ivaldo
Mediocre Horse Whisperer, s'up wid chew?
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2012
- Messages
- 28,701
Really not surprising. Always maintained he was grossly overrated and was relieved when we didn't pick him up.
Right now he's abit like watching a Romelu Lukaku but at centre mid. Sort of kid in a smaller side can look beastly, but in a top side where you have to be more sophisticated.. he sticks out like a sore thumb. Wonder if he can over get over that.Too early to judge. He's not even 20 years old. First season at one of the top teams in the world where competition for playing time is tough. And last but not least, central midfield is an experience demanding position. I don't follow Bayern that much, but the few times I saw them Renato was deployed as wide players than his supposed natural position, so it's hard to just judge him at the moment.
Too early to judge. He's not even 20 years old. First season at one of the top teams in the world where competition for playing time is tough. And last but not least, central midfield is an experience demanding position. I don't follow Bayern that much, but the few times I saw them Renato was deployed as wide players than his supposed natural position, so it's hard to just judge him at the moment.
As an portuguese fan I also like more other type of players, more based on inteligence and decision making, but is Ancelotti taking the best out of him?I never got the hype at Euros nor do I see anything great now. I'd love it if he developed into a quality box to box midfielder, but there's so much lacking in his game. He's really young of course and the midfield role at Bayern is really demanding because of the way we play, so maybe I'm way too harsh on him. But I doubt he'll ever be a regular starter for us.
I can only see him working out in a defensive team that doesn't see much of the ball and plays on the counter or exploiting the second ball.I never thought he was all that, but it's a bit early to write him off
Its not about taking a starting spot from anyone, its about what he offers *when* he is given playtime. So far, he's looked to be out of his depth, overwhelmed by the speed of play and struggling with decision making. I'd rather have a promising 19-year old who shows to have both of these and lacking physique than the other way around.To be fair to him, even if he is not the type of player I like, it would always be hard to come to Bayern at the first season and take places from Thiago, Vidal or Alonso.
Next season he will need to play more and lets see if he has learned from this season, expectations at Bayern are huge for any player, he is only going to make 20 this year.
Yes I understand your point, his game for me his more based on the physical side, but if he improves and learns at a tactical level, who knows?Its not about taking a starting spot from anyone, its about what he offers *when* he is given playtime. So far, he's looked to be out of his depth, overwhelmed by the speed of play and struggling with decision making. I'd rather have a promising 19-year old who shows to have both of these and lacking physique than the other way around.
Everyone was playing better under Pep. Apparently it helps if there is a clear plan instead of "go out there and play some football"Yes I understand your point, his game for me his more based on the physical side, but if he improves and learns at a tactical level, who knows?
Remember that last year he played in a 4/4/2 system as an 8, and his game was more based in phisycality, he needs to improve tacticaly, but for me he will only achieve if he plays as an central midfielder on a 4/3/3.
Decision making hard to improve much, his game his more suited to an transitional play or more direct than possession football, next year for him will be decisive, remeber that Coman with Pep was playing at an better level, so Ancelotti also has to improve the way they play, and not rely only on the individual quality of the players.
Yes but don't say that too much, general opinion is that Pep is vastly overrated, he will never make it in England, and for Bayern fans Jupp was 10 times better because well, he did not played possession football and Ancelotti is much better because he won a match 4/0 against Bayern playing on counter attack with Ronaldo in the form of his life.Everyone was playing better under Pep. Apparently it helps if there is a clear plan instead of "go out there and play some football"
I always thought that Anderson was technically quite good. Is that wrong?He reminds me so much of Anderson.
He had the worst technique I've seen when shooting - honestly it was like he would run at the ball, close his eyes and hit it with his wrong foot. But he could play some good passes and was a good penalty taker. So he was technically good in some aspects.I always thought that Anderson was technically quite good. Is that wrong?
I think that's a fair opinion. I warned about his limitations but tbf (even if i'm not his biggest fan) i expected a bit more from him after some decent performances at the Euro and Champions League for Benfica. It's just his first season abroad and he may (or may not) evolve but with just over half of a season at top level, i think he should have stayed at Benfica to gain even more experience and keep evolving with playing time. Something he isn't getting in an extremely strong and full of choices Bayern Team. He's also putting his NT career at risk. He's not playing and there are other young players taking advantage of the spotlight. I think Bayern will end up loaning him next year.I never got the hype at Euros nor do I see anything great now. I'd love it if he developed into a quality box to box midfielder, but there's so much lacking in his game. He's really young of course and the midfield role at Bayern is really demanding because of the way we play, so maybe I'm way too harsh on him. But I doubt he'll ever be a regular starter for us.
Ancelotti deserves some blame but it's also the player's fault. I'm not entirely sure what type of midfielder he's supposed to be. I hope he develops into a Vidal - type of midfielder, agressive box to box who can score and run with the ball. But compared to a 20 year old Vidal in his first season at Leverkusen, Sanches is just far far away from that level. I didn't watch him in Portugal at all, so all I could judge him on were his games against us in the CL and the games at the Euro.As an portuguese fan I also like more other type of players, more based on inteligence and decision making, but is Ancelotti taking the best out of him?
I say this because comparing with Guardiola, it is a little painful to watch Bayern to play this season, it is all based on the individual quality of the players, I am not seeing any improvement, even Arsenal can beat this team.
Yes I remember someone saying in Portugal that his type of game is more an Vidal type of player than lets say someone like Modric, but it is hard for me to understand that an club like Bayern would pay that amount of money without scouting him for at least the first six months of 2016, even if I believe Bayern paid something like 35, the other objectives to pay more do not sound reasonable.Ancelotti deserves some blame but it's also the player's fault. I'm not entirely sure what type of midfielder he's supposed to be. I hope he develops into a Vidal - type of midfielder, agressive box to box who can score and run with the ball. But compared to a 20 year old Vidal in his first season at Leverkusen, Sanches is just far far away from that level. I didn't watch him in Portugal at all, so all I could judge him on were his games against us in the CL and the games at the Euro.
None of what I've seen helps me make sense of the money we paid for him. If he's nowhere ready to play lots of minutes for us, he needs to be loaned out. But if that's the case, we never should have bought him for that kind of money in the first place. It's a huge gamble.
Coman has been injured for the equivalent of 3 months this season.Yes I remember someone saying in Portugal that his type of game is more an Vidal type of player than lets say someone like Modric, but it is hard for me to understand that an club like Bayern would pay that amount of money without scouting him for at least the first six months of 2016, even if I believe Bayern paid something like 35, the other objectives to pay more do not sound reasonable.
The other factor of the inflated price may have to do with Mendes and the new TV deals from the Premier League who inflated the market and now China, when we see today average players in the Championship sold by 15 million nothing surprises me.
But i still blame Ancelotti, it is not only Sanches, Coman is playing much less than under Pep, again I may be suspicious because i never rated too much Ancelotti, yes he has a lot of experience at the higher level, but for me is not even amongst the best 3 italian managers at this moment.
Lets wait and see if Sanches with an normal pre season can improve, even if i do not know if he will go to the Confederations Cup, hopefully if he goes i do not fancy him to be an starter for the NT, probably will not be called to the Euro Under 21 also.
I did not know that, but I was saying this when he was ok, was playing less like all the team, just my opinion, but ok that is also an factor, for me Ancelotti is worse than Jardim, maybe Sanches needs to be loaned to Monaco to replace Moutinho?Coman has been injured for the equivalent of 3 months this season.
No, they can keep him. Monaco isn't in the business to develop players for other clubs. Now, if they want to sell him for 5m, why not.I did not know that, but I was saying this when he was ok, was playing less like all the team, just my opinion, but ok that is also an factor, for me Ancelotti is worse than Jardim, maybe Sanches needs to be loaned to Monaco to replace Moutinho?
He didn't really play as an '8' at Benfica, he played quite deep, sometimes next to a DM, sometimes not. He was at his best when running from deep after having won the ball. Shouldn't have made such a big move so young (except maybe to work with a Portuguese coach or in circumstances where he'd feel more at home) but he'll still come good.Yes I understand your point, his game for me his more based on the physical side, but if he improves and learns at a tactical level, who knows?
Remember that last year he played in a 4/4/2 system as an 8, and his game was more based in phisycality, he needs to improve tacticaly, but for me he will only achieve if he plays as an central midfielder on a 4/3/3.
Decision making hard to improve much, his game his more suited to an transitional play or more direct than possession football, next year for him will be decisive, remeber that Coman with Pep was playing at an better level, so Ancelotti also has to improve the way they play, and not rely only on the individual quality of the players.
Ah maybe Mendes will give an gift to Jardim and it also solves Bayern problem, anyway this is to talk about Sanches, Monaco is on other topics.No, they can keep him. Monaco isn't in the business to develop players for other clubs. Now, if they want to sell him for 5m, why not.
Well i still think that i know where he played and he was not playing alongside Fejsa, even if I am an Sporting fan, I remember watching him play for Portugal at the Euro Under 17 in a 4/3/3 midfield alongside Ruben Neves and another Benfica player, anyway you are right, for me he should have stayed at Benfica at least until 2019 to develop his game and to leave Portugal as an more tactically developed player.He didn't really play as an '8' at Benfica, he played quite deep, sometimes next to a DM, sometimes not. He was at his best when running from deep after having won the ball. Shouldn't have made such a big move so young (except maybe to work with a Portuguese coach or in circumstances where he'd feel more at home) but he'll still come good.
He played in a different position in his youth days than he did in Benfica's first team, that's true. But I liked what the coach did with him at Benfica, he was learning how to improve his positioning and when to run etc nicely. Shame he can't get a kick at Bayern.Well i still think that i know where he played and he was not playing alongside Fejsa, even if I am an Sporting fan, I remember watching him play for Portugal at the Euro Under 17 in a 4/3/3 midfield alongside Ruben Neves and another Benfica player, anyway you are right, for me he should have stayed at Benfica at least until 2019 to develop his game and to leave Portugal as an more tactically developed player.
He is not my type of player and I think that the Mendes and Benfica machine hyped him too much, but still I do not want the kid to fail abroad because it is bad for portuguese players overall.
He played even more when he was fit.I did not know that, but I was saying this when he was ok, was playing less like all the team, just my opinion, but ok that is also an factor, for me Ancelotti is worse than Jardim, maybe Sanches needs to be loaned to Monaco to replace Moutinho?
Probably because he's being subbed on pretty late in quite a few matchesHow is he doing?
Edit: 4+6 games with an average rating of 6.31 on whoscored.com. Is he really that shit?
what a cockAs I always maintained even when he was most hyped on here I saw him for what he was: average. Search it up in this topic and see my expertise when everyone else was drunk with bandwagon-syndrome and slammed me for my spot on analysis.
I really don't get these kind of posts. Obviously most football fans will look stupid in hindsight because of the opinions they voiced on young players, because you never really know how they'll develop. You'll get some predictions right and at least as many terribly wrong. But ffs, we can close football forums down for everything but post match discussions if we always have to wait until something has happened rather than try to prodict what might happen. So boring.Guys.
He has gone from being 18 and a half to 19. He hasn't actually played a minute in our terrible last performance to warrant this burst of discussion.
He was raw in summer, he was still raw in November, and HEY GUESS WHAT, he's still raw now.
He hasn't gotten any worse, he hasn't gotten better, at least not that we know of. He's still the same kid whose most promising attributes are engine and workrate, not playmaking and technique.
It makes no sense to draw bimonthly, fundamental resumés, as I have already pointed out before in this thread. There's absolutely nothing wrong with the kid, apart from the fact Bayern decided to spend quite a lot of money for him.
We can judge what a player he has become when he has become that player. In, like, 4-6 years.
Isn't Ancelotti just like Mourinho in this area? He doesn't use a lot of youngsters?How come he's barely playing? They spent a lot on him.