SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

[Fergies Gum]

Fearing the worst but i hope Boris pulls through. Got to feel for his partner Carrie who has the virus herself and is pregnant.

 

[justboy68]

Boris being in intensive care isn't sadder per se than any of the other thousands of wives, husbands, mothers and fathers who are facing the same fate. It is scarier though when it happens to someone in the public eye, and even more shocking when that person is someone of power, showing that no one is safe from this virus.

It is so easy for numbers just to become numbers, but this kind of story can serve as a reminder that there is a face and family/friends behind each one and each one is terribly sad. Heart goes out to Boris, his pregnant girlfriend and all those affected by this virus.

Even if you hate Boris and everything he has stood for and done in his career, the best case scenario is for him to make a full recovery and come out the other side a better man for it. Let's hope that he gets through this with a deeper desire to take care of the vulnerable, of which he is one at the moment.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Ultimately, having inadequate experts and civil servants dealing with the problem is a responsibility that can only lie at the feet of the government that's been in power for the last 10 years and which was famously tired of experts.

Agreed. But how is that Boris's fault?

 

[FootballHQ]

Does the PM have a private medic like the Queen or just get referred to best consultant at St Thomas? Must be a brief surreal moment when your next patient is PM.

 

[Moiraine]

Some of the replies in that are sickening. It really doesn't matter if you think he's a cnut or not. The guy is a human being with a baby on the way ffs.

Welcome to the world we live in. Sometimes I question myself how some people can be so evil! Shouldn’t there be an identity check for making a profile on Facebook, twitter etc.?

Just read on this thread that some hackers are actively targeting hospitals...I mean who in his/her sane mind will target hospitals at a time like this for heavens sake. I can’t understand how world has become so evil. I have tears in my eyes reflecting upon this... maybe we deserve What’s happening to us... maybe its a punishment.

It will be over one day and when it is over, there are things that need rectifying and fixing. Social media control is one thing that is a must. People should be made accountable to what they say on social media.

There should be a real trail of China for putting world under serious health and economic crises. This is the second time a lethal virus has originated from the same place. Not only this, but deliberately hiding it from the world, falsifying the facts about the disease and punishing the very doctor who tried to warn the world. When 9-11 happened, the world got United against radicalism and collectively chased the roots. Clamped down hard on the financial and other support for any potential breeding ground. Why it should be any difficult to take action against something that has caused a million times worse damage?

 

[TwoSheds]

Agreed. But how is that Boris's fault?

Because he's been an important part of the government for 10 years? And it was his crazy eugenicist advisor who said "and if a few old people die, too bad"? And he's highly culpable in the shitting on experts game they've been playing for a few years now? But apart from that, what have the Johnsons ever done for us?

 

[Moiraine]

Johnson has had severe pneumonia in the past, and I think he had a heart issue too.

Neither of which bode well for him now.

Feck man
I am not british, nor i like his politics but i feel really terrible. I really hope he fight the hell out of this virus. Come on Borris, there’s your dream waiting for you .... an independent British Nation. Just pull through this. Get well soon.

 

[Redplane]

Feck man
I am not british, nor i like his politics but i feel really terrible. I really hope he fight the hell out of this virus. Come on Borris, there’s your dream waiting for you .... an independent British Nation. Just pull through this. Get well soon.

Well there s kind of a conflicted message if I've ever read one.

 

[Moiraine]

Well there s kind of a conflicted message if I've ever read one.

He got a mandate from British Nation for a certain thing. Now that he got the opportunity, he got life threatening sickness. I hope he gets better soon. Maybe this is clear for you.

 

[Sweet Square]

There should be a real trail of China for putting world under serious health and economic crises. This is the second time a lethal virus has originated from the same place. Not only this, but deliberately hiding it from the world, falsifying the facts about the disease and punishing the very doctor who tried to warn the world. When 9-11 happened, the world got United against radicalism and collectively chased the roots. Clamped down hard on the financial and other support for any potential breeding ground. Why it should be any difficult to take action against something that has caused a million times worse damage?

You do know China is the 2nd biggest super power in the world(And possibly the biggest in a few decades) and also has nukes(Thankfully). Also as we all know there is no more islamic terroism in todays world because the west did such a great job!

It's been mentioned before but it's telling how deep the war on terror has been burnt into our brains that whenever a crisis hits the west it's the first thing people jump to.

Anyways I'm off to draw cartoons of Covid19 because we can't let this virus take away our freedoms!

 

[Moiraine]

You do know China is the 2nd biggest super power in the world(And possibly the biggest in a few decades) and also has nukes(Thankfully). Also as we all know there is no more islamic terroism in todays world because the west did such a great job!

It's been mentioned before but it's telling how deep the war on terror has being burnt into our brains that whenever a crisis hits the west it's the first thing people jump to.

So you think if some country is powerful it shouldn’t be made accountable?
And you suggest this crises is any lesser than the “war on terror”?

World post Covid-19 will never be the same just like post 9-11.

 

[mu4c_20le]

So you think if some country is powerful it shouldn’t be made accountable?
And you suggest this crises is any lesser than the “war on terror”?

World post Covid-19 will never be the same just like post 9-11.

9/11 was an intentional act of terrorism, there is no evidence that this virus was engineered by man and spread intentionally, so nothing will happen. It's just mudslinging and conspiracy theories so far.

 

[VeevaVee]

This guy’s party is responsible for underfunding the NHS and costing lots of lives, not to mention they send thousands of men to their deaths (who also have children) in unjust wars. I don’t wish death on him, but I can’t be the only one not giving a shit?

 

[Moiraine]

9/11 was an intentional act of terrorism, there is no evidence that this virus was engineered by man and spread intentionally, so nothing will happen. It's just mudslinging and conspiracy theories so far.

Not following conspiracies, this is the second lethal virus originated from the same place!

What will you say about that?

 

[sglowrider]

I don't know how it is in England but in Sweden, we don't have arterial cannulas in most 'regular' non-ICU wards. Arterial cannulas allow for easy and repeated blood sampling which would reveal a deterioration that is not seen on the monitor where you typically just see heart rate, oxygen saturation and blood pressure.

It also allows us to see the blood pressure with every single heartbeat which can allow for blood pressure increasing medications to be introduced earlier (even though there is no real evidence that arterial blood pressure monitoring improves outcomes).

Plus, being in an ICU where all intubation equipment is located obviously makes an intubation smoother than doing an emergency intubation in a ward outside the ICU (and safer from a patient POV and in terms of spreading it to those in the vicinity).

ICU definitions vary from country to country. Some country's healthcare system will only intubated ventilators. Others will also include non-invasive ventilators. From the sounds of it, BoJo is just getting 'some oxygen' sounds like some CPAP non-invasive.

 

[sglowrider]

It will be a precaution but he's the PM. He will have every piece of equipment he could possibly need on standby.

Hopefully, they aren't taking medical advice from Trump.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Not following conspiracies, this is the second lethal virus originated from the same place!

What will you say about that?

I think they need to review their policies on handling and consumption of exotic wildlife. The only reason this is being made into a big fuss is because US and China are locked in a trade war.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Because he's been an important part of the government for 10 years? And it was his crazy eugenicist advisor who said "and if a few old people die, too bad"? And he's highly culpable in the shitting on experts game they've been playing for a few years now? But apart from that, what have the Johnsons ever done for us?

Johnson wasn't PM until a couple of months ago. His cabinet weren't the ones that shat on the NHS. He listened to his own nation's medical advisors, which as per your original point were put into position by the previous administration. His political advisor is a cnut, but that doesn't mean he himself deserves to die for it.

So far HIS administration has;

Listened to government advisors
Change tactic when it turned out the information was false
Put economic policies in place to protect millions of people in the UK

You keep saying "they" as if they = Boris. If Cummings was the one in ICU, or Osborne or Lansley, Hunt or Cameron I would give less of a shit than I do about Boris, which is already very little to begin with. But that's all irrelevant. Proclaiming that you want someone to suffer because they've made other people suffer makes you just as much of a cnut* as they are. Perhaps even moreso because they can at least try and hide behind a sense of ignorance to the situation.

*Not calling you specifically a cnut, I'm making a general statement**

**I like cake

 

[Sweet Square]

So you think if some country is powerful it shouldn’t be made accountable?
And you suggest this crises is any lesser than the “war on terror”?

World post Covid-19 will never be the same just like post 9-11.

Again China is the 2nd largest super power in the world and has nuclear weapons. China is a vital cog in global capitalism. It's not a failed state like Iraq. Funny enough if you really wanted to treat this covid19 crisis as similar to 9/11 the end result would be the west going to war with country that had nothing to with the original outbreak.

Also as mentioned already the outbreak of Covid19 wasn't a deliberate act of terroism but an accident involving wet markets, yet you're suggesting going to war with a centralised nuclear world power which has a population of over billion people, basically causing ww3 and nuclear mega death because of this.

Yeah I get it I miss football as well but let's not risk turning the world into a giant dust bowl.

 

[oates]

There should be a real trail of China for putting world under serious health and economic crises. This is the second time a lethal virus has originated from the same place. Not only this, but deliberately hiding it from the world, falsifying the facts about the disease and punishing the very doctor who tried to warn the world.

I agree. Whenever the World comes out of this crisis it will immediately face the next crisis of getting back to whatever our new normal will be and every man, woman and dog will be in some sort of debt, countries will be in massive debt.

This virus started in China, whether in a lab or due to hygiene issues in a wet market serving citizens who spread this virus. Nearly every country in the World, especially Europe services debt held by China. The costs of their failure to prevent the virus and its spread around the World while being deceitful could maybe be offset against those debts.

 

[Moiraine]

Again China is the 2nd largest super power in the world and has nuclear weapons. China is a vital cog in global capitalism. It's not a failed state like Iraq. Funny enough if you really wanted to treat this covid19 crisis as similar to 9/11 the end result would be the west going to war with country that had nothing to with the original outbreak.

Also as mentioned already the outbreak of Covid19 wasn't a deliberate act of terroism but an accident involving wet markets, yet you're suggesting going to war with a centralised nuclear world power which has a population of over billion people, basically causing ww3 and nuclear mega death because of this.

Yeah I get it I miss football as well but let's not risk turning the world into a giant dust bowl.

When does Making accountable has become similar to waging war ?
I asked for the world to be united so there isn’t an incident like that in the future. Wars are never the solution, they bring more chaos.

But yeah maybe we do miss football.

 

[Sweet Square]

Johnson wasn't PM until a couple of months ago. His cabinet weren't the ones that shat on the NHS. He listened to his own nation's medical advisors, which as per your original point were put into position by the previous administration. His political advisor is a cnut, but that doesn't mean he himself deserves to die for it.

So far HIS administration has;

Listened to government advisors
Change tactic when it turned out the information was false
Put economic policies in place to protect millions of people in the UK

You keep saying "they" as if they = Boris. If Cummings was the one in ICU, or Osborne or Lansley, Hunt or Cameron I would give less of a shit than I do about Boris, which is already very little to begin with. But that's all irrelevant. Proclaiming that you want someone to suffer because they've made other people suffer makes you just as much of a cnut* as they are. Perhaps even moreso because they can at least try and hide behind a sense of ignorance to the situation.

*Not calling you specifically a cnut, I'm making a general statement**

**I like cake

• In a 1995 column unearthed by Business Insider, UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson called for patients to be charged to use the National Health Service to prevent free care being "abused" by people who can afford to pay.
• The prime minister wrote in the Spectator magazine that free healthcare should be only for "those who are genuinely sick, and for the elderly."
• He added that "if people have to pay" for NHS services, "they will value them more.

Also

• Almost always voted against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
• Almost always voted for a reduction in spending on welfare benefits

As someone with a disabled family member and I've also seen the struggles of people with mental illness over the last decade, I think it's only fair I treat Boris in a similar way to how he's treated them. It's what he would have wanted.

 

[Sweet Square]

When does Making accountable has become similar to waging war ?
I asked for the world to be united so there isn’t an incident like that in the future. Wars are never the solution, they bring more chaos.

So why are you using 9/11 as an example ?

What do you actually want to happen to China.

 

[Moiraine]

So why are you using 9/11 as an example ?

What do you actually want to happen to China.

You didn’t read me i think. I said world was on one page, united.

Take care of their wet markets, compensate for hiding the severity of virus from the world. There are so many deaths, unprecedented damage to the world economy.

You think world should resume everything like nothing happened?

 

[Mr Pigeon]

• In a 1995 column unearthed by Business Insider, UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson called for patients to be charged to use the National Health Service to prevent free care being "abused" by people who can afford to pay.
• The prime minister wrote in the Spectator magazine that free healthcare should be only for "those who are genuinely sick, and for the elderly."
• He added that "if people have to pay" for NHS services, "they will value them more.

Also

• Almost always voted against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
• Almost always voted for a reduction in spending on welfare benefits

As someone with a disabled family member and I've also seen the struggles of people with mental illness over the last decade, I think it's only fair I treat Boris in a similar way to how he's treated them. It's what he would have wanted.

Ah fair enough. He is a cnut. But again, i can't defend anyone who wishes ill will on another person regardless of how much of a cnut they are. Maybe my voice is more outside than others so I can do it without getting (not saying this is a bad thing to have) emotionally attached to it.

 

[Bebestation]

You didn’t read me i think. I said world was on one page, united.

Take care of their wet markets, compensate for hiding the severity of virus from the world. There are so many deaths, unprecedented damage to the world economy.

You think world should resume everything like nothing happened?

I'm rubbish at politics and stuff but this is the time where the nations should get together like the UN, maybe have a trip to China and make sure everyones happy this stuff stop happening in the future again.

It cant repeatedly keep happening. Mistakes does happen, but if dirty mistakes keep happening in a dirty area then it's time that it may need to be cleaned with a bit of force after the pandemic has died down as a way of saying sorry for this problem happening.

"The Asian Flu in 1956 killed between one and four million people worldwide. SARS in 2002 infected 8,098 and killed 774 in seventeen counties. H7N9 emerged ten years later to strike at least 1,223 people and kill four out of every ten of them. Now, the milder, yet more infectious COVID-19 has sickened more than 70,000 across the globe, resulting in 1,771 deaths."

All from China.

https://www.realclearscience.com/bl..._outbreaks_always_seem_to_start_in_china.html

 

[justboy68]

I'm rubbish at politics and stuff but this is the time where the nations should get together like the UN, maybe have a trip to China and make sure everyones happy this stuff stop happening in the future again.

It cant repeatedly keep happening. Mistakes does happen, but if dirty mistakes keep happening in a dirty area then it's time that it may need to be cleaned with a bit of force after the pandemic has died down as a way of saying sorry for this problem happening.

"The Asian Flu in 1956 killed between one and four million people worldwide. SARS in 2002 infected 8,098 and killed 774 in seventeen counties. H7N9 emerged ten years later to strike at least 1,223 people and kill four out of every ten of them. Now, the milder, yet more infectious COVID-19 has sickened more than 70,000 across the globe, resulting in 1,771 deaths."

All from China.

https://www.realclearscience.com/bl..._outbreaks_always_seem_to_start_in_china.html

It really all comes down to education on food safety and hygiene. The Chinese government really needs to get serious about educating and enforcing proper hygiene. I'm not sure what else you can really do to solve it.

 

[fishfingers15]

It's unfortunate that if he dies, he would have died as a martyr for his own herd immunity policy.

 

[Sweet Square]

You didn’t read me i think. I said world was on one page, united.

Ah right thats makes sense(Although the outcome of 9/11 was wars in Iraq and Afghanistan)

Take care of their wet markets, compensate for hiding the severity of virus from the world. There are so many deaths, unprecedented damage to the world economy.

China already have made moves to tackle wet markets but it's a billion dollar global market(https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/05/...-wildlife-consumption-ban-intl-hnk/index.html)

Also

Prof Cunningham says if we're to stop another pandemic in the future, we must focus on causes as well as effects. At the root of the problem is the destruction of nature, bringing animals and humans into conflict.

"Even in protected forests, the forests are still there, but the wildlife's gone from within them because they have ended up in markets," he says. ".And it's easy to finger point, but it's not just happening in China, it's happening in many other countries and even in the western world. We like to have exotic pets and many of those are wild caught and we ought to be putting our own house in order too."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-52125309

One of the most disturbing facts I've heard is that covid19 has actually saved more lives in the long run due to it slowing down economy and causing clearer air in places like China.Covid19 has got nothing on climate change.

As for compensation 1)How do you even come up with a number 2)Maybe the West isn't the best to talk about compensation 3)China is quite possibly the most important cog in global capitalism, if China struggles then we all struggle. It's not the fault of the CCP that Britain has a shortfall of ventilators.

You think world should resume everything like nothing happened?

Definitely not but what we need is as you've said a united world but that must involved global changes(universal healthcare, possibly a UBI, tackling mass inequality, etc)and not just focusing in on China.

Ah fair enough. He is a cnut. But again, i can't defend anyone who wishes ill will on another person regardless of how much of a cnut they are. Maybe my voice is more outside than others so I can do it without getting (not saying this is a bad thing to have) emotionally attached to it.

I wouldn't wish ill on him but I won't care about the outcome of his health, similar to how he didn't shit when casting those votes. Although it's worth saying my position is clearly not the majority one.

 

[Ludens the Red]

• In a 1995 column unearthed by Business Insider, UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson called for patients to be charged to use the National Health Service to prevent free care being "abused" by people who can afford to pay.
• The prime minister wrote in the Spectator magazine that free healthcare should be only for "those who are genuinely sick, and for the elderly."
• He added that "if people have to pay" for NHS services, "they will value them more.

Also

• Almost always voted against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
• Almost always voted for a reduction in spending on welfare benefits

As someone with a disabled family member and I've also seen the struggles of people with mental illness over the last decade, I think it's only fair I treat Boris in a similar way to how he's treated them. It's what he would have wanted.

is this really shitting on the NHS though? What is so outlandish about saying those things? You don't have to agree with them but aren't these things just standard things that get debated all the time in government?

Johnson wasn't PM until a couple of months ago. His cabinet weren't the ones that shat on the NHS. He listened to his own nation's medical advisors, which as per your original point were put into position by the previous administration. His political advisor is a cnut, but that doesn't mean he himself deserves to die for it.

So far HIS administration has;

Listened to government advisors
Change tactic when it turned out the information was false
Put economic policies in place to protect millions of people in the UK

You keep saying "they" as if they = Boris. If Cummings was the one in ICU, or Osborne or Lansley, Hunt or Cameron I would give less of a shit than I do about Boris, which is already very little to begin with. But that's all irrelevant. Proclaiming that you want someone to suffer because they've made other people suffer makes you just as much of a cnut* as they are. Perhaps even moreso because they can at least try and hide behind a sense of ignorance to the situation.

*Not calling you specifically a cnut, I'm making a general statement**

**I like cake

It's standard modern day culture, the age of the blame and character assassination culture. It's honestly vile to see and boils down to people and their sense of self importance. Like when a load of people couldn't just let the nation appreciate the NHS with the Thursday night applause, they had to turn it into a point scoring exercise and anyone who didn't vote labour was a 'cnut' and 'not allowed to clap'.

 

[Foxbatt]

It really all comes down to education on food safety and hygiene. The Chinese government really needs to get serious about educating and enforcing proper hygiene. I'm not sure what else you can really do to solve it.

Some cities in China has already banned the wet markets and I am sure eventually the whole country will.

By the way what is the whole world or the international community? It's never the Caucasian countries alone that count as the whole world or the international community.
The major part of the world is not against China. So the whole world is not United in blaming China or looking to punish China. It's preposterous to even think so.

 

[Revan]

I'm rubbish at politics and stuff but this is the time where the nations should get together like the UN, maybe have a trip to China and make sure everyones happy this stuff stop happening in the future again.

It cant repeatedly keep happening. Mistakes does happen, but if dirty mistakes keep happening in a dirty area then it's time that it may need to be cleaned with a bit of force after the pandemic has died down as a way of saying sorry for this problem happening.

"The Asian Flu in 1956 killed between one and four million people worldwide. SARS in 2002 infected 8,098 and killed 774 in seventeen counties. H7N9 emerged ten years later to strike at least 1,223 people and kill four out of every ten of them. Now, the milder, yet more infectious COVID-19 has sickened more than 70,000 across the globe, resulting in 1,771 deaths."

All from China.

https://www.realclearscience.com/bl..._outbreaks_always_seem_to_start_in_china.html

Add to that H5N1 (bird flu) which had end-of-civilization potential.

I agree with your post. It is happening too often from the same place and it does not get explained by simply China being the host of 1/5 of world's population. The only comparable diseases in the last few decades that did not come from there were Ebola and MERS (swine flu was a new strain of an old virus, a virus that probably originated in China in 1918).

Their wet markets have always been a ticking bomb, as their culture of eating every type of animal. Add to that an autocratic government that censures the media and individuals, and you have a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[Sweet Square]

is this really shitting on the NHS though? What is so outlandish about saying those things? You don't have to agree with them but aren't these things just standard things that get debated all the time in government?

He's advocating for getting rid of free at the point of use healthcare. Maybe it's just me but agree to disagree I want to take away you're healthcare is shitting on the NHS.

Again(It's really a endless list tbh)

Boris Johnson advocated an insurance-based healthcare system for non-essential treatments and pushed for patients to have more private care outside the NHS, a newly unearthed article shows.

In a 2004 column for The Daily Telegraph, Mr Johnson lamented how individuals were paying “more and more in their taxes for this ‘unimprovable’ universal service” while having operations cancelled at the last minute.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...lthcare-general-election-tories-a9225061.html

Also he's hardly been a out spoken critic of the last decade of tory rule.

 

[Revan]

Anyway, good news for the US, it seems that it has already peaked. 100 more deaths than yesterday, but 200 less than the day before that, and the number of new infections is stable around 30k new infections per day. University of Washington revised their forecast to less deaths, and now Fauci is saying that he expects less than 100k deaths. Hopefully they are right.

Washington and California were the two countries that have been hit first, but seem to have managed to flatten the curve. Hopefully, the rest of the country reaches the same good results soon.

 

[RedSky]

This guy’s party is responsible for underfunding the NHS and costing lots of lives, not to mention they send thousands of men to their deaths (who also have children) in unjust wars. I don’t wish death on him, but I can’t be the only one not giving a shit?

Couldn't give a feck if im honest.

 

[Ludens the Red]

He's advocating for getting rid of free at the point of use healthcare. Maybe it's just me but agree to disagree I want to take away you're healthcare is shitting on the NHS.

Again(It's really a endless list tbh)



Also he's hardly been a out spoken critic of the last decade of tory rule.

I don’t agree with it and obviously you don’t but I don’t see how it’s shitting on the nhs per se. Again I’m not agreeing but the idea that they have, is that it would actually Strengthen the NHS.

This guy’s party is responsible for underfunding the NHS and costing lots of lives, not to mention they send thousands of men to their deaths (who also have children) in unjust wars. I don’t wish death on him, but I can’t be the only one not giving a shit?

Not to nitpick but labour were in rule when soldiers were sent to Aghanistan and Iraq for the ‘war on terror’.

 

[Organic Potatoes]

One of the most disturbing facts I've heard is that covid19 has actually saved more lives in the long run due to it slowing down economy and causing clearer air in places like China.Covid19 has got nothing on climate change.

This is not a fact, and even if it was to make such a claim would need a reference. Energy prices will be depressed and the focus of governance will be on the economy whatever the cost to the environment, so we will go straight back to burning fossil fuels at a rapid pace if the economy rebounds.

I don’t mean to derail the thread any further, but I am pedantic sometimes...

 

[shamans]

One thing not to care about Boris being critical (despite being very cold) but if you're one of those people who share memes on my FB about his "imminent death" as a joke, I'm immediately deleting you. Speaks about a person really.

 

[hobbers]

One thing not to care about Boris being critical (despite being very cold) but if you're one of those people who share memes on my FB about his "imminent death" as a joke, I'm immediately deleting you. Speaks about a person really.

Less bleeding hearts more just plain rotten hearts.

 

[Sweet Square]

I don’t agree with it and obviously you don’t but I don’t see how it’s shitting on the nhs per se. Again I’m not agreeing but the idea that they have, is that it would actually Strengthen the NHS.

We are just going to recreate the worst thread of last year(The UK general election thread). It's pretty clear from Boris past comments and voting record why a certain part of the population won't care about his current health situation.