Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

[Penna]

My sister voted leave, I still really have no idea why but we don't fall out about it. She volunteers extensively with community groups. She said to me the other day that where she lives (a big northern town with high levels of social and economic deprivation), many people feel abandoned by decision-makers in London and wanted to protest against that. Lots of them voted Tory recently to secure Brexit, because they think leaving the EU is the key to it all. These are folk who would have always been traditional Labour voters.

I said that I couldn't see how switching your vote to secure a right-wing Conservative government run by hedge-fund toffs would help improve deprivation in the north. The whole thing is inexplicable and all sense seems to have gone out the window.

 

[stepic]

She said to me the other day that where she lives (a big northern town with high levels of social and economic deprivation), many people feel abandoned by decision-makers in London and wanted to protest against that.

the weird thing about this argument is that... it's been the Conservatives that have been in power for the last decade. so their protest vote against the decision makers in London (the Conservatives) is to vote for the Conservatives. that makes sense.

at least in the US the whole 'protest vote for Trump' was against the Democrats, which was still ridiculous but is at least slighly more logical.

 

[Sassy Colin]

The collective mental breakdown of Britain has started.

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That is a truly shocking image. What is wrong with these people?

 

[Fener1907]

You have to be mentally impaired to think that doing that is acceptable.

 

[SteveJ]

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. Make it worth my while to be certain.

 

[Penna]

the weird thing about this argument is that... it's been the Conservatives that have been in power for the last decade. so their protest vote against the decision makers in London (the Conservatives) is to vote for the Conservatives. that makes sense.

at least in the US the whole 'protest vote for Trump' was against the Democrats, which was still ridiculous but is at least slighly more logical.

You're absolutely right, it's illogical. People have short memories for some things.

 

[Sweet Square]

the weird thing about this argument is that... it's been the Conservatives that have been in power for the last decade. so their protest vote against the decision makers in London (the Conservatives) is to vote for the Conservatives. that makes sense.

It's a protest vote against cosmopolitanism and liberal values. The conservatives who have been in power for the last decade have been the more openly ''liberal'' tories like Cameron, since Boris has become PM he's being running an illiberal campaign - Prolonging Parliament, attacking judges, attacking liberal institutions like the BBC and putting forward nationalist sentiments. Similar to Trump, Boris's anti liberal views make him appear as a ''protest vote'', also the Labour party rightly defending both cosmopolitanism and liberalism adds more weight to the ''anti establishment'' credentials of the former eton boy.

The ''abandoned by decision-makers in London'' stuff isn't about economic ideas like austerity, the reasons old voters in post industrial towns dislike London isn't because of high living cost, gentrification, homelessness etc. Their dislike comes from the fact London is a divisive, multi cultural city with a muslim mayor and its inevitably where their children go off to find work and rarely come back.

The problem these post industry traditional labour voters have is they can't form and act as a class in their own interest(Big state intervention economic policy + far right social policy ) due to their relations to each other, their size and their role in the economy, so they have to be represented - enter Boris Johnston.

 

[Sassy Colin]

My sister voted leave, I still really have no idea why but we don't fall out about it. She volunteers extensively with community groups. She said to me the other day that where she lives (a big northern town with high levels of social and economic deprivation), many people feel abandoned by decision-makers in London and wanted to protest against that. Lots of them voted Tory recently to secure Brexit, because they think leaving the EU is the key to it all. These are folk who would have always been traditional Labour voters.

None of this makes any sense whatsoever and is exactly the reason why a 2nd referendum was the correct course of action, rather than a 1 issue General Election.

 

[Walrus]

All the recent noise from the govt is about how we dont need to follow EU rules anymore. Call me a cynic (I am), but I reckon I can guess the first EU rule that a bunch of self-serving millionaires/tax dodgers/expenses claimers/offshore investment fund types are wanting to get rid of ASAP.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

So far it looks as if Johnson is trying to go for a Canada style deal (very deep sh!t for the UK) or an Australian style deal (extremely deep sh!t for the UK). As the brexiters cheer and celebrate - until this time next year anyway.

 

[Drifter]

Pound sinks as Boris Johnson warns of hard Brexit

The pound has sunk in early trading today ahead of a Boris Johnson speech in which the Prime Minister is expected to demand a looser trade deal with the EU that could spell a hard Brexit.

Sterling fell over one per cent against the dollar to $1.3069 ahead of the Prime Minister’s speech. Johnson is set to start UK-EU trade deal negotiations today with the aim of securing a Canada-style free trade deal.

What does an Australia-style trade deal mean?
But if they fail to secure a deal by December 2020, Johnson will say he will fall back on a hard Brexit. That would see the UK trade on World Trade Organization (WTO) terms.

While a Canada-style deal would enable tariff-free and quote-free trade on goods, a WTO-style deal would buck City expectations of tighter alignment with the EU.

Instead, the model would look similar to Australia’s own arrangements, defaulting on WTO terms with the potential for sector-specific side-deals. That includes the potential for significant new tariffs and other barriers to trade.

“It would appear that the currency has taken a look at what comes next Brexit-wise … and had a bit of a wobble,” Spreadex financial analyst Connor Campbell said.

Its fears aren’t unfounded. They are based on the details of a speech Boris Johnson is set to deliver to businesspeople and ambassadors. [It will state] that the UK will refuse close alignment with EU rules and reject the jurisdiction of European courts.”

https://www.cityam.com/pound-sinks-as-boris-johnson-warns-of-hard-brexit/

 

[Buster15]

So far it looks as if Johnson is trying to go for a Canada style deal (very deep sh!t for the UK) or an Australian style deal (extremely deep sh!t for the UK). As the brexiters cheer and celebrate - until this time next year anyway.

Not sure if you listened to his so called speach. More like a rambling diatribe about why Britain is so wonderful and world leading.
None of it made much sense at all.
But it was Boris so everything will be great, because Boris says so.

If l had made a speach like that I would have died of embarrassment.

 

[Berbasbullet]

So far it looks as if Johnson is trying to go for a Canada style deal (very deep sh!t for the UK) or an Australian style deal (extremely deep sh!t for the UK). As the brexiters cheer and celebrate - until this time next year anyway.

Why is a Canada one bad? Because of checks?

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Not sure if you listened to his so called speach. More like a rambling diatribe about why Britain is so wonderful and world leading.
None of it made much sense at all.
But it was Boris so everything will be great, because Boris says so.

If l had made a speach like that I would have died of embarrassment.

I saw the text of it, it's a continuation of the same incoherent ramblings and chest thumping.
If he actually goes through with this the UK will have a real problem and it won't take long for Brexiters to start saying - "this isn't what we voted for".

Why is a Canada one bad? Because of checks?

That is one of the major problems. Hard border which seems to be the aim, must be under instructions from the hedge funders aiming to make a killing next January.

 

[Full bodied red]

must be under instructions from the hedge funders aiming to make a killing next January.

I'm selling tickets - pm me for availability and prices.


Thursday 31st Decemeber 2020 at 23.30 on Horseguards Parade.

Hedgefunders All Stars X1 who want the UK to leave the EU with a Hard Brexit for the benefit of themselves

versus

George Soros Supporters X1 who want the UK to cancel Brexit altogether for the benefit of themselves.


Winner takes all. Which one will it be ?

 

[Paul the Wolf]

I'm selling tickets - pm me for availability and prices.


Thursday 31st Decemeber 2020 at 23.30 on Horseguards Parade.

Hedgefunders All Stars X1 who want the UK to leave the EU with a Hard Brexit for the benefit of themselves

versus

George Soros Supporters X1 who want the UK to cancel Brexit altogether for the benefit of themselves.


Winner takes all. Which one will it be ?

Too late to cancel Brexit.
On a runaway train with a maniac at the controls.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

So far it looks as if Johnson is trying to go for a Canada style deal (very deep sh!t for the UK) or an Australian style deal (extremely deep sh!t for the UK). As the brexiters cheer and celebrate - until this time next year anyway.

It's fine though because the EU will be blamed for his feck ups. And if that doesn't work then there's always the default Jimmy the benefit scum with his massive telly.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

It's fine though because the EU will be blamed for his feck ups. And if that doesn't work then there's always the default Jimmy the benefit scum with his massive telly.

True but as they have taken back control and knew exactly what they voted for , whatever happens from here on in is entirely down to them even if the final outcome looks nothing remotely like what they thought it would.

 

[MikeUpNorth]

Johnson's repeated mentions of 'parallel' trade negotiations with the US (and presumably other counties too) makes me wonder if he's planning some audacious scheme with the Americans whereby the proposed US tariffs on EU cars and other goods get implicitly linked to the EU concluding a trade deal with the UK and conceding some American demands. Basically trying to unofficially make it US and UK vs EU to even up the market sizes a bit in the negotiations.

 

[Adisa]

Johnson's repeated mentions of 'parallel' trade negotiations with the US (and presumably other counties too) makes me wonder if he's planning some audacious scheme with the Americans whereby the proposed US tariffs on EU cars and other goods get implicitly linked to the EU concluding a trade deal with the UK and conceding some American demands. Basically trying to unofficially make it US and UK vs EU to even up the market sizes a bit in the negotiations.

We aren't that valuable. This "parallel" just means simultaneous.

 

[horsechoker]

How long until we just become an American state?

And by we I mean England.

 

[711]

How long until we just become an American state?

And by we I mean England.

I think you should bet your house on it before the end of next year. Let us know how you get on.

 

[sun_tzu]

Johnson's repeated mentions of 'parallel' trade negotiations with the US (and presumably other counties too) makes me wonder if he's planning some audacious scheme with the Americans whereby the proposed US tariffs on EU cars and other goods get implicitly linked to the EU concluding a trade deal with the UK and conceding some American demands. Basically trying to unofficially make it US and UK vs EU to even up the market sizes a bit in the negotiations.

Not a chance

I would point out that we have very few trade negotiators - and virtually no experienced ones (as the EU has handled these negotiations for years) - we certainly don't have sufficient numbers to be conducting numerous high profile highly complex negations in parallel - and certainly not enough to be playing the us negotiators off against the EU ones) ...

 

[Smores]

Johnson's repeated mentions of 'parallel' trade negotiations with the US (and presumably other counties too) makes me wonder if he's planning some audacious scheme with the Americans whereby the proposed US tariffs on EU cars and other goods get implicitly linked to the EU concluding a trade deal with the UK and conceding some American demands. Basically trying to unofficially make it US and UK vs EU to even up the market sizes a bit in the negotiations.

It would be nice if we could draw substance from our prime ministers words but I'm fairly confident his ramblings are just meant to placate the domestic audience (a nice way of saying telling the idiots what they want to believe)

For him to allude to the fact that we can't negotiate several trade deals all at the same time would be to show weakness. Bannons playbook doesn't allow any such talk, we're supreme and only ever supreme.

 

[2ndTouch]

How long until we just become an American state?

And by we I mean England.

Think you could just waltz in like that? Ask Puerto Rico about it. Come to think of it, perhaps they let you in as United Rico or something like that. As a new colony, you might be an attractive proposition...

 

[Paul the Wolf]

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/qanda_20_179

EU/UK negotiating directives Q&A session.

 

[VeevaVee]

Makes me laugh when people still use fishing as one of their main reasons for voting Brexit. Since when does the world revolve around fishermen? It's not all about making them happy. Think about yourself, your family, your friends, and your local community before you think about how fishermen will benefit ffs.

 

[horsechoker]

fecking Brexit cnut

 

[Mr Pigeon]

fecking Brexit cnut

had to scroll back to see what the background was to you posting this.

 

[sun_tzu]

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/qanda_20_179

EU/UK negotiating directives Q&A session.

GENERAL QUESTIONS

Can you really negotiate everything by the end of the year?

The Commission intends to achieve as much as possible during the transition period. We are ready to work 24/7 to make the best out of the negotiations. It is possible to extend the transition period by 1 to 2 years. This decision must be taken jointly by the EU and the UK before 1 July.

Extending the transition period: if no decision is taken by July 2020, surely there is an alternative mechanism, if needs be?

If no decision has been taken by the Joint Committee before July 2020, there is no other legal basis for extending the transition beyond 2020.

Is there still a risk of a “no-deal” scenario at the end of the year?

As in every negotiation, the risk of not reaching an agreement is there. Regardless of whether a future partnership will be in place, all businesses need to prepare now for the end of the transition period, as the UK will no longer be in the Single Market or the Customs Unio

Hard brexit at the end of the year then... expect to see the next three months full of cake and eat it and arguments about fish as frank mansour wraps himself in the flag and explodes with bile on a regular basis

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Hard brexit at the end of the year then... expect to see the next three months full of cake and eat it and arguments about fish as frank mansour wraps himself in the flag and explodes with bile on a regular basis

Think this was always inevitable. All the rubbish over the past three or four years from both Tories and Labour suggesting all kinds of mental gymnastics and impossibilities. Unless the UK stay as they are regarding standards and many other things a hard border/Brexit was inevitable if they are outside the single market and customs union. If they stayed in the single market and customs union , Brexit was pointless.

This time next year fantasy should be starting to meet harsh reality head on.

 

[Penna]

had to scroll back to see what the background was to you posting this.

In Italy they have Capitan Findus, who looks suspiciously like Captain Birds Eye.

 

[JPRouve]

In Italy they have Capitan Findus, who looks suspiciously like Captain Birds Eye.

And Capitaine Iglo in France.

 

[horsechoker]

In Italy they have Capitan Findus, who looks suspiciously like Captain Birds Eye.

And Capitaine Iglo in France.

Typical, backed Brexit now he's swanning about his villas on the Amalfi Coast and Monaco.

 

[JPRouve]

Typical, backed Brexit now he's swanning about his villas on the Amalfi Coast and Monaco.

He also has a german passport.

 

[horsechoker]

He also has a german passport.

He's worse than Farage!

 

[Smores]

Makes me laugh when people still use fishing as one of their main reasons for voting Brexit. Since when does the world revolve around fishermen? It's not all about making them happy. Think about yourself, your family, your friends, and your local community before you think about how fishermen will benefit ffs.

The opposition to fishing quotas is merely symbolic, it's an example of 'them' telling us what to do. The principle belief of the hardcore daily mail type brexiteer is that they can't do or say what they want anymore so push back against anything that constrains them or 'us'.

I've yet to figure out what the motivations are for the mythical 'reasonable brexiteers' though, despite several brexiteers on here claiming they're the reasonable kind.

 

[Maticmaker]

Since when does the world revolve around fishermen?

Every country in the world that has a coast line or an inland sea able to support fishing cares about Fishing and the men and women who brave the sea to bring home the seafood, and whom for some its their staple diet... ask the Netherlands, French and Spanish fishermen how important it is!

 

[Mr Pigeon]

When asked by the BBC's Laura Kuenssberg whether he accepted that leaving the EU with no comprehensive trade deal could have significant cost for jobs and businesses, Mr Johnson replied: "We've got a deal, it's a great deal, we're out

He's becoming more and more like Trump as each day passes. Censoring press, banning journalists and avoiding scrutiny, "great deal" which I bet will eventually becoming "greatest deal in history". It's like combining Zippy, Bungle and George into one human shaped wedge of Play-Doh, having witches chant the same incantation over and over until it becomes sentient, and then topping it off with a strand of Donald's hair in order to give it a personality.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

I want to know if Brexiters are keen on traditional fish and chips being made with battered herring and mackerel caught in British waters instead of cod.