starting to gather pace which will ultimately end in his departure - its the Mourinho way !! We must at least hold on to our best future talents so they can flourish after his departure..

 

[Andersons Dietician]

positions and literally signed players just to try and help him.

Who did we sign specifically to help him? I’m of the opinion there are more factors to this than just Jose and Pogba. He’s been played out of position for most of the season but then his form isn’t helped by the lack of fullbacks and movement upfront and the speed at which we play. He by the way also has a hand in some of that.

 

[Leftback99]

He also comes across as a very popular figure in the dressing room and highly influential on the other players like Lukaku, Lingard, Rashford, Martial, Bailly, etc. That core of players was effectively set to be the long term leadership group of the club, driving the culture in the playing group.

That core of players is and their attitude is a problem rather than a positive going forward. They don't strike me as a group of players driven to win like we've had in the past. Apart from Lukaku they just appear immature and couldn't care less win or lose.

With Pogba, i think Mourinho thought he could change him and mould him into the dominant CM he wanted. He's failed, the weaknesses in Pogba's game have barely changed since watching him in our u18s.

 

[POF]

Is anyone really being serious in saying we should sell 2 of our best potential future young talents in Pogba and Martial as they're not playing to their potential for a manager who can't seem to get the best out of any of the attacking players. Sell them and short-termist Mo will just bring in more 28-30 year old workhorses who will need replacing along with half the squad when he realises he can't overtake City and sacks it off in a year or two. Another big rebuild would be just what we need! Meanwhile they'll both go off to be worldbeaters for years elsewhere in teams that play to their strengths. Fact is both these players were playing fine until Mo inexplicably brought in Sanchez to play him mostly on the LEFT where he has disrupted Pobga's play as he continually drifts into the same areas and has displaced both Martial and Rashford. How many would have wanted Sanchez if we would have known he would be used to totally disrupt the balance of the team ? Play him on the RIGHT and all problems are solved - Mo is such a stubborn pigheaded sod he's the only one who chooses not to see it and has persisted with it for 3 months of on the field rubbish and disorganisation. No wonder half the team look disinterested or hacked off - they must know like us what simple changes are needed to solve the problem but the manager is such a narcissist he must always be prooved right. All the usual issues of squad unity and criticism of players are now starting to gather pace which will ultimately end in his departure - its the Mourinho way !! We must at least hold on to our best future talents so they can flourish after his departure..

On the first point, I think there is an increasing likelihood that it will happen. Although I agree that the lack of attacking fluidity is a huge problem, I think the biggest concern is that Jose's "tough love" approach hasn't worked with any of the talented but mentally suspect players. At times the players seemed to be responding (Martial and Shaw in particular) but are then dropped again far too easily.

I completely disagree with the second bolded point above. This United squad (and Pogba in particular) have far bigger issues than positional. The "how can I play well if I am not played in my best position" schtick just breeds an excuse culture that winning clubs don't have.

 

[kouroux]

Offer him to Madrid in exchange for Kroos then buy Savic and I think that would not be bad piece of business if it happened!

Why would Madrid even be interested ?

 

[POF]

That core of players is and their attitude is a problem rather than a positive going forward. They don't strike me as a group of players driven to win like we've had in the past. Apart from Lukaku they just appear immature and couldn't care less win or lose.

With Pogba, i think Mourinho thought he could change him and mould him into the dominant CM he wanted. He's failed, the weaknesses in Pogba's game have barely changed since watching him in our u18s.

Those players certainly are very immature and don't have the drive at present. If they were on the same page as the manager I think they certainly could, in the same way the Class of 92 developed as leaders later in their careers.

Lingard and Rashford have that bit of menace about them having come through the academy. Bailly does have leadership qualities but is also immature. Lukaku has surprised me with his maturity at times this season and has looked like a potential leader.

The absolute key is Pogba. He was never going to be a Roy Keane type leader but he could be as effective a leader in his own way. Like Keane he has the ability to be a huge influence on games because he is the best player in the team. He showed real signs of added maturity last season and early this season.

The Sanchez signing and his reaction to it has been a huge disappointment. I think Jose feels he misjudged him and not being able to build around Pogba drastically changes what he was building.

 

[United_We_Stand]

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[Giggsyking]

Pogba is now becoming a massive problem for the club. They invested heavily in him, he was destined to be the captain and is already the face of the club. He would ensure that the "one academy product in every match day squad" record would be maintained long term.

He also comes across as a very popular figure in the dressing room and highly influential on the other players like Lukaku, Lingard, Rashford, Martial, Bailly, etc. That core of players was effectively set to be the long term leadership group of the club, driving the culture in the playing group.

The worry now is that Pogba and Jose are clearly not on the same page and the only culture being driven by Pogba is one of inconsistency, indifference and lack of effort.

If it gets to a position where the club has to choose between Pogba and Jose it will be a massive call. You cannot have players undermining the manager but getting rid of Pogba would have huge implications on a number of levels.

The whole situation reflects really badly on both of them. Jose has done a lot of really good things at the club but the amount of conflict between the squad and management seems to be at unhealthy levels.

Between Jose and Pogba, the club should never think twice and did like Real Madrid when they took Ronaldo's side. Pogba is our star, many here underestimate his quality. He was in the FIFA starting XI when he was 21 years old. People forget easy his superb performance in Juventus. He is the type of player that you build a team around. If he has some mentality issues, Mourinho is the one to blame cause he does nothing but slams him in the media and he is looking clueless for finding the right position of a player he bought for 105 m euros.

 

[Giggsyking]

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So stupid of the club if they back Mourinho for this. If they back him and we sell Pogba, by Christmas as expected we would be out of the title race and possibly he will get the axe. By January 2019 we will be without Pogba and a manager.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

Between Jose and Pogba, the club should never think twice and did like Real Madrid when they took Ronaldo's side. Pogba is our star, many here underestimate his quality. He was in the FIFA starting XI when he was 21 years old. People forget easy his superb performance in Juventus. He is the type of player that you build a team around. If he has some mentality issues, Mourinho is the one to blame cause he does nothing but slams him in the media and he is looking clueless for finding the right position of a player he bought for 105 m euros.

I don't think you can compare Pogba and Ronaldo.

Ronaldo scores 50 goals a season every season, he wins you the biggest trophies. He's earned the right to be the main man.

 

[el3mel]

I don't think you can compare Pogba and Ronaldo.

Ronaldo scores 50 goals a season every season, he wins you the biggest trophies. He's earned the right to be the main man.

Exactly.

Build a team around Ronaldo and you guarantee having a player who will score shite loads of goals and will always take his chances.

If you're going to build a team around a player, it must be someone who will deliver consistently. So far nothing suggests that with Paul. It's the opposite actually.

 

[haram]

The only way Pogba is sold is if we replace him with someone like Kroos or Verratti in exchange.

 

[bosnian_red]

So stupid of the club if they back Mourinho for this. If they back him and we sell Pogba, by Christmas as expected we would be out of the title race and possibly he will get the axe. By January 2019 we will be without Pogba and a manager.

We'll be out of the title race by Christmas even with Pogba. Pogba isnt that great individually to be a game changer to that extent that he can carry a team to a title. Nowhere near consistent enough, wasnt for Juve, isnt for France and definitely isnt for United.

 

[Revaulx]

I do remember Juan Sebastian Veron. He was the guy who was going to take our team to new levels, especially in CL games.
It just didn't work out for him in England.

“Let’s buy him first and work out how we’re going to fit him into the team later.”

Some things never change...

 

[Giggsyking]

We'll be out of the title race by Christmas even with Pogba. Pogba isnt that great individually to be a game changer to that extent that he can carry a team to a title. Nowhere near consistent enough, wasnt for Juve, isnt for France and definitely isnt for United.

I know we will be out of the title race even with Pogba in the team, because I can't see Jose turning things around on city with a couple of signings, he is a manager who lost his mojo. But Pogba is one of the best midfielders in the world, if we sell him it will be very hard to find a player in his caliber.

 

[POF]

“Let’s buy him first and work out how we’re going to fit him into the team later.”

Some things never change...

That wasn't the issue at all with Veron. United often got overrun in midfield because they played a 4 with 2 strikers and the plan was clearly Keane and Veron in midfield with Scholes in the number 10 role.

The reason it didn't work were:
- Scholes had a sulk and didn't want to play a more advanced role.
- Beckham and Giggs didn't score enough goals for the more advanced roles in a 4-2-3-1.
- Stam left which meant the team needed an extra shield in midfield, meaning Butt or Neville next to Keane.

The latter was the biggest issue in my opinion. Losing a striker from your starting 11 for more control of the game is fine if you don't look like conceding every time the opposition has the ball.

 

[Giggsyking]

I don't think you can compare Pogba and Ronaldo.

Ronaldo scores 50 goals a season every season, he wins you the biggest trophies. He's earned the right to be the main man.

Ok. Fair point, although my thought was clear we must not sacrifice our star player to a manager who most probably wont be here next summer. But we can take another example. Hazard and Mourinho, he is no 50 goals scorer.

 

[VP89]

The only way Pogba is sold is if we replace him with someone like Kroos or Verratti in exchange.

Because he's really been performing at a Kroos or Veratti level for us since he joined hasn't he.

 

[kbbear]

Woodward must be extremely hacked off. Gave Jose £89 and pulled out all the stops together him Pogba then 18 months later (if the press are right) Jose can't wait to be rid of him. Im equally disappointed with Jose and Pogba.

 

[breakout67]

Because he's really been performing at a Kroos or Veratti level for us since he joined hasn't he.

No, but his agent is something else. He managed to get a £35m valuation for Mkhitaryan who was frozen out of the squad and was a nothing player 10 games into the season.

If Pogba goes (a big if) then we'll get a pretty penny for him. We might actually benefit from the Neymar transfer.

 

[haram]

Because he's really been performing at a Kroos or Veratti level for us since he joined hasn't he.

He’s still one of the most talented CM’s in the world and will be of interest to big teams.

 

[YouOnlyLiveTwice]

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It's from Jason Burt, who i think is pretty reliable?

I think the situation is a bit like Di Maria with LvG. The player and manager doesn't fit together. Both players struggle/struggled under the instructions given.
Tbf, Pogba has been shambolic for a lot of 2018 and i wouldn't be against selling him. In fact, i think we should sell him as long as Mourinho is the manager.