They had lost 3 all season and beat Inter, Barce and PSG in the CL
However bad you’re trying to argue they were under Nagelsmann they’ve dropped off a cliff since he left
Thomas Tuchel | Gone to & from Bayern (In Summer)
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However bad you’re trying to argue they were under Nagelsmann they’ve dropped off a cliff since he left
I agree that Mainz was good, but as I said, they had been a mid table team before then. It was a good job, but it wasn’t miraculous. He had one particularly great season after getting them promoted.
Dortmund had some very good players and I still remember there was a debate as to how well he was doing at the time, particularly in his second season. Again, a good job, but nowhere near the miracle you claim. Again, they blipped, but they had won the title under the last boss.
I just think that his football isn’t great and the wealth of talent he had at his disposable in Ligue 1 doesn’t convince me of his abilities to consistently provide quality football and good league form at big clubs. His football at Chelsea was never convincing after his initial period of clean sheets. He lost his job because of it.
They had a very good first half of a season last year under Nageslman and then played hard to watch football with mediocre - to abysmal results in the second half (lost 0:5 in the Cup to Gladbach and went out in the CL against Villareal). Had again a very good start this season and played unconsistent eversince - after the WC even that bad that a mediocre Dortmund made up, what, 9-10 points on them til Nagelsman got fired being second in the league that they should sleepwalk. But those were just the (lacklustre) results: Most of the (partly extremely well payed) players had no form at all and as a whole showd incredibly lacking positional play at that time with the young talents seeing little to no minutes as well. Bayern in the past were mostly good with their 4 at the back system, Nagelsmann still thought it a great idea to kick in his 3 at the back, which didn't really work, so he switched to a 4atb - got some results that kept him floating to switch back to his 3atb system: he looked lost. Those were imho the main public reasons he got sacked and also rightly so. Nagelsman is extremely talented but also extremely well hyped. His Leipzig side did feck all after all in the big games, cup was won after he left, and his Bayern side only impressed when everything went in their favor.
Not sure if you really watched those games under Tuchel but imho they played quite well against City over both matches most of the time and mainly Rodri's strike of god, Upamecano's individual mistakes + lack of true no9 / goalgetter made it that one sided. Out of the cup vs Freiburg per lucky strike and could have easily scored eight vs Dortmund so a 4:2 win doesn't read that great. Draw vs Hoffenheim after brilliant free-kick (first time Hoffenheim scored after a set-play this season). They do look way more comfortable with the ball now which was something Nagelsman was/is totally neglecting in his sides and imho will make it hard for him to succeed at elite clubs if he doesn't get this sorted out on his side. With a proper pre-season and the obviously faulty collection of indiviuals to form a real team I can see Bayern play much differently and much better next season.
Also, a midfield of Kimmich and Goretzka will never work (consistently). We saw that in the German NT and Bayern much too often to not being obvious - I'll rate Tuchel mostly if he has the balls (and power) to send Goretka packing or introduce a tactic that works with both (doubt it).
You‘ve obviously watched them a lot more than me so I’ll take your word on how they’re playing but for me I’ll never be convinced that sacking him at that point in the season made sense and when Dortmund win the league the board will have a lot of explaining to do.
True. The timing is an issue, but if any, it was too late, not too early to sack Nagelsmann.
They obviously wanted a new manager bounce in an important part of the season and it’s spectacularly back fired
These losses arent on the former manager he must be sat at home laughing his bollocks off
I’ll go one further. He will be Madrid manager this summer whilst Tuchel won’t make it through a full season.
Well, I don‘t really disagree with you. There are under the hand talks about internal struggles with him that got kept behind closed doors because they still rate him and because he‘s such a young coach - that may be the usual (rather silent) PR talk after a sacking or not but the moment was so unusual that I do believe that there was more to it than what I mentioned. But most certainly it shows (again) that Kahn+Salihamidzic are not elite management material as well and it dis put a lot of limelight and pressure onto them. I mean the boulevard here in Germany is already question Kahn hinting at a possible sacking. I never liked them and I think the squad got worse for an extreme amount of money - that‘s not really on Nagelsmann but from what I know he suggest a duo of Mane + Gnabry could replace Lewandowski and that is just nuts imho. Salihamidzic got Kovac (ugh) sacked him for Flick (not his choice IIRC) who played the most grandiose season ever in club history albeit with a little asterisk and fell out with him in no time to appoint everybodys darling Nagelsmann to quickly see that detoriate.
Nagelsmann at Real? I‘d love to see that! Never gonna happen soonish - they‘d rather appoint Alonso.
I think he has become overrated as a coach.
Chelsea were not very good in the league under him. The warning signs were there last season for what was to come.
He won the Champions League, which is great, but so did Di Matteo.
Chelsea were not very good in the league under him. The warning signs were there last season for what was to come.
He won the Champions League, which is great, but so did Di Matteo.
ETH has a contract with Utd so unless he throws his toys out the pram, there's no way Bayern is going to pay enough for Utd to let him go because that would extremely small time. We've been mismanaged terribly but as an organisation, we're not going to let our best manager since Fergie to go without it being on our own terms.
Before Tuchel took over they got relegated and then they failed to get promotion. Under none other than Jürgen Klopp. To try and claim that taking them to 9th place in his first year and then into the EL the following season was not a very special achievement, because they finshed 11th four years and a relegation earlier is just intellectually dishonest.
The squad had finished 7th the season before and they had to turn a profit on transfers to account for missing the CL. People were hoping to rebound into top four, the press was writing about how Wolfsburg were the new force behind Bayern. Then Tuchel got the second higehst points total in the club's history, despite playing b-teams for the last 6 games, waltzed through the EL until some late Klopp/Anfield comeback bullshit and took Bayern to penalties in the cup final. He's still Dortmund's highest ranking coach in terms of ppg in the modern era.
I mean what you do is you take your perception from Tuchel's 18 months for Chelsea and try to cram 13 years worth of his career into that perception, making some ridiculous claims based on taking a glance at some tables, just so you can stick with it. There's a reason Dortmund went straight for him after Mainz or Bayern were considering him and PSG hired him after Dortmund and there's a reason Bayern fecked themselves up just so they could get him before he committed himself to another club.
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Nah they made an approach for Nagelsmann in the past and he turned it down. I think Ancelotti will take the Brazil job and he will go to Real this summer
I love losing half the games I play by being more comfortable with the ball.
Yep, Real approached him in 2018 and wanted him to be the successor of Zidane but he turned them down because he was way too young to be a coach of Real Madrid. He is still very young but both Leipzig and Bayern jobs matured him as a coach so may be he is ready now..
Btw Barcelonas president Joan Laporta also wanted Nagelsmann to replace Ronald Koeman but he was already in contact with Bayern so he turned to Xavi instead.
No this is incorrect. We were possibly the most inform team in the league when he first joined. Regularly crushing teams and missing easy chances to boot. Last season after Xmas is where we nose dived off a cliff and we’re regularly shit scrapping points.
Maybe it was to do with the RA stuff? Idk. It lasted from January until his firing and people still say he shouldn’t have been fired because they seem to have short term memory loss. We didn’t improve with Potter but we didn’t get worse - we were just that bad, now we are a complete shitshow.
He has always been overrated though I thought he would do better with them in the cups which is his speciality.
His mid-season appointment would have to be seen as the most colossal failure if Bayern Munich ends up letting the Bundesliga title slip away. 
Oliver Kahn might be forced to resign and/or Hasan Salihamidžić gets sacked as well.
Oliver Kahn might be forced to resign and/or Hasan Salihamidžić gets sacked as well.
Is it true that he's lost the same amount as the Nag now this season? That's hilarious.
I dont watch Bayern very often, how come Kimmich and Goretzka doesnt work? Out of curiosity?
Simply said, both like to attack the space in front of them, none are naturally holding DMs, that makes Bayern vulnerable to counter attacks. They miss someone like Thiago or Martinez, who are completely different types of players but both offered the structural stability that now often just isn't there.
But on the other hand, both joining the attack can overwhelm other teams and is key to crushing them. It's a high risk/high reward setup.
I can understand saying we miss Javi Martinez but not Thiago who can't tackle or provide any defensive support
Yeah, W2, D2, L3. Now 1 point behind Dortmund at the top of the league, lucky for him that they beat them in his first game too or it could have been worse.
Isn't it a bit unfair to judge him so after a couple of games? Comes in the middle of the season, no players of his own, toxic atmosphere. I think he is a good manager, if a bit overrated, and will do well there in due time. Unless Bayern completely implode internally, of course.
Looks at Lampard thread
Don’t know for the Bundesliga with Bayern where even Kovac won the league.
But I said it when he was at Chelsea that I can’t see him winning the Premier League.
Chelsea under him had too little creativity or attacking threat to win the league. For cup competitions however he was really good.
But I said it when he was at Chelsea that I can’t see him winning the Premier League.
Chelsea under him had too little creativity or attacking threat to win the league. For cup competitions however he was really good.
Both are defensively dubious, too much forward thinking and leave their respective positions too often vacant. Goretzka is a decent b2b but lacks creative input and isn‘t really able to help in build up or ball circulation / possessional gameplay. Kimmich is a great player but also technically not good enough to easily free himself when pressed. That‘s where I disagree with the poster above who said Thiago isn‘t missed: he actually was very good in that + kept his position and had a good anticipation which helped a lot defensively.
Bayern imho lacks a true strategic cm like Schweini, Alonso or Thiago or at least a Martinez kind of player who grants more freedom and a possibilt to play Musiala and Kimmich togetherfurther forward.
Ah ok. Thanks.
Cool thanks.
About to do pull off a Pochettino.
Put some respect on his name. He is capable of producing a good bottlejob.
Put some respect on his name. He is capable of producing a good bottlejob.
Don't worry Dortmund will bottle it
Remember when the Caf was saying Bayern was the best run club in the whole world.
Even if Dortmund bottle it, it hasn't been all roses since Nagelsmann got fired. No real manager boost and think it absolves the real issue of player quality isn't as good as it is and the recruitment by the people above Nagelsmann needed a fall guy. Sure there seems to be some manager and player friction with some long tenured players, but no Lewy, no Neuer and hoping Sommer, Gnabry, Sane, Mane, etc. were good enough to really push on hasn't worked out.
Managers are only as good as their players and Bayern players aren't as good as they were in previous years.
Managers are only as good as their players and Bayern players aren't as good as they were in previous years.
They should bring back Pep
Should've just kept Naglesmann.
Tuchel’s actually shown himself to be a good manager previously, Lampard’s garbage and always has been.
Tuchel lost the French league and about to do it again with bayern.
Definitely not a coincidence now
Tuchel has always been a good, yet overrated manager.
Bayern getting it wrong is always good to my eyes. Because theyve been so high on their horses as if their methods are the best, etc.
Argued with so many in here that he’s massively overrated. As a league manager his record is just isn’t great, even managed to mess up the French league on the way to getting his P45; and make no mistake, his Chelsea league record was meh and he’s also a large part of the reason for their demise this season.
He’s a very good cup manager and a decent enough coach all in all, but if you wanna be a top league side, he aint your man.
He’s a very good cup manager and a decent enough coach all in all, but if you wanna be a top league side, he aint your man.
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He didn't, he won when he finished the season and was fired mid-season while trailing just a few points.