Cüneyt Çakır

Mockney

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I'm over it now. I was fuming last night and a bit of this morning, but calming down, it was just a dodgy decision by a bit of an attention seeking ref. The talk of corruption or an anti-English agenda is a little cringy.

We've had fortunate reds in our games at Chelsea & Liverpool this season. However much it sticks in the craw, it IS football, and you move on.
 

Count Orduck

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Should we accuse him of being racist towards our players? Seems to be the done thing when you don't like an official's decision.
 

SteveJ

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UEFA stand by their man, unsurprisingly:

Uefa has backed referee Cuneyt Cakir following his controversial decision to show Nani a red card during Manchester United's defeat to Real Madrid on Tuesday night.

The Portuguese winger was sent from the field after catching los Blancos defender Alvaro Arbeloa with a stray boot with United leading 1-0 on the night and 2-1 on aggregate in the sides' Champions League last-16 clash.

And, despite the Turkish official coming in for criticism after United went on to lose the tie courtesy of two quick-fire goals from the visitors against the 10-man Red Devils, Uefa insists there are "no issues" with Cakir.

"We have no problem with him," a spokesman told The Guardian. "There are no issues for us regarding the sending off.

"We will wait for the official reports of the match delegate and the referee's observer, as is procedure. If they raise concerns then we will act.

"He remains on our list of officials."

Cakir, who is set to officiate at the 2014 World Cup, is no stranger to red card controversy, having sent off John Terry during last year’s Champions League semi-final meeting between Chelsea and Barcelona.
http://www.goal.com/en/news/596/exc...spurs-secure?source=breakingnews&ICID=HP_BN_8
 

Nighteyes

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I still don't know how he could send him off. Had all the Real players surrounded him ala Bayern then you could put it down to pressure but there seemed to be no vociferous complaints by any of the players.
 

Revan

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I wasn't aware the Terry sending off was controversial? He kneed him in the back!
Yeah, lazy journalism. Even a die-hard non-objective Chelsea fan I knew after the game agreed that Terry should have been sent off. Anyway, the Gerrard sending off didn't look to me that much red deserved (if I remember it correctly).

Looks like the referee has a superiority complex, loving to make big decisions without thinking that much and being in the center of attention. The Turkish version of our beloved Mike Dean.
 

ha_rooney

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I still don't know how he could send him off. Had all the Real players surrounded him ala Bayern then you could put it down to pressure but there seemed to be no vociferous complaints by any of the players.
Ramos was the only one who had a word with the referee, as he usually does. RVP went over and was saying that Nani was watching the ball to which the referee seemed to motion calm down and go away. That suggested he'd book Nani and that would be that.

How he could send him off was amazing. Stunned everyone, except the referee and his new BFF Roy Keane.
 

Wowi

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So UEFA stands by their man, despite their man not following the actual ruleset he's been hired to uphold? Well, why not. Just shows how pointless it all is really, when you have a completely wrong decision like that - no one at United is allowed to speak their mind without the risk of getting banned and UEFA is already busy covering it all up.

This whole closed community shit that is both UEFA and FIFA seriously need to change. I haven't seen a single sane (this excludes the bitter Roy Keane) pundit/expert/whatever say that the ref got it spot on. The closest I've seen is Kim Milton (former Danish FIFA/UEFA ref) saying that the ref wasn't entirely wrong, but that it was a harsh decision. And yet UEFA say they have no problem whatsoever with the man and that the sending off was fine. It's mind-boggling.
 

Danny1982

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I'm over it now. I was fuming last night and a bit of this morning, but calming down, it was just a dodgy decision by a bit of an attention seeking ref. The talk of corruption or an anti-English agenda is a little cringy.

We've had fortunate reds in our games at Chelsea & Liverpool this season. However much it sticks in the craw, it IS football, and you move on.
Agree with pretty much everything you said. I'm still not totally over it to be honest.. The build-up for the game and the wait was too long for the game to be screwed this way..

It's not only because we lost really. I wouldn't feel this bad if we lost because Ronaldo scored a hattrick and Real won deservedly (does that sound familiar?), but when a ref decides that "no matter who's on the field, I am the star of the show", it ruins everything. It was like the ref giving all the football fans around the globe the finger.

He ruined what would have been a game for the history books. Now this game (and this tie) will only be remembered for that moment.
 

amolbhatia50k

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He's in the wrong profession, what with being blind and all.
 

Scrumpet

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I'd rather have it this way than go out fair and square. Now we have a moral quarter final to play.
 

Joemo

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Just a poor decision at the end of the day, and I hate all the talk of corruption. But if that twitter account turns out to be his, serious questions have got to be asked about how UEFA could let him referee a Real Madrid match when he follows them and Cristiano's account.
 

TheRisingSun

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Yeah, lazy journalism. Even a die-hard non-objective Chelsea fan I knew after the game agreed that Terry should have been sent off. Anyway, the Gerrard sending off didn't look to me that much red deserved (if I remember it correctly).

Looks like the referee has a superiority complex, loving to make big decisions without thinking that much and being in the center of attention. The Turkish version of our beloved Mike Dean.
Neville said that it was harsh at the time and that a yellow card would have done.

Sanchez made a huge meal of it but I would say the off the ball element meant in a game like that, you can have no complaints for a red card.
 

TheRisingSun

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As I've said before, nobody to my knowledge has died from being kicked in the arm.
[image]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BEqztTWCIAAzeN_.png[/img]

It doesn't matter where he was touched, although the above photo clearly shows studmarks on his ribcage. It's like a two footed challenge, it doesn't even need to connect with the other player for it to be a red card due to its dangerous nature.
 

redflash

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I'm glad to see some next day perspective creeping in. It was a bad night for us reds without dooubt and yes like most who were fuming last night i was ready to burst at the injustice but today is a new day.

I don't buy Uefa/Ref's are against the English or even currupt towards the Spanish giants you have to look at his performance on the whole which was generally quite poor. He made mistakes both ways and yes the red card changed the game but if we had defended better and stayed more compact we may have with stood the onslaught.

I was happy that SAF decided to effect a media balckout for himself and the players as if they had of come out we would be facing any number of charges this morning. Sometimes it is just best to sleep on it.

As for the Champions league, ce la vie were out...but there is always next year.

Lets focus our efforts on the rest of the season and the chance to get the league title back and fingers crossed win the FA cup again which I for one would be over the moon with.

Football is a cruel and devious mistress, she will give you the greatest pleasures ever know and then take pleasure in ripping your heart out.
 

amolbhatia50k

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Just a poor decision at the end of the day, and I hate all the talk of corruption. But if that twitter account turns out to be his, serious questions have got to be asked about how UEFA could let him referee a Real Madrid match when he follows them and Cristiano's account.
I think it's more than just a poor decision. It's probably the worst decision I can remember for a long time in terms of how bizarre it was coupled with how significant. It's most bewildered I've been by a decision for ages. Came as such a shock.
 

Danny1982

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I'm glad to see some next day perspective creeping in. It was a bad night for us reds without dooubt and yes like most who were fuming last night i was ready to burst at the injustice but today is a new day.

I don't buy Uefa/Ref's are against the English or even currupt towards the Spanish giants you have to look at his performance on the whole which was generally quite poor. He made mistakes both ways and yes the red card changed the game but if we had defended better and stayed more compact we may have with stood the onslaught.

I was happy that SAF decided to effect a media balckout for himself and the players as if they had of come out we would be facing any number of charges this morning. Sometimes it is just best to sleep on it.

As for the Champions league, ce la vie were out...but there is always next year.

Lets focus our efforts on the rest of the season and the chance to get the league title back and fingers crossed win the FA cup again which I for one would be over the moon with.

Football is a cruel and devious mistress, she will give you the greatest pleasures ever know and then take pleasure in ripping your heart out.
He is in trouble now for that for "failing to fulfill his media obligations".. Just saw that on Sky..
 

Joemo

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I think it's more than just a poor decision. It's probably the worst decision I can remember for a long time in terms of how bizarre it was coupled with how significant. It's most bewildered I've been by a decision for ages. Came as such a shock.
I don't think it's as bad as everybody is saying. Nani's foot was up and he caught Arbeloa at a bad height. Don't get me wrong, it's an appalling decision, but it's only one that demonstrates that referees really have no clue about being a player. Any ex-player (except Keane) would say that Nani didn't see Arbeloa coming and so had no "intent" which is the crucial bit for me. The ref sees it as a high challenge that hurt the opponent without really contextualising it.

I was more shocked with the Torres red card against us.
 

redflash

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He is in trouble now for that for "failing to fulfill his media obligations".. Just saw that on Sky..
Yes but they can only fine him for that they cannot hand out touchline bans or anything silly like that.

Imagine what he would have said and the questions the media would have put to him to get a sound bite that they oculd twist. Best to stay quiet and calm down. we can afford the fine.
 

NinjaFletch

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I think people have to accept that you have to 'manage' a game as a referee.

Sometime you'll let innocuous niggles go to allow the game to flow, sometimes you won't play advantage because the game is getting a little dirty and you need to regain control.

Sometimes you'll give a yellow card rather than a red because you need to manage the occasion. As far as is reasonably possible the referee should be striving to keep it 11 vs 11 and let the best football team win, a good referee should be using his red card as the absolute last recourse not be looking (as our good friend from last night did) to get it out at any opportunity.

At the absolute crux of the argument is whether he needed to send Nani off, he patently didn't. He instantaneously turned what up until that point had been a game he'd marshaled reasonably well and one where the victor was to be decided on the balance of the football into a game where he lost the players, the crowd and decided the result single handidly.

Nani caught him last night, any debate of intention is irrelevant, and if Cakir had applied any common sense he would have got out his yellow card, booked Nani and carried on with the game. There might have been a posthumous debate about whether Nani was lucky to have gotten away with it, but that decision clearly does not destroy the game in the way a red card did.

Cakir showed himself to be a bad referee last night not because he made the wrong decision, it happens, but because he decided for whatever reason that he was going to make a decision that he did not have to make and thus make himself the talking point.
 

gooDevil

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So, should refs who are fans of Real be allowed to ref their games?

I would think definitely not. I doubt we'll ever hear of this again, though.
 

OB

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What makes the decision worse is the fact that there was absolutely no pressure on the referee to produce a red card. He was not surrounded by Real players, merely a yellow would suffice. Even if he didn't see the foul clearly, he could have just given the foul, and no card. But giving a red out of nowhere, was really bad refereeing, after being in no pressure.
 

VeevaVee

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It's clear this ref is absolute shite from past experiences in this thread. It's also clear he wants to make a name for himself. Look at the smug expression on his face as he gives the card. Nah, feck him. I hope he does lose his job. That's not an over-reaction, that just makes sense. Of course he won't and we'll never hear anything of it until he comes to ref us again in the future.
 

TheReligion

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If I made such a balls up regarding rules and regulations at work I would be in the dog house and at least have to explain my rationale.

Why should this idiot face nothing and potentially end up getting to ref the final?

Football needs to get a grip FFS
 

The_Red_Hope

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Not sure if it would be feasible or practical but managers should have one 'challenge' per game to contest penalty or red-card decisions. The referee, linesmen and fourth-official should be made to see a replay of the event and decide if they want to change their original decision. It's been implemented in so many sports. Yesterday's spectacle wouldn't have been reduced to the farce it was and the better team would have prevailed. Still gutted by the way.
 

AlwaysRedwood

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If, as it seems, intent is irrelevant in this decision, why was Reals hero goalkeeper not sent off for punching Vidic in the head?
Right. Or this...



If Nani's a red. Those are both reds.

The studs to the leg is clear intent.
 

kps88

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Not sure if it would be feasible or practical but managers should have one 'challenge' per game to contest penalty or red-card decisions. The referee, linesmen and fourth-official should be made to see a replay of the event and decide if they want to change their original decision. It's been implemented in so many sports. Yesterday's spectacle wouldn't have been reduced to the farce it was yesterday and the better team would have prevailed. Still gutted by the way.
I honestly think this ref would have stuck to his decision even after seeing a 100 replays. Refs hate admitting mistakes.
 

NinjaFletch

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Right. Or this...



If Nani's a red. Those are both reds.

The studs to the leg is clear intent.
Nah, he was clearly just putting his leg across him to trip him up.

It's cynical and nasty, but I don't think there's much to say it is ared.
 

AlwaysRedwood

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Nah, he was clearly just putting his leg across him to trip him up.

It's cynical and nasty, but I don't think there's much to say it is ared.
By the rule of the law, studs up, yes it most certainly is a red

But you are missing the point. If one is a red, the other is a red.
 

NinjaFletch

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By the rule of the law, studs up, yes it most certainly is a red

But you are missing the point. If one is a red, the other is a red.
It's not missing the point, I just think its a bad point.

Referee got one right and one wrong, no point trying to make out he got two wrong in order to be even more indignant about the wrong decision.
 

Mockney

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I think the point is if he's going to defend his decision, he needs to have been consistent. It does compound it to a degree. If he sent everyone off for doing what Nani did, or similar, his decision making would hold more weight.
 

Sandikan

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i hate the aftermaths of bad decisions.

Everyone going through the minutae of the game's decisions.

Should Arbeloa have gone
Should Rafael have conceded a pen and gone
Should their keeper have got punished for missing the ball and punching Vidic.

The answer for me to all of those is the same answer to the Nani one...no!
 

NinjaFletch

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I think the point is if he's going to defend his decision, he needs to have been consistent. It does compound it to a degree. If he sent everyone off for doing what Nani did, or similar, his decision making would hold more weight.
Certainly, but I don't think it adds anything to the arguments against Cakir to bring up incidents like the Arbeloa or the Lopez ones where he probably made the right decision.

I know why people are doing it, but when I've seen the points made on other forums it just makes the people making them look petty and undermines the general argument.

Indeed, if you argue for red cards for Lopez and Arbeloa you effectively make the Nani decision the 'correct' one and those incorrect, which doesn't help when the point you're making is the opposite.