I thought of this thread while watching the match yesterday. Well done, noods.
Static, slow motion zombie passing
- Thread starter noodlehair
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
I think it's unfair to dismiss noodle's observation until we've seen zombie's attempt to pass a football. For all we know it could be like-for-like to how we played yesterday.
I can't post it here but but if you youtube a video for a song called I Hear You Calling by a band named Gob they play aginst some zombies in a soccer match.
Cheers Dwayne, I'll watch and observe it a few times and see what the comparisons are like before completely disagreeing with moses on this whole affair.
No, it's not something that happened for brief 10 minute spells, sandwiched between swashbuckling football. You say I'm dismissive of posters, yet this grievance you lot have is exactly that. Think for a second why people say it. It's obvious that they don't agree with you that it was something tiny that happened amidst great football. Give them at least that much credit. Noodles isn't a moron, he knows his football fairly well. So yeah, the people who "harp" on about or did so in the past, didn't actually see it as something that was insignificant and hence as relevant as a yourube clip. They felt it was something that was seeping into our football, in general. Or at least quite frequently.
The general style is still there (and has been for two years), but we really did see it for great periods of games when this thread was made. Those first 8 or so matches of last season were mind-boggling, with us either playing this sort of football or getting repeatedly pinned back in our own half by the likes of Southampton. Barring those bizarre 20 minute spells at the end of matches, we were looking like a very shite football team - as bad as the one that turned up yesterday actually, only that we never played anyone that good during that period.
The fact is, when we have the ball and we're attacking (the fullbacks and Hernandez aside) all our players just stand there....like zombies. They make no attempt at any decent movement or clever runs, they just all just stand there waiting for something to happen.
noods is spot on with this term.
noods is spot on with this term.
Yup our movement off the ball has been atrocious for a number of years now, bar the odd game here and there. My favourite recent United attacking performance was the 4-4 against Everton. We were amazing going forward.
The problem is that we have had a pedestrian midfield pairing ever since Keane/Scholes. Carrick does not run beyond, nor did Scholes. You look at a player like Mata or Ozil who have many assists. I doubt they could replicate those figures with us, because you are only as good as your options. I'm sure a large amount of Mata's assits are for the likes of Ramirez or Lampard who have run beyond him.
I honestly cannot recall the last time one of our central midfielders ran beyond a striker and was played through on goal. My guess is that it has rarely happened since Scholes was in his 20s!
I honestly cannot recall the last time one of our central midfielders ran beyond a striker and was played through on goal. My guess is that it has rarely happened since Scholes was in his 20s!
On your last part, I'm getting Vision of a younger Carrick at Roma
There was a stark contrast between City's movement and ours. When they had the ball you had several players probing, looking for space, jinxing here and there. With us everyone stood in space except the person with the ball, who eventually lost possession because he had no options to pass through.
For all his faults, Cleverley is one of the few players in our team who understands the concept of movement, on AND off the ball.
For all his faults, Cleverley is one of the few players in our team who understands the concept of movement, on AND off the ball.
See I think Anderson and Cleverley (i.e - our only properly mobile midfielders) have done this quite a lot, just unfortunately almost every time they've done it they've neglected to bring their shooting boots with them. I think we've tried having midfield runners but the players who've gotten into those positions have been wasteful when they've got there.
Ultimately, as a midfielder if you're going to make those runs you have to take your chances more often than not in order to make up for the times it doesn't come off and you find yourself in the box when your opponent is 30 yards up the pitch on the counter. We don't have any players who can guarantee that level of finishing so I suppose from a manager's point of view it makes sense to try and keep the midfield solid and hope that the front 4 do the job offensively.
Cleverly and Anderson are a good combination.
I think Cleverley, Anderson and Carrick would be a good 3, Cleverley and Anderson were amazing to watch at the start of the season before last but the number of goals we shipped due to having no defensive cover from the midfield was amazing.
Not good enough though. However, given they play with a bit of urgency, they stand out and make a huge difference to our team when paired.
We should just stop this game and buy a very, very good midfielder - like all other very, very good teams do.
Same. That's the best attacking performance I can remember literally since that bizarre period at the start of 11/12.
Fergie and Moyes seem to think otherwise.
People are letting their emotions cloud their judgement after yesterday.
this is true. But man we were playing total football...or so it seemed. Fluid. I think if we added Herrera as the third midfielder......
EDIT: to Anderson and Cleverly I mean....
We can disagree, it happens.
I'm not saying people should use my term, which is why I haven't made a thread on it saying so, or actually asked anyone to use it. I did however call the existing term retarded.
I honestly think the term "zombie passing" riles a few on here up so much because it's such an accurate portrayal of our play. There have been spells where we've shaken off the zombie-ness and played in a manner approaching what we should be capable of, but overall the feeling remains that this team hasn't "gotten out of second gear" for a couple of years now.
Mobility in CM might be part of the problem but I don't think its the only one. There are a number of factors that contribute to a team with such talented individuals playing in such a boring manner. Right now I think CB is a huge issue, neither Vidic nor Ferdinand is capable of carrying the ball out of defence and we end up wasting a lot of long balls to the wings. Normally this is fine as Vidic and Ferdinand dominate defensively, but since that no longer happens its time to let one of our promising young CBs have a go.
It's worth noting that noodle hair, in his typically humorous manner, pointed out how bad our CBs (Ferdinand in particular, as its never been Vidic's strength) have been with the ball. Just because its fun to read doesn't mean there isn't a worthwhile point being made.
Mobility in CM might be part of the problem but I don't think its the only one. There are a number of factors that contribute to a team with such talented individuals playing in such a boring manner. Right now I think CB is a huge issue, neither Vidic nor Ferdinand is capable of carrying the ball out of defence and we end up wasting a lot of long balls to the wings. Normally this is fine as Vidic and Ferdinand dominate defensively, but since that no longer happens its time to let one of our promising young CBs have a go.
It's worth noting that noodle hair, in his typically humorous manner, pointed out how bad our CBs (Ferdinand in particular, as its never been Vidic's strength) have been with the ball. Just because its fun to read doesn't mean there isn't a worthwhile point being made.
That first half was full of it. Very little movement between the lines, crossfield passes leading to pointless crosses that were easily dealt with by Sunderland.
The passing between the CBs is awful - Evans would help. Jones and Vidic passing to each other while waiting for Carrick to become available was painful, even worse when they had to give it to DDG to clear.
I still cant get over the fact we play a flat 4-4 fecking 2. 2006 wants its formation back.
I think our players are under the impression there is a rule in football whereby only the player in possession is allowed to move.
1999 wants its formation back more like.
I didn't think this could get much worse, but it has. Its now a joke. The times when Januzi has waltzed into the middle, looked up, and just seen everyone standing there, just waiting and watching is pathetic now. They just stand there like fecking useless twats.
Remember when our midfielders would actually pass and then run. Or when they would win 2nd balls. Or when they ran beyond the forwards. Remember those days?
I actually think the zombie passing has reduced, but the zombie crossing, now that's a different matter.
Far too much lifting the ball in, after telegraphing it first so it can be easily dealt with.
Far too much lifting the ball in, after telegraphing it first so it can be easily dealt with.
Carrick, Cleverley and Rooney have made more passes than Sunderland's whole team. They have done absolutely feck all with it.
we've taken to relying on scoring from crosses far too much for my liking. i'm not really that concerned about our poor start just yet, but it's getting to be apparent that we need to adapt to a different style of play and for the personnel we have to step up or we're going to be hard pressed to finish in the top 4, let alone win anything.
Pretty sure Rooney's made more passes to the Sunderland team than Sunderland's whole team as well.
Carrick still seems to think he's earn't the right to play with half the urgency of every opposition team he's up against. He must be the thickest person in the world or something.
Carrick still seems to think he's earn't the right to play with half the urgency of every opposition team he's up against. He must be the thickest person in the world or something.
Always thought this was pretty much the dumbest fecking thread on the internet. Now its confirmed.
Yeah I'm sick and tired of 442 and crossing crossing crossing, its so fecking predictable.
I want us to play with someone in between the midfield and forward lines. We looked so much better when Rooney was taking up those positions against leverkusen
Kagawa.
I think that might just be the most absurd thing I've ever seen you say.
Carrick had a good second half but watch the first again. He was taking SO long on the ball it was painful. It wasn't even like the passing options weren't there, he was just insisting on taking an age to decide to pass it. Second half suddenly everything was first or second touch with no hesitation.
Rooney was just poor all game. Good movement but on the ball he was shite.
Rooney was just poor all game. Good movement but on the ball he was shite.
Carrick was very good today.
Nah. First half he was taking all the tempo out of our possession and playing passes into the edge of the box to players who could do absolutely nothing with them. He was annoying me a lot.
Second half we upped things and Carrick in particular was moving the ball quicker. Suddenly players were getting the ball in forward positions that didn't just result in them being kicked in the shins.
Second half we upped things and Carrick in particular was moving the ball quicker. Suddenly players were getting the ball in forward positions that didn't just result in them being kicked in the shins.
Been quiet pleased with us in this first half. Ok, a lot of it has been possession based without really progressing but everyone is moving well off the ball, using space and making themselves available.