The World Cup next time around will fall in the middle of your sporting season so presumably much less interest?
Team America at the World Cup
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Well it is not like this is the first World Cup being shown in the US and more then just US National Team games are shown. Also remember in the US the PL gets lots of TV time, and there are stations that carry Spanish, German, various South American leagues, etc. So American fans are getting more exposure every day to all sorts of games and all sorts of styles.
The problem is the World Cup often does much to re-enforce stereotypes of the game in the US. Not always of course.
But you will always find people who think the game is boring, even with baseball and American Football being so huge, there are a lot of people in the US who find them boring to watch.
Not sure what you mean by this? This year as in years past The World Cup happens in the middle of baseball and "soccer" season. In 2018 will also. 2022 in Qatar might get moved to the winter, assuming the event actually takes place in Qatar, I think it will but there will be much pressure to move the event, so if it gets changed to the winter time well it falls during the NFL playoffs possibly, NBA, College Basketball, NHL,etc but just like with the Winter Olympics interest will be high.
Not sure how many of you have been watching the various USA footy programs on ESPN here in the states, but I've found them to be fairly entertaining. Most of all, however, I'm developing an appreciation for just how far the game has come in past twenty-odd years. I'm not sure if we'll ever be a world power, though the realistic potential is certainly reassuring.
As a someone in their mid-twenties, I never really got to see the days when the US were a complete shambles, having not qualified for the World Cup for some forty years, without a professional league, and with most of its national team players being glorified (or run of the mill) amateurs. We still haven't produced a so-called world class talent (and Jurgen is often very blunt with this fact), but gone are the days when American youth players are afterthoughts in the international game. I think that the more we embrace the immigrant/dual-nationalist side of the game (which, right or wrong, is very much the American identity), the better the national team can be.
That said, our grassroots and "football/soccer culture", so to speak, is still light years behind where it needs to be to facilitate success at the highest level. That much has been beaten to death. Who knows if we'll ever catch up in that regard? It certainly cannot be done by Klinsmann & co alone.
As far as this WC is concerned, one could argue that the US is playing with house money. Whether that is a good or bad thing remains to be seen. It's still disappointing to have squandered a golden opportunity in 2010 to make a deep-ish run; even more disappointing considering the group and potential knockout draw this year. We aren't good enough on paper to advance, but crazy things happen in football, particularly at the World Cup.
This waiting period is very nerve-wracking. We, unlike most nations, will not name the final 23 until the very last minute. Meanwhile, the players are training behind closed doors and won't face decent opposition for more than a week (sorry, Azerbaijan). You can't help but get the feeling that it all comes down to who is "less shite" than their colleagues. Even so, the youth in this squad gives a little bit of hope for the future. The stars (Donovan, Howard, Dempsey) are aging, but their is more depth in the new generation. At the very least, the US won't be fielding college amateurs any time soon.
As a someone in their mid-twenties, I never really got to see the days when the US were a complete shambles, having not qualified for the World Cup for some forty years, without a professional league, and with most of its national team players being glorified (or run of the mill) amateurs. We still haven't produced a so-called world class talent (and Jurgen is often very blunt with this fact), but gone are the days when American youth players are afterthoughts in the international game. I think that the more we embrace the immigrant/dual-nationalist side of the game (which, right or wrong, is very much the American identity), the better the national team can be.
That said, our grassroots and "football/soccer culture", so to speak, is still light years behind where it needs to be to facilitate success at the highest level. That much has been beaten to death. Who knows if we'll ever catch up in that regard? It certainly cannot be done by Klinsmann & co alone.
As far as this WC is concerned, one could argue that the US is playing with house money. Whether that is a good or bad thing remains to be seen. It's still disappointing to have squandered a golden opportunity in 2010 to make a deep-ish run; even more disappointing considering the group and potential knockout draw this year. We aren't good enough on paper to advance, but crazy things happen in football, particularly at the World Cup.
This waiting period is very nerve-wracking. We, unlike most nations, will not name the final 23 until the very last minute. Meanwhile, the players are training behind closed doors and won't face decent opposition for more than a week (sorry, Azerbaijan). You can't help but get the feeling that it all comes down to who is "less shite" than their colleagues. Even so, the youth in this squad gives a little bit of hope for the future. The stars (Donovan, Howard, Dempsey) are aging, but their is more depth in the new generation. At the very least, the US won't be fielding college amateurs any time soon.
He had to retire due to repeated concussions. I don't think he can do anything more strenuous than walking a golf course these days.
I'm really glad that the media's exposing the sport, more. I just hope that more people start to follow the sport. Even if people dismiss baseball and gridiron football as boring, those are still more popular than football. All I want is for the sport to be accepted to the level that other American sports + ice hockey are.
The US is undergoing massive demographic changes so it's likely football will become more popular over there, I think it will be more popular than hockey within a few decades and maybe one day more popular than baseball, it's unlikely it will ever beat basketball and US football though.
Posted in the US Soccer thread before I realized this one was here:
Donovan out, Wondolowski / Julian Green in. Unbelievable.
John Brooks in at Goodson's expense is insane, also.
Donovan out, Wondolowski / Julian Green in. Unbelievable.
John Brooks in at Goodson's expense is insane, also.
I'm shocked that Donovan isn't in it. I don't think he would have started, but he could have been useful. Goodson more likely got snubbed because Cameron can play anywhere on the back line or in midfield if a backup is needed. I wouldn't be surprised if Donovan pulled out of the squad or suggested Klinsmann take someone else.
Chandler being in the team is strange. He hasn't played for the US in forever.
Chandler being in the team is strange. He hasn't played for the US in forever.
I feel for Parkhurst/Evans that Chandler dicked the US around, then got frozen out, and still got picked ahead of them. I like Yedlin a lot but he's nowhere near ready, same with Brooks. If we're looking straight to the future, I'm disappointed Terrence Boyd isn't coming. Maybe throwing MLS a bone by picking Wondo over him.
Tough pill to swallow, to be honest. Sure, Landon isn't the player he used to be (and I've never been his biggest fan, frankly), but to not bring him to the World Cup is baffling. It leads me to believe that this was a decision based on his attitude and relationship with Jürgen. Speculatively speaking, of course.
I understand how highly Kilinsmann supposedly thinks of Julian Green (I also remember highly he thought/thinks of Terrence Boyd). I hope he'll grow into a great playe for the US, but I don't see what he brings to the table or has done to this point that justifies his selection. If this was all about the future, why is a player like Wondolowski going ahead of Boyd? Again, I'm not following here.
This might not be totally correlated, but blooding players for the future in the face of a very difficult draw isn't the right option IMO. For one thing, no amount of short-term experience is going to get the USA on Germany or Portugal's level. As a footballing nation, we are who we are and will not be challenging for international honors for many years to come. Pulling upsets against the big boys is really all we can hope for, no matter what squad we choose.
As such, I would rather have Landon Donovan (who, despite his peculiar sabbatical, still featured in many qualifiers and sealed qualification with a goal against Mexico) on the field than a prospect playing in the 4th tier of German football (who has contributed less than a half of football for the US in his fledgling career).
I could go for days, but I'm sure my disproval is obvious. I'm not bitter Donovan fanboy. I do respect his contributions to my national side and what role he still can bring, given the chance. That day has since passed, I'm afraid. Good luck, boys. Prove me wrong.
Edit: I just saw we're taking Brad Davis (of my hometown Houston Dynamo) to the World Cup over Landon Donovan...
Holy hell that's not even bold, that's just stupid. Clearly a clash with Klinsmann then. Oh well.
I understand how highly Kilinsmann supposedly thinks of Julian Green (I also remember highly he thought/thinks of Terrence Boyd). I hope he'll grow into a great playe for the US, but I don't see what he brings to the table or has done to this point that justifies his selection. If this was all about the future, why is a player like Wondolowski going ahead of Boyd? Again, I'm not following here.
This might not be totally correlated, but blooding players for the future in the face of a very difficult draw isn't the right option IMO. For one thing, no amount of short-term experience is going to get the USA on Germany or Portugal's level. As a footballing nation, we are who we are and will not be challenging for international honors for many years to come. Pulling upsets against the big boys is really all we can hope for, no matter what squad we choose.
As such, I would rather have Landon Donovan (who, despite his peculiar sabbatical, still featured in many qualifiers and sealed qualification with a goal against Mexico) on the field than a prospect playing in the 4th tier of German football (who has contributed less than a half of football for the US in his fledgling career).
I could go for days, but I'm sure my disproval is obvious. I'm not bitter Donovan fanboy. I do respect his contributions to my national side and what role he still can bring, given the chance. That day has since passed, I'm afraid. Good luck, boys. Prove me wrong.
Edit: I just saw we're taking Brad Davis (of my hometown Houston Dynamo) to the World Cup over Landon Donovan...
Holy hell that's not even bold, that's just stupid. Clearly a clash with Klinsmann then. Oh well.
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I had to google who Brad Davis was, he's 32, never left the MLS and has 14 caps since 2005 for the US. I know they're different positions but fact he was in the squad and Donovan wasn't is insane.
See, that's the thing, they're not really different positions. Davis is slow left midfielder and Donovan, despite being listed as a forward, was also likely to feature there. Davis can whip in a good free kick, but I wouldn't say that's an the level of play to aspire to. Boggles the mind.
I'm at a loss for words that Donovan can be left out yet the likes of Davis, Wondolowski, Yedlin, and Green all make the squad. I'm thinking Klinsmann made some kind of agreement with Green if he chose the US. Then Chandler, a guy that hasn't player for the US for months (and for various reasons depending on which accounts to believe, his or others), granted he's easily a better fullback choice than Beasley or Evans. And Brooks over Goodson and Yedlin over Parkhurst...wtf?
I can only presume there must have been some bustup between LD and JK. Perhaps a Harkes/Sampson issue although not due to banging a teammates wife.
I can only presume there must have been some bustup between LD and JK. Perhaps a Harkes/Sampson issue although not due to banging a teammates wife.
No Donovan is shocking.
People say US football or 'SOCCER' is on the rise? When you look at that team there is no real stars. If football really get's big there, USA could be a force. The population size, history of sport,with the major investment in youth development. I wonder if they will challenge in a decade?
The best quality of the national side is team spirit. They are a proud nation and hard to beat. They almost have an olympic type pride when they play. If a team like France had this they would clean up, they have all the talent but no togetherness. You could argue that maybe it's compensating for lack of talent? Never the less I hope they have a good tournament. They can always spring an upset.
The best quality of the national side is team spirit. They are a proud nation and hard to beat. They almost have an olympic type pride when they play. If a team like France had this they would clean up, they have all the talent but no togetherness. You could argue that maybe it's compensating for lack of talent? Never the less I hope they have a good tournament. They can always spring an upset.
This really is the only logical explanation to take Brad fecking Davis over Donovan. Sure, Landon is a strange guy with questionable commitment, but he's light years ahead of the footballer Davis even has dreamt of being. There's a reason thirty-two year-old Brad Davis has hardly featured for the national team. Even when he has, I can't think of a single performance that was better than average. He certainly hasn't once contributed more than Donovan is capable of, regressed though he has. Really disheartened by all this, really.
He's not particularly good either. Does well in MLS but a nothing player at the international level and now World Cup bound. There are plenty of more talented players that should be selected over Davis. Corona, Torres, Gil, Edu, Kljestan, Shea...
I might have lived with a Torres, Edu, Kljestan, or even Shea (as a wildcard). Not this though. Truly stunned.
Davis is only in for his set piece ability. There's no way he can warrant a place otherwise. Donovan's commitment to the national team, particularly in the last year and a half, has been questionable because of his sabbatical. The other issue with Donovan is that he can be a bit like Rooney, very good or very bad but nothing in between. His ability to impact the game as a sub isn't great either. He should have been in the squad at least for the sake of experience for younger players. Wondolowski making it...smh.
The young players I imagine are in it to give them some preparation for 2018 since our group is as strong as it is.
The CB pairing should be interesting. Omar and Brooks can't play together because they're both inexperienced and slow. Besler has been great at times and shaky at others.
The young players I imagine are in it to give them some preparation for 2018 since our group is as strong as it is.
The CB pairing should be interesting. Omar and Brooks can't play together because they're both inexperienced and slow. Besler has been great at times and shaky at others.
The only logical back four I can see actually holding up somewhat would be be Chandler/Johnson combo at fullback (both can play either side) with Cameron and Besler in the middle. Omar will get annihilated by any half-decent player.
I don't see Omar improving either. He's reached his apex. Struggles with reading the game at the highest levels, lacks awareness, gets beat on crosses, and has the pace of a legless amputee without a wheelchair. Brooks is one for the future and hopefully he'll progress into a solid defender by 2018.
Any future CBs on the horizon? I think Matt Hedges has earned his shot at a cap after this World Cup.
I don't see Omar improving either. He's reached his apex. Struggles with reading the game at the highest levels, lacks awareness, gets beat on crosses, and has the pace of a legless amputee without a wheelchair. Brooks is one for the future and hopefully he'll progress into a solid defender by 2018.
Any future CBs on the horizon? I think Matt Hedges has earned his shot at a cap after this World Cup.
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Not an american here but is anyone else tired of seeing this 'football vs soccer' crap pop up in all US-related discussions? As if the word is an indicator of quality or a measure of the football culture. It's like watching 8-year-olds argue on Reddit.
Not to mention that the term 'soccer' originated and was used frequently in the UK.
Not to mention that the term 'soccer' originated and was used frequently in the UK.
Never let facts get in the way of an argument.
It will probably beat the NBA before it beats MLB.
It is brought up by people who are either ignorant of the term or bring it up because they think it is cool. sort of like the old school reporters in the US who bring up the same tired arguements about the game ignoring the facts. It really is a level of uninspired ignorance.
So Landon Donovan left off the US National Team. What's everyone think of that? He has been so-so in the MLS so far this season and of course he took some time off from the National Team in 2013. At 32 this was going to be his last World Cup. He has been replaced with a 18 year old with little international experience.
Now this really is not going to change the US's outcome at the World Cup, Donovan is not good enough to carry the US team over the teams it faces in the Group Stage. Klinsmen just got an contract extension till 2018 so he might be buidling his squad in part with an eye to the next World Cup, hoping to have an experienced team with many of the youngsters from this squad in their prime.
I can understand the decision from that point and obviously nobody deserves a spot on the squad just because of what they have done in the past. But I am sort of surprised he is not taking him along.
End of the day, though this decision is unlikely to change the outcome of what the US does at this World Cup, no matter how much Landon's fans scream about it.
Now this really is not going to change the US's outcome at the World Cup, Donovan is not good enough to carry the US team over the teams it faces in the Group Stage. Klinsmen just got an contract extension till 2018 so he might be buidling his squad in part with an eye to the next World Cup, hoping to have an experienced team with many of the youngsters from this squad in their prime.
I can understand the decision from that point and obviously nobody deserves a spot on the squad just because of what they have done in the past. But I am sort of surprised he is not taking him along.
End of the day, though this decision is unlikely to change the outcome of what the US does at this World Cup, no matter how much Landon's fans scream about it.
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Sad for Donovan but I agree that it won't change the US prospects. In addition, Klinsmann loves surprise nominations; anyone recall Odonkor in 2006 for the German team, or preferring Jens Lehmann over Oliver Kahn as #1 GK?
I watched a short documentary on Klinsmann a couple of weeks ago. He stated that they've built up a comprehensive database in which they track players from all over the world with American roots, and if one looks promising, they approach and try to convince them to play for the US team.
Being German, I still have reservations about Klinsmann's abilities as a manager but he's very determined, has stamina, and thinks out of the box. There are worse things to be said about a manager.
I'm really looking forward to observe his collaboration with Berti Vogts - this was a clever move of Klinsi! The battle with his old buddy Jogi Löw should be fun - and I wouldn't be the least surprised if we only draw against the US or even lose.
In fairness, I think it might be an old photo.
klinsmanns a fool. cutting donovan for the likes of beckerman or davis or that handful of mutts he dug up from average bundesliga clubs. disgrace.
Maybe Klinnsman thinks the US team has no chance so he might as well bring the future instead of bringing the old guard. Or maybe he's just crazy.
If that photo is recent, then I can't really blame him. He can't be carrying a gut into the World Cup.
Edit: It's from April 30th. Looking a bit like Cuauhtemoc Blanco...
Edit: It's from April 30th. Looking a bit like Cuauhtemoc Blanco...
Looking at the US roster makes me think that not a lot has changed, the strong positions are at goalie and the rest are suspect, especially now that Donovan is not going.
That photo is outdated or shopped, because post 245 https://www.redcafe.net/threads/us-soccer-thread.374646/page-7 reflect he's not fat.
He is a pretty good pundit now to be fair. Also players like twellman and mcbride show that the americans arn't afraid to maim themselves for their club or nation.
Can't believe Donovan didn't make the squad. Ridiculous. What makes it worse is that Altidore was picked ahead of him. Unreal..
While i agree he shoulda taken donovan, im not sure beckerman and davis (yes i know, same positions) are the worst on that list. Julian Green isnt exactly an all star... yea lots of potential and bench rides for bayern.. donovan could of at least been good off of the bench.
Twellman did a bit more than maim himself. Read through his symptoms: http://theshinguardian.com/2010/12/07/inside-taylor-twellmans-head-part-i/
Most of them don't even look like professional footballersPosted in the US Soccer thread before I realized this one was here:
Donovan out, Wondolowski / Julian Green in. Unbelievable.
John Brooks in at Goodson's expense is insane, also.