[Greck]

So stupid of the club if they back Mourinho for this. If they back him and we sell Pogba, by Christmas as expected we would be out of the title race and possibly he will get the axe. By January 2019 we will be without Pogba and a manager.

BS. Who exactly are the board members sanctioning the sale to be giving the tabloids this kind of info? Aren't our board based in the US? This is likely from someone who thinks they know what the board are thinking but our board's decisions have generally been well guarded secrets till the time of implementation

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

I said before, I can't see both Jose and Pogba being here next season. And they ain't sacking Jose now he's got us back finishing top 4.

 

[izec]

A lot of smoke lately, doesnt look that unlikely that he may leave

 

[VP89]

He’s still one of the most talented CM’s in the world and will be of interest to big teams.

We were the only team willing to pay 90m EUR for him from Juvenuts when he was at least twice the player he's shown to be here.

Massive talent no doubt. His stock has gone down though from whatever Real valued him at 2 years ago.

 

[El Jefe]

Pogba should be sold, oh and while we're at it Martial too .

This is the sort of scenario ABUs would have concocted prior to Jose's arrival that all of us on here would have laughed our arses off at. Fast forward two years and we're all looking silly.

Perhaps the funniest thing is those fighting Jose's corner. Salah and KDB have both shown the whole league the complete lack of foresight and long term planning in Mourinho. I mean the two of them, week after week have the whole league scratching their heads as to how he let them go. Salah and KDB were successful at all of their clubs other than Chelsea. That tells you all you need to know really.

Its bordering on insanity how some of you are even entertaining this talk. I will bet my house on it that if these two were to be sold it would look even more embarrassing than the KDB/Salah scenario 3 years from now.

 

[Canagel]

Between Jose and Pogba, the club should never think twice and did like Real Madrid when they took Ronaldo's side. Pogba is our star, many here underestimate his quality. He was in the FIFA starting XI when he was 21 years old. People forget easy his superb performance in Juventus. He is the type of player that you build a team around. If he has some mentality issues, Mourinho is the one to blame cause he does nothing but slams him in the media and he is looking clueless for finding the right position of a player he bought for 105 m euros.

Make no mistake his loss will be another teams gain. We should fight hard to help him succeed and reach his potential. It's not worth backing a short term manager like Mourinho over someone who has the potential to be here for the next 10 years. This is the same manager who let go KDB and Salah. And within 2 years he was sacked by Chelsea. In the end the losers are the clubs. We cannot afford to make the same mistake with Pogba, Martial etc. Mourinho may gone on to be successful without Pogba but these things come back and bite you in the arse. Mourinho could be gone within 2/3 years. Pogba can be at United for 10 years so selling him now would be losing all that potential to satisfy a manager who's well known for not hanging around for more than 3 years. Like you said just 3 years ago he was in the FiFA World 11 and had the biggest clubs in the World vying for his signature. At the age of 21/22. He hasn't become a bad player overnight so it's down to both sides to find the right solutions.

 

[haram]

Pogba should be sold, oh and while we're at it Martial too .

This is the sort of scenario ABUs would have concocted prior to Jose's arrival that all of us on here would have laughed our arses off at. Fast forward two years and we're all looking silly.

Perhaps the funniest thing is those fighting Jose's corner. Salah and KDB have both shown the whole league the complete lack of foresight and long term planning in Mourinho. I mean the two of them, week after week have the whole league scratching their heads as to how he let them go. Salah and KDB were successful at all of their clubs other than Chelsea. That tells you all you need to know really.

Its bordering on insanity how some of you are even entertaining this talk. I will bet my house on it that if these two were to be sold it would look even more embarrassing than the KDB/Salah scenario 3 years from now.

It’s not really about Pogba and Martial being sold, it’s about who replaces them. I support Manchester United, not individual players.

If we hypothetically replace Pogba with another top player, I dont see the problem? If we sold Martial for a top RW (or someone with similar potential like Dembele), I don’t see the problem?

If we replaced Pogba with Drinkwater yeah I’d be pissed. That’s never going to happen though.

 

[haram]

We were the only team willing to pay 90m EUR for him from Juvenuts when he was at least twice the player he's shown to be here.

Massive talent no doubt. His stock has gone down though from whatever Real valued him at 2 years ago.

Prices of players have risen further. Pogba is also younger than the likes of Kroos. You cannot overlook Pogba’s marketability either. Pogba is still worth £100 million +.

 

[Trigg]

Selling Pogba is just a crazy idea.

But then Jose got to Jose.

 

[el3mel]

Even with all my criticism for him I'm strongly against selling him. Too much talent to sell and still young. However, he needs to start doing his talent some favor as well with some consistency and maturity.

 

[AndyJ1985]

We already have enough deadwood to get rid of, and Carrick is retiring. If we sell Martial and Pogba too we really will be in need of a radical overhaul. You're talking at least half a dozen players coming in.

 

[NinjaZombie]

So Jose wants to sell Pogba and Martial. He also wants to keep Fellaini.

Brilliant.

 

[haram]

Even with all my criticism for him I'm strongly against selling him. Too much talent to sell and still young. However, he needs to start doing his talent some favor as well with some consistency and maturity.

Yeah, dont want him sold either.

So Jose wants to sell Pogba and Martial. He also wants to keep Fellaini.

Brilliant.

I mean we offered Martial a contract so it would appear its more Martial wants to leave rather than we want to sell him...

 

[breakout67]

It’s not really about Pogba and Martial being sold, it’s about who replaces them. I support Manchester United, not individual players.

If we hypothetically replace Pogba with another top player, I dont see the problem? If we sold Martial for a top RW (or someone with similar potential like Dembele), I don’t see the problem?

If we replaced Pogba with Drinkwater yeah I’d be pissed. That’s never going to happen though.

Exactly, everyone is replaceable at the club. If we were in the position of Chelsea or Arsenal then we would have gotten a new manager in the summer.

If we got rid of Pogba and Martial for Kroos and Dybala then I wouldn't bat an eye. Both are better than their counterparts while also being able to give several years to the club.

Obviously I'd want to keep both players, because both are amazing on their day and can turn into world class players with time, but they aren't indispensable.

 

[Canagel]

We already have enough deadwood to get rid of, and Carrick is retiring. If we sell Martial and Pogba too we really will be in need of a radical overhaul. You're talking at least half a dozen players coming in.

Is that wise though? All this chopping and changing will not help us one bit. We should've been at the stage where we just need to tweak the squad and add 3/4 players maximum. Even Ed Woodward said the club won't be churning any new players. If this really happens we are doomed. Will be further away from winning the title next season.

 

[Revaulx]

That wasn't the issue at all with Veron. United often got overrun in midfield because they played a 4 with 2 strikers and the plan was clearly Keane and Veron in midfield with Scholes in the number 10 role.

The reason it didn't work were:
- Scholes had a sulk and didn't want to play a more advanced role.
- Beckham and Giggs didn't score enough goals for the more advanced roles in a 4-2-3-1.
- Stam left which meant the team needed an extra shield in midfield, meaning Butt or Neville next to Keane.

The latter was the biggest issue in my opinion. Losing a striker from your starting 11 for more control of the game is fine if you don't look like conceding every time the opposition has the ball.

Ah. Interesting!

Keane and Veron as a pair didn’t seem to work either. I seem to remember a run of games towards the end of Veron’s time when Keane was out injured and he played in a two alongside Phil Neville, with considerable success. The two complemented each other perfectly, and Scholes seemed happy enough in a more advanced role. In retrospect I wonder how much was due to Keane (bless him!) taking against him and stirring things up.

 

[roonster09]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Nothing article based on assumptions.

It is already known that Luke Shaw, Matteo Darmian and Daley Blind are up for sale but it is possible that Anthony Martial, who is disenchanted, Mata, Herrera and – most dramatically of all – Pogba could be added to that list despite the France midfielder being the most expensive player in English football at a transfer fee of £89million.

 

[Lentwood]

Who did we sign specifically to help him? I’m of the opinion there are more factors to this than just Jose and Pogba. He’s been played out of position for most of the season but then his form isn’t helped by the lack of fullbacks and movement upfront and the speed at which we play. He by the way also has a hand in some of that.

I just think that we are in danger of going down the Rooney route and making one too many excuses for Pogba

So far I’ve seen Utd fans blame is his poor form on;

- Lack of width
- Poor full backs
- Lukaku
- Not playing at #10
- Not playing wide of a three
- Jose’s negative/defensive football
- Long ball tactics

I’ve not seen many people blame Paul Pogba

I would say Matic was signed to help Pogba. We might have signed Matic anyway but if Pogba had proved himself capable of playing as a proper CM we might have gone for a full back in the Summer

 

[Revaulx]

I just think that we are in danger of going down the Rooney route and making one too many excuses for Pogba

So far I’ve seen Utd fans blame is his poor form on;

- Lack of width
- Poor full backs
- Lukaku
- Not playing at #10
- Not playing wide of a three
- Jose’s negative/defensive football
- Long ball tactics

I’ve not seen many people blame Paul Pogba

I would say Matic was signed to help Pogba. We might have signed Matic anyway but if Pogba had proved himself capable of playing as a proper CM we might have gone for a full back in the Summer

You’ve forgotten Sanchez occupying his space. Despite Pogba putting in crap performances (H v Southampton) prior to Sanchez’s arrival.

To be fair, people on here’s views on Pogba seem to have got a lot more balanced, and the discussion about him more intelligent, in the last few weeks. His poor form was being used as a pretext to bash Jose; now it’s possible to be a Jose-sceptic while recognising that not everything is his fault.

 

[royboy16]

I like Pogba but if JM can get a replacement to improve us so be it.

Id be more annoyed if he got rid of DDG who at least is consistent and doesnt blow hot and cold like Pogba..

 

[Balerion]

Well, if Pogba can't get on Mourinho's page and one of them would have to leave, I don't think the club has much of a choice. They have to back the manager. Because the other option leads to a huge can of worms in the future.

Worst of all? Sourness might've been right all this time. I'm still keeping hope Pogba turns it around somehow, I'd hate to see him leave again.

 

[Member 90678]

Show pony in my eyes, prancing around the pitch and jogging like he's having a kick about with the lads!!
If he can play against city like he did then turn out the next game and give the performance he did then that just shows his lack of desire to play for us.
He has been average at best for us since he came back.
Hopefully we can sell him and get someone that is dedicated to being the best they can instead of a show pony!

 

[.Rossi]

Big Dunc saying he's staying put, articles this morning saying he is desperate to stay.

Arsed

 

[Ban]

We won't sell him ffs.

 

[BluesJr]

Big Dunc saying he's staying put, articles this morning saying he is desperate to stay.

Arsed

Link?

 

[Andersons Dietician]

I just think that we are in danger of going down the Rooney route and making one too many excuses for Pogba

So far I’ve seen Utd fans blame is his poor form on;

- Lack of width
- Poor full backs
- Lukaku
- Not playing at #10
- Not playing wide of a three
- Jose’s negative/defensive football
- Long ball tactics

I’ve not seen many people blame Paul Pogba

I would say Matic was signed to help Pogba. We might have signed Matic anyway but if Pogba had proved himself capable of playing as a proper CM we might have gone for a full back in the Summer

Matic was signed for the team, not just Pogba.

And to be honest it’s all of those things you’ve mentioned because the team just doesn’t play well. We don’t seem to be getting the best out of anyone and if a whole team isn’t playing to what they are capable of I guess that then puts the looking glass back on the manager. I just feel there are many factors that are limiting our play and what we get out of players.

Pogba for sure needs to shape up his ideas but watching him watching us part of his not living up to expectations is clearly the tactics and the way the team is playing.

 

[.Rossi]

Link?

Podcast on Dunc's Twitter page

 

[Lentwood]

Matic was signed for the team, not just Pogba.

And to be honest it’s all of those things you’ve mentioned because the team just doesn’t play well. We don’t seem to be getting the best out of anyone and if a whole team isn’t playing to what they are capable of I guess that then puts the looking glass back on the manager. I just feel there are many factors that are limiting our play and what we get out of players.

Pogba for sure needs to shape up his ideas but watching him watching us part of his not living up to expectations is clearly the tactics and the way the team is playing.

I've not given up on Pogba, I think he is a fantastic talent but I'm just saying the culture of blaming players performances on the manager is slightly dangerous imo

Regardless of whether your manager is a totally incompetent buffoon, you should still be able to do the real basics. Especially in games like West Brom where you can hardly say we lost for tactical reasons

 

[Banat]

I'v been very supportive of Mourinho so far, but if he really wants to get rid of Pogba and Martial, there is no way anyone sane can back him.

 

[SwansonsTache]

If Mourinho ships out Pogba I am truly done with him.

We won't get another CM as talented, and Pogba would stay for years after Mourinho has packed up and left.

 

[Trizy]

Yeah, the Pogba thread is far too narrow to discuss that one. A huge proportion of transfers since SAF left have made very little sense.

It's desperation on our behalf, though.

Mata, Di Maria & Pogba being the big summer signings of their respective first seasons. These are marquee signings that haven't suited the managers at the time.

Jose is trying to build a squad of his suited players. Should we let him continue before the inevitable meltdown and sacking (next year or the year after)?
Huge issue with allowing him to continue to build is the next manager will walk in and have a squad that won't match their style.

City had a brilliant vision. They put everything in place for Pep before he even signed. I'm convinced KDB was a Pep signing even though he hadn't put pen to paper at City yet. Would also explain why Bayern didn't really compete for his signature.

 

[Trigg]

I'v been very supportive of Mourinho so far, but if he really wants to get rid of Pogba and Martial, there is no way anyone sane can back him.

Yeah, I like Jose but not being able to get the best out of Pogba is on him as much as it is on Pogba. If not more. So everytime hes passively aggressively talks about Pogba he's also highlighting his shortcomings.

 

[Zoo]

I wonder how many articles on Pogba the Fail will put out today.

 

[OldSchoolManc]

I’ll tell you what I am getting fed up with - people excusing Pogba because of his age!
He is 25 and should be at the peak of his footballing years and mentality. Yet I hear everywhere that he is still developing and he’s going to be great in x amount of years time.
Now! Be great now!

 

[Andersons Dietician]

I've not given up on Pogba, I think he is a fantastic talent but I'm just saying the culture of blaming players performances on the manager is slightly dangerous imo

Regardless of whether your manager is a totally incompetent buffoon, you should still be able to do the real basics. Especially in games like West Brom where you can hardly say we lost for tactical reasons

In a way we did lose for tactical reasons along with what looked like a real lack of effort. If you see that positional map Sanchez, Mata and Pogba all seem to be playing the same position and occupying the same space. Our fullbacks didn’t push on to provide the width if we are going to play that narrow so that is a tactical flaw and it’s not the first time it’s happened this season.
I somehow doubt experienced players like Mata and Sanchez just ignore instruction and do what they want and if they were then Jose should have noticed this and changed it.

It’s clearly not all Jose’s fault, as I said there are probably so many differing factors. However at the end of the day it’s up to Jose to sort it out and I don’t feel he is helping himself. Especially with the Pogba situation. I honestly think there is a really good team there however it’s a contradiction to what Jose would like his team to be able to do so instead of embracing the talent that is there and what would I feel get the best out of them he seems determined to bend them to his will, and his ways.

 

[Noc-Z]

I agree that people are making far too many excuses for him. He's just not mentally strong enough to be a top player. His mind isn't on it. It looks like social media hits excite him more than playing good football.

 

[Canagel]

I’ll tell you what I am getting fed up with - people excusing Pogba because of his age!
He is 25 and should be at the peak of his footballing years and mentality. Yet I hear everywhere that he is still developing and he’s going to be great in x amount of years time.
Now! Be great now!

Not really to be fair. Central Midfielders tend to peak later than that. 28-32 is the peak I would say.

 

[NinjaZombie]

Yeah, I like Jose but not being able to get the best out of Pogba is on him as much as it is on Pogba. If not more. So everytime hes passively aggressively talks about Pogba he's also highlighting his shortcomings.

How many times has Mourinho come out and criticised his players this season?

If you can't get the best out of the majority of the players at the club, then you're probably the problem.

 

[royboy16]

Big Dunc saying he's staying put, articles this morning saying he is desperate to stay.

Arsed

Id want to stay too if I was on good wages and had it cushy

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah, I like Jose but not being able to get the best out of Pogba is on him as much as it is on Pogba. If not more. So everytime hes passively aggressively talks about Pogba he's also highlighting his shortcomings.

How many times has Mourinho come out and criticised his players this season?

If you can't get the best out of the majority of the players at the club, then you're probably the problem.

Mourinho should be ultimately held responsible because he was the manager when Pogba was signed. And it's always the manager's responsibility to turn his own signings into a success.

Having said that, I do think that Pogba's inability/unwillingness to do the basics expected of a player in the position he wants to play could well be the single biggest factor in our team flattering to deceive this season. He's our star player, someone who cost a huge amount of money, plays in the most influential position on the pitch and is supposed to be at the centre of everything we do as a team. He was even talking this up himself pre-season, when Thierry Henry was asking him what sort of player he wants to be and he basically said someone who can do absolutely everything. When he's consistently failing to track runners, giving the ball away cheaply, not making enough tackles, almost never breaking into a sprint and taking too much time on the ball then is it any wonder that we have only very rarely clicked as a team?

Sure, you'd like to think that Mourinho can "fix" him but it's also possible that he's an unfixable problem. As we all know, his stats at Juve were even worse than what we've seen at United. He was part of an extremely strong team but I suspect his involvement was mainly flitting round the edges of things, racking up tricks and flicks for highlight reels but generally needing all the hard work to be done by other players. The definition of a fair-weather footballer. His inflated fee was down to his excellent agent, his extreme marketability and the potential he had to grow and mature into a proper, well-rounded central midfielder. A potential that was, unfortunately, by no means guaranteed.

It's funny the grief that @sammsky1 got for his "elephant in the room" thread because I think that's exactly what Pogba has become. The one player that - more than any other - has caused this team to malfunction since we signed him. And before anyone says anything, I know that we've also looked shit without him in the team. Arguably even shitter. But that's besides the point. The reason he's missed is because he does have some good qualities, qualities sorely lacking in all our other CMs (creativity, specifically) but that's not worth the downside that comes with all the other flaws in his game. So we're damned without him and damned with him. Had the money been spent on a more well-rounded and disciplined creative central midfielder then our season would probably have turned out a hell of a lot better. Mourinho's to blame for not spending the money wisely but the uphill battle he's fought to get the best out of Pogba since then might be genuinely unwinnable.