[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

McTominay spawned an odd phenomenon, something along the lines of "Schrödinger's managerial competence".

On the one hand, any criticism of him is often met with the putdown that four managers played him a lot, "do you know more than these experienced professionals?"

These people, however, are usually also adamant he isn't a "six" and he would be a lot better in a role that these four managers didn't really play him. In this case, it is of course fine to know better than these four managers.

The irony of such a statement clearly oblivious to the fact the Carrick and Matic are the ONLY actual 6s we've had in that period. Forcing bosses to cover that hole with the sheer desire and work rate of McFred once Matic's legs went....

 

[Chief123]

Neither Fred nor Mctominay are 6s for example. For years we paired them together just to take advantage of their work rate and desire to defend. Jack to do with actual aptitude for the 6 position. Heck we've just come off a season in which a fully fit Eriksen was first choice partner for Casemiro in ETHs double pivot. So I KNOW its disingenous....

You’re living in cuckoo land if your argument is Mctominay isn’t a 6 and is still useful to
us. If the argument is he’s a an 8, then he’s even less useful to us as he is not even close to Bruno level. He’s a worse 8 than he is a 6. Which brings us to the obvious conclusion he is not good enough and should be sold. Some of you need to stop getting so giddy over international performances.

 

[Ayrlad39]

Ah, another round of internationals, another time to repeat what should be bleeding obvious by now. Say it together with me:

McTominay isn’t a DM, he is an attacking box to box player.

Stick him in the side instead of Mount and I reckon he does a good job. Stick him in instead of Casemiro and he will not. It honestly baffles me that Ten Hag and others can’t see that.

What I didn’t understand at the end of last season when we were lacking support for Rashford up front is why we didn’t just try McTominay up there, starting a match. His goals for Scotland at least show he has goal scoring capabilities. Some of them may have been against less strong teams but you still have to be able to take your chances. He doesn’t seem to be a player that would spit his dummy out and not try his best so I would be giving him a try there, even if for a League Cup game to see how he gets on.

Spain and

If we ever play a team as bad as Cyprus he can start.

What about Spain and Norway?

 

[Ayrlad39]

You’re living in cuckoo land if your argument is Mctominay isn’t a 6 and is still useful to
us. If the argument is he’s a an 8, then he’s even less useful to us as he is not even close to Bruno level. He’s a worse 8 than he is a 6. Which brings us to the obvious conclusion he is not good enough and should be sold. Some of you need to stop getting so giddy over international performances.

McTominay this years scapegoat McGuire last year

 

[MasterDarcy]

Personally, It gladdens me that so many people are breaking rank by saying that Scott McTominay is a good player.

Maybe the "Scott McTominay hides from the ball" spell is finally starting to break.

McTominay's goalscoring (6 goals) assists (he's been involved in around 4 goals) and general performance in the European Championships Qualifiers are making the pseudo analysts look foolish.

Long may it continue.

Hopefully it continues on Tuesday.

What are the haters going to say then? "it's only England"?

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

You’re living in cuckoo land if your argument is Mctominay isn’t a 6 and is still useful to
us.

That's rich coming from a person who not only doesn't know what a 6 is. On top off not having the first clue about the various options that can occupy a double pivot, going of your laughable Bruno coments. Frankly, YOU are the one lost in the land of make believe......

 

[Chief123]

That's rich coming from a person who not only doesn't know what a 6 is. On top of not having the first clue about the various options that can occupy a double pivot, going of your laughable Bruno coments. Frankly, YOU are the one lost in the land of make believe......

There’s a very good reason why the likes of ETH are managers rather than fans with views like yourself. If only Ten Hag didn’t miss a trick like you.

 

[Chief123]

McTominay this years scapegoat McGuire last year

He can’t really be a scapegoat when he rightfully doesn’t play. We’ve just got a few here getting a bit too excited about his dazzling displays against the likes of Cyprus. Memories are short.

Let’s all head to the Hojberg thread to moan about why we didn’t sign him when he’s scoring at international level.

 

[MasterDarcy]

He can’t really be a scapegoat when he rightfully doesn’t play. We’ve just got a few here getting a bit too excited about his dazzling displays against the likes of Cyprus. Memories are short.

And Spain.

What are you going to say if he scores and dominates the midfield on Tuesday?

In fairness, it's only Rice and a semi retired Henderson or a part of the City bench (Phillips).

Gilmour will certainly dominate the England midfield. As he did when he just turned 20.

 

[Chief123]

And Spain.

What are you going to say if he scores and dominates the midfield on Tuesday?

McTominay has scored against the best club team in Europe who are better than virtually every national team. What’s your point? You’re showing your football IQ using that evaluation.

 

[Bwuk]

All his goals for Scotland come arriving late into the box.

His strengths are driving forward and using his physicality and ability to carry the ball.

He’s never a 6.

Whilst we’ve got our RW dilemma I wouldn’t be against trying to replicate similar to how Scotland line up.

I’ve had a few beers so forgive me if I’m chatting shite. It’s maybe not ideal with our current injury list, but….

Gunn
Porteous - Hendry - Tierney
Hickey - McGregor - Gilmour - Robertson
McSauce - McGinniesta
Adams

Onana
Lindelof - Casmiro - Martinez
Dalot - Amrabat - Bruno - Regulion
McSauce - Rashford
Hojlund​

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I reckon we should look at another player who’s hit a similar vein of goalscoring form during the international break. This guy has also scored a brace in the World Cup knock out rounds, so proven at the very highest level. Two goals against world champions > two goals against Spain. Big lad. Dutch. His name is Wout Weghorst.

 

[Bwuk]

I reckon we should look at another player who’s hit a similar vein of goalscoring form during the international break. This guy has also scored a brace in the World Cup knock out rounds, so proven at the highest level. Big lad. Dutch. His name is Wout Weghorst.

Do it. Might win a trophy this year.

 

[AltiUn]

McTominay this years scapegoat McGuire last year

Calling people a scapegoat is such a cop out response, he’s not a scapegoat, he doesn’t even play, he’s just bad.

 

[MasterDarcy]

McTominay has scored against the best club team in Europe who are better than virtually every national team. What’s your point? You’re showing your football IQ using that evaluation.

So, no answer then?

You're reduced to insults.

Thanks.

All his goals for Scotland come arriving late into the box.

His strengths are driving forward and using his physicality and ability to carry the ball.

He’s never a 6.

Whilst we’ve got our RW dilemma I wouldn’t be against trying to replicate similar to how Scotland line up.

I’ve had a few beers so forgive me if I’m chatting shite. It’s maybe not ideal with our current injury list, but….

Gunn
Porteous - Hendry - Tierney
Hickey - McGregor - Gilmour - Robertson
McSauce - McGinniesta
Adams

Onana
Lindelof - Casmiro - Martinez
Dalot - Amrabat - Bruno - Regulion
McSauce - Rashford
Hojlund​

Agreed.

Plus 6 EPL players. 1 La Liga player and 4 players who have/would hold their own in the EPL.

Strongest Scotland XI in a long time.

Calling people a scapegoat is such a cop out response, he’s not a scapegoat, he doesn’t even play, he’s just bad.

Because let me guess, "he hides from the ball"?

Think for yourself. Your brain will thank you for the exercise.

 

[Chief123]

So, no answer then?

You're reduced to insults.

Thanks.

Oh I’ve got an answer for sure. I thought it was obvious. Clearly not. He can dominate the whole game and score against England….it won’t change the fact he’s bang average and far too often plain shit. Rather weird to suggest it makes a difference.

 

[MasterDarcy]

Oh I’ve got an answer for sure. I thought it was obvious. Clearly not. He can dominate the whole game and score against England….it won’t change the fact he’s bang average and far too often plain shit. Rather weird to suggest it makes a difference.

Yes. And by saying as such you're calling England "bang average".

It matters not, Scott McTominay could join Barcelona. Win the European Cup 6 times. Win the ballon d'or 6 times and there would still be people who calls him "bang average".

I'm sure there are a few Manchester United fans who live under a rock whl still think Cristiano Ronaldo is a one trick pony.

Or Darren Fletcher was "Alex Ferguson's son" (before being included in the EPL team of the season).

I suspect you are one of the the aforementioned few.

This post is a gift to you. For the insult, I shan't be replying any longer.

Namaste.

 

[AltiUn]

Because let me guess, "he hides from the ball"?

Think for yourself. Your brain will thank you for the exercise.

He's a poor passer, technically limited, needlessly careless with his tackles, takes forever to decide what to do with the ball when he does have it, has incredibly poor defensive positioning and yes, has ridiculously low touches per game for the positions he plays. That's why he's bad.

 

[In Rainbows]

All his goals for Scotland come arriving late into the box.

His strengths are driving forward and using his physicality and ability to carry the ball.

He's not a good carrier of the ball. He needs open space to carry the ball. Good carriers can do it while under pressure. They need technical ability to be able to do that. Antony is a better example of that then McTominay and I don't rate Antony either.

He is a good goal scorer from midfield though as he times his runs well.

The problem is that a number 6 either has to protect the backline better than McTominay, or they need to be able to pass the ball better than McTominay. A number 8 has slightly less defensive responsibility, but they have to bring in overall qualities from a passing perspective, technical perspective (which involves press resistance), a creative perspective, and or a scoring perspective. He brings the last quality, but a number 8 at United needs their overall game to be much better in the other 3 areas. How else are you expected to dominate other midfields if your midfielder can only score? Sure it might look great from an individual statistic point of view, but you're never going to dominate midfields in that manner which is important in getting the rest of your team to perform at their best, or for the team to pick up the most points.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

There’s a very good reason why the likes of ETH are managers rather than fans with views like yourself. If only Ten Hag didn’t miss a trick like you.

You lack ANY self awareness. The likes of you are the ones actually diametrically opposed to the views of most actual managers. No wonder you are actually convinced Bruno played 6 for us last season

 

[Chief123]

You lack ANY self awareness. The likes of you are the ones actually diametrically opposed to the views of most actual managers. No wonder you are actually convinced Bruno played 6 for us last season

The irony.

 

[nau05194]

Some good points on here. I feel that Scott is gaining in confidence and is showing everyone just how good a player he is on the international stage. I'm looking forward to seeing him back in the United team scoring goals once we resume the league campaign hopefully in a more advanced midfield role.

 

[Idxomer]

He isn't going to be playing in advanced positions ahead of Mount, Eriksen or Bruno. It's not even certain that he's ahead of Mainoo in that position. He's probably 3rd in the DM position after Casemiro and Amrabat. His main role now will be adding a bit of height late in games.

 

[nau05194]

People were saying that boy Zidane Iqbal should be in the team last year, but he ended up having to leave to play at Utrecht so while it's not really surprising to see people say the exactly the same thing about this Mainoo guy I just can't see it. Mainoo's a young guy with some potential while but has only played 10 minutes of Premier League football while McTominay is a boss if used correctly.

I'd have McTominay replace Antony or even Mount who has been dire so far.

 

[AltiUn]

People were saying that boy Zidane Iqbal should be in the team last year, but he ended up having to leave to play at Utrecht so while it's not really surprising to see people say the exactly the same thing about this Mainoo guy I just can't see it. Mainoo's a young guy with some potential while but has only played 10 minutes of Premier League football while McTominay is a boss if used correctly.

I'd have McTominay replace Antony or even Mount who has been dire so far.

I see where you're trying to come from but Mainoo's one of the best talents in our academy (if not the best) whereas Iqbal wasn't even the best midfielder in his age group, you'd also have to be intentionally ignoring that ten Hag clearly rates Mainoo. Also you'd have McTominay replace Antony on the wing ... what?

 

[Lyng]

Given our current rw situation it would make sense to test out different setups and formations. I dont think Scott works in our usual system, but a different system with him further forward might add some explosive movement that we are actually missing.

 

[philippexyz]

Ok, we have two defensive/holding midfielders in the squad now(Casemiro, Amrabat). When/if McTominay plays, he'll play further towards opponents goal and we can finally "unlock" him, according to some people's opinion here.

Let us see, finally, what he can do when he's not the DM. I never rated him, maybe I was wrong all along. I actually hope I was wrong, let him show us all his talents.

 

[Solius]

You lack ANY self awareness. The likes of you are the ones actually diametrically opposed to the views of most actual managers. No wonder you are actually convinced Bruno played 6 for us last season

The irony.

Now folks what we've got here is called a Chief-off.

 

[Woziak]

Brighton will be a very difficult game, especially with the 4 man midfield box they use, add that to the attacking threat they now have with A Fati, S March, E Ferguson, J Enciso and Mitimoto, if Amrabat is not fit highly likely we must play Scott in the midfield.

I would like to see a 4312 which can change in game to 4222 and 4231 formation in this game with a starting 11 looking like this;
Onana, AWB, Lindelof, L Martinez, D Dalot, Casemiro, S Mctominay, Ericsen, Bruno, Haaland And Rashford.

Subs - A Bayinder, S Reguilon, H Maguire, J Evans, A Garnaucho, D Gore, H Mejbri, F Pellistri, A Martial

I’d hope Sancho on the bench but I can’t see it and Mount won’t be fit yet !

 

[Woziak]

Ok, we have two defensive/holding midfielders in the squad now(Casemiro, Amrabat). When/if McTominay plays, he'll play further towards opponents goal and we can finally "unlock" him, according to some people's opinion here.

Let us see, finally, what he can do when he's not the DM. I never rated him, maybe I was wrong all along. I actually hope I was wrong, let him show us all his talents.

Ok I sit on the opposite fence to you that he has never and will never be a CDM or a CB as Scotland tried in certain games but he is a ball carrying attacking midfielder or a Box to Box midfielder who doesn’t quite have the passing range to be a true number 8 playmaker, he’s not a number 10 either, he’s not clever enough, however he is a much silkier version of M Feillani, he has the potential to get double figure goals in a season from the bench or starting, he arrives late and finishes with both feet exceptional plus he can score with his head. His physicality is essential in the PL, we’ve seen it already in 4 PL games if we play any 3 from Mount, Ericsen, Bruno and Casemiro we are simply too weak physically in the midfield.

Sofran is a beast and will help this issue no end but so too is Scott and he’s with us until at least January, let’s play him and get his value up to £50m. I genuinely believe that he can win ETH over because of his attitude.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

The three chaps on the forum who rate McTominay highly sure are excited.

 

[nau05194]

Ok, we have two defensive/holding midfielders in the squad now(Casemiro, Amrabat). When/if McTominay plays, he'll play further towards opponents goal and we can finally "unlock" him, according to some people's opinion here.

It's not just people on here who are thinking that. The Scotland National team boss had the same thought and it's working well. I don't see a good reason why it couldn't work for United.

With Scotty we’ve been trying to find a way to play that can unleash him and John McGinn to get forward. It’s nice to have two ball players behind them in Billy (Gilmour) and Callum (McGregor) to control the game.

Steve Clarke​

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/foot...rus-it-tells-everyone-what-were-about-4286896

 

[Chief123]

Now folks what we've got here is called a Chief-off.

Too many Chiefs.

 

[Withnail]

Plenty of players put in good performances at International level and aren't good enough to cut it at the top end for the Premier league. There isn't much point using International performances as proof of anything in relation to club football and especially not the PL.

We've seen enough of McT. He's a good lad. I'm sure he's great around the training ground and he does talk a good game but he's limited. He'd do well at a lower level PL club but he's not what we need.

 

[Cantona’s Kung Fu Kick]

Ok, we have two defensive/holding midfielders in the squad now(Casemiro, Amrabat). When/if McTominay plays, he'll play further towards opponents goal and we can finally "unlock" him, according to some people's opinion here.

Let us see, finally, what he can do when he's not the DM. I never rated him, maybe I was wrong all along. I actually hope I was wrong, let him show us all his talents.

It’s not like the guy has never been given a chance here. He’s played over 200 games for the club already and is nearly 27. He’s had way more opportunities than many have been granted. If it’s so obvious he should play further forward like some think then why hasn’t he been used that way? After all some on here say Mouriniho, Ole, Rangnick and ETH know way more than us fans. I would suggest that he’s simply not good enough. ETH clearly thinks that as he’s been consigned to the bench so far this season and hardly featured in pre-season. Would much rather his minutes be given to Mainoo as that lad looks like he has the potential to become a class act.

 

[Dve]

If Hag is to use McTominay, he must utilise his strengths. He needs to play in an advanced position so he can make frequent runs into the box. That would add some punch, which has been most needed. Højlund will add strength, but so far this season United as a team have been lacking physics. Garnacho, Sancho, Antony, Martinez, Lindelöf, Eriksen, Fernandes, Mount, Pellistri. We are not the strongest team.

 

[MasterDarcy]

He isn't a playmaker. No one has ever said that he was. He's an old fashioned number 8. A box-to-box midfielder.

He would've thrived in the 80s/90s as he has a Robson/keane/Ince look to him.

And before some bright spark chimes in, no, I'm not saying that he's comparing him to Robson or Keane.

Here's a great article that sums it up for me. I've been saying since Ole was in charge that McTominay should be a roaming number 8. Seems like the media have finally taken notice.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2023/09/10/scott-mctominay-manchester-united-scotland/

Even Lineker is giving Scott props:

https://www.geordiebootboys.com/new...-try-and-sign-40m-newcastle-target-very-soon/

Nowhere in those (or any) article does it say that he "hides from the ball". The people who say that are starting to look very stupid.

Chris Sutton said that Henderson (who is a starter for England) wouldn't start for Scotland over McTominay, McGregor, McGinn or Gilmour.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...s-Sutton-Mail-Sports-podcast-Kicking-Off.html

 

[OrcaFat]

He isn't a playmaker. No one has ever said that he was. He's an old fashioned number 8. A box-to-box midfielder.

He would've thrived in the 80s/90s as he has a Robson/keane/Ince look to him.

And before some bright spark chimes in, no, I'm not saying that he's comparing him to Robson or Keane.

Here's a great article that sums it up for me. I've been saying since Ole was in charge that McTominay should be a roaming number 8. Seems like the media have finally taken notice.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2023/09/10/scott-mctominay-manchester-united-scotland/

Even Lineker is giving Scott props:

https://www.geordiebootboys.com/new...-try-and-sign-40m-newcastle-target-very-soon/

Nowhere in those (or any) article does it say that he "hides from the ball". The people who say that are starting to look very stupid.

Chris Sutton said that Henderson (who is a starter for England) wouldn't start for Scotland over McTominay, McGregor, McGinn or Gilmour.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...s-Sutton-Mail-Sports-podcast-Kicking-Off.html

He was close to being useless last night. In particular, he did not do enough to get himself into positions where he provided a good passing option for his team mates. This is sometimes called “hiding” from the ball - he doesn’t do it on purpose but, in the end, what’s the difference?

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He isn't a playmaker. No one has ever said that he was. He's an old fashioned number 8. A box-to-box midfielder.

He would've thrived in the 80s/90s as he has a Robson/keane/Ince look to him.

He may have that ‘look’ to him but he not the ability to match. He is a box to box midfielder who is suited to and more useful for smaller clubs or those that play with a small team mindset. He’s a decent tool to disrupt things in the middle with a big physical presence but good teams tend to value the things he doesn’t have (passing, close control etc) highly.

 

[Champ]

McT for the first twenty minutes was Scotland's best player last night, sitting on Rice whenever the England back line had the ball, essentially nullifying the build up from the back.

However, Rice got wise to this and started drifting across the pitch and McT was then dragged out of position and so stopped doing the man marking job, from that point on Scotland were in trouble, and so it proved.

McT had a great first 20 minutes or so, average after that, but was still better than the rest of the Scotland midfield last night.