The LAM role is the same one Pogba had his great start to the season in. I feel like Pogba doing his defending higher up the pitch is a much better plan than him trying to play a disciplined role in a double pivot.
Ralf’s 4-2-2-2
- Thread starter Desert Eagle
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
A 424 is much different from a 4222, as the latter doesn't use wingers.
Nonetheless your second point is crucial, players need to know how they should execute their positions, otherwise a formation is just a bunch of numbers, but not a system.
I just liked that he explained why he used it and what the benefits of it were and you could actually see what he was talking about on the pitch, it was a breath of fresh air after vibes FC and reactive football.
Our fitness levels are going to be an initial issue no matter what system we are playing, but the longer term issue with the 4-2-2-2 is the fullbacks, Shaw and Telles can provide the wide attacking threat on the left but Dalot is still an uncertainty and AWB hasn't been great in attack.
Our fitness levels are going to be an initial issue no matter what system we are playing, but the longer term issue with the 4-2-2-2 is the fullbacks, Shaw and Telles can provide the wide attacking threat on the left but Dalot is still an uncertainty and AWB hasn't been great in attack.
Yeah , I don’t get this at all. I’m sure McTominay has issues with his play but mostly this idea seems based off of one Tifo video. I imagine I could screen grab every footballer to ever play and show him ‘hiding’ behind the other player. Football isn’t static.Some of the agenda posting on this place is absolutely staggering
Either way, McTominay is young enough and professional enough to take instruction. I’m actually more excited by what Rangnick could do with McTominay than Fred. He has the energy and tackling to be excellent at high pressing. It’s been trying to get him to play as a DM that has caused a lot of his issues.
It’s funny because you could just as well argue Mctominay is positioning himself for the pass after the pass to Fred.Some of the agenda posting on this place is absolutely staggering
Id love to see Cavani and Ronaldo play together in this system.
It would help only if we are ignoring the fact that the dude is out for months and probably won't be here next season.
A waste of energy and space to even think about how to fit him unless we have injured crisis when he comes back. Better get a midfielder in January for that.
Yeah.
I mean I do agree with the point but he's fecking off at the end of the season anyway. Why waste time trying to accommodate Pogba into a new role so he can redeem himself for the umpteenth time, only for him to look good for a month before drifting back to the inconsistent daydreaming performances that we already know he will drift back to.
We've already wasted several seasons trying to subscribe to the idea Pogba can be a player he just isn't ever going to be instead of either accepting him for what he is or finding someone else. It's beyond tiring
Because its lazy. Posting rumours without some sort of source (no matter how shaky) adds nothing to the conversation
I looked on Google and I mentioned him and anyone else to do the same. There wasnt one or two mentions, which I could have put a link, but loads. Thats why I said Google it.
If you read some of the posts about the 4-2-4 you would have realised that people were not simply criticising the numerical label of laying the team out with four defenders, two midfielders etc. They were pointing out that in our particular attempt at a 4-2-4, there was too much of a gap between the midfield 2 and the front 4.
That has no connection whatsoever with the 4-2-2-2 which is an entirely different approach which, with the centre halves playing so high, narrows the distance between each phase or passage of play. It is in fact the solution to the issues caused by the poor 4-2-4 we were fuking round with.
Good piece of analysis on MNF
missed it - if anyone has a link to it later on that would be great, cheers!
Our 424 was so bad compared to the 4222 though. Huge gaps in the middle of the park because of the medium defensive line and non-aggressive full backs. Pressing was also dysfunctional.
That said, I feel like Crystal Palace could have been braver (especially in the 1st half) and played 2 attackers higher up the pitch to exploit long balls against Lindelof/Dalot on the right. Or just counter attack quicker.
That said, I feel like Crystal Palace could have been braver (especially in the 1st half) and played 2 attackers higher up the pitch to exploit long balls against Lindelof/Dalot on the right. Or just counter attack quicker.
The 4222…
Imagine how different it can be depending on who the 2 half 10s are.
Bruno and Pogba
Sancho and Amad/Rashford
Very intrigued to see how it plays out with different players.
Imagine how different it can be depending on who the 2 half 10s are.
Bruno and Pogba
Sancho and Amad/Rashford
Very intrigued to see how it plays out with different players.
Decent bit of analysis
Dumbest comment. Scoring was not result of passing to Lindelof. Maybe we would have scored in 10 seconds instead of 18. What does that have to do with anythingHe passed it to lindelof and then we scored 18 seconds later. What a horrible decision from Maguire
Will be curious which 2 Donny starts in tomorrow. Would like to see him deeper but also think he might do surprisingly well in the Bruno role in Ralfs system.
the only 2 issues with this formation(no different than the diamond) is that the front two can get isolated and if you don't have damn good outside backs, you're going to struggled offensively.
I imagine it will be as one of the deeper positions as our options are fairly limited as I doubt he will play Fred and McT so with Pogba injured it pretty much has to be Matic and VDB.
Just go watch Southampton & then imagine that system with vastly better players & depth. Exactly the same system as RR.
I just found it jokes that you picked the one moment in the game right before we scored.
I’m not sure how to post tweets from my phone but Maguire played 15 passes into the final third against Palace, which is the second highest of any United player in a league game this season (Pogba being top against Newcastle with 23).
I’d rather form my opinion off that stat than you pointing out one random screenshot from that 90 minute match.
No disrespect, but maybe you should spend more time watching games, and less - watching stats on your phone.
Most forward passes by Maguire are long balls, and not the kind of progressive forward passes I was talking about. Anyway, it wasn't just about Maguire, our whole team has been horrible at moving the ball forward, under Ole, and Maguire episode was just an example.
Front four fluid, but we didn't defend high, the centre backs (makeshift as they were) weren't pushing forward, the midfield with Mata was never going to do any heavy lifting out of possession, so it looked a 4222 but counter attacking.
He'll definitely bring in a midfielder in January.
He'll definitely bring in a midfielder in January.
if you don't press the ball well, they'll pick you to pieces out wide with releasing their outside backs
He's played, what, 25 different players in the first two games? Today was always going to be difficult. The game didn't matter, the result was in the bag, so today was an opportunity for RR to assess the wider squad.
We're well suited to 4-2-2-2. We're going to need to bring in another midfielder simply for the amount of work those middle 4 need to get through.
We're well suited to 4-2-2-2. We're going to need to bring in another midfielder simply for the amount of work those middle 4 need to get through.
I don’t disagree that passing through midfield hasn’t been good enough, it’s my opinion that this is mainly due to the tactical instructions and lack of coaching, rather than the ability of Maguire like you were suggesting.
Also, no disrespect, but I can’t check stats while at Old Trafford as there is no signal, thanks for the advice though. Try not to be so condescending.
It's very tough on the middle 4. In an ideal world 2 of the 4 would be subbed every game, then the other 2 the next to keep a good rotation and fresh legs but we don't have the midfield 2 to do that.
We've got Bruno, VDB, Sancho, Pogba and Lingard for the two #10s when fit, with Mctominay, Fred, Pogba and VDB for the defensive 2 when fit, so that's 7 players for 4 positions, which I agree is a little tight.
Agree, we are perfect for this 4222. We will sign a high energy CM in Jan.
I expect us to be a decent team by Feb, before we start the CL.
I agree to an extent. He may not fancy pogba or dvb as part of the bottom 2 which could just leave Fred and mct with an odd game for matic.
Loads of numbers for the middle 2.
I doubt Ralf will trust Pogba as one of the defensive ones. We are very light in that area.
He's fourth choice there. Who knows, the high level of press might actually suit Pogba. His issue is he switches off, maybe RRs tactics around winning the ball back so quickly might mitigate that somewhat.
He'll prefer VDB to Matic there. He needs his players to be aggressive and proactive when out of possession.
I think it's pretty tough to play a fringe side with this setup. Very much relies on everybody being on the same wavelength and the fullbacks being high up the pitch to pressure opponents out wide. Match fitness is very important and you don't have that with random players.
As soon as you start dropping off you start to see the drawbacks of gaping holes down the sides that the midfield struggle to plug.
I like the look of it at times but whether we can play this every game remains to be seen.
As soon as you start dropping off you start to see the drawbacks of gaping holes down the sides that the midfield struggle to plug.
I like the look of it at times but whether we can play this every game remains to be seen.
Didn't mean to, sorry.
I agree that Maguire not passing through midfield has probably been mostly due to poor coaching. Now that coaching clearly instructs differently, whether he can change his habits or not will be interesting. Candidly, I am not too optimistic, but open to be proven wrong.
But we didn't play 4222 today, at least for the most part. It looked like a 4141, Amad was clearly wide.
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Not a fan, just doesn't suit our attacking players at all
Too early to say, it’s only been 1.5 games, let’s not write it off yet.