This past week should warrant a third option in the poll..
[Poll] Are you convinced by us, or do you think we're flattering to deceive?
- Thread starter Fortitude
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
I said it in the other thread but today shows how far we still have to go to get to the very top. I would say we need a number 10 and a right sided winger (AG7 and Sanchez would do lovely), at the back we really need some quality in teh fall back positions. Some of their crossing today was awful.
Mata/Herrera/Miki just arent good enough for what we need of them. Lindof i'll give some benefit to because hes clearly not ready but those three players have been here long enough and are the biggest bottlers in our team. To challenge City we need both Mata and Miki to be firing. And they're simply not good enough.
I still think the progress we've made has been good and to turn a team around the way Jose has shows he knows what hes doing. But still a ways to go
Mata/Herrera/Miki just arent good enough for what we need of them. Lindof i'll give some benefit to because hes clearly not ready but those three players have been here long enough and are the biggest bottlers in our team. To challenge City we need both Mata and Miki to be firing. And they're simply not good enough.
I still think the progress we've made has been good and to turn a team around the way Jose has shows he knows what hes doing. But still a ways to go
When this was posted, I decided to defer judgement till we had played someone of quality in form . my verdict will be posted once we have...
Called it after the Everton game and was attacked on here. We are not very good as a unit, our attacking play is basic and unimaginative, majority of our attackers are not good enough and we crumble under the slightest bit of pressure. We've been unlucky with injuries these past few weeks but we've not played much better than this all season
We won't win the title with this squad. People who think that are clearly spending too much time with arsenal and Liverpool fans and are are becoming deluded.
Voted "flattering to deceive" and that was in our very good period. If you looked at the team, honestly it was a bit obvious what was gonna happen (injuries and poor performances)
I voted "flattering to deceive" too. But I do think we are better than this. I think the Liverpool game has taken the confidence out of our attacking game. We weren't great but we kind of knew we could score but after that park the bus second half vs Liverpool I think it took away our confidence.
Subtle, very subtle
Voted convinced
I tend to get carried away with good and bad runs as I would certainly change my vote after this past week
I tend to get carried away with good and bad runs as I would certainly change my vote after this past week
I am convinced by the players who I consider to be our best XI but, as I have said for 3/4 seasons now, players like Herrera, Mata, Young, Lingard and Smalling are just not up to the level required to play for Utd every week.
Lindelof just isn't even a footballer so didn't put him in that list. A CB who can't tackle or head the ball and has zero positional sense
I am a ST holder but I am now questioning whether I will bother much this season. I've just lost my patience with the same old players making the same old mistakes. It's not even glorious failure it's just failure caused by a reluctance to address glaring issues
City spend £25m on a 3rd choice RB/LB and we are still f**king around with Ashley Young in that position. Says it all really
Lindelof just isn't even a footballer so didn't put him in that list. A CB who can't tackle or head the ball and has zero positional sense
I am a ST holder but I am now questioning whether I will bother much this season. I've just lost my patience with the same old players making the same old mistakes. It's not even glorious failure it's just failure caused by a reluctance to address glaring issues
City spend £25m on a 3rd choice RB/LB and we are still f**king around with Ashley Young in that position. Says it all really
Looks like we're experiencing another false hope from the good start we had.
The right side is a mess attacking wise. He won't entertain playing Rashford there. The number 10 situation is now a huge concern. Pogba is injured till god knows when.
We're going to see more cack football for a while.
We're going to see more cack football for a while.
Has anyone changed their opinion yet?
Those 4-0 results were mostly from last 20 minutes hiccup from other teams. Still don't see us as a winning team.
Those 4-0 results were mostly from last 20 minutes hiccup from other teams. Still don't see us as a winning team.
We are a good side. Not a title winning one. Too many players who lack hunger and are comfortable losing.
We dominated most of those games. Come on. The common denominator is the absence of Pogba and Fellas. Matic looks like he's playing on his own. I still have no idea what Herreras role is in this team
With pogba and fellaini back we will start winning again for sure
No, but my initial fear has come true (flattering to deceive).
Flattering to deceive. Our attack play is shit and unimaginative, our defensive play is somewhat coward, we rely too heavily on a few players to perform.
I feel that Mourinho is mainly at fault for this.....
the way he approached the Liverpool game was pathetic and it, coupled with the international break, has resulted in us losing our confidence with José effectively telling the players you are good enough for a draw. We've lost momentum and it has shown vrs Benfica and Huddersfield - Mourinho and Herrera talked about attitude after the game and it feels like stuffing has been knocked out of us
injuries have played their part and it looks clear that with no Bailly, Jones or Rojo we are dealing with poor defenders
Matic again was superb I thought and looks like our player of the year but when you consider the form of Herrera, Mata, Martial and Mhiki as well as the ability of Lingard, Young or Valencia in an attacking sense we are going to struggle
an attitude shift, a left back, Ozil and Griezeman would be a great start to making us the real deal
the way he approached the Liverpool game was pathetic and it, coupled with the international break, has resulted in us losing our confidence with José effectively telling the players you are good enough for a draw. We've lost momentum and it has shown vrs Benfica and Huddersfield - Mourinho and Herrera talked about attitude after the game and it feels like stuffing has been knocked out of us
injuries have played their part and it looks clear that with no Bailly, Jones or Rojo we are dealing with poor defenders
Matic again was superb I thought and looks like our player of the year but when you consider the form of Herrera, Mata, Martial and Mhiki as well as the ability of Lingard, Young or Valencia in an attacking sense we are going to struggle
an attitude shift, a left back, Ozil and Griezeman would be a great start to making us the real deal
One of the worst displays I've watched, and I woke up for this?? We have ZERO creativity in the final third, our crossings are a shame to football.
I think people are slowly realizing, no matter what you say about Zlatan, he was our big leader last season. I love how Lukaku has started this season and he even assisted yesterday, but his holdup play, touches and passing leaves alot to be desired to. Zlatan was not as clinical last season and we dropped points but his overall level was very good. In fact i think playing both of these will help, Lukaku won't be involved in build up play and Zlatan won't be bullied like Mata and Miki and he will assist Lukaku. I agree Last season we were overall attacking wise with Zlatan and Pogba at the heart of things. We are much more solid defensively this year and more likely to grind wins which will probably see us get top 4 easily. If i were Jose i would get Ozil in Jan play him Right wing in place of Mata, Play Zlatan in behind Lukaku and get Pogba patched up and play Martial every match and i think we will start seeing positive and good football.
We defend poorly in exactly one game and somewhat our defensive approach is cowardly? Let's stop with the recency bias shall we
Yet we still finished 6th with the so called big leader in the team. Lukaku is far from the cause of our problems
Is this why we finsihed 6th? And why we scored only 54 league goals? Where would we have been without him? 16th? And only 30 scored goals? Strange conclusions right there.
nah bro he did very well - he's been carrying midfield since Pogbas injury - Fellaini was good when he played but Herrera has been awful
He was absolutely horrible against Huddersfield, just pure shit.
not with you on this one given the responsibility he's taken on in Pogbas absence
I never said Lukaku was the problem, my point being Lukaku is no Zlatan and he needs the whole team to be playing well and to create chances for him. He won't change the game on his head like Zlatan with a long range goal or a moment of brilliance etc. My point was overall we played better with Zlatan, but didn't get the desired results, now i feel we have a more settled team so we are more likely to win more matches due to the defence and midfield being stronger.
I suppose you misunderstood my post. I felt his contribution was under rated it was not his goals only but his passing, linkup play was ignored. Now this season although we have scored more goals and are doing better, but our style of play for a first half of the season was better than this season and created so many openings. we are just more clinical this year with a settled midfield and a defense thus we are getting more points.
We were dreadful even with Zlatan. For whatever good touches etc he had, Zlatan had zero movement which led to players around him standing around doing nothing as the striker was so immobile. At least with Lukaku there is movement, which is a big reason why we have scored so much. When your striker actually attempts to move well off the ball, it tends to open the game around him, moreso when he's a player that draws attention from two defenders like Lukaku. It's the very reason why Everton are now useless. They don't have Lukaku doing all the hard work around the box. But back to our problems, they are down to our totally useless midfield ever since Pogba and Fellas got injured. Herrera in particular has been completely useless (not to mention Mkhitaryan)
New signing syndrome
Matic was easily our best player in that game.
He was absolutely horrible against Huddersfield, just pure shit.
HowParking the bus is coward, especially against weaker opponents.
Matic is the caf darling, Rashford, Smalling, Valencia were or better or ar least as good.
But Matic wasn't any good, so i'm not sure how "at least as good" is factored in here.
International break killed our rythym and momentum and the injuries added salt to injury. The attacking flow and cohesion has been completely torn apart by those 2 factors. Lets be honest, all our games up until Liverpool was a true showing of our team. The attacking displays in those games would have shredded any team. That kind of attack needs momentum and confidence.
Which attacking displays were these because from what I can see.. we were struggling to put together cohesive displays even before the international break and were thumping goals past tiring teams for example... it wasn't really scintilating football, more efficient.
Valencia never puts in a single accurate cross (his primary job as a wing back), but somehow he's good?? Matic shielded the defence excellently as usual (both goals were from ridiculous errors) and was the only midfielder providing any accuracy and penetration through his passing. In fact make that the only player doing that. Smalling was good too. Rashford other than his goal blew hot and cold as he always does (he's still young so I'm OK with that)
Im not saying good, at least as good doesnt mean good. But he was no worse than Matic who got bypassed very easily later in the match and gave the ball away stupidly.
Rashford didnt do much wrong. Should have passed it to Miki a bit sooner.
I still think we flatter to deceive, from the very beginning. I said the big test will come against the big teams so let's see if we do better than against Liverpool. People were too quick to judge once we beat some poor teams 4-0. Teams now know how to play against us and we have not seen a Plan B or C yet