Pep's Barca was better team than Zidane's Madrid in almost every aspect except winning mentality. Thats why they failed to win back to back CL trophies. This is not a critique to Zidane, on the contrary that puts his success with Madrid even higher because he won more with an inferior squad! To be honest i would love to see Guardiola and Zidane on the touchline managing City and Real in this years CL final..
Zidane sack watch - 19/20
- Thread starter JoaquinJoaquin
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I think because he was such an amazing player people have a hard time accepting that he can be such a good manager too. Pep was a good player but Zidane is one of histories greats. Perhaps people have a hard time accepting that someone can be so dominant in both arenas. Either way what a truly unique sportsman. I’m really impressed by the man management, the tactical discipline and the psychological intensity.
Man management so good he made Ødegaard go to the club and demand a January transfer after Zidane personally wasted half a season of his career.
Zidane is known for many things, but being a good man manager is very far down on the list. He's mocked daily for ruining the clubs talents. By Real fans.
I've lost interest in Real the past couple years. There's nothing about that team that appears exciting outwards. It doesn't help that Benzema is one of the worst people in football thought. Complete scumbag on and off the pitch.
He played Odegaard. Who proceeded to get injured. And the kid isn't good enough to start ahead of Modric or Kroos in big games.
He's the one who went asking for a loan because he didn't think he was good enough to break in. Nothing to do with management.
Bollocks and I'm willing to bet you don't know anything about his offpitch scandals other than the few headlines you've read.
Also scumbag ON the pitch? Benzema? You've never watched Real Madrid.
Not really, he's consitently praised for being a good man manager rather than for his tactics.
Which club talents did he ruin? Every single player he sent away hasn't proven he was Madrid quality anywhere else, the few ones who left and are doing good are those whom he wanted to keep as bench options because they weren't better than his starters, but chose to go elsewhere to be number 1.
Remarkable personal attack on Benzema. Calling it over the top would be kind. At best it’s slander.
Ødegaard could not prove his place in a top caliber midfield. He knew the risks when he decided to fight for a place. That’s hardly reflecting badly on Zidane. It’s not Ødegaard FC.
Well you're clearly very objective so I'll take your word like the gospel it must be.
If only you had a right to disagree on a public discussion forum
Yup, even if he doesn't get to manage Juventus after Real Madrid I'm sure he will be manager for France at one point.
Because we're insane
Got to hand it to Zidane. I questioned him at the start of this season and still feel that the previous summer’s business was disastrous but he’s been faultless this season. This squad has no business being in this position, specially when you consider the absolutely ridiculous injury count. He’s turned it around and in style. I won’t mind Real missing out on the double and reckon most fans would have accepted ceding the league and focusing on the CL. Not Zidane. He’s gone and made the double a real possibility.
For context, take the scouse-infested media. They’re all moaning on and on about Liverpool missing their two CBs. Not a peep from them about Real Madrid missing 3 first-choice defenders (Ramos, Varane and Dani) as well as Hazard.
If Zidane wins the CL - like I fervently hope he will - he’ll definitely be in the discussion for the best manager this past decade and the best CL manager of all time.
For context, take the scouse-infested media. They’re all moaning on and on about Liverpool missing their two CBs. Not a peep from them about Real Madrid missing 3 first-choice defenders (Ramos, Varane and Dani) as well as Hazard.
If Zidane wins the CL - like I fervently hope he will - he’ll definitely be in the discussion for the best manager this past decade and the best CL manager of all time.
I don't know that I trust the judgment of a player who had a talk with Mikel Arteta and said "I'll have some of that."
There's Real Madrid fans that never budged on Ronaldo being bad. You can find all sorts of people everywhere.
The reality is that few if any of these 'talents' that Zidane 'ruined' are outperforming the Real Madrid squad right now. And Odegaard isn't one of them.
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To be honest, the reason why Barcelona failed to do the back-to-back-to-back CL number was because it's been proven that the gods are madridistas
Remember the one thing that stopped them was a volcano
Probably helps to get your facts right if you’re going to accuse someone else of arbitrarily picking parameters. We were comparing Zidane’s 3 peat team (over 3.5 years as you say) to Pep’s 4 year period. In that case, the count is actually 1 Liga and 3 CLs for ZZ and 3 Ligas and 2 CLs for Pep.
Dismissing the Copa Del Rey doesn’t make any sense. You still have to play and win those games with all the attendant issues of which squad members you play when as you are also chasing the league and the champions league.
If you don’t understand why winning the league and the Champions League in the same season is a major achievement then I can’t help you. It only takes a basic understanding of football to get that. After all, Madrid have 13 Champions League titles and 34 La Liga wins and have won both in the same season only 3 times. People talk about doubles and trebles for a reason.
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It’s strange that there are still people that refuse to give Zidane credit for what he’s achieved thus far. What he has achieved in a short space of time is nothing short of mind blowing, and has already put him among the echelons of the most successful managers in history.
There’s a very strong chance that by the time he’s finished he might very well be the most successful manager in the history of the game. The man knows how to win.
There’s a very strong chance that by the time he’s finished he might very well be the most successful manager in the history of the game. The man knows how to win.
Yeah, that would be great. But there’s so many interesting potential matchups.
Zidane only managed Real Madrid for 2.5 years in his first stint, not 3.5. So the count is "Zidane won one less major title than Pep in 1.5 less seasons," which makes him look ever better, thanks!
It's a major achievement. But an even better achievement is to just win more Champions League trophies. Because, after all, other clubs don't have 13 Champions League titles.
Still not a better team, if you actually watched both of them play regularly. But you’re apparently a Madrid fan so we’re not going to get objectivity out of you unfortunately. I’m not a Barca or a Madrid fan so I can see it a bit clearer.
This is pretty much why my concerns are. Zidane deserves our support as long as he is our manager because of what he has achieved but I think we're at a point we also need to introduce new players in order to have a smoother transition once we move on from the old guard. It's very hard to judge Zidane right now as he has the team still in contention from both La Liga and UCL trusting the same set of players and the margins can be thin but if we win la liga and/or UCL he will get a lot of praise and if we don't win anything he will be criticized. It's all about delivering results at the end of the day.
That’s not the point. If you win a treble in a single season, you demonstrate complete domestic and European dominance that year. If you win only the Champions League in a single season, well that’s a cup competition, you can get a bit lucky in knockout scenarios. ZZ himself has talked about the importance of the league (for example) in demonstrating your consistent quality as a team.
All this talk about greatness to see his team vanish at Anfield on Wednesday.
In all seriousness though, better to keep the plaudits or criticism for Wednesday at this very same time.
In all seriousness though, better to keep the plaudits or criticism for Wednesday at this very same time.
He’s already won more CLs than Ferguson in his entire career.
And not to mention they should've had a CL less(Barca) after that con job against Chelsea. That was a fecking disgrace!
Pep's Barca had no domestic competition whatsoever till 2011, Madrid had been losing CL last 16s on a yearly basis, no matter the opposition, they were far from Europe's top 10 even. 2011 was Mou's first year, and the first year Madrid finally rejoined the A sides of European scene once again, Pep won 1 Liga against that by 3 points and lost the next one by a bigger margin and left. That's it 1 vs 1. There was no strong Atleti either.
If Zizou's Madrid (in 2016 till 2018) had the same poor domestic rivals (as Madrid was in Pep's first two years) he'd have had more Liga&CL doubles too. It's worth reminding that he lost his first Liga by "ONE" point, and he had got the helm midseason with a much bigger margin, against a very strong Barca with MSN that had won the treble the season before. He barely lost any points, yet it wasn't enough. That alone was far above any of Pep's Ligas. And Zizou won the next Liga&CL double. His only bad league campaign was hist third season, which he won the CL anyway. In his second stint he's won the first Liga, and has a good chance of landing the second one.
If Zizou's Madrid (in 2016 till 2018) had the same poor domestic rivals (as Madrid was in Pep's first two years) he'd have had more Liga&CL doubles too. It's worth reminding that he lost his first Liga by "ONE" point, and he had got the helm midseason with a much bigger margin, against a very strong Barca with MSN that had won the treble the season before. He barely lost any points, yet it wasn't enough. That alone was far above any of Pep's Ligas. And Zizou won the next Liga&CL double. His only bad league campaign was hist third season, which he won the CL anyway. In his second stint he's won the first Liga, and has a good chance of landing the second one.
What? There are worse footballer players who are complete scumbags. This kid just gets in with the wrong crowd and he seemed to have learned his lesson. The extortion and the prostitute thing doesn't make him look good but in all fairness it was his friends extorting Valbuena and he was only the messenger(probably under pressure) and the prostitute he banged looked like a washed up 40+ year old bimbo instead of 17.
There are definitely worse people out there in the football world.
Agreed. People need to think harder before they start to claim he's a tier above SAF. That's just ridiculous.
Not happening. Stop overrating that out of form Liverpool side just because they pulled a comeback on an utterly mediocre Barca side 2 years ago something that Roma also achieved a year earlier
Fair point, game’s not over. But I think even if the turnaround does happen, ZZ has done well to make Madrid competitive in both the league and the CL with all the injuries they’ve had to deal with. And they looked genuinely awful earlier this season so they’ve come back nicely
JFC man, I guess you're a fan and nervous but the bedwetting is too much. Madrid know how to defend and the counters are lethal. Madrid will be in the final, let's hope you win it against Pep
Why is legacy or lasting influence important? At the end of the day I want a manager that could extract the maximum potential out the current squad, knowing full well that the potential output of Real Madrid or Barcelona will be quite different from Betis or Celta Vigo. Unless you theoretically gave all managers the same amount of money at the beginning of the season and told them go out and buy 22 players you can't really compare managers. So it's down to maximising the potential output of the squad, down to making the most of the financial resources you've got, it's about achievements vs expectations etc.
Guardiola the "visionary" destroyed Jupp's Bayern to build the club in his image and in the process fecked up Bayern's golden generation chances of winning a few European pots. His DNA didn't work with the Bavarian DNA. Mourinho's DNA didn't work with ours. In the end I want the guy that will get the maximum potential out of a team - someone who has a clear idea what he wants from the team and is able to obtain it from the team. Philosophy and all that is secondary.
Zidane has taken the maximum or very close to the maximum output of his team, consistently, so it baffles me people don't consider him a great manager - whereas someone who's allowed to spend hundreds of millions of pounds on centrebacks and fullbacks year after year and yet chokes in Europe over and over is considered an unfettered genius (applies to both Mou and Pep btw).
Let's be realistic and say that Real Madrid got their fair share of advantageous refereeing performances, against Bayern Munich and Juventus stick out.
Was it Pep that went on the field to win those honours? I could have sworn it was Messi, Xavi and Iniesta but I could be wrong...
Being facetious, but how can you compare two different managers with vastly different squads at their disposal.
What an awful take.
Yes and he's nowhere near as a manager.
Only a matter of time.
Nope. Just like with Pep it isn't only a 'matter of time' either.
I think Zidane has done an excellent job and hasn't gotten his due credit at times, especially from Madrid fas themselves. But it's a huge leap to Sir Alex Ferguson. But I think todays football fans see football simply as the CL. I'm sure they think Ancelotti is better Sir Alex too.
Jesus fecking Christ. That "probably" is doing a lot of heavy lifting, and sleeping with a 17-year-old wasn't so bad because she was ugly? Have a word with yourself.
That's just silly, those two still have decades of management ahead of them. To say they would never get close to SAF considering what they've already accomplished is top red nonsense. I don't think there will be another manager that will have the impact SAF has had on a club, in that regard I don't think it's a ridiculous notion, but to say either will be nowhere close is just baffling.
He’s the only manager to ever win modern CL back to back. Not only that but 3x. This is not Di Matteo.
There’s no doubt Z’s a great manager.
His management career is still very young so there’s plenty more to happen that will determine how he’ll go down the books
There’s no doubt Z’s a great manager.
His management career is still very young so there’s plenty more to happen that will determine how he’ll go down the books
To suggest that it's only a matter of time for these 2 is even worse. He has 2 league titles right now. Sir Alex had 15, involving the astounding achievement of breaking the dominance of the big 2 in Scotland and raising a sleeping (for decades) giant at United. After doing the unthinkable in Scotland he built an empire in England. While I do appreciate Zidane having done a wonderful job at Madrid, it's not exactly the same thing and he has a long long way to go. He needs to work hard and spend many years catching Mourinho and Pep first than worry about his place alongside Sir Alex. On Pep, he is among football's great managers, but I do think it's one blot against him that he's racked up a lot of titles with absolutely incredible sides personnel wise - although again, too many people dismiss the special job he did indeed do at Barcelona.