SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

[F-Red]

And currently people are catching this more often than they’d catch the common cold. This ain’t over yet

That's just semantics though, I'm sure if you tracked the two they wouldn't be that far apart. I've had a cold three times already this year.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I agree with that and about 75% of your last post. I don’t fully agree with your point about school effects. It was pointless closing things like restaurants and cinemas for so long yet you must go to school. You ca control everything but what happens when you drop your kids off in that Petri dish.

The restaurants/cinemas vs schools was about what we prioritise as a society. Is it more important to keep our kids in school or be able to eat out/go to the cinema? I’m biased but I think they made the right call. Which is vindicated by hindsight when you see the longterm negative consequences of school closures. Which have been obviously far worse for underprivileged kids.

Anyhoo. Me banging on about schools is about as interesting for everyone else in the thread as arguing about Swedish ski holidays, so I’d better button it!

 

[choccy77]

That was my sentiment too.

As life began to return to normal, it was tempting to tell myself that maybe I'd been overly cautious, stuck too rigidly to the shielding guidelines etc. But then I caught Covid and wow was I grateful for being triple jabbed.

Hope you start feeling better soon!

Thanks dude.

 

[Wibble]

That's just semantics though, I'm sure if you tracked the two they wouldn't be that far apart. I've had a cold three times already this year.

And covid is far more serious for so many comparing the two isn't really valid.

 

[Wibble]

The restaurants/cinemas vs schools was about what we prioritise as a society. Is it more important to keep our kids in school or be able to eat out/go to the cinema? I’m biased but I think they made the right call. Which is vindicated by hindsight when you see the longterm negative consequences of school closures. Which have been obviously far worse for underprivileged kids.

Anyhoo. Me banging on about schools is about as interesting for everyone else in the thread as arguing about Swedish ski holidays, so I’d better button it!

Here in Sydney the delineation seems to be that most people with kids get covid and many (but not all) of people with no kids don't. We aren't seeing more than a handful of children dying from covid and older age groups are hugely vaccinated so it could be worse.

 

[Fridge chutney]

I've stayed out of this thread for the past 1000 pages or so. Has anything substantial happened?

 

[F-Red]

And covid is far more serious for so many comparing the two isn't really valid.

2 years ago, yes. On the current strains that are circulating in a triple jab & high immunity environment, I’d say there’s more validity to that argument now more than ever.

 

[Wibble]

2 years ago, yes. On the current strains that are circulating in a triple jab & high immunity environment, I’d say there’s more validity to that argument now more than ever.

People who aren't already very sick don't die from having a cold even though not vaccinated so they are completely different.

 

[golden_blunder]

@Pogue Mahone

here’s a doc asking for a temporary mask mandate again to ensure medical services can cope. Sounds like Connolly are getting it bad!

Dr O’Connor added that if a return to mask-wearing could bring this wave of Covid to an end sooner rather than later, then it would be a minor inconvenience for people.

She added that she has worked some of the worst shifts of her career in the last few weeks and that she, and a number of colleagues, have recently contracted the virus.

"The problem is that four out of six of us consultants in Connolly and emergency medicine caught Covid last week," Dr O’Connor said.



"I can't begin to tell you how much that decimates a system which can't reduce its inflow of patients."


(File photo: RollingNews.ie)
Dr O'Connor added that GPs have also been overwhelmed with Covid care and patients are reporting difficulties in gaining access to their GP in a timely fashion.

She said the numbers in emergency departments are currently "enormous'"and there is little capacity to deal with this.


"We have very little capacity to cope with the surge like this - both in staff sickness and in attendances that that's happening at the moment," Dr O'Connor said,

She added that the effects of the long St Patrick's weekend are yet to be seen, but added that "thankfully the weather was very good so most people were outdoors".

She warned that a wet Easter weekend with people celebrating indoors could "well cause problems".

 

[Pogue Mahone]

@Pogue Mahone

here’s a doc asking for a temporary mask mandate again to ensure medical services can cope. Sounds like Connolly are getting it bad!

Note the “if”. She seems about as convinced as I am that masks will make any difference to this current surge!

From talking to friends working in hospitals the big problem isn’t covid hospitalising loads of people it’s loads of staff off sick. Which is what she’s saying too. The health service is always run on incredibly fine margins when it comes to staffing levels and general capacity at busy times of year. So it doesn’t take much for the wheels to come off. That’s a long term problem though. I don’t see how making people wear masks in Tescos will fix it.

 

[Ian Reus]

Was this posted?
This Deltacron is looking grim.

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[Pogue Mahone]

Was this posted?
This Deltacron is looking grim.

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Yer man's a fecking tool and I wouldn't worry about Deltacron. Or basically anything else he gets hysterical about.

That footage is crazy though. Feels as though China is right back where Europe was in March 2020.

 

[Ian Reus]

Yer man's a fecking tool and I wouldn't worry about Deltacron. Or basically anything else he gets hysterical about.

That footage is crazy though. Feels as though China is right back where Europe was in March 2020.

So he is a scare mongerer?
I must admit, I've been mostly following his advice and info on this since it all started.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

So he is a scare mongerer?
I must admit, I've been mostly following his advice and info on this since it all started.

Oh yes. He's the worst of the worst.

And I say this as someone who's been repeatedly called a scaremonger myself, in this very thread!

 

[Ian Reus]

Oh yes. He's the worst of the worst.

And I say this as someone who's been repeatedly called a scaremonger myself, in this very thread!

Will keep that in mind next time he scares me.

Cheers.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

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Speaking of China. Fecking hell.

 

[Pexbo]

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Speaking of China. Fecking hell.

Jesus Christ that’s unimaginably cruel

 

[Ian Reus]

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[Pogue Mahone]

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This is why he's a fecking tool. He's been one of the most vocal advocates for draconian measures likes these throughout the pandemic. Now he's drumming up outrage at the reality of the exact measures he's been calling for!

 

[Massive Spanner]

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Speaking of China. Fecking hell.

Jesus fecking Christ. At least the order was stopped.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

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The viral load stuff is really interesting. I got off very lightly and was a bit worried that this was because I was extremely lucky and only got a very small dose of virus.

 

[Tony Babangida]

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The viral load stuff is really interesting. I got off very lightly and was a bit worried that this was because I was extremely lucky and only got a very small dose of virus.

That viral load idea became a widely accepted with no evidence to justify it, was a bit strange.

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

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Speaking of China. Fecking hell.

At least they took that back after the massive scandal it made in Hong Kong not this long ago.

If China wants to solve the problem faster to avoid long queues and deaths in hospitals, it should be simple enough: get vaccinated with the right vaccines. I don't know what is the reasoning behind persisting with their zero-COVID policy, but the majority of economists and medical experts worldwide say that has to stop because the virus is there to stay just like seasonal influenza does.

 

[Balljy]

At least they took that back after the massive scandal it made in Hong Kong not this long ago.

If China wants to solve the problem faster to avoid long queues and deaths in hospitals, it should be simple enough: get vaccinated with the right vaccines. I don't know what is the reasoning behind persisting with their zero-COVID policy, but the majority economists and medical experts worldwide say that has to stop because the virus is there to stay just like seasonal influenza does.

Xi is going for re-election in the Party Congress in November. There are rumours that they now know that it's not a long term strategy, but they don't want to rock the boat before the re-election so will keep zero-covid going until then. That's probably the reason for staying with local vaccines too.

 

[Lj82]

At least they took that back after the massive scandal it made in Hong Kong not this long ago.

If China wants to solve the problem faster to avoid long queues and deaths in hospitals, it should be simple enough: get vaccinated with the right vaccines. I don't know what is the reasoning behind persisting with their zero-COVID policy, but the majority of economists and medical experts worldwide say that has to stop because the virus is there to stay just like seasonal influenza does.

I think they know, but they do not want to admit their vaccine is inferior to mRNA vaccines by foreign countries. They are now developing their own mRNA vaccines and maybe they will revaccinate their population when it is ready.

Currently, they clearly do not have the medical capacity to cope if they open up.

 

[Wibble]

Far from what we used to think of as normal but we have "only" an average of 20 covid deaths per day. Barring voluntary mask wearing in most circumstances almost everything is almost back to normal here in Australia. Not scanning in to every place you visit is still a bit weird.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Two weeks, no masks and I haven't got covid yet, at least not that I know about.

 

[Lj82]

Far from what we used to think of as normal but we have "only" an average of 20 covid deaths per day. Barring voluntary mask wearing in most circumstances almost everything is almost back to normal here in Australia. Not scanning in to every place you visit is still a bit weird.

We relaxed the mask wearing mandate here in Singapore a couple of days ago so it is no longer mandatory to wear a mask outdoors. But based on observation almost 99% of the people still wear it.

The biggest indicator of a "return to norm" here is the full reopening of the causeway between Singapore and Malaysia. Boy that was emotional.

 

[Garethw]

Excuse my ignorance, but with the infection rate being absolutely ridiculous in the UK right now, is there a chance that we could see a more deadly variant materialise? Or is it likely that every future variant will be less severe and will in effect weaken down to virtually nothing?

 

[Adamsk7]

Interesting coming to Milan and Como from the UK for my first holiday in two years - mask compliance is still very high. I know there’s still a mandate in some settings like trains etc but there was in England too and you’d only see 30-40% actually bothering. I’m seeing literally 100% in tubes, about 90 on trains and around the same in shops. Attendants are actually asking people to put them on or pull them up as well. Impressive stuff. They’re also using the terms “FFP2” on notices too and most people are wearing masks of this type.

 

[calodo2003]

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[utdalltheway]

I had two negative rapid antigen tests over the last few days as some of my sisters had tested positive.
Today I tested again to check as one more sister came down with it: I tested positive.

Still no real symptoms apart from being a little lethargic.

 

[Anustart89]

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I wonder what anti-vaxxers will make of him being alive after 90 vaccine shots.

 

[Compton22]

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Must be quite lucrative, giving his finances a real shot in the arm

 

[jojojo]

Must be quite lucrative, giving his finances a real shot in the arm

Can diversify into charging for his services as a 5G antenna as well.

 

[Salt Bailly]

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[Suedesi]

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What the heck - some people are crazy

 

[Brwned]

An intriguing theory may help explain why the flu and Covid-19 never gripped the nation simultaneously — the so-called twindemic that many public health experts had feared.

The idea is that it wasn’t just masks, social distancing or other pandemic restrictions that caused flu and other respiratory viruses to fade while the coronavirus reigned, and to resurge as it receded.

Rather, exposure to one respiratory virus may put the body’s immune defenses on high alert, barring other intruders from gaining entry into the airways. This biological phenomenon, called viral interference, may cap the amount of respiratory virus circulating in a region at any given time.

“My gut feeling, and my feeling based on our recent research, is that viral interference is real,” said Dr. Ellen Foxman, an immunologist at the Yale School of Medicine. “I don’t think we’re going to see the flu and the coronavirus peak at the same time.”

…

Only 0.2 percent of samples tested positive for influenza from September to May, compared with about 30 percent in recent seasons, and hospitalizations for flu were the lowest on record since the agency began collecting this data in 2005.

Many experts attributed the flu-free season to masks, social distancing and restricted movement, especially of young children and older adults, both of whom are at the highest risk for severe flu. Flu numbers did tick upward a year later, in the 2021-2022 season, when many states had dispensed with restrictions, but the figures were still lower than the prepandemic average.

So far this year, the nation has recorded about five million cases, two million medical visits, and fewer than 65,000 hospitalizations and 5,800 deaths related to the flu.

….

Recent studies have shown that co-infections of flu and the coronavirus are rare, and those with an active influenza infection were nearly 60 percent less likely to test positive for the coronavirus, he noted.

“Now we see a rise in flu activity in Europe and North America, and it will be interesting to see if it leads to a decrease in SARS-COV-2 circulation in the next few weeks,” he said.
Advances in technology over the past decade have made it feasible to show the biological basis of this interference. Dr. Foxman’s team used a model of human airway tissue to show that rhinovirus infection stimulates interferons that can then fend off the coronavirus.

“The protection is transient for a certain period of time while you have that interferon response triggered by rhinovirus,” said Pablo Murcia, a virologist at the MRC Center for Virus Research at the University of Glasgow, whose team found similar results.

But Dr. Murcia also discovered a kink in the viral interference theory: A bout with the coronavirus did not seem to prevent infection with other viruses. That may have something to do with how adept the coronavirus is at evading the immune system’s initial defenses, he said.

“Compared to influenza, it tends to activate these antiviral interferons less,” Dr. de Silva said of the coronavirus. That finding suggests that in a given population, it may matter which virus appears first.

Dr. de Silva and his colleagues have gathered additional data from Gambia — which had no pandemic-related restrictions that might have affected the viral patterns they were observing — indicating that rhinovirus, influenza and the coronavirus all peaked at different times between April 2020 and June 2021.

That data has “made me a bit more convinced that interference could play a role,” he said.

Thought this was particularly interesting…

Last year, one team of researchers set out to study the role of an existing immune response in fending off the flu virus. Because it would be unethical to deliberately infect children with the flu, they gave children in Gambia a vaccine with a weakened strain of the virus.

Infection with viruses sets off a complex cascade of immune responses, but the very first defense comes from a set of nonspecific defenders called interferons. Children who already had high levels of interferon ended up with much less flu virus in their bodies than those with lower levels of interferon, the team found.

The findings suggested that previous viral infections primed the children’s immune systems to fight the flu virus. “Most of the viruses that we saw in these kids before giving the vaccine were rhinoviruses,” said Dr. Thushan de Silva, an infectious disease specialist at the University of Sheffield in England, who led the study.

This dynamic may partly explain why children, who tend to have more respiratory infections than adults, seem less likely to become infected with the coronavirus. The flu may also prevent coronavirus infections in adults, said Dr. Guy Boivin, a virologist and infectious disease specialist at Laval University in Canada.

 

[Wibble]

Thought this was particularly interesting…

Not saying it doesn't help but Australia and NZ virtually eliminated flu when there was no covid.

 

[Brwned]

Not saying it doesn't help but Australia and NZ virtually eliminated flu when there was no covid.

Interesting. I don’t think the point was that covid prevents flu, just that the likelihood of covid and flu running riot simultaneously seems unlikely because of those factors.

But it could just be an anomaly of a flu year(s)! Presumably this applied when there were few preventative measures too - just masks? Otherwise if it happened with social distancing then I guess it wouldn’t tell us much!