Tottenham (4th Jan game), Man utd and now Arsenal have dominated Chelsea whilst setting up 5 at the back, is it that simple to counter act Chelsea's tactics?
Chelsea under Conte | Let's sign the next Hazard, literally.
- Thread starter Gandalf Greyhame
- Start date
Congratulation Arsenal!
Am glad they gate crashed Chelsea Double party.
The level of worshipping people having for Conte this season is getting on my nerve. You would think Conte is some kind of a super manager who brought some unknown club to Champion ala Ranieri last year. Most of their players were champions two season ago FFS.
(Don't mind Arsenal going ahead of us for FA Cup at all. We will get ahead of them in time)
Am glad they gate crashed Chelsea Double party.
The level of worshipping people having for Conte this season is getting on my nerve. You would think Conte is some kind of a super manager who brought some unknown club to Champion ala Ranieri last year. Most of their players were champions two season ago FFS.(Don't mind Arsenal going ahead of us for FA Cup at all. We will get ahead of them in time)
Chelsea definitely need more depth with European football next season. They have 3-4 players not in their first choice 11 who are good enough. They will need a much deeper squad than that.
Moses, Kante and Matic were terrible in the final and they only had Fabregas to replace any of them. Their defensive record this season meant they rarely had to chase games and they struggled chasing the game today.
Two howlers by Kante cost them badly today. If only they had Herrera . . . . .
Moses, Kante and Matic were terrible in the final and they only had Fabregas to replace any of them. Their defensive record this season meant they rarely had to chase games and they struggled chasing the game today.
Two howlers by Kante cost them badly today. If only they had Herrera . . . . .
Serie A is shit. Only one team there. Hopefully AC Milan are back this time. Good signings so far.
Spurs didn't dominate, they were more clinical with their chances
United and Arsenal outran and outmuscled them, simple as that.
Also, you all need to realise "tactics" and "systems" mean nothing. It's all about the players.
Loads of teams tried thought the season and it made no difference really. Man Utd, Spurs and Arsenal are not a million miles away from Chelsea in terms of quality.
A timely reminder that they are still human. Every team has a weakness and theirs has been exploited a few times now. It's on Conte to sort it out and/or purchase the players to allow him to do that.
Other than Juventus, who are a top side, when was the last time an Italian team did anything in Europe?
Hmmm... I'm surprised by how optimistic you are. You reckon Chelsea will be competing with Juventus, Real, Barcelona etc. with 3-4 additions? I reckon you need to add in midfield because Matic-Kante in a two leave you too reliant on the front 3 to create chances. Plus, the world ng backs are the other obvious area of improvement. I don't mean that as a shot a Moses and Alonso as both (Alonso especially) have been excellent, but I imagine Chelsea can upgrade. Same goes for Cahill in defense.
With Costa's recent comments, it looks like he'll be staying which is obviously good news, plus I reckon Hazard will also stay for at least another season before Real snap him up. Pedro has been excellent but you have to worry anout his place in the team with rumours of Sanchez. Can Sanchez and Hazard play in the same team?
Surprised you say that since most Chelsea lot on here call me the most pessimistic of us around.
4 Players should be enough and either way I dont think any team can change more players and expect to perform at their best in the first season anyway.
Out of the 4 one is going to be a replacement for Costa. The other three I would want to be upgrades over Cahill (Van Dijk), Alonso (Rodriguez) and Matic (someone similar to Nainggolan).
We can live with Pedro/Willian still sharing the RF position for a season.
These changes would allow us to line up in Conte's favoured 4-1-4-1 formation as well as 3-5-2 and also the standard 3-4-3.
He did so well to win the league with not a great team. But what Chelsea still lack is someone like Ramsey, Alli, Silva and Pogba who are capable to score coming from behind. Kantè and Matic are just too static.
I said there are less top sides. I think Napoli is very competitive at European level as well, they lack in experience but they have done very well in the last 3 campaigns. Napoli lost in UEFA semifinals 2 years ago and they were extremely unlucky with referee, besides an Higuain underperforming.
Fiorentina also had a good run in Europa league. In any case I am not disputing the notion that serie A is less competitive than EPL, but it is not an easy league to win and tactically is actually more difficult than Liga or EPL
Intrigued to see how his tactics will work in Europe.
See is A is one of the most uncompetitive leagues in Europe when it comes to the top prize.
Juve are vastly superior to anyone else and like last season with Pjanic and Higuain, they can easily picked the best players from their rivals.
It feels like it's an easy league to win if you're Juventus.
What is it? 6 titles in a row?
And like I said I think Juventus are a truly fantastic side, but Serie A is in a bit of a mess right now it seems.
It's because they aren't a genuinely great team. Which makes Conte getting 93/94 points with them even more absurd. He's been incredible this season. Out preformed the other big named by a country mile
well Juventus is at present oversized for serie A and would have won the EPL as well in the last 2-3 years, but a lot of the games even with smaller teams are much closer than they would seem and certainly more difficult than games in Liga or Bundesliga for instance
Im still not convinced by Conte yet. I can't deny he is a great manager but I think his work in the next couple of seasons will determine how good he really is.
He is doing a great job so far but so it was Ranieri when Leicester won the PL and then everyone saw what happened in the next season.
Obviously Leicester and Chelsea are 2 very different teams but my point being that 1 great season doesn't mean exactly that they will dominate the next season aswell or play with the same quality.
Plus now they have to play in the CL aswell so lets see how they cope with a tight schedule
He is doing a great job so far but so it was Ranieri when Leicester won the PL and then everyone saw what happened in the next season.
Obviously Leicester and Chelsea are 2 very different teams but my point being that 1 great season doesn't mean exactly that they will dominate the next season aswell or play with the same quality.
Plus now they have to play in the CL aswell so lets see how they cope with a tight schedule
This wasnt the case when Conte took over. Juve were struggling at best. They has finished 7th two seasons in a row and he took them to an invincible season straight from there.
Context is also important though.
This was just after Jose had left Italy with Rafa taking over and starting the Inter decline.
Both the Milan clubs went into massive decline around the same time. It's not like they were finishing 2nd or 3rd but much further down so that is a factor to consider.
I'm not saying he didn't do a decent job mind you but Juventus are Italy's s biggest and richest club. After a few years of reacclimatising to the league, they were likely to improve.
That is correct, when Conte took over Juventus had finished 2 back to back seasons seventh and out of Europe, the worst results in its modern history. When Conte took over Juve had the 4th turnover in Serie A and many did not even think the team was strong enough to qualify for CL (the club target was CL within 2 years). The defense that today many consider the best in the world was considered mediocre at best including by many Juve fans who wanted Chiellini and Bonucci sold away and Buffon to retire. Pirlo who joined for free had not played a decent season for 3 years. Inter, Roma and Milan had all better teams on the paper.
Conte set the foundation for today's dominance bringing back the winning mentality that has always been Juve trademark. Club and Allegri have built on his foundation and have done an amazing job. Allegri himself in some respect is an even better coach but do not fool yourself Juve dominance would not have happened without Conte who btw did a great job with the National team and with Chelsea this year.
You can discount this as a biased Juve fan's opinion, but I am fairly sure that this time next year you will find out it was not.
Agree with that the conditions have been favorable for him. But the kind of dominance that Juve showed under Conte (and even Chelsea this season) is just something else. Think he deserves a lot of credit for that.
Unlike many on here, I am willing to extend him that credit. This has been a brilliant season, especially because he did it his way.
Next season will be harder, but I'm not making the mistake of underestimating him again.
Conte had exactly zero for Plan B in the cup final. her inherited a fantastic squad at Chelsea - even Moyes might have got a win or two under his belt with that lot!
How do Chelsea fans feel about potentially signing a new CB like Koulibaly? I mean the depth there is incredible: David Luiz, Cahill, Azpilicueta, Zouma, Ake and Christensen. Who would be the most likely to leave?
I think one has to acknowledge that Arsenal were very un-Arsenal-like in that game. They had a brilliant day.
I'd be fine without signing a CB, if all of these 6 stay. It would be a great opportunity to give players like Ake and Christensen more game time.
Having said that Zouma is probably a little doubtful - at least from my perspective - because I do not have the impression that he has recovered well from his injury.
If we can get Koulibaly or Vandijk, I would sell on Ake with a buy back clause. Zouma is going to leave any way possibly on a loan. While Christensen is likely to be a part of the first team next season.
That said Ake is very very highly rated in the club and was a big favorite of the likes of JT and Lampard while coming through the youth ranks. The club will surely find a solution to have him back even if he leaves for a couple of years.
so they had a rubbish squad did they?right, that's why they were strong favourites as league winners last summer
they had a team that was at shambles and last year performed very poorly with several players who were shxt or wanted out like Costa. Others that had been key for the last title like their captain that had their last good season and faced retirement.
They had obviously a good team but one full of "holes" (and still with lots of room for improvement) and a transfer investment that was well below those of the Manchester clubs.
Nobody said they were rubbish, but nobody was expecting them to compete for the title let alone win it comfortably with a huge advantage on all the other teams except Spurs. I do not think it is just my imagination, just read your own forum predictions at the start of the season and let me know if you find one single post anticipating it. Now apparently Conte did nothing, and it was all due given the amazing team they had. I hope put your money where your mouth is because at the start of the season a Chelsea win was paid very handsomely by bookies.
I think we need two top strikers including Costa for a decent 3-5-2 to work as 3-4-3 is two predictable.
Agree that any more than 4 players will upset dressing room harmony.
Think the Ranieri comparison is not a good one as Leicester's winning streak was under Pearson, Rainieri's best move was to change very little.
Good point about next season and the CL.
Good points above.
Conte deserves credit for changing things earlier managers like Scolari and AVB had bold ideas and failed, he got the players to buy into it and it worked.
My fear about Conte is next season our weaknesses will be too apparent unless we have the ability to make more tactical changes and some upgrades on personnel like a DM and better WBs.
We also need an additional top striker.
Without upgrades on key players we are likely to struggle to make the top 4 as the EPL never remains static.
right, that's why they were strong favourites as league winners last summer
They were in my book one of the favorites, especially playing one game a week with that squad.
just where did you get thatr nonsense? they were second favourites behind City at almost any bookie worth their salt
I believe I got the nonsense from bookies, since I looked at the time.
Most have not the old odds but some examples are here: http://www.101greatgoals.com/premier-league-outright-winner-20162017-tips-odds-predictions/
And actually for quite a few Arsenal was third favourite. Again you do not need to go far to check that, just look at your own prediction thread and see how many people predicted a Chelsea win or 2nd place. If that was the sentiment on one of the most popular football forums how do you think that translated into bookies odds?
Congratulation Arsenal!
Am glad they gate crashed Chelsea Double party.
(Don't mind Arsenal going ahead of us for FA Cup at all. We will get ahead of them in time)
When nearly every club starts copying Conte's style and playing three at the back you can understand why some might consider worshiping Conte.
Credit to Arsenal they played better.
We've seen it with Leeds when they crumbled in the 90's just because a side has won something the season before last does not mean they will reach that standard again.
Conte had to change the style as well as three players. A little bit different from Leicester who discovered a winning formula eventually under Pearson which the Tinkerman didn't tinker with too much.
yes.. I saids bookies worth their salt: ie well-known ones. not some website that's been around 10 minutes.I believe I got the nonsense from bookies, since I looked at the time.
Most have not the old odds but some examples are here: http://www.101greatgoals.com/premier-league-outright-winner-20162017-tips-odds-predictions/
And actually for quite a few Arsenal was third favourite. Again you do not need to go far to check that, just look at your own prediction thread and see how many people predicted a Chelsea win or 2nd place. If that was the sentiment on one of the most popular football forums how do you think that translated into bookies odds?
I dont think a striker like Lukaku or Morata will be prepared to sit at the bench when we are not playing 3-5-2. Also if we play two top strikers (say Costa & Lukaku) if a 3-5-2, there will be no place left for Hazard.
We dont need another top striker if Costa is still around next season, that said I would love to for us to replace him with a younger and more mentally stable player this summer.