Pogba Future

Would you accept Dybala and Sandro for Pogba?


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Rolaholic

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Not trusting the bumbling geniuses in charge to do anything even with a potentially huge fee in terms of replacing the creativity that would be lost

Not saying he's 100% irreplaceable either just that those clamoring for his sale are gonna be in for a rude awakening once he leaves.

Clubs like Barca,Bayern,Citeh,Juve etc would keep running like a well oiled machine but we're not anywhere near that sort of set up
 

Giggsyking

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What's this based on? Have you looked into their financial structure or is this just a punt? I'm not suggesting its sustainable because as you say, they can't do it every year. But it appears they have a lot of money to spend, and will move on Cancelo and Dybala if they have to in order to make way for Pogba.
https://www.calciomercato.com/en/news/official-juventus-register-e20m-loss-for-the-year-25696
This was last June. Even before buying C Ronaldo they were 19 m euros in losses.
You can take a look at their financial report on their website. As said, despite not paying huge wages and not buying expensive, they managed to go back.
 

mu4c_20le

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Clubs like Barca,Bayern,Citeh,Juve etc would keep running like a well oiled machine but we're not anywhere near that sort of set up
Not that I disagree in general, but bayern and juve have the luxury of being able to poach the best domestic talent every year. Citeh have enough dirty money to throw at both player and manager over and over again until something works. Barca is the only one credible on that list, the only one that sticks to their philosophies and style, meanwhile half our fans are moaning about us clinging onto the 'United way'.... silently implying that we should be more modern like chelsea, i suppose.
 

ivaldo

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Because they are fooking clueless idiots. Their supporters are already starting to question his signing on those wages. They'll get to see first hand how he isn't worth it.

The Basque Allen.

Doing Allen a disservice there

He's lucky that he didn't play next to someone like Keane. He is spineless and loses every 50/50.

He's been terrible this season. Don't think he knows what he's supposed to be doing.

I've stuck up for him a lot in the past

But he has been shocking, A little pussy out there. Disgraceful effort

For a supposed technical player he can't pass or control a ball for shit.

54.6% passing, brilliant.

I've been saying he's shite for quite some time now. I even had a thread called "I hate Herrera". Now gone?

And people blame LVG when we have garbage like Herrera on the pitch.

Spineless pussy, he is the epitome of what is wrong with this team.

Complete crap season from him. He tries though and he's enthusiastic, but he's just been ordinary.

Abysmal. Absolutely brainless the amount of free kicks he gives away and not just tonight

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/ander-herrera-2015-16-performances.406635/page-62

Cue the 'that was just one season', 'those are comments after a bad game', 'why are you bringing up old stuff, he won player of the year in 2016/17' retort. They are many more comments like this but you make it seem like the guy has been perfect in his time here.
:lol:
 

roonster09

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No, of course I dont know them personally.

Listen to Duncan Castle's podcast.
Read up on Hererra's pay cut and think about how that affects his mates particularly whilst useless cnuts are getting contract extensions purely cos they're English.
Get your head out of the sand.
Yeah, Duncan Castles report, nothing to do with him being a massive Jose fan and throws shit at every manager who replaces Jose or compete with Jose. He said we asked Herrera to take pay cut and he was on 80K per week, do you believe that also?
 

Mr Chutney

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At it again with the transfer leaks etc :rolleyes:

Is it time to just get rid of the prick?
 

Canagel

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Because they are fooking clueless idiots. Their supporters are already starting to question his signing on those wages. They'll get to see first hand how he isn't worth it.

The Basque Allen.

Doing Allen a disservice there

He's lucky that he didn't play next to someone like Keane. He is spineless and loses every 50/50.

He's been terrible this season. Don't think he knows what he's supposed to be doing.

I've stuck up for him a lot in the past

But he has been shocking, A little pussy out there. Disgraceful effort

For a supposed technical player he can't pass or control a ball for shit.

54.6% passing, brilliant.

I've been saying he's shite for quite some time now. I even had a thread called "I hate Herrera". Now gone?

And people blame LVG when we have garbage like Herrera on the pitch.

Spineless pussy, he is the epitome of what is wrong with this team.

Complete crap season from him. He tries though and he's enthusiastic, but he's just been ordinary.

Abysmal. Absolutely brainless the amount of free kicks he gives away and not just tonight

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/ander-herrera-2015-16-performances.406635/page-62

Cue the 'that was just one season', 'those are comments after a bad game', 'why are you bringing up old stuff, he won player of the year in 2016/17' retort. They are many more comments like this but you make it seem like the guy has been perfect in his time here.
Pogba is the inconsistent and should leave. Herrera had red in his heart and was the future captain. :lol:
 

Loublaze

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Pogba is the inconsistent and should leave. Herrera had red in his heart and was the future captain. :lol:
He said all the right things and 'got United'. What a terrible thing the club did letting that mediocre money grabbing merc leave. He won the jackpot at PSG.
 

DevilAgeIdiot

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Was going to let it slide but then you had to edit and throw in the shot about getting my head out of the sand, that after calling me a fool in your previous post. For the record you think because you heard a journalist say some things on a podcast it is "the truth" and apparently you have an issue with being challenged on your claimed intimate knowledge of what Pogba and DeGea are thinking. You have an opinion you don't have the truth and I am sorry you feel that being rude and disrespectful to other posters is the way to make yourself heard around here.
Ffs, give us a break, there is a big difference between calling someone a fool and using the common and acceptably polite Shakespearean idiom "more fool you"
which is simply used to convey that a specified person may be behaving or speaking unwisely.

Also the metaphor of 'head in sand' is simply that, another metaphor. This is how language itself operates, the sliding via the gap (the emptiness of meaning), from one signifier to another. Your taking offence to ordinary language metaphors suggests to me that you are not entirely convinced by your own defence.

Suggesting that a football supporter's opinion is negated by the fact that they do not personally know the footballers we are speaking of is utterly nonsensical. Herrera has been disrespected, asked to take a pay
Yeah, Duncan Castles report, nothing to do with him being a massive Jose fan and throws shit at every manager who replaces Jose or compete with Jose. He said we asked Herrera to take pay cut and he was on 80K per week, do you believe that also?
Or maybe it's not a convoluted conspiracy theory but rather the plain and simple truth.
 

roonster09

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Or maybe it's not a convoluted conspiracy theory but rather the plain and simple truth.
It's Duncan Castles, would be weird if he didn't put his own spin on every news.

All the news that we offered him around 150K per week and now all of a sudden Duncan Castle says we asked him to pay cut.

From James Ducker
United want Herrera to stay and believe their desire to keep him is reflected in the offer of a new three-year contract that represents a huge hike on his existing £80,000-a-week wages.

But Herrera, 29, is understood to be demanding in excess of £200,000 a week, amid interest from PSG, and United are unwilling to be held to ransom.
BBC reported Herrera wanted salary inline with highest paid players at the club. Times reported ManUtd offered new contract which was improvement on his existing contract but it was rejected, it was the first proposal. So any subsequent contract would be higher than the previous one in negotiations, not lower.

BBC, Simon Peach and other journalists reported big reason for Herrera leaving was the lack of communication, nothing to do with forcing him to pay cut which is just laughable suggestion but not surprising it came from Duncan Castles.
 

QoS

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I just don't see why Pogba should be worth 50% more than we signed him for. He came from Juve when his stock was high and he'd been winning titles at a young age. Now he's in his prime and at best you could say there's serious question marks over his consistency etc. Has inflation of transfer fees really been that big over the last 3 years? Because it's not an increase in value that he's added himself.
Finally someone who gets it. Pogba has added 0 value to himself as a player on the pitch since he has joined United. Just proved how disruptive he can be off it.

Honestly I dont think United will sell but I genuinely believe you would be a better team without him. I think if he is sold though it wont be nowhere near the 150 mil mark. Will be a tiny bit more than what United paid for him at best.
 

Gandalf

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Ffs, give us a break, there is a big difference between calling someone a fool and using the common and acceptably polite Shakespearean idiom "more fool you"
which is simply used to convey that a specified person may be behaving or speaking unwisely.

Also the metaphor of 'head in sand' is simply that, another metaphor. This is how language itself operates, the sliding via the gap (the emptiness of meaning), from one signifier to another. Your taking offence to ordinary language metaphors suggests to me that you are not entirely convinced by your own defence.

Suggesting that a football supporter's opinion is negated by the fact that they do not personally know the footballers we are speaking of is utterly nonsensical. Herrera has been disrespected, asked to take a pay


Or maybe it's not a convoluted conspiracy theory but rather the plain and simple truth.
Not remotely offended by you and nor did I say so, your reading comprehension leaves a lot to be desired. Merely pointing out that you can get your point across with more civility than you were showing but that seems to have fallen on deaf ears. I also did not suggest your opinion was negated by not knowing the footballers personally I simply pointed out that you could not assert your opinion as "the truth" without personal knowledge of the players and their thoughts or did you not write the following?

More fool you then.
The truth is that Pogba, De Gea and others have very serious doubts about Olé's ability to do the job. Neither are they happy with with the 'know the United Way boys' favouritism shown to many of the English contingent.
The board's amateurish shenanigans and Olé himself have contributed to the split in the dressing room. Don't expect our best players to say they want Olé out. They might be a bunch of primadonnas but when it comes to PR management they're not fecking stupid.
 

Needham

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Not trusting the bumbling geniuses in charge to do anything even with a potentially huge fee in terms of replacing the creativity that would be lost

Not saying he's 100% irreplaceable either just that those clamoring for his sale are gonna be in for a rude awakening once he leaves.

Clubs like Barca,Bayern,Citeh,Juve etc would keep running like a well oiled machine but we're not anywhere near that sort of set up
If we can intelligently build around him and he's mentally fully on board with Manchester United, that's awesome. But if he's discontented or the actual type to "virus" things up it's best to cash in. Only those who work with him on the day-to-day will know that.
 

RedRonaldo

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Pogba got 9 assists in the PL last season.

But his expected assists xA total was 5.19.

His expected assists per 90 mins xA90 was 0.15

His key passes per 90 mins was 1.64 (Mata, Martial and Sanchez all had higher numbers for this particular stat)

In simple terms, his team-mates did a very good job of finishing the chances he created. His assists total is also far higher than some other players, due in part, to the vast difference in the number of mins played. Pogba's xA90 figure of 0.15 is very ordinary. Ander Herrera 0.13, Ashley Young 0.14, Luke Shaw 0.15. Lingard 0.17. Mata 0.26
Wow jumping into conclusion from meaningless stats. Or maybe the chances he create are in much higher quality and hence his teammates are more likely to score? It’s up to how you want to interpret. Either way, it’s meaningless, there’s no one taking these broken/out of context stats seriously, and there’s reason for that.

Not every chances created are same, there’s huge difference between good chances and bad chances, where stats won’t cover. Over-interpreting these broken stats out of context had fundamental flaw and will lead you to nowhere. Pogba has highest number of goals/assists output, that’s all it matter.
 

Ban

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More fool you then.
The truth is that Pogba, De Gea and others have very serious doubts about Olé's ability to do the job. Neither are they happy with with the 'know the United Way boys' favouritism shown to many of the English contingent.
The board's amateurish shenanigans and Olé himself have contributed to the split in the dressing room. Don't expect our best players to say they want Olé out. They might be a bunch of primadonnas but when it comes to PR management they're not fecking stupid.
Why are you making things up? What split? And you talk to DDG and Pogba on regular bases?

Edit: oh Castles is your source. :lol:
 

DevilAgeIdiot

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Not remotely offended by you ....you being rude and disrespectful.....
It's clear to all, that you, either have indeed been offended, or at the very least are disengenously using the remote possibility of having possibly been offended, in order to add emotionality to your point.
You can not call out posters or anyone else, say for example in the work place, for their use of language, 'rude and disrespectful etc' and then claim to have no sense of having your sensibility even remotely offended.

Sorry Gandalf but on this occasion you simply can not have it both ways.
Seems that just like many other social media user you can throw out the insults liberally and yet call out others for having been rude and disrespectful for using everyday metaphorical tropes such as 'head in sand'.
Gandalf ; "Was going to let it slide but then you had to...throw in the shot about head..sand.."
A certain Pot and Kettle metaphor comes to mind.
Why are the offensive so easily offended?

Anyway sorry for my digression on the narcissistic foibles of the social media generation. The reality,that most of us fans agree on is that the board have acted shambolically regarding managerial appointments, transfer signings and contract extensions over the last 6 years.
I beleive this is down to the prioritising of commercial success to the detriment of the football. This is a shame and with the Glazers milking their cow it seems United are ultimately paying for our success over the Fergie years. The shite transfer strategy, idiotically bloated wages and contract extensions and favouritism, in my opinion will most certainly have contributed to disgruntlement in the dressing room.

And no I do not think one has to know the players such as DeGea, Hererra or the board personally, to comment on the the amateurish and shambolic contract strategy being implemented.
Until there is a major rethink by the board regarding football planning and strategy or until the club is sold it looks like United will falling prey to the parasitical nature of finance Capital for some time.
 
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jackal&hyde

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I'm starting to think that some of the Pogba irrational hate might be down to some peoples inability to get over the fact that as a 18 yo he chose Juve and became a huge hit there. Just like a jealous ex, some people can never move on and deny any and all facts just to be able to say "she wasn't so great anyway" :lol:
 

Reddy Rederson

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I'm starting to think that some of the Pogba irrational hate might be down to some peoples inability to get over the fact that as a 18 yo he chose Juve and became a huge hit there. Just like a jealous ex, some people can never move on and deny any and all facts just to be able to say "she wasn't so great anyway" :lol:
Or, it’s the reasons they say it is and people need to stop making up random shit to fit their argument.
 

GlastonSpur

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United should get rid of him this summer for whatever money they can. He clearly wants out and clearly will never be the kind of committed player that all teams need.

United are not to going to progress with a half-arsed Pogba jogging about the pitch, thinking more about his next hair-colouring or social media post than the game in progress.
 

balaks

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Not trusting the bumbling geniuses in charge to do anything even with a potentially huge fee in terms of replacing the creativity that would be lost

Not saying he's 100% irreplaceable either just that those clamoring for his sale are gonna be in for a rude awakening once he leaves.

Clubs like Barca,Bayern,Citeh,Juve etc would keep running like a well oiled machine but we're not anywhere near that sort of set up
Gotta love those stats - 105 shots and 13 goals doesnt exactly sound that great - 2068 passes attempted but no mention of how many were actually successful, 2747 touches - no idea why that is even included, I can touch the ball 100 times in a match but if I do feck all with it it's utterly meaningless. Only thing thats worth anything there is the goals scored and the assists from open play. Talk about stat padding.
 

roonster09

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Gotta love those stats - 105 shots and 13 goals doesnt exactly sound that great - 2068 passes attempted but no mention of how many were actually successful, 2747 touches - no idea why that is even included, I can touch the ball 100 times in a match but if I do feck all with it it's utterly meaningless. Only thing thats worth anything there is the goals scored and the assists from open play. Talk about stat padding.
Talk about inability to interpret stats :lol:
 

Halal Jalal

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Gotta love those stats - 105 shots and 13 goals doesnt exactly sound that great
This stat - like many others - largely depends on quality of teammates. Elite teams have intelligent strikers which specialize in pulling defenders with their movement (Benzema, Aguero) or simply with brute force (Mandzukic) and thus creating spaces for better shots. For Real Madrid or Juve, those 105 shots would easily translate into 25+ goals. Our attackers lack both the intelligence and physical presence - despite Lukaku's size - to be helpful in any way.
 

roonster09

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Maybe you can enlighten me about how wrong I am?
Touches, passes are not stat padding. It shows how much he is involved in the game. Taking shots shows he is involved in attacks too.
 

balaks

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Touches, passes are not stat padding. It shows how much he is involved in the game. Taking shots shows he is involved in attacks too.
It is no reflection of quality or effectiveness though. Being involved in the game is great and all but if most of your passes go to the opposition and most of your shots wizz over the crossbar then it's about as much use as a fart in a spacesuit.
 

roonster09

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It is no reflection of quality or effectiveness though. Being involved in the game is great and all but if most of your passes go to the opposition and most of your shots wizz over the crossbar then it's about as much use as a fart in a spacesuit.
:lol: Consistent quality posts.
 

balaks

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:lol: Consistent quality posts.
Am I wrong? Those particular stats just say a pass or a shot happened - doesnt say whether it was successful. Would you rather have a player make 150 passes a game with 120 of them going to the opposition or a player making 40 passes a game with 39 of them going to a team mate? Those stats give no indication of the quality. This is my point and honestly I don't think how you can argue against that. They are utterly pointless.
 

roonster09

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Am I wrong? Those particular stats just say a pass or a shot happened - doesnt say whether it was successful. Would you rather have a player make 150 passes a game with 120 of them going to the opposition or a player making 40 passes a game with 39 of them going to a team mate? Those stats give no indication of the quality. This is my point and honestly I don't think how you can argue against that. They are utterly pointless.
Instead of going to extremes it takes less than 20 seconds to see how many passes are completed.

They are not pointless. It tells you how much Pogna is involved in the game. Just check the pass completion it gives you how many passes are completed. Obviously it wont be in high 80s considering the style of play. It's not pointless stat, it's just that you can't interpret it.
 

balaks

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Instead of going to extremes it takes less than 20 seconds to see how many passes are completed.

They are not pointless. It tells you how much Pogna is involved in the game. Just check the pass completion it gives you how many passes are completed. Obviously it wont be in high 80s considering the style of play. It's not pointless stat, it's just that you can't interpret it.
Yes of course - I was talking about THOSE stats as shown in the image being used as some illustration of Pogba being amazing - those stats are mostly meaningless. If that image had successful pass completion, etc. in it we wouldnt be having this conversation.