All three of our strikers are living on their past reputations.
There, I said it.
There, I said it.
So what is the actual issue then?
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
Laughable to think Eriksen can't get into this United side.
What about the current bunch is at the title winning level?
Defence is poor at best. Midfield is unbalanced. Attack flatters to decieve and is past its prime.
We will need to break our Summer spending record again to get anywhere close to our rivals.
I don't believe that for a moment
We have some top players and it is the managers job to get the best out of them. so far this season with the exception of one of par two LVG has failed with the majority of the squad
He can do it now, and he's had a core of players fit for a good while.
Herrera, Janujaz, Wilson, Mata have all come into the team only to get no rhythm and disappear again.
Like I said its at the point where I don't even care who the players are just as long as it's consistent and allows them to get some sort of flow going between each other. It can be tweaked from there but until we have a rhythm going we're not going to improve.
Spurs and Liverpool don't have squads as good as ours, except when Sturridge and Kane are playing well.
There are plenty to choose from but I put a lot of it on our "star" players. Rooney, Van Persie, Di Maria & Falcao are all on huge wages and I don't care how they're being asked to play or what position, none of them are contributing anywhere near enough. Obviously there are deficiencies in this squad like we need a top class CB but looking at what we do have these players are not doing enough.
Our squad is worse than Chesea's and City's but it's no more than that. The issue is that almost every player in the team is playing at a lower level than they are capable of, which the manger needs to take responsibility for.
They are not even close, who said that anyway
Uniteds first 11 is stronger (when he finally decides what it is 
) and United have much better back ups for just about every position. The difference being that those sides mentioned don't have the plethora of talent to get into a first 11 and are playing more consistent formations and players every week.
They have better midfielders and defenders. Which is a big deal.
RvP and Falcao have been playing worse than most PL strikers this season, never mind Kane and Sturridge, and I don't see either of them turning things round any time soon.
No they don't.I think we are missing top quality players in key areas. I believe that area is primarily in defence.
I honestly don't think thats the case, I'd take our midfield over there and our defence actually defends better as a unit than it's given credit for. The latter part is the difference maker for me on why their form is better
Who even said that? Why not read the thread before you faceplant yourself into a wall ofThey are not even close, who said that anyway
emoticons. The difference is they have strikers in form and we dont. Personally I think RvP and Falcao are done, with Rooney not far off, that's rather a big deal because like it or not the striker is the most important position on the pitch.
I don't believe that to be the case. Liverpool's defence is as bad or worse than ours. I'd even say the midfield is up for debate. It's their consistent formation and playing with high tempo and energy which is to their advantage. Strikers are definitely playing/functioning better.
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I think he has failed to get the best out of our best player, di Maria. But I think the reason for that is the shortcomings of our attack.
Defence is touch and go (although a dominant and consistent presence like Skrtel would improve our other defenders massively) but it's midfield and up front where Liverpool (and Spurs) are so much better. The likes of Di Maria and Hererra will hopefully swing it when they settle but we're desperately lacking in proven PL talent in the centre of the pitch. So long as Carrick can't stay fit anyway.
To be clear, I see Mata as basically a support striker. That's where he was at his best for Chelsea. He's too lightweight to be much use in the actual midfield battle, which is why Mourinho preferred Oscar.
I'd also go with Mata and Rooney up front, seeing RvP and Falcao have not delivered. A midfield of Blind and Carrick holding with Hererra and Di Maria ahead would work well and betters Scousers and Spurs midfield. Unfortunately, Blind and Carrick have hardly been fit at the same time.
The lack of on-pitch leaders is glaringly worrying to me.
We'd be fine if we played a proper formation and stopped using idiotic England tactics.
Our strikers are a problem but they weren't until deadline day happened.
I have no idea how good our midfield is because, three quarters of the way into the season, the only time we've lined up with a midfield in midfield was against Sunderland, when it was Fletcher and Cleverley. Since then we've always had a player in midfield, playing against the other team's midfield, on their own. We can't say we only have one midfielder because we bought two of them in the summer.
Our strikers are a problem but they weren't until deadline day happened.
I have no idea how good our midfield is because, three quarters of the way into the season, the only time we've lined up with a midfield in midfield was against Sunderland, when it was Fletcher and Cleverley. Since then we've always had a player in midfield, playing against the other team's midfield, on their own. We can't say we only have one midfielder because we bought two of them in the summer.
Losing Rio, Vidic and Evra all at once is a huge blow. Not because of their abilities (which have continued to wane since they left) but their leadership is sorely missed. Our captain aside, Carrick is the only other really senior pro and leadership has never been his thing.
Rojo and Blind have something about them but they're only new (and Rojo might turn out not be good enough)
Hererra and Blind? Ummm... They both lined up in midfield yesterday?
Which people are they? People more knowledgeable than Van Gaal? Let's not underestimate this guy I have seen Van Gaal with Ajax, Barca and Bayern playing some great Football. That doesn't happen with someone who doesn't understand football.
This is the same guy who Guardiola and Mourinho learnt there trades from what are we saying he has gone senile?
I think it has to be Blind and Carrick with Herrera in front of them.
They sort of did, but Blind was still there on his own a lot of the time...and even so, that'll be how many times this season? ...just the once then.
Do you not also think we played quite noticably better yesterday until we went into Fellaini mode?
Definitely. I actually thought the first 20 minutes of the second half was some of the best stuff we played all season.
It did look a bit one man midfield at times, so I know why you thought that. I really like Hererra but his positioning when we don't have the ball leaves a lot to be desired.
It's been clear for a while that simply changing formations and swapping around players isn't going to solve our problems.
The way I see it some or all of the following issues are causing our poor performances:
1. A lack of cohesion/chemistry between the players, brought about by bringing so many players in in the summer.
2. Tieing in with 1, some of these players have not settled yet.
3. Lack of confidence following last season, which will only be restored when we start to play well for an extended period.
4. LVG has only had one summer window to build a squad. It seemed obvious he wanted a box to box mid which he couldn't get. This type of player could easily be the missing piece. We obviously need to reinforce other positions too before he has a squad he can call his own.
I keep hearing those caf members who've turned on him referring to the fact he should he doing better after spending £150m. That is irrelevant to an extent as he's not responsible for the fact we overpaid for a number of those additions. What's more important is the time frame - he's
only had one summer window to effectively change the squad from SAF's to his own. Which brings me on to 5:
5. I believe there is still a hangover from SAFs retirement too. By this I mean some players exceeded under him who seem incapable of adapting to LVG's 'philosophy'. They will be replaced over this coming summer.
I won't judge LVG until around this time next year. By then hopefully most of this coming summer's signings will have settled and the squad should largely be his own. He's done enough to deserve at least that much time for me.
The way I see it some or all of the following issues are causing our poor performances:
1. A lack of cohesion/chemistry between the players, brought about by bringing so many players in in the summer.
2. Tieing in with 1, some of these players have not settled yet.
3. Lack of confidence following last season, which will only be restored when we start to play well for an extended period.
4. LVG has only had one summer window to build a squad. It seemed obvious he wanted a box to box mid which he couldn't get. This type of player could easily be the missing piece. We obviously need to reinforce other positions too before he has a squad he can call his own.
I keep hearing those caf members who've turned on him referring to the fact he should he doing better after spending £150m. That is irrelevant to an extent as he's not responsible for the fact we overpaid for a number of those additions. What's more important is the time frame - he's
only had one summer window to effectively change the squad from SAF's to his own. Which brings me on to 5:
5. I believe there is still a hangover from SAFs retirement too. By this I mean some players exceeded under him who seem incapable of adapting to LVG's 'philosophy'. They will be replaced over this coming summer.
I won't judge LVG until around this time next year. By then hopefully most of this coming summer's signings will have settled and the squad should largely be his own. He's done enough to deserve at least that much time for me.
They're still playing great football without LvG being at the club. LvG does not have a monopoly being the only knowledgeable football man.
I had a read back, it's astonishing really.I honestly don't think thats the case, I'd take our midfield over there and our defence actually defends better as a unit than it's given credit for. The latter part is the difference maker for me on why their form is better
Who even said that? Why not read the thread before you faceplant yourself into a wall of
The difference is they have strikers in form and we dont. Personally I think RvP and Falcao are done, with Rooney not far off, that's rather a big deal because like it or not the striker is the most important position on the pitch.
I don't think the strikers are the clear difference between the 3 squads, Liverpool in particular have only just started playing one, they've had Sterling up front whilst the rest of the side has been played consistently, same can be said of Spurs really, injuries aside or slight tweaks it's the same consistent side.
We have the better players that is abundantly clear but all the chopping and changing is damaging our ability to gel as a team.
In all honesty it just wants keeping as simple as possible, flat back four which we've decided on but pick four players two centre halfs and two fullbacks, not a flat back four containing a fullback and 3 centre halfs but yes an actual back four with every player in position.
The midfield is currently picking itself, Blind, Herrera, Fellaini/Mata, Young and Di Maria. Put Rooney up top and just leave it alone, it can be tweaked once the players have full match rhythm.
He talks about it and has broken it up consistently, everyone's fit and the answer is actually simple.
I think its a multiple of things.
Forwards-We have a misfiring forward line,if we have strikers that are banging in the goals it will take the pressure off the midfield and the defense, that's not happening at the moment.
Defense - We are just all over the place with our defense due to injuries and some of our defenders not being good enough,as a result we have some of our forwards dropping deep in midfield to help out (midfielders) who are dropping back to help out the defense.
Midfield -still a work in progress,we need a box to box midfielder and another winger.
Injuries -constant disruption to the team.
It's still the system though. You have one holding and then everyone else pushing up AND having to provide width. It's really fecking dumb. Herrera would be better positionally if his position was next to Blind in midfield, instead of being a half midfielder, half winger, half fullback cover, half no10 type thing.
I thought we would have played well yesterday if Fellaini wasn't on the pitch. We had them pinned in and panicking, and we just started aiming the ball at Fellaini even though he was constantly stood in a position where he wasn't a threat to anything. Again, even I'm getting bored with me whining about Van Gaal, but what on earth is this about exactly?
Until that point we'd played well and looked threatening, but it was like the players were told that instead of trying to create chances they should just aim the ball at Fellaini's head regardless of anything else. Then after Swansea scored we went into full on Sunday league mode and started aiming it at him from our own half.
That would be an issue for Stoke these days, let alone Manchester United. There is NO argument for us not having players to allow us to do better than that. Every team in the top two divisions has the players to be doing better than that.
I think that's mainly because of the diamond formation, Herrera has to be a sort of right center midfielder and that will make him go forward and leave space when counter attacking. If Blind/Carrick plays next to him in more or less the same lineup, not only would the passing be better from the defence to attack but we wouldn't be so vulnerable during counters.
Formation isn't that important as long as we keep a basic 2 CMs in front of the defence, with one being more oriented towards defending and the other towards spreading the ball around. That would also mean playing with one up top and wingers. The moment LVG starts with 2 strikers, automatically our midfield gets unbalanced in terms of number and space.
Very good and reasonable post good to see some people see the bigger picture.
I get fed up hearing about this 150 million as if we have went out and bought Ronaldo, Messi and co. This is an age where Gareth Bale costs 100 million we bought 5 players.
Same as every time we play a team like Burnley or Preston how there team cost nothing and we spent 150 on 5 players. Media sound like they are trying to put us in the same bracket as city or Chelsea. They forget to mentions the players that money was spent trying to replace.
I get fed up hearing about this 150 million as if we have went out and bought Ronaldo, Messi and co. This is an age where Gareth Bale costs 100 million we bought 5 players.
Same as every time we play a team like Burnley or Preston how there team cost nothing and we spent 150 on 5 players. Media sound like they are trying to put us in the same bracket as city or Chelsea. They forget to mentions the players that money was spent trying to replace.
Good post and I agree.
Two strikers are our main problem. RVP said it last season there is always s
He wins for one or two seasons. He has never gone into a team an managed consistently over a four or five year period. He has also had some very spectacular misses in his career, first time as Holland coach and second time at Barca come to mind.
For the first hour yesterday we looked like a team that deserved to win. Unfortunately we also looked like a team that didn't know how to score. Every time we went towards the box I was hoping for a poor clearance or a fluky rebound bouncing out to Herrera or Di Maria or someone who was going to make a lucky shot through a sea of legs. We didn't look fast enough or accurate enough to create actual chances.
Meanwhile at the other end it felt like (I'd be interested to know the stats because feelings can be deceptive) every high cross and every setpiece led to them getting a shot or a header.
So what's wrong? A disorganised and uncoordinated defence, and we really can't keep blaming injuries for it. An out of form attack that seems to defy any obvious selection criteria. And a lot of slow play, too many pass and pass moments, and not enough pass and move. Passing backwards or sideways isn't a problem in itself, it's the fact it seems to be harder work for our players than for the opponents who jog quietly into position and stand around watching it.
Summing up, I'd say the problem was on the training ground and in the briefings. As I've said before, it may click into place. Like any new skill, it might be something you learn slowly that suddenly becomes second nature and your speed leaps up. It's just that we're running out of time and if it doesn't click soon, maybe it never will.
Meanwhile at the other end it felt like (I'd be interested to know the stats because feelings can be deceptive) every high cross and every setpiece led to them getting a shot or a header.
So what's wrong? A disorganised and uncoordinated defence, and we really can't keep blaming injuries for it. An out of form attack that seems to defy any obvious selection criteria. And a lot of slow play, too many pass and pass moments, and not enough pass and move. Passing backwards or sideways isn't a problem in itself, it's the fact it seems to be harder work for our players than for the opponents who jog quietly into position and stand around watching it.
Summing up, I'd say the problem was on the training ground and in the briefings. As I've said before, it may click into place. Like any new skill, it might be something you learn slowly that suddenly becomes second nature and your speed leaps up. It's just that we're running out of time and if it doesn't click soon, maybe it never will.
I'm afraid I don't subscribe to the "blind faith" that you're peddling here. What you seem to be saying is that only he knows what he's doing and the rest of us are too thick to understand it so we should go along with it because he knows best.
His record in the past is just that - in the past. At United he will rightly be judged on what people see happening or not happening on the pitch, not on what he's achieved elsewhere. Up to now he's not justifying any faith.
I think our issue is not kicking the ball at the goal enough.
Do you understand Van Gaal's philosophy from any of the past teams he has achieved succes with? Because that is not what I am saying but what I am saying is if you had an understanding of Van Gaal's philosophy you may actually be able to see what he trying to do is and understand the problems. Other people understand his philosophy and most hold him in high regard whether they agree with the way he behaves as a person or not.
These are people that understand football as well. Find out about the philosophy and then come back and judge. I have good book on Van Gaal and his system/philosophy and on the face of it I Agree without knowing the thought behind it it doesn't seem promising. But when you do start to see the way he thinks of football the things we are seeing start to make a bit more sense.
I am going to get some of it and post up later may be worth a read if you want more of an understanding of what he is trying to achieve and the directionhe is taking us in or at least trying.
No world-class centre half, midfield not dynamic or combative enough, not enough pace or imagination out wide, not enough pace or imagination up front. Too many touches. Too slow. Boring. Predictable. Uninspiring. Can't believe how poor we've been given the money he's spent. Frustrating on so many levels.