Kag
Full Member
I’m inclined to agree. He works nicely in this Liverpool team, but his stock would be a lot lower if he were to play elsewhere and be relied upon to score goals regularly.
Totally agree that he's not been at his best this season, but for people to say he's overrated is laughable. Like you say the previous 2 seasons he was absolutely incredible. I think his loss of form this year might have had something to do with us having to grind out more wins than we're used to. He really is that important - at his best - to how we operate as an attacking unit. I think some people forget that even players like Ryan Giggs & Dennis Bergkamp had off seasons too.This thread is like a looking-glass into what it must have been like for you lot when Liverpool fans said Carrick was massively overrated while you were the best team in the world.
Having said that, this year particularly has not been his best for consistency. But I think a lot of the arguments getting levelled at him don't apply to the previous two seasons where he was consistently vital and fantastic.
He's holding Liverpool back from reaching untold levels at this point?I don't understand the apparent need to consistently explain the position he plays as if that explains why he sometimes fails to make the right passes hence not get assists.
The man plays as a false 9 with two wide forwards either side of him. He basically plays the same position Messi played during the Pep years or that Cruiyff played during Holland's total football days. Or that Totti played at times at Roma.
One thing in common amongst those great players is that they didn't struggle to put up great numbers be it goals or assists. Why? Because they were truly great players who possessed an accuracy and technical level that Firmino isn't close to.
How he plays in no excuse for his lack of productivity. For example, in the video whoever posted it shows him doing what he should consistently do in that position and exactly what he doesn't consistently do. His touch fails him at times, he isn't much of a dribbled and his passing is inconsistent. He's holding Liverpool back from reaching untold levels at this point.
So would most of Liverpool's team.I’m inclined to agree. He works nicely in this Liverpool team, but his stock would be a lot lower if he were to play elsewhere and be relied upon to score goals regularly.
He's not an out & out striker though. He's more of an attacking midfielder type. If you're going to compare him with someone like Harry Kane or Mo Salah then he's not even close. But then again, Harry Kane is generally not known for his creative play & ability to bring others into the game with just a delicate touch. & he's most certainly not recognised for his workrate & helping break up opposition play.Is he actually that highly rated? I don't remember a lot of people talking about him as an exceptional players, he is very good and has a niche but I'm pretty sure that most people will have at least a handful of strikers above him?
That's the point, he isn't that highly rated, so how is he overrated? I feel that the people that rate him do it within a certain context which to me is fair but rare are the people who believe that he is Lewandowski, Benzema, Ronaldo, Kane, Suarez or even Mbappé's equal. He is a key player for Liverpool though and would be for several others.He's not an out & out striker though. He's more of an attacking midfielder type. If you're going to compare him with someone like Harry Kane or Mo Salah then he's not even close. But then again, Harry Kane is generally not known for his creative play & ability to bring others into the game with just a delicate touch. & he's most certainly not recognised for his workrate & helping break up opposition play.
In the last year the British pundits have put a lot of praise into him.Is he actually that highly rated? I don't remember a lot of people talking about him as an exceptional players, he is very good and has a niche but I'm pretty sure that most people will have at least a handful of strikers above him?
The reason people and Spurs fans rate Kane as one of the best strikers in the world is because he scores goals and he play-makes for them. He’s definitely known for his creativity too.He's not an out & out striker though. He's more of an attacking midfielder type. If you're going to compare him with someone like Harry Kane or Mo Salah then he's not even close. But then again, Harry Kane is generally not known for his creative play & ability to bring others into the game with just a delicate touch. & he's most certainly not recognised for his workrate & helping break up opposition play.
They know nothing about football and most of them are Liverpool ex-players.In the last year the British pundits have put a lot of praise into him.
This seems about right. Like Park was a defensive winger, he is a defensive striker. Personally, not what I’d want from my No9.Offensively, he is overrated.
The defensive work he does and the cynical tactical fouling he does, however, is underrated. He's a key part of Klopp's gegenpressing/ tactical fouling system.
Dennis Bergkamp only had one season out of 11 for Arsenal where he scored over 20 goals. Still doesn't stop people remembering him as a great player. The season Arsenal won the league in 2002 he only scored a total of 14 goals in 46 competitive games. People were most certainly not calling Firmino overrated in the 2 seasons prior to this.In the last year the British pundits have put a lot of praise into him.
The reason people and Spurs fans rate Kane as one of the best strikers in the world is because he scores goals and he play-makes for them. He’s definitely known for his creativity too.
Firmino is clearly a very good player. The only thing that I’d say is negative about him is that he’s only had one year where he’s managed over 20 goals in the season (for Liverpool). His 17/18 season shows he is capable and he notched up a genuine World Class tally of 27 goals and 17 assists all season.
I’d agree. They’re a lot better than the sum of their parts.So would most of Liverpool's team.
Dennis Bergkamp was also a much better player in every facet.Dennis Bergkamp only had one season out of 11 for Arsenal where he scored over 20 goals. Still doesn't stop people remembering him as a great player. The season Arsenal won the league in 2002 he only scored a total of 14 goals in 46 competitive games. People were most certainly not calling Firmino overrated in the 2 seasons prior to this.
Disagree, strongly. He's exactly the type Sir Alex would go for.Not the type of player Sir Alex would have had at United.
This I do agree with. Of course, football being a team game, that doesn't really matter!I’m inclined to agree. He works nicely in this Liverpool team, but his stock would be a lot lower if he were to play elsewhere and be relied upon to score goals regularly.
Martial may be the better player in your eyes... but very very rarely does he play better.Completely and utterly agree. Martial is a better player, but you'd never hear any pundit say that.
Sometimes the obvious answer, the one that is staring you massively in the face, is the right one. Not everything has to be subtle or beyond the intelligence of us mere mortals. Salah and Mane are far better players.
You could say the same about VVD.I’m inclined to agree. He works nicely in this Liverpool team, but his stock would be a lot lower if he were to play elsewhere and be relied upon to score goals regularly.
Nah. He has zero X factor about him and as many have said he's a defensive forward. Fergie would go for a goalscorer (Cole, Ruud, Hernandez) or someone with that bit of class (Cantona, Berbatov, Rooney)Disagree, strongly. He's exactly the type Sir Alex would go for.
Even if that were true, that is as much an issue of style as it is quality. You could just as easily say the same about James Milner or something - doesn’t make him a top player by any stretch.Our most important player. Not VVD, it's Firmino. Without him, our whole attack is toothless most of the time.
Not to mention his defensive contributions. His pressing is probably best in the world for an attacking player.
Klopp's whole ideology starts with Firmino. He's his ultimate wet dream. It would be the same for Pep.
I think he is decently rated.
The best false 9 in the world? probably. Not many can do what he can, supporting the wide forwards.
Liverpool set up that way, suits him really well. If he comes to United he won't have any use for us, as we prefer our CF to score goals.
That’s absolute nonsense Mane is the best player Liverpool have even better than Salah this season.He’s not overrated. He’s an excellent footballer, I’d argue he’s the most important player in Liverpool’s front three.
Mane is the overrated one in that attack.