[Fluctuation0161]

The over reaction to his dip in form is boardering on the ludicrous.

Mourinho needs to shoulder a lot of the blame as well. He spent £90 million on an attacking midfielder and is playing him as a defensive midfielder. It’s utter madness.

I tend to agree with this. We need to play to his strengths.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

That post is pretty misleading and the comparison is not the best. As @hellohello said Modric played in midfield 2 for Spurs on a brilliant level for 2 years before he went to Madrid. Only at the beginning of his career with Spurs, he played sometimes on the left wing to get accustomed to the higher intensity of the league. But, he was always hard working and very positionally aware player, so Pogba comparisons are not so close. Not to mention his ability to dictate the game, or be involved all the time.

Jose bought Modric and he wasn't terrible under him. He wasn't good only in the first part of the season. That biggest flop label he got by the voters in Marca was made after first 3 months were he played around eight full matches. In the second half of his first season, he actually started playing very good and by the end of the season, he already became one of Madrid's best players. The turning point was (unfortunately) his goal against us at Old Trafford and Jose moving him to a deeper role.

I do agree that Pogba still has time to develop. 24 is a pretty young age for a midfielder, especially one that is such a physical beast and has so much talent. Would only like to see more discipline and hunger in his game. For example, someone like Yaya Toure would be a better comparison when we talk about Pogba imo.

I wasn't comparing them as players. They're nowhere near alike. More-so comparing the fact that Modric didn't perform to his best under Jose.

Sure he improved a bit in the 2nd half, but he had a poor season overall. Then Carlo Ancelotti came in, and he started thriving.

 

[Silas]

Many are conveniently ignoring the Huddersfield game to push their narratives of him being consistently shite. He came on around the 65th minute and looked fine. It has quite literally been three poor games (including one away against a very good team and another where he may have been injured) that has caused such amounts of negativity on here. Some of the conspiracy theories I've seen are ridiculous.

 

[Jaybomb]

So Pogba’s the problem.

He leaves the club and then.... what? We’re stuck with Smalling, Jones and Young cause they’re so much better? Give me a break.

Pogba is the least of our problems.

Buy some defenders and a partner for Matic and we’ll be sorted.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

Very rarely do I agree with Michael Owen or Owen Hargreaves but I do here.

Love that, and agree with everything that was said, surprisingly.

Thanks for posting.

 

[Jim Beam]

I wasn't comparing them as players. They're nowhere near alike. More-so comparing the fact that Modric didn't perform to his best under Jose.

Sure he improved a bit in the 2nd half, but he had a poor season overall. Then Carlo Ancelotti came in, and he started thriving.

Overall it was a bad first part of the season and very good second part. He already started thriving at that stage.

Funny thing is that Jose was misusing him at the start, but took him only 3 months to figure that out and start playing him deeper. So, a million dollar question still stands. Why he won't do the same with Pogba and try to play him in a midfield three more often, especially in tougher games?

 

[Manny]

Very rarely do I agree with Michael Owen or Owen Hargreaves but I do here.

I'm glad they brought up Lampard.

They are right but I think we got stop reffering to Pogba as an attacking player. That just confused the issue .

Hargreaves said it best "he can do a lot of things really well" minus the discipline. Thats the system we and he need, playing in a three, knowing Matic will be sitting and another #8 who is more disciplined. Not at all hard to fix but it looks like Jose has frozen Herrera out.

 

[3KDré]

Very rarely do I agree with Michael Owen or Owen Hargreaves but I do here.

It's frustrating that Michael Owen sees this, yet our manager fails. It's so obvious ffs.

 

[diplomat]

I'm glad they brought up Lampard.

They are right but I think we got stop reffering to Pogba as an attacking player. That just confused the issue .

Hargreaves said it best "he can do a lot of things really well" minus the discipline. Thats the system we and he need, playing in a three, knowing Matic will be sitting and another #8 who is more disciplined. Not at all hard to fix but it looks like Jose has frozen Herrera out.

Both Lampard and Gerrard busted a gut in games for their clubs though. Maybe not so much in their 30s, but it's understandable. Pogba is in the zenith of his physical and fitness levels, but still doesn't show up with the required work-rate consistently enough.

However, for a team that runs the least in the whole Premier league, a lot of times most of our players are looking anything but sharp, especially in decisive moments, which is supposed to be the time when the saved energy is used effectively. So it could be a coaching issue or a bad pre-season, which is a long shot to be honest.

 

[Adnan]

Very rarely do I agree with Michael Owen or Owen Hargreaves but I do here.

Interesting what Owen says about Gerrard too.

 

[El Jefe]

Very rarely do I agree with Michael Owen or Owen Hargreaves but I do here.

I've given these two shit for their punditry over the years but they couldn't be more right on their opinion of Pogba.

Mourinho takes a massive share of the blame here.

 

[eat_grass]

Lukaku has played in his best position week in week out - how is that situation comparable to Pogba's?

I don't understand why you're okay with Pogba giving less than 100% effort because he's not being played in his favorite position. Would you offer the same understanding to Martial since he's playing on the right wing to accommodate Sanchez?

On at least two different occasions against Newcastle a United player farther away from the ball than Pogba busted his ass to make a critical play that Pogba should have made: 1) Jones running past Pogba to throw himself in front of a shot from the top of the box, 2) Lingard sprinting back from midfield, past Pogba, to intercept a pass in the box.

Why isn't everyone furious with him for that?

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Okay, let's forget about what position he should/shouldn't be in. There's absolutely no reason why he shouldn't be challenging opposition players for headers and showing less desire than Jonjo Shelvey.

 

[NotQuiteManc]

Lack of desire or lack of bravery?

I think some of them are very technical players, but lack the bravery of taking risks which is the core features of past excellent United players. NUFC players looked scared of United in the early minutes but they didn't take advantage of it. Only player in the attacking part that was brave enough was Sanchez. Perhaps Lingard too without the luck or execution this time.

Hope this is just a blip, or a short lost of form. Critical games are coming up, and United need him the most during these periods.

 

[TsuWave]

The over reaction to his dip in form is boardering on the ludicrous.

Mourinho needs to shoulder a lot of the blame as well. He spent £90 million on an attacking midfielder and is playing him as a defensive midfielder. It’s utter madness.

I agree with this post.

 

[roonster09]

I was aware of those quotes, but I think they predated SAF's final verdict:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-showing-disrespect-which-led-to-9315028.html

Maybe that was just sour grapes (over negotiations) and an attempt to save face, but he also has questioned Pogba's mentality and character in the past. Again, maybe that's just SAF realizing the new generation of players don't match up to his old guard, but it casts a very negative light on Pogba.

BTW, I think Pogba is immensely talented, has the attitude and balls to fight for his teammates (when he feels like it), and is very clearly playing out of position. But that's not the point. Twice now he's sulked and refused to put in effort because he's not on his favorite left side. That's inexcusable, and he belongs on the bench until he sorts it out.

For as much shtick as Lukaku has copped for poor performances, he's never looked like he's half-assing it on purpose. Pogba has done it twice now.

He never questioned him when he was at ManUtd, it was only after he left. It was like how dare a player can leave ManUtd type attitude. To answer your OP club did everything they could to sign Pogba on long term contract.

 

[Greck]

Shite pundits telling Jose how to use him will make him even more stubborn. God forbid we ever play a 433 and they're proven right.

 

[haram]

Shite pundits telling Jose how to use him will make him even more stubborn. God forbid we ever play a 433 and they're proven right.

Well we did play with 3 CM's against Everton. Maybe he just felt we had enough to beat Newcastle, and if we took our clear chances we would have.

 

[Yagami]

Well we did play with 3 CM's against Everton. Maybe he just felt we had enough to beat Newcastle, and if we took our clear chances we would have.

You could apply the same logic to Newcastle. If they had scored their chance in the first few minutes of the game we probably would've went on to play even worse due to how we often play when we go a goal down. Not to mention their penalty claim. They were deserved winners.

 

[Davistiano]

It is interesting that a while back when Pogba was injured, fans are craving for his return because how good the team played with him on the field.

Now all of a sudden he is the problem and should leave the club? Seriously?

He is one of the best players we have in the squad at the moment c'mon. Every players have ups and downs, and I believe there is always a "process" for one to learn and become mature.

Lets put some more faith into our players to support them, yes we can critise an individual because we care about our team, but I personally think we should not say a certain player should leave because he is shite - as long as the player is a MU player and not sold by the manager, I will support the player fully!

 

[Raees]

That's how it looked during this game.

I'm not saying it's an ideal set-up, but to say that Pogba was shackled in this particular game is far off the mark imo.

How is Pogba meant to be unleashed when it is Lingard playing as the CM - someone who is not going to remain in the heart of midfield and dictate the play. No slight on Lingard but naturally he's going to be bombing forward more than Pogba - complete lack of balance there.

 

[Rasfene]

I agree with this post.

Disagree.

Obviously mourinho bought matic as a DM and it's a signal to tell pogba he can go forward (do more attacking than defence).

So you cannot blame the manager. Mou already intend to bring out the best in pogba by buying matic. Sometimes he did play pogba in AM position but pogba did not really grab his chance.

Of course, to be fair, pogba did well against everton, Stoke and Arsenal and has the highest average rating among united players actually.

 

[Raees]

I don't understand why you're okay with Pogba giving less than 100% effort because he's not being played in his favorite position. Would you offer the same understanding to Martial since he's playing on the right wing to accommodate Sanchez?

On at least two different occasions against Newcastle a United player farther away from the ball than Pogba busted his ass to make a critical play that Pogba should have made: 1) Jones running past Pogba to throw himself in front of a shot from the top of the box, 2) Lingard sprinting back from midfield, past Pogba, to intercept a pass in the box.

Why isn't everyone furious with him for that?

Because it is so clear to me that is the wrong position for him. I even started a thread when he first joined setting out exactly where he needs to play and I was quite baffled as to why we thought he's going to turn into this CM general when he was anything but for Juve and struggled massively for France in the same position.

It must be massively frustrating for the player that he's being misused tactically and that it is clearly harming both his own personal development but it is also choking the progress of the team because even if Pogba does apply himself there is a massive limit on how well he can play that role because he lacks the ability to play there (physically, tactically and mentally) he's not a CM at all.

Jose is extremely stubborn so sometimes you have to sulk to send out a message you're unhappy. I honestly don't blame Pogba for putting his own interests first here because long term it's better for him and for United that he's moved from that position. People are very short term thinkers and blinded to the fact that him sulking for a few games is actually the best long term thing that could happen to our midfield.

In any line of employment if you feel your manager is wasting your talent and you're losing your enjoyment of what you do and you feel like you can't even do the task well because it's such a bad fit for you - are you just going to stick at it like a sheep or are you going to be proactive in getting what you want. Pogba has the ability to be an attacking force - a star and he has the ego to go with that.. it's natural that a player of that talent is going to have an ego.. so you have to sometimes indulge that because in a way he's right .. you can't make a player like that play like a defensive midfielder or hold because he's naturally going to want to be the star of the show. It's about acknowledging personality traits and forging a team from various personalities not just forcing square pegs into round holes. Mourinho management has been shocking in this respect.

 

[roonster09]

Because it is so clear to me that is the wrong position for him. I even started a thread when he first joined setting out exactly where he needs to play and I was quite baffled as to why we thought he's going to turn into this CM general when he was anything but for Juve and struggled massively for France in the same position.

It must be massively frustrating for the player that he's being misused tactically and that it is clearly harming both his own personal development but it is also choking the progress of the team because even if Pogba does apply himself there is a massive limit on how well he can play that role because he lacks the ability to play there (physically, tactically and mentally) he's not a CM at all.

Jose is extremely stubborn so sometimes you have to sulk to send out a message you're unhappy. I honestly don't blame Pogba for putting his own interests first here because long term it's better for him and for United that he's moved from that position. People are very short term thinkers and blinded to the fact that him sulking for a few games is actually the best long term thing that could happen to our midfield.

In any line of employment if you feel your manager is wasting your talent and you're losing your enjoyment of what you do and you feel like you can't even do the task well because it's such a bad fit for you - are you just going to stick at it like a sheep or are you going to be proactive in getting what you want. Pogba has the ability to be an attacking force - a star and he has the ego to go with that.. it's natural that a player of that talent is going to have an ego.. so you have to sometimes indulge that because in a way he's right .. you can't make a player like that play like a defensive midfielder or hold because he's naturally going to want to be the star of the show. It's about acknowledging personality traits and forging a team from various personalities not just forcing square pegs into round holes. Mourinho management has been shocking in this respect.

Also it takes just few minutes to check his heat map for Juventus games and the area where he operated. He wasn't even always the most advanced midfielder but he was the one who was able to drive the ball from midfield and wasn't asked to drop very deep.

Like you said, it's a short term thinking and will backfire big time.

 

[haram]

You could apply the same logic to Newcastle. If they had scored their chance in the first few minutes of the game we probably would've went on to play even worse due to how we often play when we go a goal down. Not to mention their penalty claim. They were deserved winners.

No, because Martial had a clear chance even when we went 1-0 down.

 

[Treble]

Jose has decided that the least disruptive way to introduce Sanchez in the team is by playing Pogba and Matic in CM. Why?

Because Jose does not want to bench Martial or Lingard. Both were doing very well prior to Sanchez. He doesn't want to bench Lukaku either for obvious reasons. Therefore, he has decided that with so many good players in midfield and attack the team will have enough firepower to win games. Even against top 6 teams (Spurs away).

Problem is Pogba isn't ready to sacrifice his attacking game to make the tactics work. Or is just not good enough defensively. And Lingard ain't good in midfield even if he is willing to track back and press.

Jose has to find a solution soon. Big games are coming.

 

[cletus7]

That's how it looked during this game.

I'm not saying it's an ideal set-up, but to say that Pogba was shackled in this particular game is far off the mark imo.

I was debating this on a previous thread. Yes, Lingard plays in a 3 with Pogba and Herrera so if your at the game it’s clear we are set up with a 4-3-3 rather than a 4-2-3-1 BUT the idea that Lingard relieves Pogba of defensive responsibility is a joke. The reference point for a genuine 4-3-3 is the game away at Everton where Pogba played left of Herrera and Matic and was able to create and dominate.

 

[redIndianDevil]

Lack of desire or lack of bravery?

I think some of them are very technical players, but lack the bravery of taking risks which is the core features of past excellent United players. NUFC players looked scared of United in the early minutes but they didn't take advantage of it. Only player in the attacking part that was brave enough was Sanchez. Perhaps Lingard too without the luck or execution this time.

Hope this is just a blip, or a short lost of form. Critical games are coming up, and United need him the most during these periods.

I don't understand why you're okay with Pogba giving less than 100% effort because he's not being played in his favorite position. Would you offer the same understanding to Martial since he's playing on the right wing to accommodate Sanchez?

On at least two different occasions against Newcastle a United player farther away from the ball than Pogba busted his ass to make a critical play that Pogba should have made: 1) Jones running past Pogba to throw himself in front of a shot from the top of the box, 2) Lingard sprinting back from midfield, past Pogba, to intercept a pass in the box.

Why isn't everyone furious with him for that?

People like you rate players who run around a lot or the ones busting their gut or generally doing a bit extra donkey work higher than players who exhibit technical expertise. The fact that you seem to think Lingard showed bravery in the attack proves it, Lingard was utter dogshite against NUFC, he was our number 10 but barely made a single incisive pass in the final third the entire duration he played, can you remember at least one chance he created the entire match? He was supposed to be our most creative midfielder but just because he was running around like a headless chicken not doing the task that he was actually asked to do you seem to give him a free pass.

 

[redIndianDevil]

This Pogba criticism has been a bit OTT in my opinion. He never was a holding midfielder, he doesn't have the skill to play there but he did a decent job against Newcastle. Our main problem was that Lukaku, Sanchez, Lingard, Martial created hardly anything of note.

 

[NotQuiteManc]

People like you rate players who run around a lot or the ones busting their gut or generally doing a bit extra donkey work higher than players who exhibit technical expertise. The fact that you seem to think Lingard showed bravery in the attack proves it, Lingard was utter dogshite against NUFC, he was our number 10 but barely made a single incisive pass in the final third the entire duration he played, can you remember at least one chance he created the entire match? He was supposed to be our most creative midfielder but just because he was running around like a headless chicken not doing the task that he was actually asked to do you seem to give him a free pass.

Oh please, stop putting words in my mouth. Such generalisation.

Look at Carrick. 5 minutes in and already he made a forward pass to Young to attack the flank. In that game, Pogba despite being technically sound, didn't do much passing wise and that ball holding wise.

Yes Lingard had a pretty bad game, but he was taking risk attacking the spaces, trying to link up with Sanchez even though it didn't result in clear chances. I rather players like Pogba take risks instead of doing the safe passing. I would take that from the likes of Fellaini but not Pogba. Not enough intensity in his game, and risk taking, but like I said hope this is just a loss of form albeit temporary.

 

[edgar allan]

Because it is so clear to me that is the wrong position for him. I even started a thread when he first joined

It must be massively frustrating for the player that he's being misused tactically and that it is clearly harming both his own personal development but it is also choking the progress of the team because even if Pogba does apply himself there is a massive limit on how well he can play that role because he lacks the ability to play there (physically, tactically and mentally) he's not a CM

In any line of employment if you feel your manager is wasting your talent and you're losing your enjoyment of what you do and you feel like you can't even do the task well because it's such a bad fit for you - are you just going to stick at it like a sheep or are you going to be proactive in getting what you want. Pogba has the ability to be an attacking force - a star and he has the ego to go with that.. it's natural that a player of that talent is going to have an ego.. so you have to sometimes indulge that because in a way he's right .. you can't make a player like that play like a defensive midfielder or hold because he's naturally going to want to be the star of the show. It's about acknowledging personality traits and forging a team from various personalities not just forcing square pegs into round holes. Mourinho management has been shocking in this respect.

It must indeed be massively frustrating for a player to be only paid 250k a week to put a little effort for an hour and a half a week.
You are actually nearly making me feel sorry for Pogbas overinflated ego.

I hope none of this turns out to be true and Pogba shows the determination to fight for the team in what ever position he is picked to play. If he doesn't then we have a spoilt diva on our hands who we need rid of asap.

 

[Raees]

It must indeed be massively frustrating for a player to be only paid 250k a week to put a little effort for an hour and a half a week.
You are actually nearly making me feel sorry for Pogbas overinflated ego.

I hope none of this turns out to be true and Pogba shows the determination to fight for the team in what ever position he is picked to play. If he doesn't then we have a spoilt diva on our hands who we need rid of asap.

Then you're the type of idiot who would 've got rid of Messi, Near or Ronaldo each time they have a strop. Or unable to deal with a sensitive character like Cantona.

If Neymar moved to PSG and then they go and play him in the right, or give him defensive responsibility you reckon he wouldn't throw a strop? Go watch Pogba video from his day at Juve and tell me you'e watching the same player from a tactical perspective.

He was exclusively used from the left in big games, almost a left midfieler like a Pires who also could join in with certain midfield duties, not a double pivot CM. Completely at odds with how he has played in the best phase of his career to date.

Very easy to bring wages into it which is neither here nor there. If you don' feel like the manager is listening to you and doesn' care about your development why should you run for him? Even if Pogba tried there is a limitation on how good he can be in that position.

 

[edgar allan]

Then you're the type of idiot who would 've got rid of Messi, Near or Ronaldo each time they have a strop. Or unable to deal with a sensitive character like Cantona.

If Neymar moved to PSG and then they go and play him in the right, or give him defensive responsibility you reckon he wouldn't throw a strop? Go watch Pogba video from his day at Juve and tell me you'e watching the same player from a tactical perspective.

He was exclusively used from the left in big games, almost a left midfieler like a Pires who also could join in with certain midfield duties, not a double pivot CM. Completely at odds with how he has played in the best phase of his career to date.

Very easy to bring wages into it which is neither here nor there. If you don' feel like the manager is listening to you and doesn' care about your development why should you run for him? Even if Pogba tried there is a limitation on how good he can be in that position.

I can't believe that you have named those players in the same breath as Pogba. Pogba has done nothing to be considered in the same category of player in terms of performance or workload.
If you compare the effort and work ethic of Aguero, Hazard, KDB et al , Pogba isn't on the same playing field.

Does he expect a team to be built around him? when he goes missing in each and every big game he plays.
You are describing a Fancy Dan, since he has come to us his Ego and his reputation have been far more impressive than his performances.

Why should he run? He is not running for Jose, he should run because he is representing our great club and history. The supporters that paid a lot of money to travel up to the Newcastle game.

 

[Jeffthered]

I'm glad they brought up Lampard.

They are right but I think we got stop reffering to Pogba as an attacking player. That just confused the issue .

Hargreaves said it best "he can do a lot of things really well" minus the discipline. Thats the system we and he need, playing in a three, knowing Matic will be sitting and another #8 who is more disciplined. Not at all hard to fix but it looks like Jose has frozen Herrera out.

The only person who questions this is Jose Mourinho, and he is too stubborn, and selfish to change his thinking. One has to question his coaching team because either a: they agree with Jose... b: they haven't the nuts to tell him... c: they do tell him but he just ignores them...

 

[Ban]

Evil Jose, selfish, arrogant, stubborn. Pogba doesn't want that man to ruin him so he doesn't put a shift.

 

[Canagel]

It seems to me that Mourinho is just sticking the middle finger up to all the people who have talked about Pogba's best position being on the left hand side of a midfield by deliberately shoehorning him into the DM position to prove a point. He takes pride in these small things. To put things into perspective last year Chelsea won the league playing 2 in the middle. Matic and Kante. Both are defensive minded so it gave freedom to the attackers upfront. Now we are trying to play 2 in the middle with Pogba next to Matic. Kante and Pogba are two completely different players. One is defence minded and the other wants to go forward, create and be that attacking force we need. I can't understand Mourinho's tactics here. He has to find a solution.

 

[Raees]

I can't believe that you have named those players in the same breath as Pogba. Pogba has done nothing to be considered in the same category of player in terms of performance or workload.
If you compare the effort and work ethic of Aguero, Hazard, KDB et al , Pogba isn't on the same playing field.

Does he expect a team to be built around him? when he goes missing in each and every big game he plays.
You are describing a Fancy Dan, since he has come to us his Ego and his reputation have been far more impressive than his performances.

Why should he run? He is not running for Jose, he should run because he is representing our great club and history. The supporters that paid a lot of money to travel up to the Newcastle game.

The same great club which was unable to recognise his talent in the first place, only for him to develop into a big player capable of gracing Champions League finals, european championship finals?

We're in danger of doing a ruining Paul Pogba Part II, only for him to leave once again and find a proper platform for himself on which to shine once again at a higher level.

Pogba is not ever going to be mentioned in the same breath as those players as they're more attacking players, proper match winners who are in a different league to him by virtue of their position, but he absolutely by the end of his career should be aiming to be on the same level as say guys like Iniesta/Nedved.. secondary game-changers who might not have been the most star-studded, the indisputed star of a side but had the ability to impact on the biggest games and come up with the odd match winning moment but more likely to come up with the killer assist, and turn a passive moment of possession into a dangerous one.

He undoubtedly has the talent to be a world-class supporting act but right now we are using him as a midfield warrior. It is such a bad fit for his personality. He is a fancy dan, that is the whole point of Paul Pogba. He oozes flair, panache and the whole point of us getting him back (which I didn't agree with as I thought we should have focused on getting a proper CM playmaker in) was to get people off their seat, hit breathtaking passes, drive at defences with the ball and hit long range shots, get on the end of crosses with his heading ability and become a more consistent goalscorer/assist maker. We were meant to be getting a French Gerrard by signing him.

Instead we are trying to turn him into Modric, Alonso or Schweinsteiger. It is painful to see. It is like putting diesel into a petrol tank.. for once most educated football people and the usually thick media/ex football pundits are aligned on this one issue and Mourinho is too stubborn to see it and the fools who think he shits gold at every turn are also blind to seeing it.

End of the day anyone who has played the game and I don't care how much you are paid, you want to enjoy your football because at the end of the day it is a game. Yes for some of these guys it is a privileged job, but the best footballers are at their best when they're enjoying themselves and it doesn't just feel like a job. For some players, they can enjoy it from playing at RB, for others it might only be as a CF.. bottom line is everyone is different. Some players are more versatile than others and can enjoy themselves in a variety of positions.

So that is enjoyment covered, but the next step is competency and feeling comfortable. For some players their vision of the game is compromised by being on a certain side of the pitch, for others its about the fact they have to deal with alot of aerial challenges at CB vs being played as a full back.. for other guys its about not having to track back and forth down the wing and being allowed to just roam in central areas. The bottom line is every player has a different way of feeling comfortable on the pitch and the manager's job is to discover each little nuance about all his players and create a cohesive collective of a team which manages to cover all the aspects of what a successful football team should be able to do. If you ignore each individual nuance, you're less likely to be able to create a cohesive collective as you're basically going to end up forcing players out of position doing things they're uncomfortable with. Which is why either you sign the right players to fit your system or you find a system which suits the players. You can never do one and the other at the same time to full effect, it never ever works.

So Pogba is not feeling happy, and he's not feeling comfortable. Now he's earning £250k a week, but does that matter to Paul Pogba? does he give a flying feck if me and you are on this forum fighting over him.. no he doesn't. Nor does he give a shit about United.. he left us once, he can easily do it again.

What matters to Pogba is not money, but its about enjoying his football, feeling like he's growing as a player in alignment with the vision of where he wants to go as a player and then once he feels that is in place, the next step is can he use his own personal development to help take his side to glory and win medals for them (whatever that side may be). He owes it to no one, to sacrifice his own happiness, and his own personal development and the peak years of his career if he feels that it is detrimental to his own career and if he feels long term it isn't going to yield any medals either because he's being forced to do something he knows deep down he is incapable of doing and its going to harm the team further.

So yes, well within his rights to sulk IMO and Jose, you.. can go piss in the wind for all Pogba cares, because what matters to Paul Pogba is Paul Pogba and rightfully so.. because in any profession, you should put your own happiness and development first.

FWIW do I think Pogba is overrated - yes possibly and I also think that even if we went 4-3-3, no guarantee that we are going to win big trophies by restoring Pogba to his best position. What I do know though, is we will get a much better Paul Pogba than what we are seeing now and therefore a better Manchester United than the current shower of shit I am witnessing week in week out. As a fan, that comes first for me.. not whether the manager gets his arse licked in the right way.

 

[edgar allan]

The same great club which was unable to recognise his talent in the first place, only for him to develop into a big player capable of gracing Champions League finals, european championship finals?

We're in danger of doing a ruining Paul Pogba Part II, only for him to leave once again and find a proper platform for himself on which to shine once again at a higher level.

Pogba is not ever going to be mentioned in the same breath as those players as they're more attacking players, proper match winners who are in a different league to him by virtue of their position, but he absolutely by the end of his career should be aiming to be on the same level as say guys like Iniesta/Nedved.. secondary game-changers who might not have been the most star-studded, the indisputed star of a side but had the ability to impact on the biggest games and come up with the odd match winning moment but more likely to come up with the killer assist, and turn a passive moment of possession into a dangerous one.

He undoubtedly has the talent to be a world-class supporting act but right now we are using him as a midfield warrior. It is such a bad fit for his personality. He is a fancy dan, that is the whole point of Paul Pogba. He oozes flair, panache and the whole point of us getting him back (which I didn't agree with as I thought we should have focused on getting a proper CM playmaker in) was to get people off their seat, hit breathtaking passes, drive at defences with the ball and hit long range shots, get on the end of crosses with his heading ability and become a more consistent goalscorer/assist maker. We were meant to be getting a French Gerrard by signing him.

Instead we are trying to turn him into Modric, Alonso or Schweinsteiger. It is painful to see. It is like putting diesel into a petrol tank.. for once most educated football people and the usually thick media/ex football pundits are aligned on this one issue and Mourinho is too stubborn to see it and the fools who think he shits gold at every turn are also blind to seeing it.

End of the day anyone who has played the game and I don't care how much you are paid, you want to enjoy your football because at the end of the day it is a game. Yes for some of these guys it is a privileged job, but the best footballers are at their best when they're enjoying themselves and it doesn't just feel like a job. For some players, they can enjoy it from playing at RB, for others it might only be as a CF.. bottom line is everyone is different. Some players are more versatile than others and can enjoy themselves in a variety of positions.

So that is enjoyment covered, but the next step is competency and feeling comfortable. For some players their vision of the game is compromised by being on a certain side of the pitch, for others its about the fact they have to deal with alot of aerial challenges at CB vs being played as a full back.. for other guys its about not having to track back and forth down the wing and being allowed to just roam in central areas. The bottom line is every player has a different way of feeling comfortable on the pitch and the manager's job is to discover each little nuance about all his players and create a cohesive collective of a team which manages to cover all the aspects of what a successful football team should be able to do. If you ignore each individual nuance, you're less likely to be able to create a cohesive collective as you're basically going to end up forcing players out of position doing things they're uncomfortable with. Which is why either you sign the right players to fit your system or you find a system which suits the players. You can never do one and the other at the same time to full effect, it never ever works.

So Pogba is not feeling happy, and he's not feeling comfortable. Now he's earning £250k a week, but does that matter to Paul Pogba? does he give a flying feck if me and you are on this forum fighting over him.. no he doesn't. Nor does he give a shit about United.. he left us once, he can easily do it again.

What matters to Pogba is not money, but its about enjoying his football, feeling like he's growing as a player in alignment with the vision of where he wants to go as a player and then once he feels that is in place, the next step is can he use his own personal development to help take his side to glory and win medals for them (whatever that side may be). He owes it to no one, to sacrifice his own happiness, and his own personal development and the peak years of his career if he feels that it is detrimental to his own career and if he feels long term it isn't going to yield any medals either because he's being forced to do something he knows deep down he is incapable of doing and its going to harm the team further.

So yes, well within his rights to sulk IMO and Jose, you.. can go piss in the wind for all Pogba cares, because what matters to Paul Pogba is Paul Pogba and rightfully so.. because in any profession, you should put your own happiness and development first.

FWIW do I think Pogba is overrated - yes possibly and I also think that even if we went 4-3-3, no guarantee that we are going to win big trophies by restoring Pogba to his best position. What I do know though, is we will get a much better Paul Pogba than what we are seeing now and therefore a better Manchester United than the current shower of shit I am witnessing week in week out. As a fan, that comes first for me.. not whether the manager gets his arse licked in the right way.

That is a very articulate and compassionate defence of Pogba. Pogba the sensitive emotional artist.

I am not disputing that he may well feel like that, that he may well be disillusioned with the style of football he is being asked to play. However it is professionalism that is very much in doubt if it turns out that he is sulking on the pitch. A professional gives their all whether they are entirely happy with their support or personal development. An ED doctor doesn't decide to down tools during a shift just because they are not happy with the management.

If Pogba wants to put in a transfer request at the end of the season because he is not happy and his personal development is not being meet to his satisfaction then fine, just don't act like a Diva now until the season is over.

 

[Manny]

I can't believe that you have named those players in the same breath as Pogba. Pogba has done nothing to be considered in the same category of player in terms of performance or workload.
If you compare the effort and work ethic of Aguero, Hazard, KDB et al , Pogba isn't on the same playing field.

Does he expect a team to be built around him? when he goes missing in each and every big game he plays.
You are describing a Fancy Dan, since he has come to us his Ego and his reputation have been far more impressive than his performances.

Why should he run? He is not running for Jose, he should run because he is representing our great club and history. The supporters that paid a lot of money to travel up to the Newcastle game.

The likes of Zidane, Ronaldhino and R9 are lucky they never ended up here when we have fans like you.

 

[Ban]

So if yore a fancy Dan or too good compared to others you have the right to sulk on the pitch..

Don't think so,try to solve that problem outside the pitch if possible but when you're playing you give your all. Suddenly players can sulk while playing for United. What if half the team would sulk for this and that reason...