Phil Jones

[Brwned]

Every game he's played in midfield he's played it as the most advanced of the trio, right? It is a bit strange. The only immediate benefits of it that I can see are him helping us press higher up the pitch and him being able to help overload that right wing, both of which I thought he did pretty well yesterday. When he gets more used to that role it could be a very effective tactic in disrupting the holding midfielder's rhythm, but then that's the thing, you can see the long-term benefits but Sir Alex obviously sees short-term benefits to it as well or he wouldn't have played him there in such important games as this one or against Anfield. It should accelerate his development in forcing him to read the game differently and getting him more comfortable in positions higher up the pitch on a consistent basis, but it looks like there'll be a lot of bumps on that development path. Maybe Sir Alex is just experimenting early on and we'll give up on it after a while, we did the same with Scholes a couple of years ago for 4 or 5 games and then just gave up.

In a two-man midfield he looked very competent in general, IMO.

 

[Sultan]

Midfield is not his gig, I'm afraid. He doesn't play with the same awareness or composure as Scholes or Carrick.

It's one thing being good on the ball from the back, when you can see the entire pitch in front of you, and quite another when you need to retain the ball and create from midfield.

Thus far, his best performances have been at right full back. Needs to improve aerially and needs to improve his defending when players run off him, if he's to carve a career at centre back.

I like Jones, but I'm worried about him not nailing a position down. Generally, you don't tend to get top class utility players.

Playing the ball out from defence you look for the safest option, and have basically the full team as options. Midfield is very different - you're looking to be creative with maybe only 2 players in front marked by twice the defenders. It's the hardest positions to play on the pitch, and someone so young with not much experience will take time adapting, and that's if he ever makes it in that position full time. I'm not sure his all action style suits him being an attacking midfielder. Maybe once composure and positional discipline comes into his play he could become a holding midfielder. At this moment in time I would say he is being played in the middle to give some pace and energy, and as a nuisance factor for the opposition.

 

[marjen]

That's about right Sultan - and he did play really well against Wolves and QPR in a two-man midfield. We dominated those games, and his role wasn't to dictate as much as press high up the pitch, and provide those surging runs from deep to open the opposition up, both of which he did brilliantly.

I don't think he'll become a midfielder long-term. I'd say he'll be a CB once he settles down.

 

[Rood]

43 passes at 84% completed.

His average position was almost identical to Chicharito. Subs in parentheses.

...................1......................
........................................... penalty area
...........................................
...........................................
............6............5...............
...........................................
...........................................
..21...4.14...16.22.................. midfield
.........................10........3.....
.....................[19]...[18].......
..25.......................[11].........


You can find all that info on the telegraph's match report under the 'Live' tab.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...lackburn-Rovers-v-Manchester-United-live.html

Cheers for that, I didnt know where to look after Guardian cancelled the chalkboard thing

His pass completion rate is decent enough for someone just getting used to a midfield role - thought he played some good one touch stuff and managed a couple of decent crosses. His positioning and timing of runs is still a bit off but it will come with time.

Bizarre that he played as far forward as Chicharito! Everyone expects Jones to play a defensive midfield role, but both Capello and Fergie have deployed him further forward.

 

[Amir]

He hasn't looked really good since the string of injuries he's had mid-season. I thought he was brilliant in the first few months, though (as long as he wasn't playing at centerhalf). We'll probably have better understanding of him next year. Looking at how he played earlier on, I'd say he should be a midfielder, with great engine and good technique. It would be a waste to put him anywhere else, as long as he develops.

 

[gooDevil]

Cheers for that, I didnt know where to look after Guardian cancelled the chalkboard thing

His pass completion rate is decent enough for someone just getting used to a midfield role - thought he played some good one touch stuff and managed a couple of decent crosses. His positioning and timing of runs is still a bit off but it will come with time.

Bizarre that he played as far forward as Chicharito! Everyone expects Jones to play a defensive midfield role, but both Capello and Fergie have deployed him further forward.

Yeah, that almost seems wrong to me, Chicharito being that deep, I seem to recall him on the shoulder of the last defender the entire time. Considering that Scholes and Carrick averaged the same distance forward it suggests Jones wasn't too far forward, but I did get a similar impression.

I think he'll become a midfielder, Vidic, Smalling and Evans are all more natural CBs. Jones has another level in him, I still think he can turn into a true box-to-box midfielder with a few years training.

 

[Rood]

Yeah, that almost seems wrong to me, Chicharito being that deep, I seem to recall him on the shoulder of the last defender the entire time. Considering that Scholes and Carrick averaged the same distance forward it suggests Jones wasn't too far forward, but I did get a similar impression.

I think he'll become a midfielder, Vidic, Smalling and Evans are all more natural CBs. Jones has another level in him, I still think he can turn into a true box-to-box midfielder with a few years training.

I think in the first half Blackburn were playing quite a high line so might explain his deep position - I seem to remember we tried to take advantage of that with a couple of balls over the top that Cheech almost got to.

Scholes and Carrick's stats are skewed by the fact that we were camped on Blackburn's 18 year line for the last part of the match. Jones has already gone off by then - he was clearly told to be furthest forward of the 3.

Like you, I have high hopes of him as a midfielder - interestingly I read that when Bryan Robson first broke into the West Brom first team, he was moved about between defence and midfield - only after a couple of seasons did he become an out and out midfielder. MOTWYW!

 

[peterstorey]

Jones hasn't got a clue playing in CM, it's difficult enough for young CMs - let alone players out of position.

 

[Rood]

Jones hasn't got a clue playing in CM, it's difficult enough for young CMs - let alone players out of position.

His positional sense and timing is way off at the moment, but he has all the right attributes - just depends if he can learn the rest.

We've been desperate for a Keane or Robbo and I dont see any available in the transfer market, so I think Fergie is trying to make one himself!

 

[gooDevil]

I read that Gerrard started as a right back, so I guess that's a one way to blood a midfielder.

 

[peterstorey]

We've been desperate for a Keane or Robbo and I dont see any available in the transfer market, so I think Fergie is trying to make one himself!

You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. (There should be a modern take on this one).

 

[gooDevil]

Good thing Jones is made of silks then.

 

[peterstorey]

He sucks in midfield.

 

[Rood]

You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. (There should be a modern take on this one).

I think you are in the wrong thread - this is the Phil Jones thread, sow's ear my arse! Surely you recognise his immense potential?

TBH I think he has probably had his best games for us at RB and could still turn into a Maicon/Alves type. He has got too much forward drive to be a CB, unless we are going to reintroduce the old sweeper.

 

[peterstorey]

As a defender yes! As a CM or FB no!

 

[DFreshKing]

He's having a bit of a dip but he has played some storming games at CM.

Great potential.

Can't wait to see him develop.

 

[Snow]

I agree with him being a center back. He lacks too many qualities to be anything but. Might be a DMC but we don't use an anchor like that.

 

[ghaliboy]

As a defender yes! As a CM or FB no!

His best game at fullback was against Bolton.

I agree - athletically I think he's JUST too lanky to be a clean midfielder. But I think there is potential for him to move into midfield in the future in a limited role.

He's only young though. I think the more appearances he makes and the more faith he's shown the more he will grow as a player. Glad he got 20+ games in a bit of an up and down season rather than none.

 

[Amir]

His positional sense and timing is way off at the moment, but he has all the right attributes - just depends if he can learn the rest.

I absolutely agree. We got a glimpse of it in a few matches he's played for us in midfield - most notably QPR and Fulham. Yeah, he's clearly not there yet, by quite a distance, but we've seen he's got good technique, great engine and a good sense at arriving late at the box. There's more than enough to work with and if we decide to do that - he's only played a handful of games in midfield this season - I think he'll be brilliant there.

He's only 20, after all. We got Keane at 22. He had far more appearances for Forest than Jones has had for Blackburn, but even he took time until to become the player we know. I remember he talked about Robson telling him to start taking better control of the team, take the ball off the defenders and starting attacks. Keane had to go through a learning curve, and even he had a stretch of playing right back in his second year. Don't look at Jones and expect to see the finished product, he's not there at any of his positions.

 

[giggs-beckham]

I would've liked to have seen against Blackburn:

Cleverley Jones Scholes

In the middle with Jonsey as defensive cover.

 

[KM]

I would've liked to have seen against Blackburn:

Cleverley Jones Scholes

In the middle with Jonsey as defensive cover.

Yes great idea to drop our best midfielder and possibly our best player.

 

[Cina]

Yes great idea to drop our best midfielder and possibly our best player.

he's always good for a laugh that giggs-beckham fellow.

Still of the opinion that Jones is not a CM in any way shape or form, and never will be.

Right now he's best at right back, and will go on to be a center back.

 

[Rado_N]

Ignoring the general performance (not worth singling people out in a shit team performance) he really annoyed me when he got injured. He almost came to a standstill to appeal to the ref and let his man leave him yards behind meaning he had to bust a gut and throw a last ditch lunge in to get the ball and thus hurt himself. Play to the fecking whistle!

 

[I'm always right]

He's got worse as the season has gone on sadly, the summer rest will do him good if he gets one.

We really missed Rafael tonight, as did Valencia.

 

[FlawlessThaw]

Yeah he hasn't been the same player since he twisted his ankle against Arsenal

 

[Man-United]

True, that was a really bad performance from him. Rafael should start every game there, if not then I rather have Smalling as RB.

 

[Randall Flagg]

He is had a fairly rotton 2nd half of the season.

 

[Neutral]

0/10 tonight.

Yes, yes, I know he's only a kid, and we signed him a year early because of Liverpool. But that doesn't mean he shouldn't be graded on the merit of his performance.

 

[Kraftwerker]

The most disappointing thing is that his shocker helped take the sting out of Valencia's game.

 

[Ash_G]

The most disappointing thing is that his shocker helped take the sting out of Valencia's game.

True they don't compliment each other at all, but Valencia was pretty poor in general anyway.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

Very harsh on Phil, wasn't great but there's a lot of revisionism going on and 0/10 really?

 

[Neutral]

Very harsh on Phil, wasn't great but there's a lot of revisionism going on and 0/10 really?

bit harsh possibly, but not by much.

Yes, he was poor defensively, Evans had to do a ton of mopping up for him, and in attack...I don't even know how to describe it.

I don't blame him for it, not his fault Fergie asked him to do a job, he is not fit to do atm. His lack of experience means, he simply has poor defensive awareness, and in attack, he lacks the nous to know when to pass, when to overlap, when to sit back, or when to offer an option for a pass. He was a liability tonight.

But he, along with Hernandez and Giggs were atrocious tonight. Valencia not much better. Shit happens, doesn't mean I think we should get rid of them, or they should be lynched.

 

[Will Absolute]

But he, along with Hernandez and Giggs were atrocious tonight. Valencia not much better. Shit happens, doesn't mean I think we should get rid of them, or they should be lynched.

Disagree.

Of course they should be lynched.

 

[Neutral]

Disagree.

Of course they should be lynched.

Ok...we can lynch them if you want.

 

[Escobar]

He had a shit game and shouldnt be picked above Rafael right now but to blame him for Valencias poor performance is a bit far stretched

 

[LLMU]

I was frustrated with his crosses all night. He needs to practice them more often

 

[Escobar]

I was frustrated with his crosses all night. He needs to practice them more often

Then again, he's not a RB, simple as that

 

[towcester_red]

Another one of our square pegs in a round hole, he can play there but he isnt a RB.

Just like when Fergie lists 15 central midfielders we have, 10 of them arent but they can play there.

 

[ben_foster]

Admittedly I am not his biggest fan and that was the case prior to us signing him. I thought he was a bit of a knee jerk reaction to all the interest shown for him and I am also not a big fan of blood and thunder type players. I always think good players and especially good united players need more than that.

The positives with jones is that he has heart, desire and a willingness to do what ever is asked of him. That cant be taught and it would be nice if every squad player had that personality. But what also cant be taught is the the footbaling ability that top players have. His defensive ablities, positionally, tactically and his awareness are all poor in comparsion to evens and smalling. His distribution is also way behind there standards.

I think people got carried away with his forward runs (which inevitble lead to him over running it, getting dispossesed and being way out of position) at the start of the season leading them to believe he was playing well. However, even during this period his defending against arsenal and chelsea was very poor but this was over looked as we won well. Im not sure the exact numbers but I think we have dropped points in 8 league games, I would hazard a guess that jones played in all of them. He was certainly the weak link at St James' and at fault for numerous goals in european ties.

Charlie Adam left him standing when we got knocked out of the cup. Anybody who believes he had some brilliant performances in midfield needs their head looking at. Bilboa, liverpool, blackburn……he looked lost. He did ok in there away at fulham but ok is fair. Thee is also this opinion, like there is with fletcher that when he plays centre mid he is what the champ manager brigade call a DM. Nothing can be further from the truth. When he's played midfield he's played more advanced and has asked to press the oppositions "dm".

I'll say it not and will be proved correct in years to come but if Phill Jones is going to be the figure head and captain of future United and England teams, we wont be winning much.

 

[kps88]

Then again, he's not a RB, simple as that

Another one of our square pegs in a round hole, he can play there but he isnt a RB.

Just like when Fergie lists 15 central midfielders we have, 10 of them arent but they can play there.

What position would you play him in though? He's looked at his best for us when at RB.